Politics, Everyday, All day... morning, noon and night....

[Apollonaris Zeus]

It was suppose to be a bill to help those that were suckered into below interest rate morgages, but it a bailout for the same people that started it!

They are turning morgage relief into their last big hoorah Tax break for the Rich Bitches and Reddened Cocks!

American Politics corruption as usual!

Man, God Damn America!! Say it again!

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/busin ... ref=slogin

Fuck GW Bush and the Republicans!

AIIZ

[can't sit still]

Zeus wrote " Man, God Damn America!! Say it again!"
This may very well come to pass. In spite of the confidence blowing out of DC, there is a very real possibility of the US losing it's AAA credit rating. We would have to continue to service our debt but wouldn't be able to borrow money for a reasonable rate. There is also the possibility of the US declaring "Force Majeure' and defaulting on it's debt payments.

The IMF just came out and said that the US is going to drop badly and drag the rest of the world down with it. The credit system is completely broken but the G7 is even more worried about food shortages. We may very well be damned. I just wish that all of the pain could fall on people like Bush and Pelosi and Cheney. Unfortunately, it will fall on the little guy who is just trying to get by.

[mdmf007]

Buy food, ammunition, fuel, spare aprts and prepare now. I see the writing on the wall.

[can't sit still]

007, I've given it a lot of thought. It's important or course what you have. It's also very important what everyone else has. I would never want to be faced with the situation where I would have to shoot someone to keep them from stealing food for their kids.
The tax base is falling rapidly. How are the counties going to keep pace with the rapidly growing rolls asking for assistance?
I understand that the courts are forcing Calif to shell out 9 billion for prisoners medical care.
Our prison system is a joke. It's not a deterrent for career criminals. 1% of Americans [and a few illegals] are in jail or prison. Do we need to re-asess our ideas of "cruel and unusual punishment" to make incarceration a real deterrent? Do we need to re-examine our basic ideas of the value of human life to bring our new economic realities into alignment? These are tough questions. I've been to other countries where the value of human life was substantially discounted from what it is here.
When we get third-world wages, will we have third world crime levels and third world prisons?

[Apollonaris Zeus]

Well I just found out that Senator Max Baucas of montana added the home builders bailout.

So it wasn't just the republicans, but Max has acted like one and voted along with them on many bills.

He voted for the Iraq war

I'm not voting for anyone that did unless their running against some else that did

AIIZ

[mdmf007]

Cant Sit Still -
you hit another nerve of mine. America has more people in prison than onyone else in the world. either per capita or sheer numbers. more than half are for drug offenses like posession or using. whats the point of that? I dont want drug users robbing me either, but thats not what they are in jail for.

I loathe illicit drug use and see it as a corrosive influence on our country.
One other thought is how we treat our prisoners. In order to call ourselfs civillized we must treat prisoners with dignity, feed them, house them safely, rehab them, educate them, and give them medical aid as needed.
With that on mind we also are one of the only countries that execute children, and mentally challenged persons. gi figure?

Sentencing laws are a joke. I could go next door rob the store, blow that guys brains out in the process and get 15 years in prison.

Cheat on my taxes and can get 20 years,
Have sex with my drunk girlfriend and get 10 years for rape - when I am as drunk as she is.
steal a car - joy ride it get 5 years
I am starting to rant - so I am out.

[Ugly Dougly]

Max Baucas? I don't get it. What's it supposed to sound like?

[can't sit still]

007, I aired my thoughts about punishment on the thread about Tooky. I still feel that the punishment should fit the crime. The punishmenmt should be comensurate with the harm that you caused to a person or society. Milken skated with something like 50 million. He also ruined the lives of thousands. I think that he did 2 1/2 years.
People are people. As long as punishment isn't a deterrent to a big percentage of people,,,, a big percentage of people will take the risk.
I'm sure that you've read about the programs of Sheriff Joe Arpio.
As long as there's desert in Arizona, he never has overcrowding.
Decriminalising pot isn't such a bad idea. I don't think it should be done for the varieties of meth. I see way too many young people who are poor, bored and stupid. Crack ends their lives.
It may be Darwinism at it's best, but very few teenagers have good judgement. They need to be given a bit more time to mature before they're exposed to easy availability of crack, etc.
I don't see any easy answers.

[mdmf007]

I would cheerfully do 30 months for 50 million. So your right its not much of a deterent.

Pot should be legal, i dont like the stuff and dont use it, but see legalization ripping the guts out of an illegal market. And reducing the workload of LEO, courts and jails.

just my 2 cents

[Glittering Clitoris]

Pot legal!!!

It's a no brainer!!!

think of all the tax money to pay your bills!!!

It Ain't being tax now and I do make an estimate there might be a billion or two dollars being exchanged each year!

That's a lot of money that could be paying your teacher & police expenses!

POT!

It's not going away! And It never will!

Now what about another Martini bartender!

[SeaShell08]

http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

PEACE

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtex ... =h110-3835

ECONOMY
www.TruthAttack.org





http://ronpaulforpresident2008.com/blog/node/100

http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congr ... 0money.htm

OTHER


http://www.dhs.gov/xprevprot/programs/g ... 53842.shtm

[SeaShell08]

Medical Marijuana hearings:

Candidate positions:
Romney and Obama:

Huckabee-

Ron Paul:

McCain-


Then information on Medical Marijuana was released by:
http://www.mpp.org/news/press-releases/ ... omney.html
http://www.medicalmarijuanaworks.org/

Following the public release of that add, McCain had this to say :


Hilary-
(notice she NEVER answers the question at hand "will you stop the
raids" which is a Yes or No question!)

