this is SAD

djsiago · Post by **djsiago** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:24 am

THIS IS SO SAD this world is being controled by the arab countries because they controlling the gas prices , by 2012,gallon of 87 regular will cost almost 10 dollars , the very sad thing about it is that nobody can do shit to stop this ,one morning we will wake up and realize that its not worth for us to work because the costs will be same as earnings and the race for survival will be faster than ever, hate will be every where possible, for those who think different i suggest to pay more attention to the growing stravation in this world , people open your eyes this planet is getting sick the green turns black happiness seems to get fake , the only thing left for us to do is to watch it happening and scream out loud from our living room YES the truth sometime hurts but when 10 dollars for a gallon will take the place , the ones who think that i see only the bad part of life will understand too
keep rocki'n people , love and respect this is the only wepon you have got!
siago

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:14 am

In the us now, the price of gas is set by the refineries.
They have decided not to set up new refineries or even keep the existing ones running properly.
That's the problem now and for some time.

The falling dollar isn't helping much either.
I won't even mention trade deficits.

oFZo · Post by **oFZo** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:39 am

Right now a gallon of gas is about $7 in my area, I doubt it will take as long as 2012 for it to reach $10.
Most of that money is tax, not the actual cost.
I ride a bicycle.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:48 am

At least you have that option in Amsterdam.
Too dangerous to use a bike all the time here and too spread out too.
We only have a pretense of public transit here and no trains.
Do many people use pedalecs in Amsterdam?

oFZo · Post by **oFZo** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 5:06 am

gyre wrote:At least you have that option in Amsterdam.
Too dangerous to use a bike all the time here and too spread out too.
We only have a pretense of public transit here and no trains.
Do many people use pedalecs in Amsterdam?

I had to google "pedalec"!
There's some electric bikes around, not as many as you might expect.
Mostly old-fashion pedaling.

Post by **AntiM** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:45 am

Our FrontRunner commuter train just opened here in Utah this very weekend, from Ogden to Salt Lake connecting to the Trax light rail ... now I can get to Salt Lake all by my lonesome! Yay trains!

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:52 am

I see somewhat of a dis-connect in the logic, for me, at least....
and, I certainly don't claim to speak for anyone else.......

We complain about high fuel.
We say "everyone" should conserve.
It seems high prices will drive conservation, and, alternate energy choices and technology.

IMHO: societies seldom do something because it's "right", mostly, they make changes because of effects on their lifestyles....ie: it gets expensive, so, they drive less, conserve, whatever.

So,
If conservation is the ultimate goal, the high prices seem to be achieving,or will, achieve,this.

Are we complaining because it will cost to much to go to the beach, etc, every weekend? Because it cost's to much to fly to Disneyland?
Because it cuts into our vacaion budget?
Mostly, I'd say yes.

I don't take away from those who struggle, and, fuel is putting them over the edge.
As is always the case, things are relative.
Unfortunately, the poor often bear the brunt of poor choices by the "elite", however you define them........
but, that's the world, and humanity, as I see it........

It will be interesting to see where this all goes......changes in economy and habits, etc.......

Just some random thoughts.......

Post by **AntiM** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:54 am

Yes, but ZPG isn't trendy anymore.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:04 am

AntiM wrote:Yes, but ZPG isn't trendy anymore.

Definitely the real issue behind everything else.
I suspect the first signs of trouble will be running out of water.
I wonder which city will be first?
It's happened to a few small towns, usually from pollution.
Water is pretty heavy when you start hauling it in.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:05 am

ZPG? am I sheltered? I don't know what that means.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:26 am

This is the 21st century, not the 1970s. Turn your paranoid xenophobia towards the Chinese. Except for the pass on Arabian citizens involved with 9/11 I can't really think of what the Arabs are getting away with. All that oil hasn't really got Iraq much traction. It gives Hugo Chavez a bully pulpit. Heck, I'd rather talk about the behavior of the oil companies. If they'd gotten into alternative energy 25 earlier, think of where we'd be now.

