Tipi Question

[kiltboy]

I have a fairly large (24' diameter) tipi that I would love to bring to the playa. The only problem is that the poles are 35 ft long and kinda hard to put on my lil car. I was wondering if I could perhaps cut them in half and use some sort of connecter at the playa (e.g. pvc). If anyone has any experience, ideas, or solutions.......HELP!!

thanks

[Bob]

I don't do teepees, but FWIW:

If it's a good set of wood poles, it'd be a shame to cut them up and spoil the authenticity and possibly the integrity, but that's up to you.

My guess is 2 or 3 ft lengths of light steel pipe (electrical conduit or possibly cyclone-fence poles) secured with 1/4 in. or 5/16 thru-bolts would work, but only with a lot of luck on sizing the pipe to the pole diameter and a lot of work shaving the poles for a close fit.

For examples, you might take a look at nautical books & mags (eg Dover Pubs. or Wooden Boat Mag.), or go to a traditional boatyard, to see what they do with wooden masts for small boats.

35 ft is pretty long. Alternatives such as military-surplus sectioned fiberglass poles used to prop up camo netting might not be hefty enough at that length.

[cowgirl]

can anyone else tell us their experience with tipis at burning man?

[bernard]

Hi folks,
I've been to BM in 03, 04 and 05, with dome tent, camper or RV.
This year, I'm helping setting up a camp. Based on my experience, I did recommend to use "V1" domes and flat shaders. That's simple, cheap, and proven gear at BM
A long story made short, we'll bring two 20' teepee, made with custom-made plastic cover and 20' bamboo poles. And I'll be in charge of raising them...
I'm not exactely happy with that, but I'll row the boat...

I have a couple of quesions :

1 - Why are there so few Tipis on BM ?
They're just out-fashioned by the domes, or teepees are not a gear to be used at BM. Cause of heat ? Cause of wind ?

2 - Have anyone used a Teepee at BM ?
What should I know about Teepees at BM ?
What should I bring ? Extra rope ? Extra rebar ? No Teepee at all ?

3 - Anyone in Los Angeles with some time and experience ?
I'd like to setup one/two of the teepees some week-end in L.A.
With some help, we could learn so much faster...

Thanks.
/bernard/

[Bob]

Try searching the eplaya for "teepee(s)" or "tipi(s)".

As to why so few teepees -- may as well ask, "Why so few wikiups?"

Friend of mine used a teepee for a couple of years and liked it; he used an inner liner of some sort. One time it got blown ass over teakettle when a big wind came up before he had a chance to stake it down.

[bernard]

Bob,

I sure did search before posting. Some occurences, no real thread.
Thanks for the burst wind warning. I can see that happening.
That's why I want to pratice before moving to black rock.

Thanks
/bm/

[Hoolie]

I think a tipi would be awesome at BM. But the one thing that stops me from using one is the task of transporting 20-foot long poles. That may be one reason why people tend not to use them. Whereas a dome frame gets broken down into shorter, more manageable parts.

[theCryptofishist]

I'm also wondering if there's a corrolation between the amount of material you have to buy and pack and the shade footprint provided there by. The ratio is much better with a dome. I'd suggest finding a teepee forum and then start quizzing about burning man conditions. Some may have been there, and the others may have camped in comparable ones. And ask about breaking down poles for transport while you're at it.

[dragonfly Jafe]

As to why so few teepees -- may as well ask, "Why so few wikiups?"

Hey, I used a wikiup made from PVC for years...

[diane o'thirst]

I think there aren't many tipis at the Burn because they haven't caught on. Also, the poles are somewhat unwieldy to transport, because they can't be broken down or telescoped; forget it if you don't have a roofrack. Whereas in a dome, the longest single strut you have to deal with is usually one-fifth the length of a tipi pole.

I agree, tipis rock. I still have a dream of putting together a roundhouse (tipi, ger/yurt, bender, wigwam, sweatlodge) theme camp one of these years.

We had a small (12') tipi in Opera Camp back in 2000. Don't know who brought it but it became a general rendez-vous point for the camp's couples.

Twenty foot tipi! Is that diameter or height? You could sleep the whole tribe in there — or is that the intention?

