Going back to a smaller center circle?

[mk-ultra]

The center ring was sort of a cluster fuck to navigate across if you were trying to cross the 6 o'clock radial via any of the inner streets. Once you hit the ring area, there really weren't any good landmarks to navigate by -- and you had to just sort of meander in the general direction toward where you wanted to go until you stumbled upon it.

It's not like this was a massive hassle -- we always managed to get to where we wanted to go -- but it would be nice to not waste 45 minutes noodling around in the dark using entropy as a method of navigation.

[alt12]

One thing that was really striking to me was the lack of any action on the esplanade at night other than at 2:00 and 10:00. Occasionally there would be a good performance or something but mostly it was dead especially on burn night. I think the effort to expand the "tourist zone" into the keyholes and plazas really backfired this year. Many camps didn't make it for whatever reason, many weren't doing a lot to bring people in, and there weren't enough cool camps left to make it worthwhile for people to "barhop" their way down in the dust. Most people seemed to just head straight for 2:00 or 10:00 and stay there or catch a party bus back/forth. The camps that were trying seemed to give up because nobody showed up.

The placers need to react to the number of camps that show up instead of just expecting there to be more and more cool theme camps every year.

I noticed this too...and I agree that espalanade theme camps have just given-up and ceded the entire night life to Opulent Temple and Root Society...as much time as I spend at those places, I think this is a very unfortunate consequence....and makes the city feel less homy and more of a ghost town at night....

its funny, everyone (myself included) complained that last year was too crowded, particularly in the week....no the complaint (myself included) is that everything was too big and spread apart....personally I would prefer it to small and jam packed.....its just more communal and more fun then when your friends are camped 9 miles away from you...

[laura*]

As a first timer maybe I'm all wet, ... but...

Having the Wheel projecting so far beyond the Esplanade was a real barrier. I hardly ever got to the 6 to 10 o'clock side of the city. I'd reach the Wheel and decide to turn off in a different direction.

I also never got to the center camp tent, not even once. The rare few times that I was at the keyhole into the Wheel I'd look at the tent in the distance and decide it was much too far away to explore.


Does the city have to be a semi-circle? Why can't it be a semi-oval? For example, take the existing circle and compress it in the 3 to 9 o'clock axis. This would make it easier to walk/ride across the empty center to the other side of the city. The radial streets can all still point at the man.

Or, how about keeping a circular city but make the Esplanade an oval that starts out in front of A street at 2 and 10, but that then dives "back" to maybe F street at 6 o'clock? In this configuration, the Wheel might be entirely in "front" of the Esplanade.

[MoisturePup]

I like Moisture Pup's idea--a lot.

The new esplanade could then be the 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock streets with the inner ring connecting them, sort of an ankh-shaped esplanade. The 10 and 2 streets would have the open view to the playa and the inner U could be more like a downtown.

In order for this design to work there would have to be many more circle streets than A-J since the inner most circles would be very small. A-Z maybe.

[mars]

I like Moisture Pup's idea--a lot.

The new esplanade could then be the 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock streets with the inner ring connecting them, sort of an ankh-shaped esplanade. The 10 and 2 streets would have the open view to the playa and the inner U could be more like a downtown.

In order for this design to work there would have to be many more circle streets than A-J since the inner most circles would be very small. A-Z maybe.

I think that's fine...does anyone from the BMorg ever read this shit?

[theCryptofishist]

Woof. I decide to add something to my first post and ended up posting twice. I wonder how much percentage I'll be claimed to have rewritten.

[theCryptofishist]

I think that's fine...does anyone from the BMorg ever read this shit?

No. Maybe AG takes a look from time to time, but this is pretty much where the bastard, red headed children hide out in disgrace.


Okay, there are rumors that LH reads this, and he did post once, but you can be pretty sure that nothing we write here will end up influencing policy in the burns to come.

[regynalonglank]

ok, I just have to tell you this, even though it is not pretty, and maybe kind of mean :) one day when I was super hungover and out of it I was trying to tell someone that I saw Larry in the coms tent as I showed up all late and visibly useless to a meeting...and I called him Hairy Larvae. by mistake, I swear. and I know every middle school kid thought of that already like a thousand years ago when he was in school, but I laughed so fucking hard I peed a little. hee

[Samsa Bee]

So, go back and check the late 90's afterburn reports.