Gravel-

....and remember. No matter what your personal stance is on medical marijuana, 13 states have VOTED for it within their state .

It all goes back to the 10th ammendment to the United States Constitution that states, "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

States that VOTED FOR Medical Marijuana:
*Alaska
*California
*Colorado
*Hawaii
*Maine
*Maryland
*Montana
*Nevada
*New Mexico
*Oregon
*Rhode Island
*Vermont
*Washington (State)

[ibdave]

Anyone seen this yet??? I plan on heading to S.F. to see this weekend..


[youtube][/youtube]

[DVD Burner]

Pentagon institute calls Iraq war 'a major debacle' with outcome 'in doubt'

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/iraq/story/34101.html

By Jonathan S. Landay and John Walcott | McClatchy Newspapers

* Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2008

WASHINGTON — The war in Iraq has become "a major debacle" and the outcome "is in doubt" despite improvements in security from the buildup in U.S. forces, according to a highly critical study published Thursday by the Pentagon's premier military educational institute.

The report released by the National Defense University raises fresh doubts about President Bush's projections of a U.S. victory in Iraq just a week after Bush announced that he was suspending U.S. troop reductions.

The report carries considerable weight because it was written by Joseph Collins, a former senior Pentagon official, and was based in part on interviews with other former senior defense and intelligence officials who played roles in prewar preparations.

It was published by the university's National Institute for Strategic Studies, a Defense Department research center.

"Measured in blood and treasure, the war in Iraq has achieved the status of a major war and a major debacle," says the report's opening line.

At the time the report was written last fall, more than 4,000 U.S. and foreign troops, more than 7,500 Iraqi security forces and as many as 82,000 Iraqi civilians had been killed and tens of thousands of others wounded, while the cost of the war since March 2003 was estimated at $450 billion.

"No one as yet has calculated the costs of long-term veterans' benefits or the total impact on service personnel and materiel," wrote Collins, who was involved in planning post-invasion humanitarian operations.

The report said that the United States has suffered serious political costs, with its standing in the world seriously diminished. Moreover, operations in Iraq have diverted "manpower, materiel and the attention of decision-makers" from "all other efforts in the war on terror" and severely strained the U.S. armed forces.

"Compounding all of these problems, our efforts there (in Iraq) were designed to enhance U.S. national security, but they have become, at least temporarily, an incubator for terrorism and have emboldened Iran to expand its influence throughout the Middle East," the report continued.

The addition of 30,000 U.S. troops to Iraq last year to halt the country's descent into all-out civil war has improved security, but not enough to ensure that the country emerges as a stable democracy at peace with its neighbors, the report said.

"Despite impressive progress in security, the outcome of the war is in doubt," said the report. "Strong majorities of both Iraqis and Americans favor some sort of U.S. withdrawal. Intelligence analysts, however, remind us that the only thing worse than an Iraq with an American army may be an Iraq after a rapid withdrawal of that army."

"For many analysts (including this one), Iraq remains a 'must win,' but for many others, despite obvious progress under General David Petraeus and the surge, it now looks like a 'can't win.'"

The report lays much of the blame for what went wrong in Iraq after the initial U.S. victory at the feet of then-Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld. It says that in November 2001, before the war in Afghanistan was over, President Bush asked Rumsfeld "to begin planning in secret for potential military operations against Iraq."

Rumsfeld, who was closely allied with Vice President Dick Cheney, bypassed the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the report says, and became "the direct supervisor of the combatant commanders."

" ... the aggressive, hands-on Rumsfeld," it continues, "cajoled and pushed his way toward a small force and a lightning fast operation." Later, he shut down the military's computerized deployment system, "questioning, delaying or deleting units on the numerous deployment orders that came across his desk."

In part because "long, costly, manpower-intensive post-combat operations were anathema to Rumsfeld," the report says, the U.S. was unprepared to fight what Collins calls "War B," the battle against insurgents and sectarian violence that began in mid-2003, shortly after "War A," the fight against Saddam Hussein's forces, ended.

Compounding the problem was a series of faulty assumptions made by Bush's top aides, among them an expectation fed by Iraqi exiles that Iraqis would be grateful to America for liberating them from Saddam's dictatorship. The administration also expected that "Iraq without Saddam could manage and fund its own reconstruction."

The report also singles out the Bush administration's national security apparatus and implicitly President Bush and both of his national security advisers, Condoleezza Rice and Stephen Hadley, saying that "senior national security officials exhibited in many instances an imperious attitude, exerting power and pressure where diplomacy and bargaining might have had a better effect."

Collins ends his report by quoting Winston Churchill, who said: "Let us learn our lessons. Never, never believe any war will be smooth and easy, or that anyone who embarks on the strange voyage can measure the tides and hurricanes he will encounter. ... Always remember, however sure you are that you can easily win, that there would not be a war if the other man did not think that he also had a chance."

[can't sit still]

A new addition to Chemistry's Periodic Table

Research has led to the discovery of the heaviest element
yet known to science. The new element, "Governmentium"
(Gv),
has one neutron, 25 assistant neutrons, 88 deputy neutrons,
and 198 assistant deputy neutrons, giving it an
atomic mass of 312.

These 312 particles are held together by forces
called
morons, which are surrounded by vast quantities of
lepton-like particles called peons. Since Governmentium has
no electrons, it is inert; however, it can be detected,
because it impedes every action with which it comes into contact.