[Kinetic IV]

Pole length would be a good answer but I bet the real answer is that few people are experienced with them anymore. Heck even I was able to build a dome using the info from the eplaya and links people suggested. But a tipi? As cool as they are I wouldn't have the first clue on how to set one up. And I wasn't a boy scout so any rope work or knots would be difficult to do. If you take one out there and have a good experience with it perhaps you would consider putting up a website to share your lessons learned and maybe persuade others to give it a try? You could take pix during the setup and teardown phases and some people might think it's easier than setting up a dome...or the opposite...in any event I thought I'd toss that out as something to consider.

[unjonharley]

In 04 a couple that got married at BM had a T P for there honymoon.

[theCryptofishist]

Jack Horner swears by them, and my friend Steve thinks quite highly of them as well. I don't know if this is the one I've heard about that was so highly recommended--I remember a pocketbook paperback, but it might be a place to start.

[Ugly Dougly]

Always bring plenty of TP.

[frenchblue1]

hopefully you have a plan to anchor it down...otherwise it will be airborn. Love to see it on the Playa!

[theCryptofishist]

Or over the playa?

[TipiDan]

Regarding tipis at Burning Man?
Let's chat...
Completely off the cuff and verbatim here.
No Indian in his (or her) right mind
would have ventured onto the playa without very good reasons.
I have no doubt
they all would have considered it a place of spirits and of death.
The white scorpions and praying mantises
would have dwelled there then,
as they do now.

Great Basin Indians lived in wikiups
constructed from native materials, often limbs and juniper bark:
most were located within the Pinyon/Juniper zone
for shelter, firewood, and food.

The best place to set up a tipi is on the Great Plains or in a meadow.
Tipi camping is made delightful
when you can throw your buffalo robes (or rugs) down
on a ready-made carpet of soft, clean grasses.
With time such ground cloth materials become damp
over such a grassy layer, and the camp needed to be moved.
But tipi camps were never meant to be in any given place for too long. Under ideal conditions it would be time to move along
just before the area was beginning to get stale and unhealthy.

But the playa is not an ideal place to camp
by any method or means.
Every contrivance for dwelling that is brought out there
is put to the test in its own way.
Tipis are no exception
but they have their own interesting story to tell.

The playa is a tabula raza.
Anything that happens there
happens in a relative vacuum and is amplified
by the forces of chaos.
If you look at a pattern generated through fractal geometry
you'll often see a series of spirals spinning off of spirals.
Many patterns in nature also behave similarly.
Wind for instance.
If you gaze aloft under the right conditions (objective and subjective)
you will see tiny vortices spinning off of tiny vortices
spinning of vortices,
or any of the above in various patterns.
The cone of a tipi's canvas (on the playa)
is like an interference pattern
in the middle of the potential chaos of the void.
The cone (of a tipi) encourages the creation of cone shaped vortices. These can spin off from either side of the canvas:
imagine an infinite number of diminuating vortices
spawning diminuating vortices extending into infinity
from the outside of the canvas
and
an almost infinite number of diminuating vortices
spawning diminuating vortices
extending inward from the interior surface of the canvas
until they collide somewhere near the center
of the interior of the lodge.
By that time
the pattern would be much too complex
to cancel itself out
like the ripples from two pebbles thrown into a pool
or like
the intersecting sound waves
proceeding out
from two chimed Tibetan cymbals
when you can
lean into the sound
and hear the waves canceling each other out
with a "phwt,phwt,phwt, phwt!"

The playa is much too big and the wind patterns potentially much too complex.
But the thing to bear in mind out on the playa
is that it CAN all start from nothing; from perfect stillness, or as close to perfect stillness as it is possible to get on this plant.
So you can see or sense the early-spawning PRIMARY vortices sometimes.
The Chinese have a saying
that the motion of a butterfly's wings once initiated,
will travel all the way around the world
and eventually caress the back of the butterfly with a soft puff.
The truth is more complex because
of the multitude of interference patterns.
But Nevada can be different.
In the back country in isolated areas under the right conditions
of stillness one human can raise a wind
by flapping a piece of cardboard.
Such prodigies are certainly possible on the playa
as we have all seen on a grand scale
when the Man (or more properly the Man’s dais)
raises his whirlwinds.

