UNDERCOVER NARCOTICS AGENTS AT BM2005

alt12 · Post by **alt12** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:35 pm

I am just trying to publicize and solicit similar accounts of the bust of 4 friends of mine by undercover operatives (not sure which agency) which resulted in 4 arrests by BLM officers and a raid on our camp.

This occurred Friday night. We were inside a theme-based chillspace dome on the esplanade with about 10 other people hanging out when 2 different undercover operatives in full costume (and young looking) solicited my friends for drugs...to give them or trade drugs. I won't state what occurred b/c I don't want to complicate their cases. But when we left the dome 2 BLM broncos and 2 BLM ATVs with a total of 10-12 BLM officers nab my 4 friends and they ended up going to the BLM station that was apparently at 6:30 and the outer ring. They later showed-up at our camp with my friends and searched their tents. They were released much later that night with 3 $525 fines and the 4th had a posession/distribution of marijuana charge.

I spoke with many, many people during the rest of the burn about undercover presence and heard rumors of a) a popsicle art-car that was asking giving out popsicles but then req to trade or find drugs b) busts of a variety of camps b/c of paraphenalia being visible in their domes from outside c) 2 cases of the exact same undercover team that nabbed my friends complete with the same young undercover agent with the same coustume using the same trick of soliciting entrapment by asking for someone to help lick a joint he had just rolled.

What other experiences did people have with udnercover raids/busts/sting operations at BM? I have never heard of this happening before but heard several stories this year?

I have a big problem with undercover officers in costume soliciting drugs, and basically entraping burners. THis needs to be publicized and people need to know not to give/trade/exchange/offer/sell any drugs with anyone at burningman that they don't know personally outside of burningman b/c even that cute little girl could be a narc.

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:42 pm

http://www.erowid.org/freedom/police/police_info6.shtml

Entrapment and other myths defined. What you describe is not "entrapment". It is a description of a LEO doing their job.

I am certainly not a fan of LE especially at the moment but I read the story and decided to go look some things up and see what I could find out. I keep coming back to the Erowid article and it's myth debunking. If it's wrong please educate me and everyone else on what exactly is entrapment. Thank you.

The CO · Post by **The CO** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:48 pm

Well, lacking some details I'd have to say: if they sold any narcotics/controlled substances to anyone in the dome, and the deal was visable to either undercovers in the dome or law enforcement outside the dome, they pretty much screwed themselves (lesson to learn: don't buy/sell in BRC-stock up before you get there). If they didn't sell anything, but talked about where they got some or what they were on, that creates probable cause for a search (Loose lips ruin trips). Hope it works out.

The CO · Post by **The CO** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 9:15 pm

K-IV, the Erowid article is pretty much dead on. And well referenced... Alt, you summed it up well re: don't buy sell trade. As to warning people, there's a whole section in the survival guide about what LEOs can do in BRC (when they have probable cause, what you'll get ticketed/jailed for, etc). Make sure all your fellow burners read the survival guide start to finish! My only interaction with law enforcement this year was positive. I hate making police do their job.

Cosworth Magellan · Post by **Cosworth Magellan** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:45 am

using the same trick of soliciting entrapment by asking for someone to help lick a joint he had just rolled.

Let me make sure I understand this:

LEO rolls joint. LEO asks someone to help finish making joint (not to smoke it)

LEO arrests said person. (after they agreed to lick the joint or after actually licking it?)

Do I have that straight? Because that's pretty fucked up.

Lassen Forge · Post by **Lassen Forge** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:11 am

Cosworth Magellan wrote:
using the same trick of soliciting entrapment by asking for someone to help lick a joint he had just rolled.
Let me make sure I understand this:

LEO rolls joint. LEO asks someone to help finish making joint (not to smoke it)

LEO arrests said person. (after they agreed to lick the joint or after actually licking it?)

Do I have that straight? Because that's pretty fucked up.

(1) Think on this - why would someone ask you to lick their joint?? Doesn't that seem... um... suspicious?

(2) Remember - you're in NEVADA - the laws are, well, if you live (or lived) there, yu'd understand.

(3) The whole thing sounds like someone didn't remember precautuion #1 - when you're in a place where you can get stung for doing something dumb, illegal, or both, and you know people are there to try to get you to do something dumb, or illegal, or both, BE AWARE, BE CAREFUL, and BE LEERY!!! If something sounds stupid (and asking someone to lick a joint for you sounds, well, stupid), RUN AWAY!!!

bb

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:17 am

People are told to leave their expectations behind at the gate. Nobody said a thing about leaving common sense there too. But it seems what we find on the playa is the reverse...common sense is sitting at the gate and expectations drive through by the ton.

ubu · Post by **ubu** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:27 am

don't run! stand there and politely say no.

Undercovers are at BM. Get used to it, or don't go. or go clean.