A minute amount of Governmentium can cause a reaction that
would normally take less than a second to take from four
days to four years to complete. Governmentium has a normal
half-life of 2-6 years; it does not decay, but instead
undergoes a reorganization in which a portion of the
assistant neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places.

In fact, Governmentium's mass will actually increase over
time, since each reorganization will cause more morons to
become neutrons, forming isodopes. This characteristic of
moron promotion leads some scientists to believe that
Governmentium is formed whenever morons reach a critical
concentration. This hypothetical quantity is
referred to as critical morass. When catalyzed with
money,
Governmentium becomes Administratium, an element that
radiates just as much energy as Governmentium since it has
half as many peons but twice as many morons.

[Apollonaris Zeus]

It makes one wonder what makes ultra-conservative so callous to the hardships of those around them. Or to be unsympathetic to the conditions of war and its horrors that are placed on those that are innocent. It is they that will pay the price of an ill conceived war while you sit comfortable in front of your TV. These cold hearted people aren't just born that way nor do they become that way over night. It's a process that occurs over time. From their parents, parents, parents handed down to them generations later. One good example is the ultra-conservative, Ann Coulter. She wasn't an instant bitch. She was cultivated to be a cold, hard stone of emotion by her dad. A man that couldn't react with emotion because it was alien to him, most probably he saw it as a weakness. He couldn't cry, he could only hate. And he hated himself from what I gathered. Being an FBI agent, like many LEO's, if he thought about what is was doing to others when the laws he was enforcing were contrary to his preconceived notions, he most likely couldn't do his job or live with himself. So you turn that part of your psyche off. He hated Unions, Communists or other groups that were for the welfare of the individual. He was part of the Mcharthey era of destroying lives of decent people. Only a cold hearted person could ever like with that without it destroy himself as it did Joe McCarthey. Money was something you used to get your way or should I say buy your way. He expected those that worked for to take what was offered with no recourse to bargain. He was a take it ot leave it man, Like Bush, it's my way or the highway. Her last line best explains her cold demeanor- sounds like a person, much like Joel's cold heartlessness on the virtues of the Iraq war. People become that way like Neo-Nazi or other White supremacists, because they have never known LOVE! They were taught only to Hate just like poor Ann Coulter.

Read this essay written by here found on the cold harden website called human events . Com:

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php? ... #continueA

"Now Daddy is with Joe McCarthy and Ronald Reagan. I hope they stop laughing about the Reds long enough to talk to God about smiting some liberals for me."

Sounds like she got the love of Christ in her!


AIIZ

[can't sit still]

The food crisis is moving to center stage in many countries;

"In the sprawling slum of Haiti's Cite Soleil, Placide Simone, 29, offered one of her five offspring to a stranger. "Take one," she said, cradling a listless baby and motioning toward four rail-thin toddlers, none of whom had eaten that day. "You pick. Just feed them."
Obviously, she had borne too many kids but, it's still a sad point to reach.

[DVD Burner]

War Tax Resistance: How a Portland Couple Have Refused to Pay Taxes for Over 30 Years to Protest Military Funding



Today is April 15th, Tax Day, a day when tens of millions of Americans scramble to file their income taxes on time. It’s also a day when people across the country are planning to protest the use of tax dollars to fund war. A recent study shows that more than 40 percent of every income tax dollar in 2007 went towards military spending. We speak with Pat and John Schwiebert, a Portland couple who have refused to pay their taxes for the past thirty years to protest military spending. [includes rush transcript]

Guests:

Pat Schwiebert, war tax resister for over thirty years. She is a registered nurse and has started a group for parents who have lost their children. The Oregonian has described her as “one of the nation’s premier experts on grief and infant loss.â€

[can't sit still]

There seems to be reasonable doubt that the 16th ammendment was ever ratified by enough states to become law. http://www.thelawthatneverwas.com/new/home.asp
The case seems to be moving slowly through the courts. If the supreme court refuses to hear the case, we can presume that it's legit. I imagine GOV will do anything to prevent the income tax law from being declared invalid.

[Apollonaris Zeus]

DVD, have you paid your taxes?

I know you're canadian, but canada did participate in the war as well.

Do you have internet wifi in your cell?
He, he, he, he, he!

Think about it. don't you pay taxes already. You buy gas. it has a tax. You buy clothing it has a tax. Tires have a tax. You can never not pay taxes. That's why I support abolishing income tax just have sales taxes on everything except food and medical products.



The world food crisis is worst then the oil crisis. Wealthy countries are cutting back on food donations. The pope didn't say a thing on it or was the news channels concentration on the sex abuse scandel.

[vanessa cardui]

BULLSHIT! Fucking funny. Watch it!

[youtube][/youtube]

[can't sit still]

Giving your all to support net neutrality; http://dontstayvirgin.movielol.org/main2.php

[can't sit still]

BUST MY CHOPS !!!

From: Vicky Davis
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 9:55 PM
Subject: Observations


I'm going crazy here... this is very upsetting.

I've been keeping a list of injuries on public officials and other public people. I started doing this after I'd noticed about 5 or 6 officials with visible injuries, a mugging of a supreme court justice, a state department employee that jumped out of a window at the state dept. and a congressional aide that was seriously beaten when two men followed her home and took nothing. I thought it was odd but not smiling.

Tonight I have to add one more person to the list:

4/24/2008 Rep. Ed. Markey seriously broken arm… Hearing on rising Oil Prices & Strategic Oil Reserves.


