***Looking for an Art Car for Burningman 2008***
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Bob
- Posts: 6747
- Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 10:00 am
- Burning Since: 1986
- Camp Name: Royaneh
- Location: San Francisco
- Contact:
Shirley, "renting" an art car, or however you want to phrase it, is hardly different from the org and its benefactors tossing money & DPWers down the rathole of funded art.
Amazing desert structures & stuff: http://sites.google.com/site/potatotrap/
"Let us say I suggest you may be human." -- Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam
"Let us say I suggest you may be human." -- Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam
Thank you for your warm regards. I appreciate your words of wisdom. I never take any of the responses/snark personally. I do listen, but if i see someone being snarky, well then, snark is what they'll receive in return. No harm done. hey, i can take what i dish out.thirt33n wrote:
Zit1 aka Elle-
This is when you might have just let go of this thread and stopped taking stuff personally. I would greet you with open arms on the playa and definately love to take a ride in one of those two 'art cars' you have found to rent. (assuming they even get cleared for the event)
peace to you, I hope you have a wonderful time.
I do sometimes find it mind boggling when someone who has never been to a city comes in and fails to really take notice of how things work and try and learn from the citizens. Yes, it will be your city too and yes, just like your father or grandparents sometimes the 'eplayans' may seem like crusty old worn out bitter folk but it's pretty true that what these people have in common is a knowledge for how things work in a righteous (sometimes over the top) way. much like trying to fight the former you'll run into flames if you jab back. If you can just realize that most here are really cool and the snark is just friendly ribbing that is usually intermixed with simple helpful answers then you can translate what is said to your own language.
It's up to you whether you want to be like an old school 'burner' or if you just want to come in like a tourist or something in between.
I hope you can use eplaya as a tool for picking up tips and tricks and not an outlet/inlet for frustration.
have fun. most everyone here is cool and if they get on your back,...listen. they're onto something.
Crux
come over for some tequila
Interestingly enough, I came across this topic posted on tribe (seeing as that's how you learned of "Elle") and it made a few good points. maybe you've read it and maybe not - but here's the link -
http://bm.tribe.net/thread/97e269a7-8f7 ... 486a432932
"Some of us can't get past it. They scream and yell and accuse others of all manner of disloyalty, disrespect and trechery. "
and thanks, i'll have some tequila, it runs through my veins.
http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... 0e7#380400
Zit1 wrote: i'll have some tequila, it runs through my veins. Cool
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LeChatNoir
- Posts: 5907
- Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2003 8:52 am
- Location: Louisville, Ky
Zit,
When someone signs up on eplaya and shortly thereafter asks (in large blue print) for what, with no immediate clarification, seems to be the desire to simply purchase an experience that most others earn by great effort, it should be no surprise that many of the responses would be like what you got.
I admit that my first thought was to assume that you were doing just that… looking for an instant experience instead of really working for it. And the idea of promoting the notion of art car rentals is something that really puts a pit in my stomach, so I had to think about it before I even gave this thread any more energy that it already has. But the truth is I don’t know your backstory or the backstory of the person(s) who you said you were trying to find an art car for. Perhaps they really have a desire share some specific gift though an art car and believe they have no means to build one. Maybe they feel that financially benefiting someone who isn’t bringing their creation to the playa is a win-win situation (personally I'm not so sure).
You also said your friend is traveling 3000 miles and that it's not feasible to bring his own art car. This is simply not true at all. If this is the only reason he using for renting one instead of creating his own vision, then he simply does not want it badly enough. Case in point, another fellow here on the boards is driving his art car out there this year from the same area I’m in. He is in Houston right now as a matter of fact, making an art car show circuit and will return here before heading to the playa later in the summer. Sometimes wanting it bad enough means saving your money for many years to bring your creation to the playa.
Its not my place to define your experience for you, but it should be noted that if you (or someone else) are thinking that renting an art car will give the same sense of joy and accomplishment that Captain Goddammit has for his yacht, or Tiahaar has for his trike, then you’ll be sorely mistaken. So be aware... if your friend is looking for a certain reaction and doesn’t get it when people find out he simply rented someone else’s hard work, he’ll have to try and understand.
But… if the intentions are in the right place (like doing something to make people smile instead of attempting to impress them with a perceived symbol of status), I suspect you and he will have a really fun burn and I look forward to seeing what you can add to the visual strangeness of Burning Man.
Just come as you are and be yourself and you’ll be fine.
