So what's to be done then? (get ready to read; it's long)

Fat SAM · Post by **Fat SAM** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:17 pm

I don't know...I don't know if I care that much that Burning Man has become such a well known social institution that it appears on The Simpsons, Malcolm in the Middle, Jay Leno, American Dad, Discovery Channel......Of course it's gotten attention. It is afterall a big party; word tends to spread about really good parties. I'm sure for those that have been there for so much longer than I have, it's a more difficult argument. To those people, though, I ask you to examine the rest of your personal beliefs for precedent...do you value detachment from material things? I know a lot of burners (long time burners, too) who claim buddhist, zen, or Nietzsche-ist beliefs but who cling to "how things should be."

It is what it is. Does it seem exclusivist to bitch about more people coming? Kind of. Is it a pain in the ass to have a mess of idiots show up who are there to look at boobies? Yeah. Is it easier to say "Throw your own party" than it is to actually throw your own party? Yes.

I think the problem with the whole idea of telling people to throw their own parties is that everybody is chasing it...I was at HeebeeGeeBee at some Ethneogenic seminar...everybody was talking about eating various drugs and the experiences that people "should" have and how they should go about doing that and there was talk of finding a "spirit guide" and setting up everything in advance so that you could have some big epiphany...I suppose that those things are all well and good, but I've done A LOT of hallucinogens and what I've found is that it's really easy to screw up a trip when you place too many expectations on it. What if you set up all this shit and then get let down?

This, I think, is the problem with people really getting the initiative to have their own event. I wonder if LH was thinking of having a city spring up around his little solstice beach party the first time he threw one. Wouldn't it be great to get ten friends together and go and camp somewhere for a week, somewhere really secluded? The responses I get when I ask people that usually include the phrase "it wouldn't be the same." OK. It's never the same. You can never step into the same river twice. Your burn will never be the same twice. Lower your expectations.

We can bitch about all this exposure, we can bandy the idea of throwing/attending a regional, we can be complacent or content (whichever you which) and just go to Burning Man; there are myriad options available. I'm for doing a regional, but perhaps on a very personal level. Camping in the desert with 35000 people is a whole lot of fun, but camping with a bunch of friends is just as rad...Imagine the freedom...no LEO's, do whatever you want, be naked, build a thing to burn if you want, camp however you want, set up wacky ass sound equipment...It'll probably be cheaper, too. Most importantly, though, is that there are no expectations. It's not a small Burning Man, it's not a regional Burn; it's a camping trip for a week. But that's my thing, I guess.

The parallels to drug use continue for me...After a while, I quit doing them - not because I didn't like it, but because I decided I had learned enough from the experience. I realized at one point that doing more hallucinogens would only be chasing the previous trips. Why? Why not try having a new trip?

Do you feel the same way? Do you know what I'm saying? Do you feel differently? Do you think I'm full of shit?

What do you got, e-playans?

Post by **Eric** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:47 pm

Fat SAM wrote:Do you feel the same way? Do you know what I'm saying? Do you feel differently? Do you think I'm full of shit?

I think you stated my own feelings better than I could.

I agree- it is what it is.

bravetiger · Post by **bravetiger** » Sat Sep 24, 2005 1:23 am

Cabanasprings · Post by **Cabanasprings** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:58 am

Thanks for the post - very well said.

It's difficult to say wether or not the lessons we learn from a bad experience are worth having gone through said experience. I guess it depends on the experience and the lesson learned. Profound - huh? Having said that I used to believe justification to be the mother of invention. I could justify "chasing it" for the cause. The cause of learning a new lesson. And then came the expectation. The expectation that "chasing it" would provide me with wisdom. So my expectation of wisdom justified my need to chase. Then came the trip I didn't learn from and then another and another and my expectaions were not fullfilled and I was nolonger justified. So I quit. I am lucky.

And now for some happy, smiley shit. Expectations are great if they are personal. When your expectations are based on the actions or reactions of others then generally you are fucked. This is what I learned. It works for Burningman. It works for relationships. It works for my career. So go forth and expect. Expectations can be a self fullfilling prophecy. Expect great things for yourself. Just don't expect others to share your expectations.

EvilDustBooger · Post by **EvilDustBooger** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:05 am

Very Thoughtful words Fat SAM.
I just returned from a weekend camping trip with friends/family
at a remote crystal clear spring creek.
We rinsed and shook alot of playa-dust from our gear, set up camp
and had a fabulous time...bonfire....the works.
It is Especially nice to have your own little un-travelled Eden to go to and do as you please far away from the influences of the default society.
With burning man such a large event, and it being such an epic journey through the default system to prepare for and then get there, it stands to reason that BM is moving further and further from the off-beat esoteric art festival that not many have heard of and travelling towards the large off-beat state type fair festival(sans the vendors).......that folks are starting to talk about......
......but still worth the time and expense for me and sweety.

It is a grand time if you just take it as it comes, and try to add something nice to the mix.

