Politics, Everyday, All day... morning, noon and night....

joel the ornery · Post by **joel the ornery** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:34 am

I want to wake up to world that lives ethically as opposed to standing on them (ethics) as a soapbox for their own opinions.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 12:17 pm

I have a confession to make: I am the foreign affairs columnist for The New York Times and I didn't listen to one second of the 9/11 hearings and I didn't read one story in the paper about them. Not one second. Not one story.

Lord knows, it's not out of indifference to 9/11. It's because I made up my mind about that event a long time ago: It was not a failure of intelligence, it was a failure of imagination.

It was neither, 911 was let to be so there could be an excuse to invade Iraq.
It was obvious that the powers that be were looking for opportunity.
Proof will show this to be true.
when time comes to prove what the FAA did during the first 45 minutes they first discovered the transponders of the planes were not responding, everyone will see these records are missing.

This administration needs to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 12:54 pm

de facto, who killed kennedy?

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 4:41 pm

stuart wrote:de facto, who killed kennedy?

no conspiracy theories now.

Hey, It's true. I bet they wont show the records. This from the Jersey women, and I'm not pulling cites cause it will be known in time.

as always.

and before I forget, do you belive in the magic bullet theory?

I thought you did.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:25 pm

The Daily show has a better insight on this government than the followers.
of Bush.

what are we gonna do without The Bush administration.

Other than live longer.

Hey, do you think there will come a time where this administration will make an attempt to outlaw Burningman when they are placed in office for the next 4 years?

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 5:55 am

great link for this thread IMHO.

http://www.sinfinity.net/

I like section 8

joel the ornery · Post by **joel the ornery** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:37 am

DVD Burner wrote:great link for this thread IMHO.
http://www.sinfinity.net/
I like section 8

Nothing like a little anti-semitism to make one shudder in their shoes.... sorry, I don't have time for hate mongerers like the above referenced site.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:39 am

joel the ornery wrote: Nothing like a little anti-semitism to make one shudder in their shoes.... sorry, I don't have time for hate mongerers like the above referenced site.

Hate mongers? how did you come to that?

fnord · Post by **fnord** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:45 am

Nothing like a little anti-semitism to make one shudder in their shoes.... sorry, I don't have time for hate mongerers like the above referenced site.

That site was quite kind to Abbie Hoffman...

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:52 am

fnord wrote: That site was quite kind to Abbie Hoffman...

Bwwaaaaa..........no no no.

you folks are rather young.

what's on this site http://www.sinfinity.net/
is rather accurate.

This is not only the history of the world but it's who runs it and how it's run.

I'm sure their are a lot of people here on eplaya that will say diffrent but it is up to them to prove it.

read it and learn.

Also I have only heard of abby hoffman ( is he from the chicago 8?) and ron bell i think his name is.
this is not quite the same.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:58 am

ABBIE HOFFMAN

A countercultural icon of the 1960's, Abbie Hoffman was successful at turning many flower children into political activists. Hoffman was born into a Jewish family in Worcester, Massachusetts in 1936, and became active in the civil rights movement after graduating from Brandeis University. He was arrested in Mississippi during Freedom Summer, and two years later founded a crafts store in New York City, Liberty House, that sold the products of poor people's coops in Mississippi.

He was best known for his rejection and parody of American corporate culture. In 1967, Hoffman and several friends threw dollar bills from the visitors' gallery onto the floor of the New York Stock Exchange, resulting in a near-riot as traders scrambled for the cash. During a major anti-war demonstration, he organized an "Exorcism of the Pentagon", in which he led over 50,000 people to surround the Pentagon in an effort to levitate the building by their combined psychic energy. He, along with Jerry Rubin and other activities, became "Yippies", and formed the Youth International Party. The Yippies held a Festival of Life at the 1968 Democratic National Convention, which led to violence and arrests; these, in turn, led to the famous Chicago Seven trial (which started off as the Chicago Eight trial, but was reduced to Seven when Bobby Seale of the Black Panthers was bound, gagged, and sent to prison for contempt of court). For the next several years, Hoffman was a full-time activist until 1973, when he was arrested for the sale of cocaine. Facing a mandatory life sentence, he went underground and disappeared for 6 years, during which time he had plastic surgery, nervous breakdowns, and was an environmental activist under an alias. After emerging from hiding in 1980, he served a brief prison sentence and then re-entered the world of activism. He continued to organize people on college campuses and elsewhere, especially about environmental issues, until his death by suicide in 1989.

joel the ornery · Post by **joel the ornery** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:17 am

DVD Burner wrote:
fnord wrote: That site was quite kind to Abbie Hoffman...

Bwwaaaaa..........no no no.

you folks are rather young.

what's on this site http://www.sinfinity.net/
is rather accurate.

