radio communication on the playa

simianofbaltimore · Post by **simianofbaltimore** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 12:23 pm

I apologize if I missed a thread already related to this, if someone could point me there I'd appreciate it. Anyway - I am coming to Black Rock City this year for my second Burn (1st was in 2002) and I am considering various means of staying in contact with my campmates throughout the city. Last time we bought some cheap handheld FRS 2-way radios, but their range was far less than the advertised 2 miles and we ended up not using them at all on the playa. This year I am thinking about handheld CB radios, but I am concerned about crowding on the frequencies.

If you have any experience or some technical information for me that might assist in my choice for desert radio communications, I'd appreciate knowing about it.

Also, I wonder if DPW has ever considered a city-wide wi-fi computer network? Now THAT's a project I would get a fucking kick out of volunteering for.

III · Post by **III** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 12:27 pm

>>DPW has ever considered a city-wide wi-fi computer network?

you've got to be kidding me.

(there are a couple camps who provide wi fi services, btw)

simianofbaltimore · Post by **simianofbaltimore** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 1:06 pm

I wasn't kidding, though it would be nice if you tell me why it seemed like I was.

Dr. Pyro · Post by **Dr. Pyro** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 2:16 pm

Well S'o'B'more, you would have to know Trey like the rest of us to completely follow his response. And far be it for me to speak for him, the point I think he was trying to make simply was that for something as ambitious as a city-wide communication network organized by anyone in a place as chaotic as Black Rock City and with the amount of dust, drugs/liquor, and general inavailability of communication experts for that sort of undertaking in a temporary city in the harshest and weirdest setting imaginable is, well, a stupid idea. There, I said it. Your idea is stupid. Organize it yourself and you'll see how right I am. But I like your "thinking outside of the box". Refreshing, but naive. Use those little Motorola hand-helds like everybody else.

The Doc

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 2:46 pm

Dr. Pyro wrote:Use those little Motorola hand-helds like everybody else.

The Doc

Last time I tried that, there was quite a bit of traffic - not that there's anything wrong with that - just people saying "where are you?" "I'm here?" "Who's that?" "It's me!" Then somebody starts singing or making weird noises...

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 2:49 pm

A hand held cb would work fine out there. Not many folks have then. We use them while traveling and never thou ght of useing then on playa. I'll run a channel sherch see if I can find youK?

shitmouse · Post by **shitmouse** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 4:49 pm

The Doc[/quote]
Last time I tried that, there was quite a bit of traffic - not that there's anything wrong with that - just people saying "where are you?" "I'm here?" "Who's that?" "It's me!" Then somebody starts singing or making weird noises...[/quote]

--lol!
that's so fucking *on*.
hahahha..
-b

precipitate · Post by **precipitate** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 10:54 pm

>I wasn't kidding, though it would be nice if you tell me why it seemed like
> I was.

OK. How much would you like to pay for your ticket to facilitate that
for the other 30,000 participants?

Or were you volunteering to do it yourself? Because that sounds like a fine
project for a young, gung-ho dude such as yourself to undertake. See BLM
permits for exact dimensions of the city.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 10:56 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote: Last time I tried that, there was quite a bit of traffic - not that there's anything wrong with that - just people saying "where are you?" "I'm here?" "Who's that?" "It's me!" Then somebody starts singing or making weird noises...

and it was really funny on the webcast too.

Tancorix · Post by **Tancorix** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 11:04 pm

Serious Wi-Fi on the playa? I hope not. One thing I love about BRC is it's in one of the few places in America that lacks cell phone coverage, landline phones, and for the most part Internet access. In other words the location pretty much insures that my work stays behind and I get to enjoy my time in BRC. It forces me to let go of the real world a bit. If there was full blown Wi-Fi and not the Oregon Country Fair limited stuff, it could dramatically change the event for some people.

In other words, I hope it all stays off the playa, or I pray for a good dust storm to knock some of it out.

III · Post by **III** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 11:21 pm

>>would be nice if you tell me why

because everyone always wants the dpw to do stuff so that they don't have to. you'd think that laying out the streets and installing the trash fence would be enough, but no, they gotta build half the shade structures in the city, install art for "artists", provide a 120 v power grid, build mr klean a new art car, provide community burn platforms and clean up after everyone.

of all the things that it's suggested that the dpw do (because *lord* knows that yer average "participant" is to incompetent to do that sort of thing) providing a high budget communications system for everyone is a bit beyond the pale. (at least you could have suggested something reasonable, like hot & cold running water to every camp...)

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 5:26 am

...Besides, those lampposts would make GREAT telegraph poles until we can get the fiber optic lines buried......

simianofbaltimore · Post by **simianofbaltimore** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 6:41 am

While I appreciate everyone's opinion, I am not a total playa virgin so I am aware of the geophysical setting and climate conditions... and I think citywide wi-fi is a lot more practical than "running hot and cold water to each camp."