And as far as the people who are upset or disagree with the various different aspects, who can`t abide this or that, and who take really strong stands....They are not my idea of the typical tolerant types that I really adore attending BM with.....
.....and I try not to pay too much attention to them.....

It was good to meet you Fat SAM. I am really sorry we didn`t get to
chat more at the M&G........

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:31 am

What to do? Well, sometime around the end of the year or so LH'll decide on a theme, which I will or won't use as the takeoff point for some sort of artistic expression. A month or two later I'll drop two hundred or so bucks on a ticket. Approximately 200 days after that I'll get on I-80 and head West.
And then for a week I'll relax, look at some really, really interesting people and things, make a few things myself, spend some quality time with some of the most entertaining and creative people I've ever known, and enjoy some really, really big fires.
Is it going to Snuff My Burn that some tiny molecule of my ice money goes, in a roundabout way, to an organization that, on a national level, discriminates against some of my fellow people?
NO.
Is it going to MOOP My Campsite that the Discos And Ovaries Channel performed unenlightened acts of photography, and may do so again?
NO.
What about the partygoers who refused to enter a polite state of Kumbaya during the Temple Burn? Will that really Bend My Dome Strut?
NO.
Growing pains, that's all....Do you REALLY want to go party with forty thousand people that all have the exact, same opinion about everything?
NO.
Is there room for improvement, and enlightenment, and growth?
HELL YES.

See you in 334 days.

d6 · Post by d6 » Tue Sep 27, 2005 4:30 pm

Hiya Sam -
some of your stated reasons are exactly why I stopped doing shows in Re:?No!,
and also exactly why I love having the multiple yearly camping trips with friends -
(I take family to other camping spots, usually "the forest"and/or "water"),
but when out on the black rock, the choices are practically limit-less, sometimes
we set-up domes, run sound, lighting, have elevated fire-pits,
or we may just sit and stare,
irregardless it is extremely rewarding, sober or otherwise.

semi-DRIFTING<>
however, i am of the opinion that theres no point in trying to "re-live" anything on the fabled "first time list" where
the correlations between first: (ahem), rave, or concert, or illegally up/out-all-night, or burning man, performance you were part of,
or fill-in-the-blank_____, may take up entire volumes........
it's all an opportunity to improve and hopefully learn something....anything.......
even if what you have learned is that you no longer want to: goto burning man, dj, play in a band, blog, be intoxicated, hang in clubs/bars, create, work, sleep, drive,bicycle,dance,maintain positive body hygiene, etc.etc
motivation is a harsh reality, and "reality is waiting for a bus"

further drifting}{}{

but then you may develop hives, and visit crazytown, and decide "sh!t, I'm ready to try _____________again! lets go! it'll be great, much better than the last time.....yeah!"
or
"f-ck all that, i'm into ______________now"
or
perhaps you'll instead think that :
"maybe it IS easier to withdraw from life"
or
maybe you've finished, you're done, onto the next section, please.
or
you are one of the lucky few who have successfully fused their life w/experiences, drawing on all influences and flourish as a human...

who knows........for myself, circles of mania abound.......

*
d6,
you'll never know unless you do it for yourself-bot
*

ubu · Post by **ubu** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:39 am

that d6 is one brilliant robot. very nicely done.
kind of like madlib for burners.

mars · Post by **mars** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 7:29 pm

With burning man such a large event, and it being such an epic journey through the default system to prepare for and then get there, it stands to reason that BM is moving further and further from the off-beat esoteric art festival that not many have heard of and travelling towards the large off-beat state type fair festival(sans the vendors).

That may be so, TO A SMALL DEGREE, but have you been to a state fair lately? BM is still so far from anything in mainstream festival world. Not even close! I do think we can start to take it for granted after awhile and think it will always exist and think it will be assimilated ("resistance is futile"), and, yes, it's giant compared to what it once was--but, it's still the most creative party on earth.

And I intend to keep finding ways to contribute to it, no matter how many people are there, no matter who they are, and no matter why they're there.

Neon

LeChatNoir · Post by **LeChatNoir** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:11 pm

FatSAM...

these are things I've pondered myself. Give me a few days and I'll get back to you with a equally long post worthy of yours.

RagnaRoss · Post by **RagnaRoss** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:12 am

We have a little regional Burn at our spot in New Mexico. The place is Three-Sided Whole and the biggest event of the year is commonly referred to as "the May event." I'd been to three events previous and been very involved with the community beforehand and was egarly awaiting the big event. When it hit there were many problems. Dispite having bent over backwards for law enforcement and the County the sheriffs harassesed the shit out a lot of the people on the way in and out and felt obliged to patrol inside the gate dispite the fact we had our own badass ranger crew. We also had an issue with a bunch o' greenhorns from town who didn't even know to bring enough water!

The best fun I ever had at the whole was last fall equinox when we just had 50 people from the core community. An abundance of food and drink and drugs with a power system for music and lights that ran just fine off four car batteries.