This is not only the history of the world but it's who runs it and how it's run.

I'm sure their are a lot of people here on eplaya that will say diffrent but it is up to them to prove it.

read it and learn.

Also I have only heard of abby hoffman ( is he from the chicago 8?) and ron bell i think his name is.
this is not quite the same.

All of the above statements are "in your humble opinion" which doesn't seem too humble for the most part.

Now where did I put that IGNORE button?

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:21 am

Well I guess you are one of the ones to prove the above not to be true.

What I have posted is not anything of what I have written. These are facts. not my opinion. In fact, you have not heard my opinion about this yet.

So please enlighten me as to what in the link I've posted is not true or just my opinion.

I described section 8 to be one of my favorites. would you like to start there?

joel the ornery · Post by **joel the ornery** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:38 am

DVD Burner wrote:Well I guess you are one of the ones to prove the above not to be true.
What I have posted is not anything of what I have written. These are facts. not my opinion. In fact, you have not heard my opinion about this yet.
So please enlighten me as to what in the link I've posted is not true or just my opinion.
I described section 8 to be one of my favorites. would you like to start there?

"PLONK"

We will never agree on above mentioned subjects or most any other that comes to mind.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:47 am

joel the ornery wrote: We will never agree on above mentioned subjects or most any other that comes to mind.

How do you know if we never debate.

You still have'nt answered. Badger and Bob have asked me cites along time ago about this stuff and though I've been late in delivering (I do have a life) I cited.

Hey if you dont want to debate it's ok.
I dont expect Bob or Badger to debate on the cites either.

joel the ornery · Post by **joel the ornery** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:48 am

And now I remember why.. "I never want to belong to an organization that would actually have me as a member."

Hmmmmm, the e-playa will be a far better place without my participation.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:55 am

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 12:08 pm

aw come on now. you created a politics thread to talk politics and now someone wants to talk politics and you run.

Joel. you are better than that.

You'll be back.

Zulegoona · Post by **Zulegoona** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 7:39 pm

From the few things on http://www.sinfinity.net that I tried to wade threw it seems like another massive diatribe that portends to explain every thing to an all encompassing conspiracy. These sorts of things make me wonder why would anyone chose to string together such an odd collection of beliefs, half truths, insignificant truth things, pure fabrications, and twisted biases, into a world view.

There are only a few reasons I can think of;
(1) They feel unsuccessful in there lives and need to blame someone else for there failures.

(2) They feel powerless and insignificant and by developing the "Grand" conspiracy, they feel empowered by there personally unique brilliance that enables them to "see" how the world works.

(3) They fear the real chaotic flow of human existence and find it more comforting to believe someone is in control even if it is someone else.

(4) They believe there lives, loves, nature would all be perfect if somebody wasn't fucking it up.

Any other ideas?

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 8:25 pm

You still have'nt proven what's not true.

what's not true, The Bush family associated with Hitler?
The Bush's association with s&b?
what?

I can understand that many want to disagree and live in a state of denial but you still have to prove any of the given (shall we'll say ) stories are not true.

Zulegoona · Post by **Zulegoona** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 9:10 pm

Ok DVD, it's all true every thing on the planet is firmly under control of the Grand conspiracy there is not a politician or candidate that hasn't been co-opted or replaced by a conspirator. It's all a part of a world wide machine and we are all just parts of the machine. Every thing is fixed and you can't change it. Nothing is permitted to happen that doesn't further the aims of the conspiracy, it's all a part of a master plan. Participation in social or political movements or not is irrelevant because you participation or lack or it has all been taken into account. You cant take a shit with out it progressing the agenda of the conspiracy. Even the illusion of free will was designed to manipulate the masses, as was the illusion of power and wealth. For generations we have lived and died as part of the grand conspiracy, our genetic make up has been honed so we might better serve the machine.

and yes you have to get up and go to work tomorrow.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 9:19 pm

nope.

ummmmmm......but you do though. I shall party tonight and sleep in late then work on my projects when I wake at will.

Sucks being awsome. but some of you would'nt know that hmmmmm.

Force · Post by **Force** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:29 pm

I am the grand conspirator. That's right, I run it all. Sorry things have kind of gotten out of hand lately, I've been busy- new girlfriend and all that.

Seriously though, does anyone else wonder if the pres and his cohorts are having massive coke parties every night or something? It sure would explain a lot of the wacky decisions he's made.... I hear the news every day and I can't help but recall the last days of Hitler, huddling in his bunker sucking down amphetamines and playing board games....

You'd think that little scene would be the death knell for the cult of personality, but noooooooo, people still wanna be led. Sigh.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Mar 30, 2004 11:31 pm

aahhhhh force.

a breath of fresh air.

