Post options for protesting the pavilion here

[Lo]

I thought it would be good to have information about what protests/resistances are being organized against the pavilion all in one place. If you are organizing something, or need help with a pavilion protest, please post your information, website, etc. here so everyone knows what options they have to get involved.

[Isotopia]

<snore>

[MozyBonz]

<snore>

yep!

[Toolmaker]

What about if someone wants to protest the protests? We also ahould have some folks protesting the fact that people are protesting the protest. Just for good measure we could have some folks protesting the lack of protest participants.

[Teo del Fuego]

how about we just wait and see the Pavillion before passing judgment on it?

[spectabillis]

how about we just wait and see the Pavillion before passing judgment on it?

depends. despite what may exist there's still reasons for some people's concerns.

people in disagreement is normal and protests are normal. so if there are enough who feel strongly about an issue who dont think its being addressed or getting what they think should be the right attention, its going to happen. others may not like it, but i would hope they choose to ignore it rather than escalate into a personal conflict.

its a polarizing issue thats important enough to let people have their say. when you block all avenues of voice, resentments build to a head.

[Archantael]

If the pavilion checks out then the protests get redirected against First Camp. Problem solved.

[Lo]

Perhaps my mistake here was in making it look as though I thought everyone wanted to protest the pavilion, I didn't mean to imply that, I just know that there are lots of people who do, and I wanted to make it easier for those of us to think about what to do, and know what others are planning.

For the record, I am concerned about advertising at Burning Man. I have been around since 98, and I have always resisted the "it used to be better" and "it's getting too mainstream" and "it's too bureaucratic and too many rules" mentality. Certainly many things about the original event (predating my attendance) have been irretrievably lost, but it's a living event, it grows and changes and that's just part of the deal. Still, the pavilion causes me concern in a way that nothing previous has. It is not possible to isolate BM from the world of commerce and business, we are part of the web of the world. The trick is to find the right relation. I think having advertising on the playa is the wrong relationship. I have yet to see a convincing argument that the pavilion is not advertising.

I can understand the desire not to have people protesting. Although I feel strongly that the pavilion should not be there, I don't really want the playa this year turned into a political event in that sense. I am not sure what the best way to act on this is; I definitely will not go to the pavilion, and I think that may be the best way to undermine it. If no one looks at the advertising, it's useless. But people are curious to see at least what it is, so I think people will end up going. I guess I do think that the best ideas have been about the culture-jamming etc. ideas. Playful, ironic, subversive seems the best way to go. But it has to be effective, too.

So, anyway, somehow this thread brought out the people who are against protesting, maybe I came off as unthoughtful or group-thinky, which I'm definitely not, trust me, in general I hate protests as much as you guys do. But some things really do matter to me enough to try to do something about it. I know there are people who agree with me out there. But I officially deem this thread a failure! If you want to PM me with your ideas, maybe we can make a web-clearinghouse off the eplaya.

[Teo del Fuego]

depends. despite what may exist there's still reasons for some people's concerns.

No doubt, specta-B, I was and am one of those concerned, though, either because of Larry's post, or sheer topic burn-out, I am less riled up and more willing to admit the possibility the BMorg has put sufficient controls in place.

Its funny, but I started bitching (in a real mild mannered way) about the Pavillion back in December 2006. That makes me a proto-bitch, I guess, or the choir leader of the church ladies. Of course, I wasnt bitching about corporate involvement, I was bitchin' about the modesty of the Big Green tarp design and how it, verily EVERYTHING, ever done will pale in comparison to the sublime splendor that was the 2005 Fun House Maze.

(Im laughin at myself with how many times Ive run that topic into the ground!)

[spectabillis]

So, anyway, somehow this thread brought out the people who are against protesting, maybe I came off as unthoughtful or group-thinky...

nah, there's just some that dont always handle disagreemnt well. but hopefully after you elaborated that wont happen.. *hopefully*

[Isotopia]

I have yet to see a convincing argument that the pavilion is not advertising.

Then it would seem that 1) you've not read the many assurances from Tom Price, Actiongirl and Larry Harvey on this and other boards (Tribe, 3playa, etc.) that there will in fact be *NO* advertising or 2) like a few tantrum tossing whiney fucks you've read them, don't believe them and choose instead to act negatively in spite of assurances made multiple times.