And welcome to eplaya as well.
Hang out and see what’s happening. Check out the board and see what other creations are taking shape.
When someone signs up on eplaya and shortly thereafter asks (in large blue print) for what, with no immediate clarification, seems to be the desire to simply purchase an experience that most others earn by great effort, it should be no surprise that many of the responses would be like what you got.
I admit that my first thought was to assume that you were doing just that… looking for an instant experience instead of really working for it. And the idea of promoting the notion of art car rentals is something that really puts a pit in my stomach, so I had to think about it before I even gave this thread any more energy that it already has. But the truth is I don’t know your backstory or the backstory of the person(s) who you said you were trying to find an art car for. Perhaps they really have a desire share some specific gift though an art car and believe they have no means to build one. Maybe they feel that financially benefiting someone who isn’t bringing their creation to the playa is a win-win situation (personally I'm not so sure).
You also said your friend is traveling 3000 miles and that it's not feasible to bring his own art car. This is simply not true at all. If this is the only reason he using for renting one instead of creating his own vision, then he simply does not want it badly enough. Case in point, another fellow here on the boards is driving his art car out there this year from the same area I’m in. He is in Houston right now as a matter of fact, making an art car show circuit and will return here before heading to the playa later in the summer. Sometimes wanting it bad enough means saving your money for many years to bring your creation to the playa.
Its not my place to define your experience for you, but it should be noted that if you (or someone else) are thinking that renting an art car will give the same sense of joy and accomplishment that Captain Goddammit has for his yacht, or Tiahaar has for his trike, then you’ll be sorely mistaken. So be aware... if your friend is looking for a certain reaction and doesn’t get it when people find out he simply rented someone else’s hard work, he’ll have to try and understand.
But… if the intentions are in the right place (like doing something to make people smile instead of attempting to impress them with a perceived symbol of status), I suspect you and he will have a really fun burn and I look forward to seeing what you can add to the visual strangeness of Burning Man.
Just come as you are and be yourself and you’ll be fine.
And welcome to eplaya as well.
Hang out and see what’s happening. Check out the board and see what other creations are taking shape.
The New and Improved Black Cat... now with 25% more blather
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Ugly Dougly
- Posts: 17612
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- Location: เชียงใหม่
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chiefdanfox
- Posts: 786
- Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 11:14 pm
- Burning Since: 1986
- Location: Bodega Bay, CA
As far as it not being feasible to bring an art car 3000 miles, I'd say showing up and operating someone else's art car is just as unrealistic. Most of the vehicles you see are heavily customized, built on old beat to hell bases, and often built in haste by people who are figuring it out as they go. They tend to break down and problems develop with the custom bits that need to be maintained or at least inspected regularly. Many require assembly on-site. So renting an art car is not like renting a Ford for a week of driving in the city. You wouldn't just be renting a car, you'd be paying someone to prepare, transport, maintain, and remove a piece of artwork they created.
On the other hand, if I had a car already built but couldn't bring or a new car I wasn't going to be able to finish due to costs I might be tempted to take him up on the offer. Afterwards I would probably question whether it was really worth it.
So I don't know. Do what you want. I hope it works out well for you and whoever you get a car from.
On the other hand, if I had a car already built but couldn't bring or a new car I wasn't going to be able to finish due to costs I might be tempted to take him up on the offer. Afterwards I would probably question whether it was really worth it.
So I don't know. Do what you want. I hope it works out well for you and whoever you get a car from.
LeChat, you spend a lot on gas.
But you have a truck for work and that's half the problem.
It's very different getting something in shape for toodling around the playa at slow speed and preparing it for thousands of miles at highway speeds.
Some people here store vehicles in nevada because the mileage was destroying them.
I'm looking at $2000 in needed maintenance myself, plus the not so cheap gas bills.
I couldn't manage it last year.
Higher gas prices aren't helping.
I'd be laughing at the prospect of dragging something from the west coast.
I have a body for an art car, concept vetted by the dmv, but it will probably have to wait yet another year.
And it's small.
I can't even consider anything larger from here.
But you have a truck for work and that's half the problem.
It's very different getting something in shape for toodling around the playa at slow speed and preparing it for thousands of miles at highway speeds.
Some people here store vehicles in nevada because the mileage was destroying them.
I'm looking at $2000 in needed maintenance myself, plus the not so cheap gas bills.
I couldn't manage it last year.
Higher gas prices aren't helping.