Gen. Shelton who was the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of staff went to work for NBC as a commentator in 2002. "Gen. Shelton joined NBC News as an on-air commentator for breaking national security news in 2002. " http://www.kepplerassociates.com/speake ... hugh.asp?1

In the spring of 2002 Gen. Shelton had an accident the ended his career as a commentator.
http://latc.com/2003/09/24/community/news01.html

"His 6-foot-6-inch military bearing and commanding presence at the Celebrity Forum belied his recent personal battle. Only months after his retirement, following 400 parachute jumps from 30,000 feet, the former special ops soldier fell from a ladder outside his home, landed with his head caught in a chain-link fence and was partially paralyzed from the neck down. " Incredibly acrobatic of him don't you think? ]

Mark Warner - on the last day of the National Governor's Association meeting, showed up with his wrist and forearm wrapped. His story was that he fell off his bike.

Arnold Schwartzeneggar - supposedly broke his thigh bone skiing at Sun Valley. He wouldn't say how it happened.

Donald Rumsfeld - arm in a sling at a public ceremony just before he resigned. I never heard an explanation.

George Bush - big bruise on his face - supposedly choked on a pretzel and fell out of his chair.

Max Baucus - black eye. Another black eye was observed on September 27, 2007, during a Senate Finance Committee hearing on the GAO Report on Border Security.

Ted Stevens - arm in a sling (I'm not 100% sure of this one but I'm about 99% sure. This was before I really started paying attention.)

Tim Russert - fell down and hurt his leg. On crutches - 'coincidently' before he testified against Scooter Libby.

Justice Souter - mugged in the park when he was jogging by 2 men who stole nothing. This was before the Kelo decision.

Congressional Staffer - Around the same time as Justice Souter, a congressional staffer was followed home by two men and was mugged in her drive way. Nothing stolen.

Senator Akaka. Arm injured - in a sling - he had the arm pinned down (so it wouldn't flap - like when you have your arm outside the sleeve).

Nancy Pelosi. When she was testifying about how she had a change of heart on nuclear power after 20 years of opposition, it appeared to me that she had some kind red marks on her right cheek that she had tried to cover with makeup. She's too old for zits.

Tim Walberg (MI) - arm in sling

Barney Frank (MA) - arm in sling

Chief Justice Roberts - “seizureâ€

[Ugly Dougly]

A federal judge on Thursday sentenced the actor Wesley Snipes to three years in prison for willfully failing to file tax returns.

Mr. Snipes was a member of American Rights Litigators, an organization founded by Mr. Kahn. Prosecutors have described that organization and its successor company, Guiding Light of God Ministries, as illegal tax-evasion schemes.

[DVD Burner]

for some of them other shit talkers on eplaya and 3playa. You cant say I didn't tell ya so.


Breaking the Silence - Israeli Soldiers Speak


http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php? ... a&aid=8777

by Stephen Lendman


Global Research, April 24, 2008

They're called "Refuseniks" but not for refusing to serve. They've done it proudly and courageously, and here's how "Courage to Refuse" members state their position:

"We, reserve officers and soldiers of the Israel Defense Forces (IDF)....have always served in the front lines....were first to carry out any mission, light or heavy, (and we did it) to protect the State of Israel and strengthen it.

We....served....long weeks every year, in spite of dear cost to our personal lives, have been on reserve duty all over the Occupied Territories, and were issued commands and directives that had nothing to do with the security of our country (but were only given to perpetuate) our control over the Palestinian people. We('ve)....seen the bloody toll this Occupation exacts from both sides.

....the commands issued to us in the Territories (have) destroy(ed) all the values (we learned) growing up in this country.

....the (way) the Occupation (undermines the) IDF's human character and (exposes) the corruption of the entire Israeli society.

We....know that the Territories are not Israel, and that all settlements are bound to be evacuated in the end.

We hereby declare that we shall not continue to fight this War of the Settlements.

We shall not continue to fight beyond the 1967 borders to dominate, expel, starve and humiliate an entire people.

We hereby declare that we shall continue serving the Israel Defense Forces in any mission that serves Israel's defense.

The missions of occupation and oppression do not serve this purpose - and we shall take no part in them."

These are courageous men and some women, hundreds of them. Their "Courage to Refuse - Combatant's Letter" web site lists 550 by name. There are hundreds more as well. Their numbers are growing, and their resistance is firm. There are five separate refusenik groups. They're listed below. Courage to Refuse is one of them.

Yesh Gvul (There is A Limit)

Yesh Gvul combats the "misuse of the IDF for unworthy ends" that includes the occupation of Palestine. It was established during Israel's 1982 Lebanon invasion that they denounced as a "naked (act of) aggression in which they wanted no part." It supports imprisoned members and their families, holds vigils where they're held, informs the public of their status, and embraces a peace agenda. They state that "as responsible citizens (they) declare that (they) will take no part in the continued oppression of the Palestinian people (nor will they) participate in policing actions or in guarding the settlements."

They further say that as "an Israeli peace group" they oppose the occupation and support soldiers who refuse to be part of it. They call the Israeli army's role "brutal" and "subjugating." It places servicemen "in a grave and moral and political dilemma (because it requires them) to enforce policies they deem illegal, immoral and ultimately harmful to Israeli interests." Many of their members are combat officers, they've served with distinction, and they rank from sergeant to major. They hold different political views, support peace but no one specific program, and they back a "two-state" solution they believe is "key to (peacefully resolving) the Israeli-Palestinian conflict."

The Shministim

The Shministim is made up of high school seniors approaching age 18 after which Jewish and Druze men and women face mandatory military service, except for exemptions on religious, health and other accepted grounds. The organization no longer maintains a web site.