BM is a bit like the bagby hot springs trail in Oregon. You could be on any stretch of National Forest land and never or almost never see an LEO, but walk the Bagby trail on a weekend and you'll see a pressed uniform wearing LEO with a citation book in hand and an itchy writing hand and pen at the ready.

Why? because it is a showcase for the NFS just as BM is a showcase for the BLM. They need to show that they are "doing their jobs", at least nominally so.
As they see it, they have to make some effort to ensure that laws are not wantonly being broken or that people are not flaunting their violation of federal laws.

Perhaps brlover can disabuse me on any statements here that seem out of line, but I think that is a reasonable assumption on my part.

Now, how does that fit in with undercover operations? I have a hard time seeing how they justify that, or how that fits in.

My inclination is to accept what the first poster to this thread has posted as factually true.

update:

Kinetic, we are sometimes talking about more than common sense. we are talking about privacy and a basic right to carry on one's daily life without harassment. One year, I was making some ginger lemonade and I was cutting some ginger root out in the open and a cop got all over my ass and wanted to look at the ginger roots I was cutting. Subjectively, I felt harassed. They seem to have a probable cause trigger finger out there. No citation for posession of ginger root was issued as it is currently not a scheduled spice.
I've never been or felt more over policed in my life as at BM.

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:53 am

The ginger root story coming from you no less is an interesting perspective.

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:19 pm

Let me make sure I understand this:

LEO rolls joint. LEO asks someone to help finish making joint (not to smoke it)

LEO arrests said person. (after they agreed to lick the joint or after actually licking it?)

Do I have that straight? Because that's pretty fucked up.

I do not think you have the story right. If the LEO produced the drugs and tempted the burner to lick or smoke it, that would clearly be entrapment.

What I suspect happened is that the joint licking thing was just some lead in to a drug sharing/trading ploy that got the burner to out himself as holding.

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:55 pm

Well, perhaps not. I just read the erowid cite, and it seems that cops can do just about any damn thing except cuff you over a table and ram drugs up your ass before busting you.

What a crazy world.

mankhost · Post by **mankhost** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 1:41 pm

This might be good to view for this discussion.

http://www.lectlaw.com/def/e024.htm

alt12 · Post by **alt12** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 4:30 pm

well trust me on this, the facts are correct in this case. Again, I think it makes perfect sense for BLM and other law enforcement agents to be out there with presence enforcing the laws of the land.

My main complaint and concern is when law enforcement officials dress-up undercover, pretend to be burners and in a party atmosphere ask people to give them drugs as a "gift" or offer to trade one drug for anothe or to otherwise exhange drugs and then bust them for doing so. We're not talking about drug-dealers here. We're talking about people out having a good time and otherwise minding their own business being set-up in a sting like operation and enticed into comitting crimes they would not otherwise be committing (which, from my understanding is the very definition of entrapment.

FYI, I got this email today from Ray at BMORG in response to my complaitn on this matter (he agreed to my posting this here):

Hi __________,

I am very sorry to hear about you and your friend's unfortunate
experience! Every year we work diligently with law enforcement
officials to try to circumvent this kind of behavior. We have made some
strides, but it is one of the areas that is difficult to completely
control.

Entrapment is an area of the law with subtle nuances of what is allowed
and not allowed. We have received similar reports this year, and our
experts believe that this has crossed the line of acceptability under
the law. I think the BLM are gambling that participants will simply
pay the tickets; rather than fight them. However, fighting
unacceptable law enforcement is one way to help change this problem in
the future.

I am recommending to all participants who may have been entrapped this year to fight their tickets. If enough of these get thrown out of
court then we can make a big stink out of it with the BLM for next
year. I can recommend a criminal defense attorney in Reno, who is also
a Burner. His name is Scott Freeman, and he can be reached at (775)
786-4788. Please tell your friends to say that Ray Allen referred
them.

I am compiling similar stories from other participants to bring up at
the post-event meeting with law enforcement so the organization can try
to curb this nonsense in the future. Please feel free to keep me in
the loop on what and your friends decide to do and how it goes if they
decide to fight the offenses.

Ray Allen
Executive Project Manager
Black Rock City, LLC
1900 Third Street
San Francisco, CA 94158-2502
(415) 865-3800 x137
[email protected]

Chai Guy · Post by **Chai Guy** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 4:44 pm

You may also want to consider some other vacation destinations next year if recreational drugs are on your "must-do" list. Might I suggest some scenic and fun locales that have a signifigantly more tolerant view of "soft-drugs" than Black Rock City. These include:

San Francisco, California
Oakland, California (aka "Oaksterdam")
Zurich, Switzerland
Vancouver, Canada

and of course Amsterdam!

ubu · Post by **ubu** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 6:24 pm

Thank You,

Alt 12 for posting this message from Ray Allen. This is important information. Not just for those who may have been entrapped but for those who care about basic rights of privacy at Burning Man. Surely, the issue of privacy and basic rights is as important if not more important than Disco channel at Burning Man.

Chai, you also might think of going to another event without as much media coverage?

