The Bar

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:33 pm

K, cool.. Dad's gonna make me tent stakes.. was showing me ones that his Search n Rescue crew uses, prob about 16" long with a loop (looks like a link of chain) welded by the end for tying/removing.. someone else on Tribe just posted that rebar shaped like a giant staple works well, too... but I think the skinny stakes-with-loops will pack better :)

Does having a shiny-sided tent make any difference for tent heat? Oh, and if I'm not going to be one of the "up til 5 am dancing" types.. how badly do I need shade over my tent for morning sun? (or will I discover that I will indeed become an "up til 5am dancing" type?) :)

Saw some video clips today from the Otter Camp... had some footage of wonderful life music, that I hadn't really pictured (other than Mutaytor style).. looking forward to that.. think they'd be as happy to have hooping around as the rave DJ camps?

X.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:35 pm

Desert Duck wrote:I find my homemade 1' stakes work fine, I just drive them all the way into the ground.

Yep some of my three footers were a little long.
1/2" or even 3/8" Rebar about 18" long with a large nut welded on end driven all the way in would probably be perfect cannot imagine tring to pound those candy canes in!

Desert Duck · Post by **Desert Duck** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:37 pm

What I use is silver sided tarp. It makes a HUGE difference, if you don't want to be frying in your tent by 8 am you'll have something extra. Air gap between shade and tent helps a LOT, too.

Hoop where you want, it's Burningman.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:38 pm

shiny-sided tent sounds perfect!

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:39 pm

Heh, with you all here, I'll run past some more of the ideas Dad and I came up with (didn't want to talk funeral talk ALL week, so we alternated with Burning Man concepts :)..

1 - instead of packing water in, buying ice and melting it? Maybe having water for day 1, so there's time for melting to occur before water is needed?

2 - shade created with tarp strung over ropes.. so, support poles pounded in, guy ropes tied for the poles, and rope strung from pole to pole, for center of lean-to style shade.. second set set a bit farther back, and a wee bit lower, to provide more standing area under shade, but not flat enough to trap any potential rain, tarp is then attached along high rope, hangs over medium rope, and is staked to ground

3 - using bungees somewhere instead of non-stretch rope to decrease flapping sound and strain?

Desert Duck · Post by **Desert Duck** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:43 pm

All of these things can work. Make sure you stake down the bases of your uprights-you can pound in a straight piece of rebar leaving 1' sticking out and slide posts over these.
Personally, I have my shade go all the way to the ground for my tent-reduces dust and wind effects.

Oh, for water-make arrangements for someone to bring extra for you, makes life sooo much easier. Have you decided to camp with us, yet? Problem solved.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:46 pm

Xta_G wrote:Heh, with you all here, I'll run past some more of the ideas Dad and I came up with (didn't want to talk funeral talk ALL week, so we alternated with Burning Man concepts ..

1 - instead of packing water in, buying ice and melting it? Maybe having water for day 1, so there's time for melting to occur before water is needed?

2 - shade created with tarp strung over ropes.. so, support poles pounded in, guy ropes tied for the poles, and rope strung from pole to pole, for center of lean-to style shade.. second set set a bit farther back, and a wee bit lower, to provide more standing area under shade, but not flat enough to trap any potential rain, tarp is then attached along high rope, hangs over medium rope, and is staked to ground

3 - using bungees somewhere instead of non-stretch rope to decrease flapping sound and strain?

1.) - Well if you got the money might work but Ice is not always there, heavy and needs to be transported. So make sure you have money and bike with basket.
2.) - Sounds good!
3.) - yes bungees good for strain!

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:48 pm

<sniffle> Was just checking my blogs list, and my sister is finally back to writing.. did a little bit about what happened on the day Dave passed, which filled in the gaps for me, but wasn't stuff I wanted to ask about... told her about the toast you guys gave Dave last night when she and I were on MSN earlier tonight... <sigh> Guess the grief will still be around for a while, and I haven't recovered as quickly as I though. http://broadzilla-goes.blogspot.com/ if anyone is curious.. no gore, just a quick story about how she found out, and what the support crew she's got up there managed to do for her...

DD... as tempted as I am, I'm gonna keep working on VCamp for a while, and hope we can pull it off. :) Is there something particularly un-effective about the melting-ice plan? Ways to make it work better? Hassles involved that I don't know about?