djsiago · Post by **djsiago** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:53 am

more than that man , bush was using army power and soldiers lives in order to balance the war againt ghosts in iraq .its just a show off power performace, this is a war againt evil . this gas prices contr"rullers" WILL drop the gas prices to almost zero when the world will move to use MAGNET MOTORS ,do really think the gas controllers doing it for money ????? they have enough money to cover mars with .they are just rasing gas prices in order to create tention and for us to be scared so WHAT is the point of sending the precious soldiers to die over there , we should invest the money over reserch and show the rest of the world how really to win this battle watch for your self brothers go on you tube serch MAGNET MOTOR and see how its starting every body now is looking for free and green energy ,this is the future it looks a bit funny but take a minute and think about it ,microwave was seems to look impossible then and now it a regular gadget , do it also SAVE YOUR PLANET by combining brains and love each-other
SIAGO

Post by **AntiM** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:58 am

ygmir wrote:ZPG? am I sheltered? I don't know what that means.

Sign of the times that you do not know ... Zero Population Growth. In other words, stop fucking breeding, quit adding more humans to the planet. But this is now very unpopular, what with all the celebrity baby bumps and people claiming THEIR child is not part of the problem because they're green ... riiight. Even the most greenly raised child in North America will consume approximately six times the resources of a child in poorer countries. (Sorry I can't find my cites, I memorized this a few years back.) Anyway, that child will spawn more children most likely, no matter the intention of the parents/grandparents. Each one of us is a burden on the ecosystem whether we care to admit it or not.

ZPG, we'll see it again.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:06 am

the very sad thing about it is that nobody can do shit to stop this

It's all relative bumpkins. Europeans have been paying close to $8-9 a gallon for some time.

Token · Post by **Token** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:24 am

AntiM wrote:ZPG, we'll see it again.

Like most complex systems, this one also will find its equilibrium. I doubt it will be in the form of gas prices, more likely it will be the next flu pandemic or maybe a volcanic eruption.

Remember that we already went down to near extinction ~ 70k years ago. Bound to happen again.

This is what we call "living in interesting times".

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:26 am

Isotopia wrote:It's all relative bumpkins.

'Bubkes' -- Yiddish for 'goat droppings'.

Hope this helps.

thirt33n · Post by **thirt33n** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:38 am

i live over a mile from my next neighbor.
I have generators, water, a fuel stash, a field of beef, some dogs, wild turkeys and a gun, some guitars and a piano.

not really sure what any of that means but WOLVERINES!!

...and I've got the anti-body and the treasure map and and and

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:56 am

antiM:
I do know what zero population growth is, I just didn't glean your reference from your post.......
It seems somewhere I read that the developed, western world is pretty clost to zpg, that, most of the increase is from 3rd world nations and peoples....
I can't swear, though, it just seems I read that. I think it even is broken down into race and culture......

I don't know that I'd feel bad my child will use more resources than a child from elsewhere............I want my child to do well and be happy and comfortable.......
I want that for them, too..........

I'd say the zpg along with not being so wasteful is the key, not pointing fingers and saying it's everyone else's fault.......
we tend to lay blame everywhere else but on ourselves.......
If you choose to live a 2 day walk from a phone, and, eat cornmeal, and not do much else, then, yes, you use less, and, if it's by choice, I'd say you can point fingers of blame. But, if you're living even in the lower strata of U.S. society, you are above most of the rest of the world in wealth and consumption...........

I'd rather raise theirs a bunch and lower ours a little, to reach equilibrium........
and, quit making so many people and encouraging same........read: some religions and cultures that promote as many kids as you can squirt out........

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:58 am

[quote="thirt33n"]i live over a mile from my next neighbor.
I have generators, water, a fuel stash, a field of beef, some dogs, wild turkeys and a gun, some guitars and a piano.

not really sure what any of that means but WOLVERINES!!

yes, Wolverines, to be sure............
The invasion has begun........

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 11:50 am

ygmir wrote:ZPG? am I sheltered? I don't know what that means.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/syste ... wbird1.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/syste ... 034040.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/syste ... mage10.jpg
ZPG for the playa, maybe?

thirt33n · Post by **thirt33n** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 11:54 am

my opinion:
Those in the world who are squirtin' out as many kids as possible or just too many either have a fundamental lack of self control or an awareness to what they are accomplishing.

they are to be equally feared. One for their intelligence and one for their lack of intelligence.

