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Post by lurker » Tue Sep 30, 2008 8:57 am

Perhaps consider just trashing the flier without comment...........?
If you don't lift up the fridge and spray from time to time the roaches will flourish.

We gain nothing by letting this type of thing slip quietly to the side, Ygmir--and we gain everything by exposing it to ridicule, to the terror of rational thought that it so abhors.

We need to stand up and speak back to it--wherever it comes from.

That's why I included my suspicions, why I checked to see if they were real. And why I cast aspersions on anyone who'd do this type of thing.

Why let ignorance flourish with your silence when you can burn it out with your voice?
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Post by Elderberry » Tue Sep 30, 2008 8:59 am

what state are you in lurker?

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Post by lurker » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:50 am

denial....no, seriously, the car was in a privately owned security laden garage in Ohio when this happened.

The owners are indian(from india) and most of the employees are black.

The flyer itself looks like a re-purposed 'miscegenation' flyer(though it may not have been re-purposed at all)

Had the flyer JUST been on our car I might've worried--given the racial hodge-podge that is my family, but it wasn't.
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Post by Elderberry » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:53 am

Ohio, well that explains it all!

JK

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Post by ygmir » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:59 am

lurker wrote:
Perhaps consider just trashing the flier without comment...........?
If you don't lift up the fridge and spray from time to time the roaches will flourish.

We gain nothing by letting this type of thing slip quietly to the side, Ygmir--and we gain everything by exposing it to ridicule, to the terror of rational thought that it so abhors.

We need to stand up and speak back to it--wherever it comes from.

That's why I included my suspicions, why I checked to see if they were real. And why I cast aspersions on anyone who'd do this type of thing.

Why let ignorance flourish with your silence when you can burn it out with your voice?
I understand what you say.
All I'm saying is the whole idea, IMHO, for them is attention, positive or negative.........

Do you really think people don't know about these groups?

Do you think yelling at them would matter?

Do you think public ridicule would matter?

IMHO, there is no more pointed disrespect possible than to relegate something to "non-existence".......that they just don't matter, nothing they say is even worth responding to..........

to treat something or someone as insignificant and not worthy of my attention, IMHO, will clearly tell them I just don't care about you.........you are of no moment in my world.

If we all did that, there'd be no soap box.

ok,
I'll quit now, and, climb down..........grin.......
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Post by lurker » Tue Sep 30, 2008 11:09 am

Silence equals consent, Ygmir.

I know some of these people, they think that everyone feels like they do, they're just afraid to say so--so they step up and say it 'for' them.

Not answering confirms their point--ridiculing them makes them look silly--not dangerous(as they like to think themselves)

But we all fight in our own way.
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Post by ygmir » Tue Sep 30, 2008 4:40 pm

lurker wrote:Silence equals consent, Ygmir.

I know some of these people, they think that everyone feels like they do, they're just afraid to say so--so they step up and say it 'for' them.

Not answering confirms their point--ridiculing them makes them look silly--not dangerous(as they like to think themselves)

But we all fight in our own way.
well,
I guess we're fightin the same war, just with different methods.....

good on ya.........
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Post by Apollonaris Zeus » Sat Oct 04, 2008 2:32 pm

Got Heroin!

Karzai's Poppy-Love Shack!

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/05/world ... n.html?hp
Here is a picture of him with a nickle bag!

Image

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Post by Elderberry » Sat Oct 04, 2008 3:53 pm

And this is a surprise?

Drugs need to be legalized. It will then bring prices and profits in-line and stop the black-market trafficking.

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Post by ygmir » Sat Oct 04, 2008 6:03 pm

jkisha wrote:And this is a surprise?

Drugs need to be legalized. It will then bring prices and profits in-line and stop the black-market trafficking.

JK
which is exactly why they're not legal.........
to much profit for the traffickers, plenty of bribes to congress to keep it illegal............

If they go legal, look how many people, let alone countries, will go broke........
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Post by Elderberry » Sat Oct 04, 2008 6:29 pm

ygmir wrote:
jkisha wrote:And this is a surprise?

Drugs need to be legalized. It will then bring prices and profits in-line and stop the black-market trafficking.

JK
which is exactly why they're not legal.........
to much profit for the traffickers, plenty of bribes to congress to keep it illegal............

If they go legal, look how many people, let alone countries, will go broke........
Damn, and all this time I thought it was because of our puritanical roots and religious suppression of all things pleasurable.