[spectabillis]

2) like a few tantrum tossing whiney fucks you've read them, don't believe them and choose instead to act negatively in spite of assurances made multiple times.

or, someone can think any showcase by a commercial group is advertising. i wouldnt call that being a whiney fuck anymore than a person who refers to someone else like that.

[Isotopia]

or, someone can think any showcase by a commercial group is advertising.

and I'd argue that those are the whiney, lame-fucks of which I speak. The one's who in spite of multiple assurances that advertising of any kind and in any measure would not - will not - be tolerated continue to exert their rigid, myopic interpretation of marketing to extend to anyone or anything being present on the playa that represents a commercially available commodity. That's such bullshit.

Such a lame, self-righteous fucking dogma.

i wouldnt call that being a whiney fuck anymore than a person who refers to someone else like that.

Whatever.

[MikeVDS]

That's such bullshit.

Not necessarily. While I agree that is probably most of the cases of what people are whining about, some may have some valid points. There are some products that are their label. I could do a "stick" figure of an ipod and just about everyone would know what it was. It's the reason so many knock offs try to imitate them. There are some cases where a commercial product is as much of it's symbol as the label.

I could care less either way, but you may be ignoring some valid points. If I'm annoyed with it, I'll ignore it or maybe heckle some people if there are any interesting targets (mostly countering those spreading disinformation).

[Dork]

With all respect, Isotopia, shut the fuck up. Assuming the promises made by the hat come to pass, any protests this year will likely be small and easily ignored. Just like the handfull of threads here and on the other boards on the subject. Yet you seem determined to lash out at anyone with a differing opinion.

Can't you just let us have our fun and see what happens?

My issue has never been with possible on-playa advertising, because that angle never made sense to me as a business model. The association with (and commodification of) our culture and exposure through the media, such as the business 2.0 article, seems to be the greater goal. It's exploiting a loophole in the no advertising rule, with the org lending a hand. The pavilion is simply a nice symbol of a trend I (perhaps falsely) see and it seems like a convenient time to speak out.

Please, if you see me protesting on the playa, feel free to ignore me.

[spectabillis]

and I'd argue that those are the whiney, lame-fucks of which I speak.

are you assuming each and every person who comes across this board has full knowledge of all the various discussions?

my point was not about this issue. it was more about discussions, your recent confrontational and insulting posts, and your reply thats similar to what seems to be annoying you - being a whiney fuck.

[BigCock]

[quote="Isotopia"][/quote]
PLONK!
buh bye

[plowman]

wine and fuck?? OK
a lame fuck is easier to catch though!!

[Toolmaker]

and I'd argue that those are the whiney, lame-fucks of which I speak.

are you assuming each and every person who comes across this board has full knowledge of all the various discussions?

I for one have fairly limited knowledge about the various discussions. When I read about the pavilion from the ORG website my initial reaction was OMG a fucking trade show at BM. After being clued in on a couple projects I started to feel a little better about the pavilion. I am totally serious about protesting the protesters etc.. I think that would be more fun. I keep thinking of the video of Shooter and pals protesting the ORG with bags over their heads. I plan on bringing paper bags for those that want to protest the protesters or those that want to protest the lack of protesters.

I will pass judgement on the pavilion after seeing it.. plans and schemes are in place to deal with violations of the 10 principles when they are found.

Now on to more important things.. who wants to play with lightsabers?

[Flammepus]

I have thought a bit about the pavillion and have come to the conclusion (before ever seeing it, before being inside of it, before seeing any of the art that is connected with it, before even leaving the warm, cuddly, womb-like social welfare state that I live in for Amerika!tm) that it is advertising. I really do hope that it is advertising 1) of good ideas and 2)to the companies who will be trying to capitalize on their BM-involvment that there is a growing consumer base of DIY people who want thier products. Yup: advertising. And.I.Don't.Care. Logos removed? No corporate moop? cool applications for cutting-edge technology? Ok then, I am going to go and look at it.