(not in the "I'm scared of them" manner but in the "concerned about")

meanwhile back at the ranch.....

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:30 pm

gyre wrote:
ygmir wrote:ZPG? am I sheltered? I don't know what that means.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/syste ... wbird1.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/syste ... 034040.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/syste ... mage10.jpg
ZPG for the playa, maybe?

very good..........

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:14 pm

I don't even know what to say about the magnet moters. It sounds like the perpetual motion machine I bought a few years back. Damn thing broke in 3 weeks.

thirt33n wrote:my opinion:
Those in the world who are squirtin' out as many kids as possible or just too many either have a fundamental lack of self control or an awareness to what they are accomplishing.

It's more complicated than that. Think about this--every single one of your ancestors had at least one child. It's the one's that are good at breeding that produced us. That's a whole lot of relearning that we are going to ahve to do. And people don't really consciously choose to get pregnant. It's a certain amount of vigilance to avoid it. I know, many people suffer from infertility, but they do suffer great anguish. And many others produce so easily, so thoughtlessly. But making them into an enemy isn't really an answer.

And even in this country far too many kids are growing up in soul crushing poverty.

A big tangled mess we have to take care of.

Flammepus · Post by **Flammepus** » Thu May 22, 2008 5:07 am

Don't blame the Arabs. Blame all people. Blame egotistical, greedy, get-across and then chop the rope that holds the bridge up, my little bit won't hurt that much in the grand scheme of things fucktards. Turns out, I am one too if I start splitting hairs...and someone always does. So yeah, fuck me (you won't be sorry, really).

Switching to alternative energy sources is not something that the energy companies will do until they have a compelling reason to do so, i.e., a way that they can continue to be the single-source for our energy. It is time for people to start taking more action. Ask your gov. reps why your town does not get a subsidy for solar/geothermal/wind/whatever it is that you have development. Ask them why you cannot play excess power back into the grid and get payed for it. Install a solar panel and start demonstrating that there is a market for solar collectors so that companies really start competing to provide them. Don't drive more than you have to. If you really want a child, adopt one; there are plenty to choose from.

Above all, do not be one of the chumps who is dragged kicking and screaming into the future if for no other reason than those people almost never see the opportunities that present themselves there.

Simon of the Playa · Post by **Simon of the Playa** » Thu May 22, 2008 6:30 am

siphon my friends, siphon.

i like to steal my gas from cop cars, but thats just me....

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Thu May 22, 2008 10:10 am

Flammepus wrote:Don't blame the Arabs. Blame all people. Blame egotistical, greedy, get-across and then chop the rope that holds the bridge up, my little bit won't hurt that much in the grand scheme of things fucktards. Turns out, I am one too if I start splitting hairs...and someone always does. So yeah, fuck me (you won't be sorry, really).

Word. They're not invading the US, it's the other way around. US companies are hip-deep in Arab oil; when is the last time you bought gas from an Arab-owned company?

See past the hype and you will be free.

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Thu May 22, 2008 10:38 am

Simon of the Playa · Post by **Simon of the Playa** » Thu May 22, 2008 10:45 am

finally someone who gets "it"

i blame the Mormans for just about everything, too...

(i had a really bad mushroom experience at Hill Cummorah)

ragabashpup · Post by **ragabashpup** » Thu May 22, 2008 11:01 am

Simon of the Playa wrote:finally someone who gets "it"

i blame the Mormans for just about everything, too...

(i had a really bad mushroom experience at Hill Cummorah)

The family isnt Mormon though. They are their own new version of christianity.

I have watched these folks on tv. Yes I have no life. They are just so scary.

erri2000 · Post by **erri2000** » Thu May 22, 2008 1:22 pm

People should not procreate more than themselves. Meaning two is enough. There probably wouldn't be the problems with food and shelter, people being orphaned and left in the cold if people realized that just popping out children is....

Oh for GODS SAKE JUST WHERE A CONDOM!

Just my opinion.

this is SAD

this is SAD

ZPG

yeah brother