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Post by ygmir » Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:33 pm

nope,
IMHO, the real power behind it is the money, follow the trail......it always ends at congress, and, starts, well.......some sort of special interest, maybe near the Mina airport...........or not...........

the Puritanicals are just an appendage, they were there first, but, have no input or influence, just someone to point at as the "reason"...........
takes the focus off the drug lords and congressmen sleeping together........
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Post by wonderphil » Sun Oct 05, 2008 12:18 am

Apollonaris Zeus wrote:
more criticism on McCain's Economic View-

"How can you tell if John McCain is lying to you about how drilling in ANWR will help save American dollars and bring down the cost of oil? Phil Gramm’s lips are moving.
AZ, in this case you are not logical.

The price of oil is currently $93 per barrel but at the recent high price of $145 per barrel we are paying for 700 billion dollars of imported oil per year. In any case, the wealth of our country is being exported to the middle east because the democrats' oppose drilling in the USA this is stupid IMVHO.

ANWR is not what you have seen on your environmental TV program. Drilling and development takes time and I do not expect that it will decrease the price of oil in the short term. I do not even think it is in our interest to decrease the price of oil in the long term. I would like it fixed at a reasonable high price so that we can develop and encourage alternate energy. If you do this you need to set a high floor price on energy prices.

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Post by Ugly Dougly » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:21 am

This is the direction we're going:
[youtube][/youtube]

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Post by ygmir » Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:01 am

I bet you'd not post a similar video of any other socio-economic-ethnic group similar to that.........

Yeah, lets get along, as long as you can put down someone and not get shit for it........

Yeah, lets be tolerant, as long as you tolerate me, but, I don't have to tolerate anyone I don't like............

Oh yeah, I don't have to be tolerant, if I don't agree.

and, if you're not tolerant of me, you're bad, if you don't agree with me, you're bad, and, I don't have to tolerate you, if, I think you're bad.......

Geeze,
either we tolerate everyone, or, we're no better than those we accuse of intolerance.........

WTF?
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Post by Elderberry » Sun Oct 05, 2008 12:38 pm

wonderphil wrote: AZ, in this case you are not logical.

The price of oil is currently $93 per barrel but at the recent high price of $145 per barrel we are paying for 700 billion dollars of imported oil per year. In any case, the wealth of our country is being exported to the middle east because the democrats' oppose drilling in the USA this is stupid IMVHO.

ANWR is not what you have seen on your environmental TV program. Drilling and development takes time and I do not expect that it will decrease the price of oil in the short term. I do not even think it is in our interest to decrease the price of oil in the long term. I would like it fixed at a reasonable high price so that we can develop and encourage alternate energy. If you do this you need to set a high floor price on energy prices.
Phil, in this case I am afraid you are the one that is not being logical.

First, if we started drillilng today, it would take ten years to benefit from those efforts.

Second, the amount of oil we could recover from drilling would literally be a drop in the bucket compared to what our usage is now, let alone what the damand would be in ten years.

Third, Drilling is just a smoke screen and a diversion to the real problem. It is a panacea to the (republican, it seems) masses. We need to spend that time, effort and resources into developing alternatives to coal and oil. Any other solution is futile and with all due respect ignorant to the reality of the situation.

JK

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Post by Apollonaris Zeus » Sun Oct 05, 2008 1:30 pm

wonderphil wrote:
Apollonaris Zeus wrote:
more criticism on McCain's Economic View-

"How can you tell if John McCain is lying to you about how drilling in ANWR will help save American dollars and bring down the cost of oil? Phil Gramm’s lips are moving.
AZ, in this case you are not logical.

The price of oil is currently $93 per barrel but at the recent high price of $145 per barrel we are paying for 700 billion dollars of imported oil per year. In any case, the wealth of our country is being exported to the middle east because the democrats' oppose drilling in the USA this is stupid IMVHO.

ANWR is not what you have seen on your environmental TV program. Drilling and development takes time and I do not expect that it will decrease the price of oil in the short term. I do not even think it is in our interest to decrease the price of oil in the long term. I would like it fixed at a reasonable high price so that we can develop and encourage alternate energy. If you do this you need to set a high floor price on energy prices.
price fixing is wrong. ask nixon about fixing prices.

We must eliminate the speculator from being a prime factor in the pricing of oil.

jkiska is right. If all the available continental oil was tapped, we would still be buying most of our oil from other countries.

We must move to electric/ flexfuel cars.

And you are right, I wasn't being logical about McCain and Gramm.

It was a joke, but Gramm has been overly influential in the process.