Haven't we learned our lesson with civilization? You've got to keep it relatively small. Groups of people get too big in one place and the negative entropy of poverty and hunger and all kinds of social barriers kick in!

the fire elf · Post by **the fire elf** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:42 am

you see immanent undesirables...

i see multitudinous facets for reflection...

you speak of results...

i am acting for action's sake...

you cringe when you extrapolate...

i progenerate...

~transeunt

blyslv · Post by **blyslv** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 3:50 pm

Sad to report that the 3SidedWhole is not longer available fo BM events.

Hey Ragna, I bet we'd recognize each other!

lurker · Post by **lurker** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 11:41 am

I can't say that I really LIKE camping....can say that camping is definately not my reason for liking Burning Man.

The city is the engine, it's what drives the whole to new heights or lower gutters---for everyone.

If you wanted camping, pristine desert or crystal mountain streams or nature in any of it's myriad forms you wouldn't be walking on the e-l wire bedecked artistically transformed naked clothed masked playa....no?

You'd be holed up in some bastion of the wilderness away from the maelstrom of human creativity that is Black Rock City.

But you're not. You're gazing out at the man rising over the desert. You're wondering where your feet will take you and what your eyes will show you--and hoping taste, smell and touch get to come along, too. You're eveloped in something different....something strange...something that defies explanation in that other world out there.

And that's exactly where you want to be.

the fire elf · Post by **the fire elf** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:31 pm

And that's exactly where you want to be.

at Her side

the fire elf · Post by **the fire elf** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 12:10 pm

And that's exactly where you want to be.
at Her side

why do i live in this manner of ever seeking

casting myself aside only to look and see where i've been

daunt and dauntless seem to be the edges of things

the fire elf · Post by **the fire elf** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 12:19 pm

for me the burningman tv thing left strange taste in my mouth

interviews played without sound due to limitations imposed by library facilities

blah...

besides, people talking at cameras doesn't translate into expanding the immediacy of the experience...

least not to me in this moment...

might be the lack of sound...

any thoughts?

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 11:50 am

"Get ready, it's long", that's what my uncle used to say.

Fat SAM · Post by **Fat SAM** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 10:59 am

Did your uncle say that everytime, or was it on the first instance only? And did he at least reward you afterward?

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Sun Oct 08, 2006 11:09 pm

Fat SAM wrote:I don't know...I don't know if I care that much that Burning Man has become such a well known social institution...

I'm sure people thought the same deep thoughts about the USSR in 1938 or thereabouts.

Or maybe they moved to Brooklyn.

philosopher · Post by **philosopher** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 4:00 am

About the evolution of Burning Man: NO SPECTATORS!

sputnik · Post by **sputnik** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 5:48 am

Fat SAM wrote:Wouldn't it be great to get ten friends together and go and camp somewhere for a week, somewhere really secluded?

Michigan's Decomp was this weekend, and it was kickass. 150 or so people showed up for an event out in the middle of nowehere (practically). Chicago represented as did London and Toronto Canada. A good time was had by all as far as I can tell.

Just do it!

Zhust · Post by **Zhust** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:34 am

philosopher wrote:About the evolution of Burning Man: NO SPECTATORS!

Come see for yourself.

...

just like we all did once.

spectabillis · Post by **spectabillis** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:37 pm

ba-dum tish

philosopher · Post by **philosopher** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 5:35 pm

jaycerochester wrote:
philosopher wrote:About the evolution of Burning Man: NO SPECTATORS!
Come see for yourself.

...

just like we all did once.

Maybe I took that brevity-is-the-soul-of-wit thing a little too far. There were two tightly-packed layers in my original post, the first being an obvous reprise of the "No Spectators" mantra that hopes to encourage participation and the second being a little complexity theory/Darwinian riff to the effect that everyone who is in BRC has an effect (however obscure the causal chains) on how the event develops.

While I certainly would not want to be (mis)understood as discouraging people from acting on the impulse to see what's really going on, it's also true that every encouragement I extend comes with an element of evolutionary hope attached.

K-mom · Post by **K-mom** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:36 pm

A good experience, a bad experience, a new experience, ANY experience.
They're all better than sitting at home watching reruns.
This year was my second year; the 1st, everything was perfect - the 2nd, so much shit went wrong. I mean wrong! But anyways, my point is that even t hough more plans went wrong than right, I probably enjoyed this experience more. I'd say, the lows made the highs so much higher....

Petal of the Playa · Post by **Petal of the Playa** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:07 pm

every year is different for me - i go to experience it with no expectations and not to relive the previous

Desiree123 · Post by **Desiree123** » Sun Nov 12, 2006 3:26 pm

i agree

So what's to be done then? (get ready to read; it's long)

So what's to be done then? (get ready to read; it's long)

Re: So what's to be done then? (get ready to read; it's long

Family Events ROCK!

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Re: So what's to be done then? (get ready to read; it's long

Re: So what's to be done then? (get ready to read; it's long

Sardonic hypocrisy.

Re: Sardonic hypocrisy.