For starters, it could be a participant-based peer-to-peer network, where each machine on the network is also a server. As long as a few camps were willing to bring good wi-fi routers (not all that expensive considering how much people tend to spend on BM) it could work. I'm not suggesting that DPW buy a bunch of routers, more like they publish a set of specifications that could be used by people willing to participate in the network project.

And internet access from the network would be unlikely, unless someone has a satellite connection whose bandwidth they're willing to share with a city of 30,000....

I think wi-fi would hold up pretty well in Black Rock City, since it's a flat, dry space with relatively low EM interference for a city of 30,000. The only interruptions I can forsee might be caused by a white-out storm.

I just think a PlayaNet would be awesome. Sue me.

III · Post by **III** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 8:04 am

>> just think a PlayaNet would be awesome.

have you done a google search on "playanet"?

i'm not saying it's a bad idea. i'm saying that loading it onto the dpw is.

simianofbaltimore · Post by **simianofbaltimore** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 8:10 am

I should probably have made the wi-fi remark a whole other thread, since this really got away from my original question about radios... hehehe.

But yeah, I admit fault for not googling... now I see playanet.

Tanks a zillion.

Last Real Burner · Post by **Last Real Burner** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 8:21 am

Another satisfied customer......

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 10:02 am

"I'm not suggesting that DPW buy a bunch of routers, more like they publish a set of specifications that could be used by people willing to participate in the network project."

Sounds like a great project for an individual to do. Write up a proposal and publish it here, maybe start a webpage. Gather input from knowledgeable people, establish guidelines, and make it happen. Why wait for DPW to do it? If it's worth doing....

regards, Jeffery

simianofbaltimore · Post by **simianofbaltimore** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 10:08 am

I'm reading up on http://www.playanet.org/ right now... looks like they did just what I suggested in 2001. I don't think the webpage has been updated in a while, though. I am going to email them and see if there are any plans for PlayaNet 2004.

I'd love to do it myself but I am A) quite low on funds and B) in Maryland, with no chance of getting to the playa early. But I will look into it.

Thank you everyone for your suggestions.

Booker · Post by **Booker** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:10 am

http://www.burningman.com/on_the_playa/ ... #directory

Taniwha · Post by **Taniwha** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 1:13 pm

honestly playanet worked great last year though it was a tad bandwidth poor - I hopped on for all of 5 minutes last year while I was uploading photos - noticed 1500 emails (mostly spam) waiting for me and shut down the laptop - there really isn't anything compelling there for me (especially since I didn't dare take the laptop out of the car) there's just too much else going on on the playa - I'd love to see some wonderfull BM related content, even a playanet that wasn't connected to the rest of the world but making web/net stuff is not something I imagine people spending a lot of playa time doing.

As far as radios on the playa are concerned - they don't work well - there's are a lot of speculation as to why not - some people think it's the water table under the playa soaking up the RF, something special about the playa dirt, others say it's the curvature f the playa (it actually bows up in the middle a little exagerating the curvature of the earth) - maybe it's the space aliens, black helecopters - who knows

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 3:02 pm

Motorola's have worked well for me in the past but we've only used them to direct folks to camp on their way in.

Wireless was available last year but it seemed to work best in Center Camp. For every web-head who thinks it's a good idea you'll find a bunch of folks who think it's a sin.

Zane5100 · Post by **Zane5100** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 2:38 pm

boer wrote:Motorola's have worked well for me in the past but we've only used them to direct folks to camp on their way in.

Those talkabouts seem to do okay in the beginning of the week, and then are worthless about Wed for the reasons mentioned earlier (BTW, that was me making all those weird noises on your radio).

boer wrote:Wireless was available last year but it seemed to work best in Center Camp. For every web-head who thinks it's a good idea you'll find a bunch of folks who think it's a sin.

Sort of like the trash cans/coffee sales debate...

Striper · Post by **Striper** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 3:35 am

There are options to the "Motorola" type FRS radios, one of the best, but a bit pricey is the Standard Horizon HX470S. $250.00 after $50.00 rebate from West Marine. These very small radios are tri-band, VHF marine, for you who also boat, FRS so you can interface with friends who also have FRS radios and these also have a MURS band with four times the power of FRS radios and are less known about so less crowded. No license required for use of any of the bands, although there are restriction on the use of the Marine VHF. These radios also recieve AM, FM, Civilian and Commercial Aviation, and weather channels. For all you get, these radios are very affordable, MURS works great on the playa and the radios are playa resistent, as the radios are rated for being able to be submerged for short periods of time. I hope this helps with your comm problems? Also check out GMRS radios, usually just the one band but they do also have more power than the FRS radios and overlap onto some of the FRS channels so you can still communicate with your FRS burner friends.

Striper

radio communication on the playa

radio communication on the playa

Kidding? no...

I am less skeptical...

whoremony

AAAAAAAAhhhhhhhhhhh.....

Re: I am less skeptical...

Thanks Jeffrey

Playa Comm