I'd be laughing at the prospect of dragging something from the west coast.
I have a body for an art car, concept vetted by the dmv, but it will probably have to wait yet another year.
And it's small.
I can't even consider anything larger from here.
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LeChatNoir
- Posts: 5907
- Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2003 8:52 am
- Location: Louisville, Ky
I spend more than I 'd care to, actually with diesel at $4.19 a gallon. I'm planning for $5+ by August, but it's still worth it to me so far. And fciron is driving his art car to the playa this year. I don't think its should so much be trying to create, on playa, a preconcieved notion of an expierience, but rather letting the expierience become what it will be and working with what you've got to work with.
I also needed a trailer so I built one.But you have a truck for work and that's half the problem.
That means you want it bad enough. And as creative and out-of-the-box thinking as you are, gyre, I have no doubt that you will get it out there when its ready to get there.I have a body for an art car, concept vetted by the dmv, but it will probably have to wait yet another year.
The New and Improved Black Cat... now with 25% more blather
Aw, shucks.
I'm just pointing out how enormous a factor the distance really is.
If I was in cali, I would have been on the playa in 1995 and had an art car there by 1996.
Most people are looking at rental or purchase of a tow vehicle plus gas.
And, oh yeah, creating something by whatever means.
When people without access to a shop create anything at all, it's a huge deal.
And most people have no clue where to start.
I told you about the fish art car with the triple electrical system
Still my favorite because it was the first one I ever saw for real.
That's when I knew I was going to get there.
I'm just pointing out how enormous a factor the distance really is.
If I was in cali, I would have been on the playa in 1995 and had an art car there by 1996.
Most people are looking at rental or purchase of a tow vehicle plus gas.
And, oh yeah, creating something by whatever means.
When people without access to a shop create anything at all, it's a huge deal.
And most people have no clue where to start.
I told you about the fish art car with the triple electrical system
Still my favorite because it was the first one I ever saw for real.
That's when I knew I was going to get there.
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dragonfly Jafe
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 11:08 am
- Location: the Oregon Trail
Well, I have an art car, and I am not able to go to BM this year. It is the Tongue Car, a totally custom giant red tongue with controls moved to the rear that seats 8.
I would be very reluctant to let anyone else drive it without me on board. It has custom steering, that can be dangerous if you are not used to it (especially given the crowds).
But let's assume I was willing to rent it...hypothetically for discussions sake.
Gas for delivery and pickup (using my truck and trailer) would have been $1000 last year (I live 10 hours away), probably more like $1500 this year. Then there would be a reasonable charge for my driving time (40 hours) and the wear and tear on both vehicles and my trailer. Let's say that's another $1000. I would also need a substantial deposit to ensure I got the vehicle back. And copies of your drivers lisence, fingerprints, photo of you, and proof of your home address. A contract would need to be signed. Since I do not know you, I would have this done at a lawyer's office in your state, adding another $500 or so.
Realize of course that I would not be there to fix it if it broke (likely), and would have to drop it off the weekend before and leave it in the impound lot (requiring you move it into BM yourself), then pick it up Monday morning so I could get back to work on Tuesday. If I missed work due to you returning it late, I would expect reimbursement for my lost pay. Also, I would not be willing to register it in my name, so the renter would have to do this (any DMV infractions regardless of who is driving at the moment get recorded against the registered name for upcoming years, in addition to the driver). I also would not be able to get it checked off by the DMV, since I would not be able to actually get into BM. And there is the possibility that it would not be approved due to increasing DMV standards. Since this in part depends on what you say to the DMV and when you get it inspected, I would not be responsible if it failed to get approved.
So for a minimum of $3000 (plus a huge deposit, big enough that you would not just forfeit it to keep the car and trailer, say $5000 or so) you would be able to rent the possibility of registering a proven art car in your name. IF I was willing to hand my heart and soul into the hands of a stranger, risking it and possibly jeopardizing my future with the DMV, which I am not. Not to mention getting dragged into a lawsuit if anything serious happens. And I would sweat buckets until I got it back in one piece.
And this would essentially be no "profit" to me, just my costs. And a whole lot of hassle and worry on my part.
I hope you find the arrangement you seek and all goes well. Not trying to be snarky, just trying to educate you on some of the considerations facing the owner of any mutant vehicle. Obviously if you can find someone who will already have one there and willing to let you have it for a few days things might be a little easier.
Best of luck, and welcome home.