Courage to Refuse (The Combatants Letter)

The organization was founded in 2002 by a group of 50 combat officers and soldiers after its members realized that their missions had nothing to do with defending Israel. They're to colonize Palestine and oppress its people. They further believe that many commands issued them harm Israel's strategic interests and they refuse to obey them.

They've served their country and support it, but they determined that "fighting in Gaza and....West Bank (was counterproductive): by obeying orders they would not be protecting the lives of their dear ones." They believe "the Occupation poses a threat to the security of Israel." They stated their beliefs openly in "The Combatant's Letter." Hundreds of IDF members signed it and joined "Courage to Refuse." New members join weekly, and Yaffee Center for Strategic Studies surveys show that over 25% of Israelis sympathize with their struggle.

They continue to perform reserve duty, but won't serve in the Occupied Territories. Over 280 of them have been court-martialed and jailed for up to 35 days. Yet they've "won a warm place for the movement in the hearts of many Israelis" who support their self-sacrifice and willingness to be imprisoned for their beliefs.

Hundreds of Israeli professors signed petitions for them. Sami Michael is acting chairman of the Israeli Association for Human Rights. He said that refusing the occupation is not just a moral act, it's the purest form of patriotism in Israel today. Their reasons for not serving are stated above.

The Pilots Group

The Pilots Group maintains a web site in Hebrew only, so it can't be monitored by non-Hebrew readers. In September 2003, 27 of their members (including reserve Brigadier General Yiftah Spector) published their statement for the first time. It declared they would no longer fly missions against West Bank and Gaza civilians, that doing so is illegal and immoral, and they denounced targeted assassinations.

On Israeli television, one pilot said: "We veteran pilots and active pilots alike....are opposed to carrying out illegal and immoral attacks, of the type carried out by Israel in the Territories. We....love the State of Israel (but) refuse to take part in air force attacks in civilian populations centers. We refuse to continue harming innocent civilians."

They knew they could be punished for their stance and for their "illegitimate" and "forbidden" statement, according to Israel's chief of army staff, Moshe Ya'alon. Israeli Air Force (IAF) chief Dan Halutz downplayed their action, said announcing it on national television was "inappropriate," and called it "the mother of all dangers to our people."

Because of it, they were expelled from the IAF, denounced as traitors, and went public again two months later to explain further. One captain's comment was typical: "In the beginning, we were pilots who believed our country would do all it could to achieve peace. We believed in the purity of our arms and that we did all we could to protect unnecessary loss of life. Somewhere in the last few years it became harder and harder to believe that is the case."

A single incident changed them. It was the bombing of Hamas military leader Salah Shehade's home that killed him and 14 members of his family, nine of whom were children. One pilot called it "murder," another "state terrorism," still another "vengeance," and all agreed they could no longer perform these missions.

Lt. Colonel Avner Raanan was one of them. He's one of Israel's most respected and decorated pilots. He signed the letter and stated: "If you look at the past three years, you see that, if we had a suicide bombing, the Israeli air force made a big operation in which civilians were killed, and that looks to innocent eyes like revenge. You hear it in the streets of Israel; people want revenge. But we should not behave like that. We are not a mafia."

Referring to an attack on Gaza's Nuseirat refugee camp, another pilot added: "Is it legitimate to take F-15s and helicopters designed to destroy enemy tanks, and use them against cars and houses in one of the most heavily populated places in the world....we have become blinded by the blood on our own faces. We cannot see that on the other side....is a whole nation of innocent people."

The pilots' action and statements shook Israeli society. Their superiors condemned them, but over 500 supportive letters disagreed, including one from a holocaust survivor and others from fellow pilots. In addition, former left wing cabinet ministers also praised their courage.

Sayeret Matkal

This is an elite IDF commando unit that maintains no web site. In December 2003, 13 of its reservists and officers (including one major) wrote the Prime Minister declaring their refusal to serve henceforth in the Territories. Their statement read: "We say to you today, we will no longer give our hands to the oppressive reign in the territories and the denial of human rights to millions of Palestinians, and we will no longer serve as a defensive shield for the settlement enterprise."

Members of this commando group carried out the 1976 Entebbe, Uganda airport raid that rescued 100 hostages on an Air France hijacked plane. They rarely serve in the Territories, but their announcement was significant because of the group's standing in Israeli society. Former Prime Minister Ehud Barak once commanded them and led a raid against a 1972 hijacked Sabena plane at Tel Aviv airport. He asked the signers to reconsider, called their letter a grave mistake, and said "it's not too late to correct it...." Other officials also condemned them, but Meretz Knesset Member (MK) Roman Bronfman believed they acted bravely, and Labor MK Ophir Pines said it requires that serious discussion be held.

In May 2004, Haaretz journalist Gideon Levy was supportive. He urged more soldiers to speak out, discuss their actions in the Territories, and ask why they serve there "to protect groups of delusional settlers (and) what their systematic abuse of the Palestinians has to do with security....how many innocent people (have) they killed and (keep on) killing."

He noted that Israelis don't know what goes on in the Territories, so it's up to soldiers to "lift this screen....The Palestinians aren't believed, the Israeli press (keeps) its distance from the Territories and the international press is perceived as hostile. Only the soldiers can break the vicious circle....No one (can) deny their accounts....it's time (for them) to stand up and speak out....how they killed and jailed and humiliated for no good reason."