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 6:54 pm

Reading between the lines of alt12's post, it would seem that his friend was busted for more than simply smoking a joint provided by an LEO. If your friend pulled drugs out of his own pockets he is fucked.

I am not saying I am happy about that, but he fell for it, and there is no way that you will make an entrapment case out of the cop offering weed as a ploy or trade.

ubu · Post by **ubu** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 7:00 pm

we really don't know enough about the case to comment. We can only comment and complain about the very use of undercovers who attempt to elicit illegal behaviour through "gifting" or soliciting gifts in brc.

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 7:59 pm

I think there is enough to comment on in the general, which is more germaine than the specific anyhow.

Specifically speaking, this makes me think alt12's friend is fucked (yes, I am assuming this is a generic description of what happened):

My main complaint and concern is when law enforcement officials dress-up undercover, pretend to be burners and in a party atmosphere ask people to give them drugs as a "gift" or offer to trade one drug for anothe or to otherwise exhange drugs and then bust them for doing so.

alt12 · Post by **alt12** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 8:52 pm

I was actually not referring to the specifics of my friends' cases. I spoke with many people at BM after the bust and heard alarming tale after alarming tale of undercover cops basically being very creative in trying to entice people into giving, trading or selling them drugs. In all, I heard the story of about 6 separate busts (not sure how many of these resulted in pressed charges or citations), and also stories of what appeared to be attempted stings (agressive soliciting of drugs by supposedly undercover agents).

I hope that the popsicle art-car story was fictitious, but I read the same thing in another forum here on eplaya. It is frightening to think that they would go to such lengths. I mean what's next, a fake burningman theme camp filled with undercover BLM agents asking people if they would mind sparking-up a joint? It all has the potential to be very messy and also ruin the spirit of community.

Bottom line, people need to be aware that if they are going to be doing drugs, do not trade/exchange/give/sell illegal substances to people they don't know. I hope to simply make that fact more public. You can say "its common sense" until you're blue in the face, but many people come in with an anything-goes mentality due to the nature of the event. Rather than blame and attack them, I'd like to help them not get into the same mess that others have (ie share the learning experience).

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 8:56 pm

Hey alt12, how about helping us out by making up a story about a friend of yours and the cops. You know, use fictional characters and situations to illuminate something that irritates you.

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:29 pm

Don, dontcha have your own BBS to go bully people on?

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:31 pm

I'm asking for information you twit.

JediDale · Post by **JediDale** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:10 pm

Nice little 20-something hottie appears out of nowhere on the Esplanade
Tuesday night right after I was done Fire Spinning. Says she: "Trade ya some shrooms for some acid!" Nay sez I , (smelling a young imperial stormtrooper in the making) "I don't do that stuff" Young evil deceptive wench then proclaims: "Trade ya some acid for some shrooms!" Oops! She got Jedi Mind Tricked! Did I make her say that? Slowly I told her she was greatly mistaking me for her prey since I don't intoxicate. Giving me a quick look of pissed-sivity she darted into the shadows never to return! Had a kind of pseudo Goth look, yet had blondish hair. Didn't seem right.
After living in Nevada for several years, you learn to not even joke about this shit, for if I had just said one "Yes" I could have gotten busted for
conspiracy to sell, or some such crap despite the fact I don't use!!
Would have liked to have been a smart ass and said "No, but how about you give me some LysergicAcidDiEthylAmide for some DiHydrogenOxide?"

Genuinely,

JediDale

Chai Guy · Post by **Chai Guy** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:17 pm

That's hilarious JediDale! And good advice too. I have a friend, that when asked for illegal substances will launch into a lengthy rambling diatribe about the history of psycho-pharmacology. Usually the person will get bored and walk away dejected after less than 3 minutes.

ubu · Post by **ubu** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:57 am

alt12, what do you think you are, bob woodward, with your composite characters? sheesh. just give use the bare facts or nothing at all.
don muerto should eat your ass with his skeletal teeth.

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:00 am

In case it wasn't clear, I am asking alt12 to tell me a fictional story involving a friend, an undercover LEO and a bust at BM. I wouldn't want him to compromise his real friend's case by relating actual facts. I just want to hear a story.

ubu · Post by **ubu** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:23 am

really, there is no need. we have plenty of stories. You can make one up yourself. You, by the way, can safely state the basic facts of a case without names without compromising a pending case.

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:25 am

I am interested in a story from the mind of alt12. All the stories I make up end the same way: Me hopping up and down on Salma Hayek.

Cosworth Magellan · Post by **Cosworth Magellan** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:29 am

One wonders... do all of Salma Hayek's stories end the same way?

Don Muerto · Post by **Don Muerto** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:30 am

I certainly hope all her stories end with me hopping up and down on her!

UNDERCOVER NARCOTICS AGENTS AT BM2005

UNDERCOVER NARCOTICS AGENTS AT BM2005

Legal definition of Entrapment

the facts

Er, who was messed up with this one?