People who want to sit around it in a candle-light vigil; stage massive be-ins; have adult-diaper pee-ins; have infernal noise brigade-style street theatre; and so forth, are more than welcome to do so. I think that it will serve to make the whole scene just a little more exciting. Nothing brings publicity like controversy.

I might add here that I do have a natural distrust for people who judge things before they have experienced them (with some exceptions, natch). It smacks of dogmatism, arrogance, and at the least a lack of a sense of humor.

Now here is my challenge to the protest faction:
If you arrive at the event and find that, to your surprise, the pavillion is not an evil den of corporate advertising that represents the begining of the end of the spirit and philosophy of Burningman. I challenge you to stand buck naked (shoes and a hat/umbrella are ok) outside of the pavillion holding a sign that says, "I was wrong" for at least :30min at some time during the week.

Any takers?

[Karma]

I think the first solid dust storm that rolls thru will send the vendors running for the hills.
End of that !

[BigCock]

Now here is my challenge to the protest faction:
If you arrive at the event and find that, to your surprise, the pavillion is not an evil den of corporate advertising that represents the begining of the end of the spirit and philosophy of Burningman. I challenge you to stand buck naked (shoes and a hat/umbrella are ok) outside of the pavillion holding a sign that says, "I was wrong" for at least :30min at some time during the week.

Any takers?

I doubt there will be takers because contrition doesn't seem appropriate. The pavilion and the environmental theme are worth opposing in concept because of what has already happened: people declaring that they are going to the event this year to troll for their businesses or to educate people - at the behest of the org. These are people who would not otherwise attend or who would otherwise leave their work at home. Anyway, a good protest requires organizing (as opposed to waiting and seeing) which is what this thread is about.

I think the first solid dust storm that rolls thru will send the vendors running for the hills.
End of that !

They'll really fly when we set it on fire. On Tuesday.

[Lassen Forge]

TUESDAY???

You mean... we gotta wait??

[Archantael]

Tuesday is still too early. Wednesday would be better. The population of BRC would be larger and the media should be slightly settled down from taking in the visual orgy they just got dropped into.

I intend to have a bullhorn and maybe, time permitting some Westboro Baptist Church type or "STYLIZED" signs...I hate their message but the sign colors and use of simple graphics always grabs attention...I'll go with something that's been proven to work. I also intend to have one that can be directed specifically towards the excesses of First Camp participants but that's a tangent for another time.

Or if all else fails I could throw together the "white board on a stick" concept and use that....it's quick and cheap, easily changeable...and concealable so snoopy Gate staff has no idea what they're going to be used for. Heck I could even use that for a "protest" at the Meet and Greet...

[joel the ornery]

dare i recommend... restraint?

[Archantael]

dare i recommend... restraint?

Absolutely. I hope that all's well and there's no need to protest the pavilion. Instead someone could protest the use of logos on the playa, for example: "Lanceland, we power the playa" slapped on the grid generators for center camp. Or they could protest the lack of mass transit...to think a city of 50,000 people doesn't even have reliable bus service, and for crying out loud it's supposed to be a green city....yeah, the possibilities are endless.

[MikeVDS]

I think the first solid dust storm that rolls thru will send the vendors running for the hills.
End of that !

The few companies or people I know of who'll be there, came from the playa, not the business world. I have a small sample size so I don't know what the overall tone will be. These people have been "advertising" on the playa for years, since they first brought out their weird idea and shared it with us, even before many thought they'd ever considering selling the product to those who didn't want to make it for themselves. This is what gives me optimism for this whole thing.

[Teo del Fuego]

adult-diaper pee-ins

You mean other people do this too? Cool!

[Toolmaker]

Now here is my challenge to the protest faction:
If you arrive at the event and find that, to your surprise, the pavillion is not an evil den of corporate advertising that represents the begining of the end of the spirit and philosophy of Burningman. I challenge you to stand buck naked (shoes and a hat/umbrella are ok) outside of the pavillion holding a sign that says, "I was wrong" for at least :30min at some time during the week.

Any takers?

Shit, I'll do that regardless more than likely.

[Finnegan]

With all respect, Isotopia, shut the fuck up.

Well said. Thank you. Makes me want to protest something..