Excerpts From Soldiers Breaking the Silence

Breaking the Silence (Shovrim Shtika) dedicates itself to two purposes:

-- exposing IDF oppression in occupied Palestine; and

-- providing discharged Israeli soldiers and reservists a platform to explain what they were ordered to do on the ground.

In their own words, hundreds of their testimonies tell shocking stories - the ordeal they faced, its moral price, and the corrupting erosion it had on their values. They focus on orders gotten, rules of engagement and operational procedures that include frequent illegal commands:

-- firing at civilians posing no risk;

-- revenge operations for collective punishment; and

-- intentionally attacking Palestinian rescue forces, including ambulances.

Their accounts are disturbing. They portray institutionalized moral corruption, universal contempt for Arabs, and how it affects everyone from new recruits to commanders. Rules of engagement are unrestrained, government oversight is non-existent, so reporting abuse is urgent. They want it stopped and demand an independent body to do it.

It goes on everywhere in occupied Palestine with Hebron a prominent example because it's the only Palestinian city with an Israeli settlement in its center. Sixty-four soldiers from the Nachal brigade spoke out, they were there during the Second Intifada, and their testimonies recount horrors on the ground they were ordered to commit.

They call their experiences "shocking" with photos for confirming evidence. Their collective statement says: "In coping daily with the madness of Hebron, we couldn't remain the same people beneath our uniforms. We saw our buddies and ourselves slowly changing....

We were exposed to the ugly face of terror....an innocent family killed while at the Sabbath table. Countless engagements, bereaved families, innocent civilians injured, chase and arrests.

The settlers....rioted, occupied houses, and confronted the police and army....The constant curfew made Hebron into a ghost town....The school in Jebl Ju'ar has been an army post....We asked ourselves why an army platoon prevents children from going to school. We found no answers.

We decided to speak out....to tell....Hebron isn't in outer space....But it's light years away from Tel Aviv....Come, see, hear and understand what's happening there."

Here are more paraphrased comments:

We man checkpoints, stop people from going somewhere, humiliate them, but "I'm doing my duty (and) inflicting pain on people, harming them unnecessarily." It affects your mind, your sleep the longer you serve there. Jews do as they please. There are no laws. Anything goes, breaking into shops, occupying Palestinian homes. Your judgment gets impaired when everyday your enemy is an Arab. You don't look at them as people. But they're not dogs, not animals, not inferior, yet they simply don't count, and since they're your enemy you can kill them.

At checkpoints, our job was don't let them pass. It was absurd, there were old ladies who had to get through to go home. Why was it forbidden to pass? It was collective punishment. "You're not allowed to pass because you're not allowed to pass." Then there are the curfews. "I'm certain that 80% of the time there was a curfew." We closed all the stores and sent everyone home.

I'm ashamed of myself because I realized I enjoy the feeling of power. I'm the Law. It's a mighty feeling. It's because you have a weapon, because you're a soldier, it's addictive. You can do whatever you want, unsupervised, enter people's homes, conduct random searches. Tell them what you want and they'll do it because they're afraid. Palestinians feel you don't let them walk in the streets, work, live or breathe.

I have a machine gun, it's loaded, the safety catch is off. I can shoot you any time, for any reason, split your head open with the gun butt and my commander will pat me on the back and say good job. It's crazy, I'm just a kid, but Hebron hardens you. I say to myself I'm doing something I don't believe in, and I'm putting myself in a position where someone wants to kill me because of it. You see things that couldn't possibly happen in your own home and shouldn't happen. But here everything is different.

Any time of day or night, whenever we feel like it, we pick a house, any house, and we go in. We move all the men into one room, the women in another, and place them under guard. We can do whatever we want. There's no justification for it. It shouldn't be happening.

Then there are the settlers. They run wild. There's no law. They do what they please. So they burn another shop, trash another home, occupy another one, no big deal, happens all the time. We just watch and do nothing.

If someone is sick and needs to go to the hospital, I ask my commander if I can let her pass. No way if there's a curfew. She's not going anywhere no matter how sick. All these stories are my daily routine for over six months. When it ended, I questioned whether I protected myself or my country. I began watching out for myself because I didn't believe in the ideology.

Serving in Hebron made me feel there's something different about being a Jew. I can't explain it. I'm supposed to guard the settlers who don't have the kind of morality I was raised to believe. I reached a point where I didn't know who the enemy was anymore, Jews or Arabs. Maybe I need to protect the Arabs, not the Jews who attack them. I feel emotionally injured. If someone's caught breaking curfew, we can let them have it aggressively. Hold them, make them wait eight hours with no water, sit and wait. "Why? Because he walked outside. Because he dared go buy something. Because he dared send his kid to school." We can even shoot them.

Selected Israeli Organizations Supporting Refuseniks

Several important ones are covered below:

New Profile

New Profile is a pluralistic feminist organization that includes men and women. It's goal is to transform Israel from a militaristic to a civil society. It opposes occupation and supports all conscientious objectors - from pacifists opposed to war to refuseniks who won't serve in occupied Palestine. Its charter states that "Israel is capable of a determined peace politics. It need not be a militarized society." It understands that "the words 'national security' have often masked calculated decisions to choose military action for the achievement of political goals."

It no longer is "willing to take part in such choices. We are no longer willing to go on being mobilized, raising our children for mobilization....while those in charge of the country go on deploying the army easily, rather than building other solutions."

It's "hard to express this type opinion in Israel today....An attitude that dares question the fundamental principle of willing enlistment is almost incomprehensible in a soldiers' state." We reject perpetuating war. We prioritize and protect life.