How does all this relate to setting up a tipi at Burning Man?
Well, it's like this...
If you live in a cone in an environment
where the winds of chaos are calling all the shots
you are living in a vortex.
The particularly nasty thing about it is that
the vortices inside the tipi pick up the dust
from the vortices that are spinning outside the tipi
and deposit it on YOU,
the tipi camper.

A tipi is a terrible choice for a tent that you would use on the playa:
it amplifies all the pure exuberant chaos of the playa wind
and brings it all back home for you.
;)
Happy Day! ;\

You want ETHNIC TENTAGE?
The best kind of a tent to set up on the playa
s a North Africa designed tent called an "Ouled Nail".
And dark colors are better because the block the sunlight and absorb the heat and then radiate it back and away from the people sitting in the breeze below.

Oh, and that reminds me:
tipis SUCK on the playa for other reasons too.
Like no practical way to let the wind blow through
and still preserve enough shade.

TipiDan

[skygod]

A guy goes to the psychiatrist and tells him
"Doc, everytime I go to sleep I dream I'm a Teepee or a Wigwam. It's driving me crazy. What do I do"
So the psychiatrist says "Don't worry. You're just too tense".

[helitack]

Regarding tipis at Burning Man?
Let's chat...
Completely off the cuff and verbatim here.
No Indian in his (or her) right mind
would have ventured onto the playa without very good reasons.
I have no doubt
they all would have considered it a place of spirits and of death.
The white scorpions and praying mantises
would have dwelled there then,
as they do now.

Great Basin Indians lived in wikiups
constructed from native materials, often limbs and juniper bark:
most were located within the Pinyon/Juniper zone
for shelter, firewood, and food.

The best place to set up a tipi is on the Great Plains or in a meadow.
Tipi camping is made delightful
when you can throw your buffalo robes (or rugs) down
on a ready-made carpet of soft, clean grasses.
With time such ground cloth materials become damp
over such a grassy layer, and the camp needed to be moved.
But tipi camps were never meant to be in any given place for too long. Under ideal conditions it would be time to move along
just before the area was beginning to get stale and unhealthy.

But the playa is not an ideal place to camp
by any method or means.
Every contrivance for dwelling that is brought out there
is put to the test in its own way.
Tipis are no exception
but they have their own interesting story to tell.

The playa is a tabula raza.
Anything that happens there
happens in a relative vacuum and is amplified
by the forces of chaos.
If you look at a pattern generated through fractal geometry
you'll often see a series of spirals spinning off of spirals.
Many patterns in nature also behave similarly.
Wind for instance.
If you gaze aloft under the right conditions (objective and subjective)
you will see tiny vortices spinning off of tiny vortices
spinning of vortices,
or any of the above in various patterns.
The cone of a tipi's canvas (on the playa)
is like an interference pattern
in the middle of the potential chaos of the void.
The cone (of a tipi) encourages the creation of cone shaped vortices. These can spin off from either side of the canvas:
imagine an infinite number of diminuating vortices
spawning diminuating vortices extending into infinity
from the outside of the canvas
and
an almost infinite number of diminuating vortices
spawning diminuating vortices
extending inward from the interior surface of the canvas
until they collide somewhere near the center
of the interior of the lodge.
By that time
the pattern would be much too complex
to cancel itself out
like the ripples from two pebbles thrown into a pool
or like
the intersecting sound waves
proceeding out
from two chimed Tibetan cymbals
when you can
lean into the sound
and hear the waves canceling each other out
with a "phwt,phwt,phwt, phwt!"

The playa is much too big and the wind patterns potentially much too complex.
But the thing to bear in mind out on the playa
is that it CAN all start from nothing; from perfect stillness, or as close to perfect stillness as it is possible to get on this plant.
So you can see or sense the early-spawning PRIMARY vortices sometimes.
The Chinese have a saying
that the motion of a butterfly's wings once initiated,
will travel all the way around the world
and eventually caress the back of the butterfly with a soft puff.
The truth is more complex because
of the multitude of interference patterns.
But Nevada can be different.
In the back country in isolated areas under the right conditions
of stillness one human can raise a wind
by flapping a piece of cardboard.
Such prodigies are certainly possible on the playa
as we have all seen on a grand scale
when the Man (or more properly the Man’s dais)
raises his whirlwinds.