X.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:49 pm

Xta_G wrote:Heh, with you all here, I'll run past some more of the ideas Dad and I came up with (didn't want to talk funeral talk ALL week, so we alternated with Burning Man concepts ..

1 - instead of packing water in, buying ice and melting it? Maybe having water for day 1, so there's time for melting to occur before water is needed?

2 - shade created with tarp strung over ropes.. so, support poles pounded in, guy ropes tied for the poles, and rope strung from pole to pole, for center of lean-to style shade.. second set set a bit farther back, and a wee bit lower, to provide more standing area under shade, but not flat enough to trap any potential rain, tarp is then attached along high rope, hangs over medium rope, and is staked to ground

3 - using bungees somewhere instead of non-stretch rope to decrease flapping sound and strain?

Bring dad and drive down!

PurpleKoosh · Post by **PurpleKoosh** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:50 pm

Xta_G wrote:I'm a Heinlien fan... and his definition (used by.. hm.. Lazarus Long? Or someone talking to him? Jubal Harshaw?) of love was along the lines of "if their happiness is critical to yours..." So, I like that. If someone is close enough to me that I would be unable to be happy myself if they were in pain/sorrow/suffering and I could not brush that aside.. that's love.

Rebuilding stuff is HARD... and it sounds like what you did tonight is one of those awkward experiences that happens in the middle zone, during the process of figuring out whether or not there is enough value to put the PAINFUL effort in to getting through the crap to the good stuff.

Funny you should bring Heinlein into it; the ex and I are both fans (and referred back to him more than once when we came out to his mother as poly...). The word was "essential," I believe, and yeah, that's where I was. (Actually, I'd gone beyond that, to the point where his happiness was preferential to my own...and, well, it was just ugly and enabling and codependent and we needed to split.)

The bad times were FUCKING miserable. The good times were amazing...and still outweigh the bad.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:50 pm

Melting ice plan has potential for contamination?

PurpleKoosh · Post by **PurpleKoosh** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:51 pm

Desert Duck wrote:I find my homemade 1' stakes work fine, I just drive them all the way into the ground.

*nods* I got 12" aluminum nails from the hardware store, and they were great. I'm only dealing with a 9x9 dome, though; your mileage (and tent) may vary.

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:51 pm

Eeep.. while I secretly wonder if my parents are secretly swingers, they are outwardly pretty straight (though mostly not narrow, accepting of anyone I have ever brought home or mentioned, at least...).. so I'm not sure how I'd feel about having them around when I'm planning to find some playful trouble :) And, telling that as soon as we get to BRC, I'm gonna ditch them, sounds pretty nasty.. Sis is coming next year, maybe she and I can then talk about bringing the folks :)

X.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:52 pm

Hey DD toss me a beer!

Desert Duck · Post by **Desert Duck** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:53 pm

Xta_G wrote:, and is staked to ground

Never mind.

Oh, you might run some additional lines in an "X" pattern between poles for more tarp support.

Ice- Camp Arctica can run out randomly and without notice. You're honestly better off making sure you've got water on site. Oh, yeah the contamination thing too.

Beer, give me a sec.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:53 pm

Xta_G wrote:Eeep.. while I secretly wonder if my parents are secretly swingers, they are outwardly pretty straight (though mostly not narrow, accepting of anyone I have ever brought home or mentioned, at least...).. so I'm not sure how I'd feel about having them around when I'm planning to find some playful trouble And, telling that as soon as we get to BRC, I'm gonna ditch them, sounds pretty nasty.. Sis is coming next year, maybe she and I can then talk about bringing the folks

X.

No you guys come together and leave together all other bets are off just agree on it at home. Might be the best thing you two/three/four ever do together!

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:59 pm

Koosh - sounds just like us way back then.. we were both Heinlien fans, and while I didn't tell my parents about it, when I moved away from home to live in Vancouver, it was to move in with him and his other girlfriend.. and later in our lives we also tried swapping partners for a while (my relationship survived for another year past that, his ended quickly in divorce)... and at a point when he had been in SAA for a while to help get his priorities straight, he gave me the loving message that he needed to move to a healthier place in life, and having codependent me needing him for support wasn't a healthy thing.. so off I went to counselling, dealt with a lot of my own crap, we stuck through that nasty chunk, and are "family" to each other now....