WOW, tribe.net being down is kind of cool....for the reason that I just learned so much about the history of BMan I didnt already know its nutso!! (by looking on this site and googling other private bloggy type stuff)

So, some year in the late 90s, the city WAS in that Pac Man way. Theres an actual aerial view of the city, and its just like the map crudely drawn on this thread with the pie shape. . Sorry I dont have the link......next time I check it out I will copy and paste. But its on this site.
Anyways, it just seems a little more disconnective and wierd to the current inner circle city "hugging" the art.

F**K I got Burning Brain.....I need help.....hahaa

[theCryptofishist]

ok, I just have to tell you this, even though it is not pretty, and maybe kind of mean :) one day when I was super hungover and out of it I was trying to tell someone that I saw Larry in the coms tent as I showed up all late and visibly useless to a meeting...and I called him Hairy Larvae. by mistake, I swear. and I know every middle school kid thought of that already like a thousand years ago when he was in school, but I laughed so fucking hard I peed a little. hee

Apparently, Larry was chatting with one of the placed artists on playa pre event this year, and she told him at the end of the conversation that her playa name was "Larry Harvey." Rumor says he was not amused.

[Samsa Bee]

Heres one of the pics I was talking about. Bman 96 from the sky, in that pac man formation:

http://images.burningman.com/index.cgi?image=340

[mars]

very cool SB...

but the thing i don't like about being here rather than tribe, is that i can't look at your lovely photos. since tribe is taking it's damn time to come back to us, you may as well get some kind of avatar for yourself here!

[pignome]

If everyone continues to bring RV's and other large vehicles to the playa, burningman will continue to expand. Wasted space because it's toxic to camp next to an RV.

Agreed...smaller circles are critical to community.

We also need to foster better community relationships so that theme camps are more inclusive and don't block campers that are simply trying to share space.

If we don't want to share space with our neighbors and we need "complete control" over "OUR SPACE".
We are killing Burningman. Talk to your neighbors and figure out how to live together.
It's only a bloody week. Figure it out.

[bradtem]

The arc design was started in 98, I think. It does make a cool shape from the air, but after 11 years, it is time, I think, for tradition to be broken with and the shape to "evolve."

Why? There are two things very wrong with a circle.

1) If you want to enclose a space, a circle is the shape that does it with the shortest perimeter. But in BRC, the Esplanade is the prime street everybody wants to be on. You want to maximize perimeter, not minimize it. A square or triangle or a fractal shape do better.

2) The concentric streets (the ones named with letters) become useless for travel. It is always shorter, unless going a very short distance around the clock, to go inwards on a radial street, go a shorter hop on an inner concentric street (or a direct line on the playa) and then go back out. As such there is lots of traffic on the radials, but much less on outer concentrics.

Furthermore the concentrics curve. This is both good and bad. On the good side, it blocks wind a bit. On the bad side it means you can't see things that are far down the street, the way you can see the man on any of the radials.

I recommend another shape, such as something like superman's symbol with the top open to the playa, or a plain old 3 sides of a square. Just don't align the now linear streets with prevailing winds. Or you could still have radials, but it mans corners will not be 90 degrees. That can be handled.


Time for some EVOLUTION.

[mikesieben]

I want a fucking rhombus and i want it right the fuck now.

[cowgirl]

*snarf*

[thirt33n]

I want a fucking rhombus and i want it right the fuck now.

[theCryptofishist]

1) If you want to enclose a space, a circle is the shape that does it with the shortest perimeter. But in BRC, the Esplanade is the prime street everybody wants to be on.

Not everybody. Some people don't want the noise and traffic. Do a disproportionate number of people want a space on the smallest arc? Yes. But not everybody.

[sputnik]

I've been thinking about the city shape for some time. Here is my concept:



There are some concerns with it, especially traffic flow, but perhaps they aren't insurmountable.

[LisaLuckyOne]

I don't know, Mr. Sputnik (assuming that you are in fact a sir and apologizing most profusely if I've assumed incorrectly!)

I can only imagine the disturbing sensation of standing in the center of your proposed configuration, late at night, with a particularly bothersome case of the spins...

Goodness! I might never find my way home!

[Bob]

The arc design was started in 98, I think....

The 1997 "Back to the Beach" layout was the template for all successive designs.

Any design needs to be simple, unless you're prepared to hire personal ushers, firefighters & EMTs for each campsite.

[Grizelda]

The pie shape looks fabulous. If people want to camp or stroll where they can see a lot of open playa, there's the crimped edge of the pie crust.

[mars]

Sputnick,

In your idea is the man in the center or center camp in the center. It looks like a well-thought idea and I am curious about it.