How does all this relate to setting up a tipi at Burning Man?
Well, it's like this...
If you live in a cone in an environment
where the winds of chaos are calling all the shots
you are living in a vortex.
The particularly nasty thing about it is that
the vortices inside the tipi pick up the dust
from the vortices that are spinning outside the tipi
and deposit it on YOU,
the tipi camper.

A tipi is a terrible choice for a tent that you would use on the playa:
it amplifies all the pure exuberant chaos of the playa wind
and brings it all back home for you.

Happy Day! ;\

You want ETHNIC TENTAGE?
The best kind of a tent to set up on the playa
s a North Africa designed tent called an "Ouled Nail".
And dark colors are better because the block the sunlight and absorb the heat and then radiate it back and away from the people sitting in the breeze below.

Oh, and that reminds me:
tipis SUCK on the playa for other reasons too.
Like no practical way to let the wind blow through
and still preserve enough shade.

TipiDan

Despite this load of shit, tipis do work on the playa

[BAS]

Igloos, on the other hand....

[Dr BENWAYLADEN]

Huh...I guess no one told them they
don't work.

[ELOstone]

Greetings and Salutations!
I am thinking about coming to my 1st BM this year and would really love to bring my 20' tipi. As has been said in this thread previously, the 27' long poles are the rub in this consideration. I'm wondering if there are many busses/RVs that come to the BM, as the poles might be more easily transported on a vehicle like a bus. I live in beautiful western Wyoming and could easily rideshare...expense isnt really a big deal. My tipi really is an AWESOME tipi, w/custom paint, full liner w/ ozan and fully carpeted.
Any suggestions? Thanx in advance!

[gyre]

http://www.shelsys.com/

Pole connectors.
And some unusual fittings as well.
Even ones to make a square shade structure.

[sassy_sue_z]

Last year we used 3 tipis made from old hospital curtains and PVC (12 foot) and they worked wonderfully. As far as transport goes, since they were little we were able to just load the poles in the van. Perhaps not an extremely helpful post, just furthering the idea that tipis do work.

[unjonharley]

BEWARE, of playa tipicreepers..

[Dusty Pony]

My boy and i brought our tipi out to the playa this year - all the way from massachusetts. We sent it out on a container truck. It was the best tent ever!

The canvas helped to keep the air inside cool in the morning, so it was easy to sleep until at least 11:30 and not be suffocated by heat. We had a liner - which is just about essential for more privacy and comfort, because the edge of the canvas outer skin is actually a few inches off the ground.

It held up amazingly to the wind, but no suprise, just like any tent they did not keep the dust out, especially when we went out and forgot to close the smoke flaps! I must say, though, it was a really sweet space to ride out a dust storm in. It was like transplanting a really beautiful bedroom right onto the playa.

We had another shade structure of cooking under, etc... Although we could have a contained fire in the tipi - our's is 14' in diameter- the smallest that you can safely have a fire inside. It is truly magical, and really made our playa experience amazing.

A tipi is wonderful on the playa - but it is a big commitment. We plan to enjoy ours year round, and luckily have access to a place to store the poles, and a vehicle that can handle them. Lots of tipi owners just put them up once in the yard and keep them up all the time. Hopefully we will be able to do that one day!

Good luck if you decide to take the plunge!
A few pics are on my site www.dustyponyranch.org

[Simon of the Playa]

tipi's, teepee's, however you want to spell it are the bomb diggity.

i was in root society (unofficially camp Hi HowAreYa) at the corner of 10 and esplanade with all the tipis (19 total) they are made by a really good guy named andi from BC.

his company is rogue dwellings, if you cant find him on the web, ping me and i'll give you his cell #...

during the wind storms they are SOLID....during the dust storms SOLID.

each one takes about 25 minutes to erect, start to finish.

they are warm at night, relatively cool during the day, and MUCH larger inside than you would think...

i normally am quite tongue in cheek on this e-playa, but for once i am totally straight, i think tipi's are great, and highly recommend them.


my girlfriend and i want to make one for summer camping with her kids, and we've already had a debate on the design for the outside...


i wanted a spongebob theme, but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

[BitterDan]

How do you carry the poles to the playa? I mean, those things are like 20 feet long aren't they?

[theCryptofishist]

How do you carry the poles to the playa?

Travois, you silly boy.

[BitterDan]

I'll admit that I had to look that word up on Wikipedia...