I would be very reluctant to let anyone else drive it without me on board. It has custom steering, that can be dangerous if you are not used to it (especially given the crowds).
But let's assume I was willing to rent it...hypothetically for discussions sake.
Gas for delivery and pickup (using my truck and trailer) would have been $1000 last year (I live 10 hours away), probably more like $1500 this year. Then there would be a reasonable charge for my driving time (40 hours) and the wear and tear on both vehicles and my trailer. Let's say that's another $1000. I would also need a substantial deposit to ensure I got the vehicle back. And copies of your drivers lisence, fingerprints, photo of you, and proof of your home address. A contract would need to be signed. Since I do not know you, I would have this done at a lawyer's office in your state, adding another $500 or so.
Realize of course that I would not be there to fix it if it broke (likely), and would have to drop it off the weekend before and leave it in the impound lot (requiring you move it into BM yourself), then pick it up Monday morning so I could get back to work on Tuesday. If I missed work due to you returning it late, I would expect reimbursement for my lost pay. Also, I would not be willing to register it in my name, so the renter would have to do this (any DMV infractions regardless of who is driving at the moment get recorded against the registered name for upcoming years, in addition to the driver). I also would not be able to get it checked off by the DMV, since I would not be able to actually get into BM. And there is the possibility that it would not be approved due to increasing DMV standards. Since this in part depends on what you say to the DMV and when you get it inspected, I would not be responsible if it failed to get approved.
So for a minimum of $3000 (plus a huge deposit, big enough that you would not just forfeit it to keep the car and trailer, say $5000 or so) you would be able to rent the possibility of registering a proven art car in your name. IF I was willing to hand my heart and soul into the hands of a stranger, risking it and possibly jeopardizing my future with the DMV, which I am not. Not to mention getting dragged into a lawsuit if anything serious happens. And I would sweat buckets until I got it back in one piece.
And this would essentially be no "profit" to me, just my costs. And a whole lot of hassle and worry on my part.
I hope you find the arrangement you seek and all goes well. Not trying to be snarky, just trying to educate you on some of the considerations facing the owner of any mutant vehicle. Obviously if you can find someone who will already have one there and willing to let you have it for a few days things might be a little easier.
Best of luck, and welcome home.
Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see.
Arthur Schopenhauer
Arthur Schopenhauer
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thisisthatwhichis
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Captain Goddammit
- Posts: 8589
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- Camp Name: First Camp
- Location: Seattle, WA
shmuk
I can't tell if this guy is for real or not...My guess is this is just one of the many spoof posts designed to get people riled up...successfully....especially the bit about "oh its for my friend"...that seems to be the backpedaling hallmark on eplaya so I really think this is fake, but if its not, I just can't help to vent a little....
Zit1: I want you to take this personally...very personally....
You're a fucking idiot. Who would go to an event they have never been to and just throw money at it to get the coolest toy?...you're either a narcissistic asshole or a fool or both.....why don't you just go to BM once and then decide what to do the next year...? Its one thing if you were going to build an art car for your first burn...that would be cool...people have done that and it is impressive...but to just buy it....well I guess its a very American concept so would fit with the theme but basically you or "your friend" are/is a douchebag...
Zit1: I want you to take this personally...very personally....
You're a fucking idiot. Who would go to an event they have never been to and just throw money at it to get the coolest toy?...you're either a narcissistic asshole or a fool or both.....why don't you just go to BM once and then decide what to do the next year...? Its one thing if you were going to build an art car for your first burn...that would be cool...people have done that and it is impressive...but to just buy it....well I guess its a very American concept so would fit with the theme but basically you or "your friend" are/is a douchebag...
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lonestoner916
- Posts: 891
- Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:41 pm
- Location: Gerlach, Nevada
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If you don't like what someone is doing, have you considered helping them figure out a better way?
"Everything is more wonderful when you do it with a car, don't you think?"
-girl by the fire, watching a tree moved by car bumper in the bonfire
It would be a shame if I had to resort to self-deception to preserve my faith in objective reality.
-girl by the fire, watching a tree moved by car bumper in the bonfire
It would be a shame if I had to resort to self-deception to preserve my faith in objective reality.
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oneeyeddick
- Posts: 5589
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- Location: Probably in your pants
Awww....Gyre....DAMMIT !!!gyre wrote:If you don't like what someone is doing, have you considered helping them figure out a better way?
Ya went and put that in there before I could post an even bigger and better picture of an actual douchebag.