"We oppose the use of the army, police, (and) security forces in the ongoing oppression and discrimination of the Palestinian citizens of Israel (and in the Occupied Territories)," in demolishing their homes, "denying them building and development rights, (and) using violence" against them. Thousands of young Israelis are opting out and refuse to serve. They reject military service in Israel today. The IDF states that only one-third of reserve forces in fact serve actively.

Israeli law doesn't recognize conscientious objection. "We regard Israeli conscription law as discriminatory and non-democratic, and call for" recognizing every person's right to act according to his or her conscience. They should have the right to fulfill their social commitment by alternative civic or community means, including through non-governmental, voluntary organizations.

The Refuser Solidarity Network (RSN)

It was founded in 2002 to support Israel's growing "Refuser Movement." RSN supports Courage to Refuse, Combatants for Peace, Yesh G'vul, the Shiministim, New Profile and other Israeli organizations advocating peaceful conflict resolution in Occupied Palestine.

Its original 2002 "Call to Action" declaration said: "The time has come" to act against growing violence. Increasing numbers of Israeli soldiers reject serving in Occupied Palestine. They've seen what goes on, it has nothing to do with security, and its sole purpose is "perpetuating our control over the Palestinian people." They now declare they no longer will help "dominate, expel, starve and humiliate an entire people."

The time has come "to listen to our consciences," summon our courage, and publicly support them. Israel can never have peace and security unless it withdraws from Occupied Palestine. This is a "crucial moment, a potential turning point." Their campaign was initiated from Chicago, but it resonates across the country as a "portal" in support of the Refuser Movement in Israel.

Combatants for Peace

Former Palestinian and Israeli cycle of violence participants are the founders - IDF soldiers and Palestinian resistance fighters. They believe their actions were futile, decided another way is crucial, and now work together for peace. Henceforth, they "refuse to take part (in further) bloodletting." They will only act non-violently through dialogue and reconciliation and work together cooperatively to understand each other's aspirations.

Their goal - end the occupation, halt the settlement project, and establish a Palestinian state with its capital in East Jerusalem alongside the State of Israel. They want to raise consciousness, educate both sides, and create political pressure to establish a constructive dialogue for resolution.

They hold meetings, conduct educational lectures and public forums, undertake joint projects, have bi-national media teams to get out their message, and participate in non-violent demonstrations against the occupation. It's motto reads: "Only by joining forces, will we be able to end the cycle of violence."

Israeli Laws Affecting Conscientious Objection and Refuseniks

Conscription existed since Israel became a state in 1948. Today, its legal basis comes under the country's 1986 National Defence Service Law. It requires all Israeli citizens and permanent residents (men and women) to serve. However, the Ministry of Defence has discretion under Article 36 to exempt all non-Jews, except the Druze. Israeli Arabs may volunteer, but they're not encouraged, and very few do it. Reserve service is also required up to age 51 for men and 24 for women.

Exemptions are possible for reasons of:

-- educational requirements,

-- religion (orthodox Jews are exempted),

-- health,

-- family considerations,

-- married or pregnant women or those with children,

-- persons convicted of crimes,

-- the undereducated (until they complete at least eight years of school), and

-- other considerations at the Ministry of Defence's discretion.

Israeli law rejects conscientious objection rights for men and only partly accepts them for women on the basis of religion. Those who cite it and refuse to serve are in trouble. They're subjected to unfair procedures and hearings that may, and most often do, recommend prosecution and imprisonment.

Israel signed the United Nations Charter and must, under its provisions, comply with the UN International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights. Its Article 18 guarantees everyone "the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion." So does the Universal Declaration of Human Rights under Article 18 where it repeats that "Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion..." By denying refuseniks this right, Israel violates international law and a fundamental human right afforded everyone under it.

No official figures exist, but refusenik numbers have grown since the Second Intifada began in September 2000. Most opt out in the Territories, and estimates of their numbers range from 1100 well-documented cases to as many as double that number. Here's what they face.

Article 35 (a) (2) of the National Defence Service Law states that:

-- failure to fulfill a duty under the law is punishable by up to two years imprisonment;

-- evading military service is subject to five years in prison;

-- refusing to perform reserve duties calls for up to a 56 day sentence that's renewable if the objector refuses repeatedly;

-- helping someone avoid military service is punishable by a fine and up to two years in prison;

-- disobeying call-up orders means facing up to five years imprisonment, although most often sentences rarely exceed 12 months.

Refuseniks are generally sentenced on one of the following charges:

-- refusing to obey an order;

-- absence without leave;

-- desertion; or

-- refusing to be mobilized.

Where exemption applications are denied, individuals are ordered to perform military or reserve duty. Continued refusal can mean discipline or court-martial, and repeat offenders face re-imprisonment in violation of Article 14, paragraph 7 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights. It states: "No one shall be liable to be tried or punished again for an offence for which he (or she) has already been finally convicted or acquitted in accordance with the law and penal procedure of each country."

Summary Comments

Peace activists, people of conscience and most notably Israeli refuseniks are in the front lines of a valiant struggle:

-- to free Palestinians from 41 illegal occupation years,

-- end decades of abuse,

-- achieve a just and lasting peace, and

-- protect everyone's fundamental human rights and freedoms that are guaranteed by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights for "all members of the human family...."