Zephryus · Post by **Zephryus** » Wed Mar 31, 2004 3:24 am

FNORD.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Wed Mar 31, 2004 2:33 pm

DVD Burner wrote:Marshall law

What's the sheriff from a bad 50s tv western doing here anyway?

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Thu Apr 01, 2004 10:08 am

April 1, 2004
OP-ED COLUMNIST
What's That Sound?
By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN

MEXICO CITY

I hadn't been to Mexico since 1996, so it definitely caught my ear when I started to hear two non-Spanish words on this trip that I'd never heard here before: "China" and "India." Mexicans are increasingly aware that these two countries are running off with jobs and markets that Mexicans once thought they owned. You have to feel sorry for the Mexicans: they are hearing "the giant sucking sound" in stereo these days — from China in one ear and India in the other. Worse, they seem stuck, unable to forge a coherent strategic response.

"We are caught between India and China," remarked Jorge Castañeda, the former Mexican foreign minister who just decided to run for president in 2006. "We have lost about 500,000 manufacturing jobs. It is very difficult for us to compete with the Chinese, except with high-value-added industries. Where we should be competing, in the services area, we are hit by the Indians with their back offices and call centers. . . . Not enough people here speak English." And that's not all. While China and India each send tens of thousands of students to be educated abroad every year in science and engineering, particularly in the U.S., Mexico sends just 10,000.

Go into any discount store in Mexico and look at low-priced clothing, toys, shoes and electronics, or even some Christian religious objects, and it is hard not to buy Chinese, added Mr. Castañeda, speaking at the Mexican Council on Foreign Relations. But more important, "the U.S. markets that we had a corner on is where we are losing jobs. . . . We knew it would happen when China [entered the World Trade Organization in 2001], but we did not get prepared."

Mexico's problem, in a nutshell, is this: The world is flat — or at least getting flatter. Thanks to PC's, telecommunication advances and market-opening agreements, capital can seek out factories and knowledge workers anywhere in the world with greater and greater ease. To get itself in shape to sign the Nafta free-trade accord with the U.S. and Canada, Mexico did what I would call the "wholesale" reforms — and they have been incredibly impressive. It made a historic transition to freer markets and democracy, with respect for human rights and fair elections.

But with China attracting huge amounts of dollars to put its low-wage workers to work on all sorts of industrial exports, and with India now able to export its low-wage brainpower over phone lines and fiber-optic cables, Mexico's advantages in the U.S. market — its proximity and Nafta — are being eroded. Mexico can stay ahead only if it does "retail reforms."

These are the micro reforms that will make its economy more flexible and productive. The government has set out five areas for reform: labor markets; the judiciary; the constitution and electoral system; tax collection, which is abysmal; and opening the energy and electricity markets to foreign investors so a gas-rich country like Mexico gets out of the crazy situation of importing natural gas and gasoline from America.

The old autocratic Mexico could have ordered these reforms from above. That's how China still does it, giving Beijing an advantage now that it will pay for later. But because Mexico is now a democracy, and needs to remain competitive, it can upgrade its institutions only by going through the messy, time-consuming process of consensus building. Alas, President Vicente Fox has not been very good at building consensus.

"We did the first stages of structural reform from the top down," said Guillermo Ortiz, the governor of Mexico's central bank. "The next stage is much more difficult. You have to work from the bottom up. You have to create the wider consensus to push the reforms in a democratic context. . . . There is an urgency for Mexico to finish the structural reforms at the micro level."

Why? Because while Mexico upgraded its competitiveness, notes the analyst Daniel Rosen in the journal The International Economy, China upgraded worker education, infrastructure, management skills, technology and quality controls even faster.

Will Rogers said it a long time ago: "Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there." Mexico has put itself on the right track. But for the moment, it's just sitting there. If it doesn't start moving again, it's going to get run over by China, India, America — or all of the above.

But America had better not be a passive spectator, as it has been in these Bush years, because if Mexico gets hit, we, too, will feel its pain.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:10 pm

Joel. heyyyyy. glad to see you did'nt leave after all.

really.

but are you going to be just a cut and paste kinda guy?

you need to write your opinion more.

really glad you're back

glam_daddy · Post by **glam_daddy** » Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:01 pm

please check out my humble politics page...

http://www.jordansplace.net/politics/politics.html

paz y amor

)'(

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Thu Apr 01, 2004 8:24 pm

Glam_daddy Rocks.
I've seen that page floating around from time to time and saw some other intersting things on there. mostly the photography and other graphics, but it's a nice site.

I'm not sure if I put it under "Really got it going on".

anyhoo, tight site.

Politics, Everyday, All day... morning, noon and night....

PLONK PLONK PLONK PLONK

Re: PLONK PLONK PLONK PLONK

ah, um, I have a confession to make...

A little wake-up call if you are paying attention.

my polticle page