I love Heinlien's vision of how relationships and families should work.. I just haven't been successfull at it yet myself, am generally too insecure to start relationships let alone share.. though I'll be a third to a relationship if I don't have strong ties to either partner that would be affected... the poly movement is new to me, saw it in your profile, and in Lying' Bare's (of Burning Tribe, over on Tribe.net she's a staunch V Camp supporter..) and the concepts look appealing..

RD - contamination from.. the ice workers? the thingy I put it in? people wandering by and playing with my ice? What size does it come in, anyway? Block dimensions, please :)

X.

PurpleKoosh · Post by **PurpleKoosh** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:02 am

*nods* There's a definite need for more therapy in my life, though that's another of the things that's coming up against my "bad case of broke." (Not least because I'd want to go back to my old therapist, which would mean an hour's drive each way and the attendant gas cost as well as her session fee.)

And it is SO past my bedtime.... Thanks for the chat, Xta. *hugs*

G'night everyone.

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:02 am

DD - ah, thanks for the ice info... did you read that my shade was going to be a one-sided thing? If it faces south (I think that was what you suggested) does it have the same effectiveness as a double-sided-to-the-ground thing for dust and noise? Is double-sided worth the extra cost and packing and setup?

Ohyeah, and what would you suggest for support poles for my shade? Trying to figure out what can be PACKED, potentially thrown onto a Greyhound bus, and not require a stop in the hardware store in Reno...

X.

Desert Duck · Post by **Desert Duck** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:05 am

First, beer for Rock.

Next, easiest to pack would be pvc-say 8-4' lengths with connectors? Something like that.

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:05 am

'night, Koosh.. <squeeze> You're welcome, anytime :)

RD - do you think there's any potential that, by taking my parents to Burning Man, I might be faced with incredible guilt/angst if their relationship winds up being irrevocably challenged? I've read some pretty amazing posts by people who have done the whole-family thing, and it sounds like it works well in some places... mebbe I just haven't seen the beauty of the event, and while being able to imagine it being wonderful for ME, I can't imagine it also being wonderful for THEM...

X.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:07 am

All of the above plus blowing dust, sitting warm all day etc

standard size bags of cubes and big blocks

Xta_G · Post by **Xta_G** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:08 am

PVC sounds do-able..

I just realized, that my idea of using ice alone as my water doesn't address the packing-out of greywater, either.. k, screw that.

Any of you tried the t-shirts or wool-blanket dip/spray version of an evap pond?

X.

Desert Duck · Post by **Desert Duck** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:08 am

Night, Koosh (hugs) sleep good.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:10 am

Xta_G wrote:'night, Koosh.. <squeeze> You're welcome, anytime

RD - do you think there's any potential that, by taking my parents to Burning Man, I might be faced with incredible guilt/angst if their relationship winds up being irrevocably challenged? I've read some pretty amazing posts by people who have done the whole-family thing, and it sounds like it works well in some places... mebbe I just haven't seen the beauty of the event, and while being able to imagine it being wonderful for ME, I can't imagine it also being wonderful for THEM...

X.

Well first thing is they would have to want to go for themselves not you!
If they went for themselves than toss any resultant guilt out window.

I do not think Burning Man tends to break up healty relationships if they have problems already than yes it might magnify them or cure them!

Desert Duck · Post by **Desert Duck** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:10 am

I came up with evapping grey water off our burn barrel. Works well if the barrel is level and well attended.

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:11 am

Thanks for the beer DD
Goodnight Koosh

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:12 am

Desert Duck wrote:I came up with evapping grey water off our burn barrel. Works well if the barrel is level and well attended.

Should build a still then you could drink pure water from grey water off burn barrel

Rockdad · Post by **Rockdad** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:13 am

Xta_G wrote:PVC sounds do-able..

I just realized, that my idea of using ice alone as my water doesn't address the packing-out of greywater, either.. k, screw that.

Any of you tried the t-shirts or wool-blanket dip/spray version of an evap pond?

X.

shhhh secret- if its just you sprinkle on Playa your not bringing enough to worry about!

Sensei · Post by **Sensei** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:16 am

Evening, Mr. Dad, Mr. Duck, Ms. G...

Say, I see that I just missed Kooshie. Shee-it. Will you foks do me a favor and tell her that Sensei thinks she's the bee's knees?

Purdy please?

Holy moly, I gots to go! Smooches all around!