Israel must no longer be exempted from international law, from being allowed to flaunt it brazenly, from ignoring over five dozen UN Resolutions going back decades. Peace activists and refuseniks condemn the Jewish state for its actions, deplore it for committing them, and demand, call on and insist Israeli governments end them. Its lawlessness must end, and collective resistance can achieve it. It's no longer an option. It's an obligation to assure that everyone has equal dignity and the right to life, liberty, security and freedom under universal international law.

May 14 is the 60th anniversary of Israel's founding. Commemorations there and in the West will celebrate it. People of conscience won't participate. Refuseniks may not either. Use this time to demand an illegal occupation end and that Israel no longer be allowed a pass on the international law it disdains.

Or using a 10-year-old child to locate and punish a 15-year-old stone-thrower: "So we got hold of just some Palestinian kid nearby, we knew that he knew who it had been. Let's say we beat him a little, to put it mildly, until he told us. You know, the way it goes when your mind's already screwed up, and you have no more patience for Hebron and Arabs and Jews there.

"The kid was really scared, realising we were on to him. We had a commander with us who was a bit of a fanatic. We gave the boy over to this commander, and he really beat the shit out of him ... He showed him all kinds of holes in the ground along the way, asking him: 'Is it here you want to die? Or here?' The kid goes, 'No, no!'

"Anyway, the kid was stood up, and couldn't stay standing on his own two feet. He was already crying ... And the commander continues, 'Don't pretend' and kicks him some more. And then [name withheld], who always had a hard time with such things, went in, caught the squad commander and said, 'Don't touch him any more, that's it.' The commander goes, 'You've become a leftie, what?' And he answers, 'No, I just don't want to see such things.'

"We were right next to this, but did nothing. We were indifferent, you know. OK. Only after the fact you start thinking. Not right away. We were doing such things every day ... It had become a habit...

"And the parents saw it. The commander ordered [the mother], 'Don't get any closer.' He cocked his weapon, already had a bullet inside. She was frightened. He put his weapon literally inside the kid's mouth. 'Anyone gets close, I kill him. Don't bug me. I kill. I have no mercy.' So the father ... got hold of the mother and said, 'Calm down, let them be, so they'll leave him alone.'"


....But his frequent, if nervous, grins and giggles occasionally show just a hint of the bravado he might have displayed if boasting of his exploits to his mates in a bar. Repeatedly he turns to the older former soldier who has persuaded him to speak to us, and says as if seeking reassurance: "You know how it is in Hebron."

The older ex-soldier is Yehuda Shaul, who does indeed "know how it is in Hebron", having served in the city in a combat unit at the peak of the intifada, and is a founder of Shovrim Shtika, or Breaking the Silence, which will publish tomorrow the disturbing testimonies of 39 Israelis – including this young man – who served in the army in Hebron between 2005 and 2007. They cover a range of experiences, from anger and powerlessness in the face of often violent abuse of Arabs by hardline Jewish settlers, through petty harassment by soldiers, to soldiers beating up Palestinian residents without provocation, looting homes and shops, and opening fire on unarmed demonstrators.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 11769.html

[ibdave]

?

[can't sit still]

A good perspective on Islam; http://www.rense.com/general81/explo.htm

[can't sit still]

This is the best analysis that I've ever read. It puts much of recent history into a very understandable "format"; http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php? ... a&aid=8854

[cowboyangel]

It's not a stretch at all to consider the infusion and influence of global capital into most affairs of state, even "religious" states like the Vatican.
Most people are simply unaware of this side to things and have no interest in understanding or trying to understand it. Yet it is probably the most controlling aspect in our lives. Money, big money, is behind everything.

I think the only remedy to the ills that this creates is to educate the public in ways that make it easy to understand. The internet is a great place for this but it is bloated with information of all types. I like http://solari.com for a take on this global money government, and how it works. Its ties to vast military budgets and even military planning are profoundly and deeply troubling.

Just when I thought I couldn't get any sicker than after reading an expose of one facet of this complex, Jeremy Skahill's "Blackwater", I started looking into another black cesspool of real corruption and pervasive influence....ya, the Vatican, specifically, Opus Dei and its real world involvement in global banking, investment and finance. The book is Robert Hutchison's "Their Kingdom Come" "Inside the Secret World of Opus Dei".

Rather than finding the dark underrworld of religious militancy, (it's there) I found an acute in depth analysis of Opus banking intrigues, such as the Ambrosiano Banking scandal of Italy, in the 70's that ended with the multiple deaths and murders of high profile international bankers. Opus is running rampant in the Vatican now and in the world, specifically in leading world governments. It is thought that they have memberships in the Supreme Court of the US. Antonin Scalia, a conservative Catholic, is thought to be a member. There are 3 other conservative Catholics on the bench as well. Thomas, Roberts and Alito. Oh ya, and Blackwater CEO founders Eric Prince and Joe Schmidt are conservative Catholics and thought to be members of Opus Dei. Check it out yourselves.

Opus received funding, quite a bit of it, according to Hutchison, from the CIA as Opus was decidedly anti-communist and running many anti-commy programs. The past Pope, JohnPaulII and the current one, have shown much partiality towards Opus. Opus also has ties to other anti-Islamic groups like the Knights Templar and Sovereign Military Order of Malta. (these groups still exist today in some form strange as it may seem. They were the push behind the Crusades)

Read Hutchison's book for yourselves. It's not an easy read but everything is documented. Warning: iT is also dark and depressing, but has value in that it sheds light on some aspects as to why things are the way they are. If Religious institutions can be corrupted.....everything falls apart.....

[DVD Burner]

If Religious institutions can be corrupted.....everything falls apart.....

Wait,

I thought that's whats been happening already?