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Post by can't sit still » Sun Oct 05, 2008 2:01 pm

Those pics are real cute. Truth is,the north slope is as boring as it gets. I've flown to both Barrow and Prudoe. Driven a bit on what roads there are. It's endless tundra with a gazillion pools for mosquitoes. That's not to say that all of ANWR is boring or that we should trash it. I've driven all over Alaska. It's a nice place.
The Inupiat invented the "Eskimo blanket toss" just because the place is so gawd-awful flat.
We might as well drill ANWR. Nobody ever goes there so it won't spoil their view. There is absolutely no reason to go north of the Brooks Range. In 25,000 years, all trace will be gone. A blink of the eye. Mother nature won't mind.
I don't post things because I believe that they are the absolute truth. I post them because I believe that they should be considered.

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Post by Elderberry » Sun Oct 05, 2008 2:21 pm

ygmir wrote:I bet you'd not post a similar video of any other socio-economic-ethnic group similar to that.........

Sure I would! :lol:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index ... the-Debate

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Post by ygmir » Sun Oct 05, 2008 3:06 pm

Image
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Mon Oct 06, 2008 9:54 am

ygmir wrote:I bet you'd not post a similar video of any other socio-economic-ethnic group similar to that.........

Yeah, lets get along, as long as you can put down someone and not get shit for it........

Yeah, lets be tolerant, as long as you tolerate me, but, I don't have to tolerate anyone I don't like............

Oh yeah, I don't have to be tolerant, if I don't agree.

and, if you're not tolerant of me, you're bad, if you don't agree with me, you're bad, and, I don't have to tolerate you, if, I think you're bad.......

Geeze,
either we tolerate everyone, or, we're no better than those we accuse of intolerance.........

WTF?
They are Democrats. Can you dredge up something like this showing some Republicans looking like idiots please? In the interest of balance and fairness, since that's what we're ALL interested in? :D

What kind of Viking are you anyway? ;)

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Post by Elderberry » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:24 am

Ugly Dougly wrote: They are Democrats. Can you dredge up something like this showing some Republicans looking like idiots please? In the interest of balance and fairness, since that's what we're ALL interested in? :D

What kind of Viking are you anyway? ;)
Hey, I'm an equal opportunity basher. :lol: You can be sure that if I run across anything like this involving the republicans, I'll post it up. :wink:

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Post by lurker » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:29 am

Hey, alternative energy retards, are you all so thick that you don't understand that we have to transition to alternative energies? That we can't just shut off oil and switch on the big, hidden, cheap alternative energy spigot?

Jesus. What is wrong with you people?
We must move to electric/ flexfuel cars.
Sure. Great. We DO need to move to some alternate. But we can't do it overnight. How many people have electric(a useless solution, BTW, since you're still burning the fossil fuels--just at the power plant instead of in your car) or flex fuel cars right now to 'switch' to?

'Switch to' means shell out tens of thousands of dollars--and that's everyone who's driving a fossil fuel powered vehicle right now.

And what makes you think that we'll be able to stop using oil when we stop burning it? Do you have any idea how many uses oil has? We're gonna need oile for all that crap even when we stop using it for power.

Transition.

That means getting all available resources working so we're not slammed with high fuel costs at a time whe we need our money to purchase alternatives. So we can get to a point where we're not burning oil anymore without screwing up the global economy any worse than it's already screwed.

Don't you get that?

And fuck your 'it'll take ten years' comment--Republicans were wanting to tap our reserves more than ten years ago but you retards whined THEN that it would take ten years---which we'd already be through if you all hadn't screwed things up. And now you whine that it'll take ten years again? And if we wait? Will you be there puling about the ten years the next time? Y'know, if you do, the time after that we might actually get to it--there sure won't be enough cheap power by then for you to be whining on the internet--of course, we might not have the resources to commit to further drilling them--because you'll have driven us back to the stone age.

It's just like this stupid bailout--there's so much footage of lefties saying 'there's no problem' that we're tripping over it. Just like the oil--we were warned, over and over, and you kept putting it off. And now we're in the shit.

Well, you know what? We can't just print up some money to make the coming oil crisis go away like we're gonna do over this bailout. Hell, we might not be ABLE to print up money to use.

But you'll just keep whining, won't you? Warning after warning. And you'll ignore it.

How can people who SEEM so smart BE so fucking stupid?

We need cheap energy to make this transition. If we don't have it we're gonna go into panic mode. We won't be able to afford the high priced alternatives--so the price of those alternatives won't go down.

Well, at less the caribou, polar bears and jellyfish will be safe.....
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Post by Apollonaris Zeus » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:48 am

Ta, Taaaa!

Look at all the non-fossilized electric production!

New Jersey Grants Rights to Build a Wind Farm About 20 Miles Offshore

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/04/nyregion/04wind.html

No oil rigs off the coast of NJ! No Never!

NJ shore produces billions of clean money!

So here's your non-oil power to run your Electric/Flexfuel vehicles.