It was sweet too !!!!
Talk about ruining a threads momentum.
next............
We have an obligation to make space for everyone, we have no obligation to make that space pleasant.
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Ugly Dougly
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Rat Bastard
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Wow, I haven't scanned the new threads in a while. I would have JUMPed in on this sooner.
Rent an art car for a day or two? Bahahaha. You've got to be kidding me. Doesn't he realize that 1.) it needs to get licensed. 2.) Whoever the license's name is in is responsible for it's use. 3.) What MV owner/builder would ever hand their keys over to a virgin and walk away?
The travel distance thing... Tell you friend, if he can afford to rent one, he can afford to transport one. I drag mine from Chicago. It's also about the biggest in the midwest. How about you have your friend send me money for gas and I'll taxi him and his gear on the playa for an event. BTW, I'd expect at least 25% of the $1700 I expect to pay for the 4000 mile round trip. That doesn't include the cost of the trailer, tires, build etc.
There's this thing called Burning Man Princibles. The main one is RADICAL SELF RELIANCE. NOT radical cash allowance. If it was up to me, I wouldn't license a "rented" Mutant Vehicle. I'd make it sit in the impound all week.
Here's an example of what we're talking about. How about if I take a mix CD from your DJ friend and get up on stage and play it. And call myself a DJ and enjoy all the fruits of his labor when the crowd cheers.
BTW, Burning Man is already sold out. Your friend can't come.
Rent an art car for a day or two? Bahahaha. You've got to be kidding me. Doesn't he realize that 1.) it needs to get licensed. 2.) Whoever the license's name is in is responsible for it's use. 3.) What MV owner/builder would ever hand their keys over to a virgin and walk away?
The travel distance thing... Tell you friend, if he can afford to rent one, he can afford to transport one. I drag mine from Chicago. It's also about the biggest in the midwest. How about you have your friend send me money for gas and I'll taxi him and his gear on the playa for an event. BTW, I'd expect at least 25% of the $1700 I expect to pay for the 4000 mile round trip. That doesn't include the cost of the trailer, tires, build etc.
There's this thing called Burning Man Princibles. The main one is RADICAL SELF RELIANCE. NOT radical cash allowance. If it was up to me, I wouldn't license a "rented" Mutant Vehicle. I'd make it sit in the impound all week.
Here's an example of what we're talking about. How about if I take a mix CD from your DJ friend and get up on stage and play it. And call myself a DJ and enjoy all the fruits of his labor when the crowd cheers.
BTW, Burning Man is already sold out. Your friend can't come.
Read my posts with a grain of salt.
Did someone say http://www.playazon.com/home.html ???veleda wrote:all i can say ..is Playazon rocks!
Don't join in the art community! Purchase a trinket instead of liberate yourself with creative expression!
Yours for just $9.99~
I was Born OK the 1st Time....
Don't bring defaultia to Burning Man, take Burning Man to defaultia...... graidawg
Don't bring defaultia to Burning Man, take Burning Man to defaultia...... graidawg
But, honestly, why would you rent an art-car or MV (whichever way you like). It is not about looking cool and picking up chicks (sorry ladies) with low-profile rims and under body glow (even though our car has one). If you can’t create MV and bring it to the Playa like Rat Bastard (and many more people) from god knows where from, DON’T!!!! Spend money on kick ass costume or bike at least. In that case you’ll be showing your contribution to BM community. By renting one – you’ll be bringing money to an a@s#s$h%o^l*e who would let you use his/her MV and will be trying to make money on it. BM is not a business yet (I hope). When it will become a business – I’ll be out! And you’ll be able to find more than enough art-cars and MVs and some crap else. So, my advice to you: go to your local fabric-hardware-light store, pick up some materials, and close your self in your garage putting your imagination to work. If you’ll come up with something original and will bring it to the Playa – you’ll be reworded 100% by compliments from other Burners.
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trilobyte
- Site Admin
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- Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2004 10:54 pm
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- Camp Name: Atomic Octopus
- Location: Las Vegas
- Contact:
While people do occasionally sell or rent their vehicle (because they're building something new, can't afford to keep it anymore, or aren't going this year), the idea of actively seeking out a rental without having any prior connection/interaction with the community... just seems kinda tourist-y.
But then, I feel the same way about people traveling in those big-ass rental RV/land yachts.