Dow chemical is moving to replace oil with biochemical production.

They will succeed in making oil use a minimum.

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Post by lurker » Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:33 am

So 5 years is okay, but not ten? And what do we do until then? But wait, there's a permitting process to go through to get permission to build this wind farm--subject to the whims of environmentalists.......5 years? Maybe 10--maybe never.

But hey, they've said that they CAN do it. And that's what's important. Even though they haven't started building a thing yet.

As the oil powered machinery builds the windmills with oil based parts(and possibly oil lubrication)--using technologies created by Big Oil.

To provide premium priced power to a financially struggling nation? Well to tens of thousands of homes anyway...what's that equal to? About 1 neighborhood in Jersey City? There are millions in New Jersey--not thousands.

What do we do until all this magic clean 'money(?) starts appearing?
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Post by Elderberry » Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:49 am

Probably before you were born, John Kennedy challenged the country to get to the moon. Something that was thought almost impossible back then. There were actually religious groups that thought we would be punnished for invading heaven.

If we had the same leadership today and the challenge was laid down to switch off of oil (and big oil companies wouldn't stand in the way) to alternative fuel, it could and would happen. All it takes is money and the committment.

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Post by ygmir » Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:57 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote:
ygmir wrote:I bet you'd not post a similar video of any other socio-economic-ethnic group similar to that.........

Yeah, lets get along, as long as you can put down someone and not get shit for it........

Yeah, lets be tolerant, as long as you tolerate me, but, I don't have to tolerate anyone I don't like............

Oh yeah, I don't have to be tolerant, if I don't agree.

and, if you're not tolerant of me, you're bad, if you don't agree with me, you're bad, and, I don't have to tolerate you, if, I think you're bad.......

Geeze,
either we tolerate everyone, or, we're no better than those we accuse of intolerance.........

WTF?
They are Democrats. Can you dredge up something like this showing some Republicans looking like idiots please? In the interest of balance and fairness, since that's what we're ALL interested in? :D

What kind of Viking are you anyway? ;)
why do you think I'm a Viking?
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Post by lurker » Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:00 pm

Probably before you were born, John Kennedy challenged the country to get to the moon. Something that was thought almost impossible back then. There were actually religious groups that thought we would be punnished for invading heaven.


JFK challenged us to get to the moon because the Soviets were trying to get there. We had an active space program and no one sane thought we could never do it

What do religious groups have to do with this?
If we had the same leadership today and the challenge was laid down to switch off of oil (and big oil companies wouldn't stand in the way) to alternative fuel, it could and would happen. All it takes is money and the committment.
Don't be an idiot. Our entire economy runs on oil--the whole world. We can't just shut off the spigot. We'd be right back to the stone age then--we are far too dependent on an oil-run technological civilization.

And Big Oil has so much more invested in finding a true alternate fuel than anyone else it's not funny. They're invested because the one who finds it will kill every other oil company. And they know--far far better than you, jkisha, that oil is a finite quantity.

Finally, in case you hadn't noticed, the challenge to get off oil HAS be laid down. And we're trying--but, and I'll say this slowly, we need to t r a n s i t i o n.

We need to make the switch gradually, without major impacts to our oil based infrastructure.

A good way to start is by getting us off fossil fuel power plants and onto nuclear and hydroelectric power. We could see to it that all newly constructed housing has photovoltaic roofing and water heaters that can use sun heat as a source--or on demand heaters. That would help bring the prices down so older homes could make the switch. Solar powered streetlights would also be a good idea.

But there's a big hurdle that doesn't get much play. We've got a problem with energy storage. We need better batteries. Better batteries would allow us to keep a lot of the energy we waste today, as heat, as vibration.

We need to change--but that doesn't mean that we don't need to drill.

McCain calls it an 'all of the above' solution. And I'm hard pressed to understand the reticence of the left to keeping ourselves fueled WHILE we pursue alternative energy.
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:36 am

ygmir wrote: why do you think I'm a Viking?
Sorry, it's such a stereotype, the horned helmet and big axe. You probably get that a lot. ;)

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Post by ygmir » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:51 am

Ugly Dougly wrote:
ygmir wrote: why do you think I'm a Viking?
Sorry, it's such a stereotype, the horned helmet and big axe. You probably get that a lot. ;)
no problem. I do get that a lot........Image

my avatar is a representation of Odin.........

People think if I'm Nordic and Pagan, I must be a Viking.......
although I have to trouble with Vikings.
Calling me, or other Nordic Pagans "Vikings" is like calling all Americans "Marines".......

Vikings were a part of Norse culture, and society, but, by no means even a large part of it........Just the most famous/notorious.......

How's that for babbling?...........
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