While I'm sure your client/customer/friend/employer is probably looking to go once in the grandest of style, I would humbly suggest that more than half of the Burning Man experience is.... the experience of getting there. I've had many great conversations with people who've ridden in something I've built, or with the builder of some masterpiece I got experience, and they've been great conversations. I can't imagine the idea of answering the questions with "it's a rental." At that point, I would suggest not even going - for far less money you could probably just buy a few videos. You see what it's like and hear what it's like, but you don't have to experience it.
Stepping off the soapbox, there are practicalities. First off, mutant vehicles need to offer a public conveyance. Meaning, they're not supposed to be personal transports. So if your client/customer/friend/employer is looking for that, they may be disappointed. Second, there is a registration process. If you haven't already sorted out a vehicle by now and are working in tandem with the builder/owner to get the registration/approval paperwork in before the deadline, you're probably way too late. And third, it is an approval process - it's entirely possible that you could wind up renting something, only to find out that either the application is denied or that it does not pass the on-playa inspection.
Granted, as an employee you may not be in the position to either say no or suggest something that your boss may not want to hear, but I'll say it anyway (though others already have). Bikes. I think you may have said that they're already planning to have them. Good - use those. And instead of chasing down the idea of playing tourist by renting an art car.... they could interact with others. Seriously, it's awesome. Other people will offer rides.
Burning Man is a very big event, in physical size and in scope of experiences. No matter how much money your client/customer/friend/employer has, they can not buy all those experiences in one go.
Good luck though, however they decide to go.
Trilo
But then, I feel the same way about people traveling in those big-ass rental RV/land yachts.
While I'm sure your client/customer/friend/employer is probably looking to go once in the grandest of style, I would humbly suggest that more than half of the Burning Man experience is.... the experience of getting there. I've had many great conversations with people who've ridden in something I've built, or with the builder of some masterpiece I got experience, and they've been great conversations. I can't imagine the idea of answering the questions with "it's a rental." At that point, I would suggest not even going - for far less money you could probably just buy a few videos. You see what it's like and hear what it's like, but you don't have to experience it.
Stepping off the soapbox, there are practicalities. First off, mutant vehicles need to offer a public conveyance. Meaning, they're not supposed to be personal transports. So if your client/customer/friend/employer is looking for that, they may be disappointed. Second, there is a registration process. If you haven't already sorted out a vehicle by now and are working in tandem with the builder/owner to get the registration/approval paperwork in before the deadline, you're probably way too late. And third, it is an approval process - it's entirely possible that you could wind up renting something, only to find out that either the application is denied or that it does not pass the on-playa inspection.
Granted, as an employee you may not be in the position to either say no or suggest something that your boss may not want to hear, but I'll say it anyway (though others already have). Bikes. I think you may have said that they're already planning to have them. Good - use those. And instead of chasing down the idea of playing tourist by renting an art car.... they could interact with others. Seriously, it's awesome. Other people will offer rides.
Burning Man is a very big event, in physical size and in scope of experiences. No matter how much money your client/customer/friend/employer has, they can not buy all those experiences in one go.
Good luck though, however they decide to go.
Trilo
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Captain Goddammit
- Posts: 8589
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- Burning Since: 2000
- Camp Name: First Camp
- Location: Seattle, WA
In fact, the licensing process does not allow for random drivers. The driver has to be the person who registered it.
That and most mutant vehicles are not late-model generic sedans... they generally need the constant attention of their builder to remain functional.
And even if those obstacles were to be overcome, there's just something anti-proper-spirit about it.
That and most mutant vehicles are not late-model generic sedans... they generally need the constant attention of their builder to remain functional.
And even if those obstacles were to be overcome, there's just something anti-proper-spirit about it.
GreyCoyote: "At this rate it wont be long before he is Admiral Fukkit."
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Rat Bastard
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 7:19 pm
- Location: Chicago
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WHAT? I'd like to see your source for the "random" drivers rule. Anyone can drive an MV. The person who registers is responsible for the actions of the vehicle. Regaurdless who drives it. Last year I had 4 drivers other then me. Either build team or camp mate.Captain Goddammit wrote:In fact, the licensing process does not allow for random drivers. The driver has to be the person who registered it.
That and most mutant vehicles are not late-model generic sedans... they generally need the constant attention of their builder to remain functional.
And even if those obstacles were to be overcome, there's just something anti-proper-spirit about it.
Personally, mine runs like a dream. Then again, my operating procedures are actually written well and thorough. Not, "turn key and go".
Read my posts with a grain of salt.