Rest In Peace Kurt Cobain

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 12:41 pm

Today's the ten-year anniversary of Kurt Kobain's suicide, or at least the finding of his body. God, how time flies.

I still miss him. A man who could say so powerfully, "No. It's not okay." The "Unplugged" album is probably the saddest recording I'll ever hear. I suggest eveyone read the Harlan Ellison story "Paingod" and think of Kurt.

I wish he had made it through. I wish he had come to the playa.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 12:51 pm

Living is tough, dying is easy.

III · Post by **III** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:13 pm

too bad el duce is dead too - now we'll never really know.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:42 pm

http://www.mindmelt.com/ripelduc.asp

DangerMouse · Post by **DangerMouse** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:44 pm

I'm glad he's gone.

Nirvana was the ZZ-Top of Grunge (Seattle/Whatever) bands. Every song sounded the same. Unintelligably mumbled lyrics. Uninspiring music.

Best thing to come out of that band was Weird Al's parody of them. And that's not saying much.

However the worst thing he ever did was kill himself and launch Courtney Love's career. He should be axed a second time for that.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:53 pm

DangerMouse wrote:I'm glad he's gone.

Nirvana was the ZZ-Top of Grunge (Seattle/Whatever) bands. Every song sounded the same. Unintelligably mumbled lyrics. Uninspiring music.

Best thing to come out of that band was Weird Al's parody of them. And that's not saying much.

However the worst thing he ever did was kill himself and launch Courtney Love's career. He should be axed a second time for that.

that is some "ornery" sh*t....

DangerMouse · Post by **DangerMouse** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:06 pm

Sorry about the above post. I didn't mean to insult ZZ-Top or its fans in such a way...

Tancorix · Post by **Tancorix** » Mon Apr 05, 2004 4:03 pm

DangerMouse wrote:Sorry about the above post. I didn't mean to insult ZZ-Top or its fans in such a way...

ZZ Top is now in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, and for good reason. Apology accepted.

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 10:48 am

Yeah, gosh, if only Kurt was as tough-skinned as Joel, maybe he woulda been writing songs as good as ZZ Top and still be alive...

You know, I knew I'd be opening myself up to some bullshit by posting this, but I didn't quite expect such junior-high level, build-yourself-up-by-putting-someone-down vitriol. Hey Dangermouse, did it ever occur to you for one moment that dissing someone in a space that's supposed to be a memorial of sorts is just a wee bit rude?

Oh well. Things like respect for other people's feelings is one of those wussy things that real men who can handle this tough old world needn't concern themselves with.

So, fuck you and I'm looking forward to hearing the news when you choke on your own bile. If anyone bothers to throw a memorial, I'll send a telegram to your family letting them know what a waste of air you were and scolding your Mom for not aborting you in the first place, you soulless piece of shit.

Oops, did I go to far? Was that a personal attack? Come on, Technopatra. Freeze me with your kiss.

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 11:08 am

Personally, I'll miss Spalding Gray more, but they were both Participants to be sure. TRAGIC is such a weighty word, and used so often in these circumstances, but it's at least SAD that someone can leave such a visible trail of misery without either being able to find a way out or have the way shown to them.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 12:44 pm

Saddest song ever written was
"The last thing I needed
the first thing this morning
was to have you walk out on me

Willy Nelson

Kurt Cobain invented his life of turmoil, it never really existed.. Aside maybe from being married to Courtney Love.
He could have bought a sailboat, and headed for a Mexican cove with a pie shop and cold beer.. No sympathy for that boy... Wish he had learned to play the guitar too..

DangerMouse · Post by **DangerMouse** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 1:14 pm

Ah, I get it now.

If you don't agree with another person's viewpoint obviously you're now the target of a personal attack.

I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings Kelly. I never have, and probably never will, understand what the big deal over a celebrity offing him/herself is. There are quite a few more people with more tragic lives on the planet than a rich, self-absorbed, drug addled musical hack.

As for your opinions of me. Pot, this is kettle. You're black... Feel free to continue the personal attack though. It does make for an amusing read.

At least I don't feel sorry for a half-wit hack on drugs who created his own little world of pity. Musical tastes aside, he wasn't man enough to live for his child. I think that's a terrible disgrace.

Lydia Love · Post by **Lydia Love** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 1:56 pm

wow.

not a very compassionate view of how much pain a person would have to be in to leave a child.

I had a friend make an exit very similar to Mr. Cobain's. I get mad at him for doing it, but I never forget how much hurt he was experiencing before he made his awful choice.

I've also *been* in enough pain that I've considered suicide. Not only can you not see the light at the end of the tunnel, you can't see the tunnel.

By all means, hate him, hate his music...

But this *was* a thread created as a memorial. All y'all that don't feel like memorializing him *were* pretty rude.

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 2:11 pm

All right, a bit calmer now.

Look DMouse. You're totally missing the point. One thing I hate about the internet is the way some people seem to think that all manners and courtesy that apply in the physical world. If you'd been at a party or a bar and someone was eulogizing Cobain (especially on the anniversary of his death), would you have thought it fine to walk over and start trash-talking? I'm guessing you wouldn't, though maybe the only thing that would hold you back was the fear of getting the crap beaten out of you - and maybe that's why you talk shit here, because that fear is removed. If that's the case, you're an asshole, pure and simple. I suspect you just lack manners, though.

I'm not dissing anyone for disagreeing with me. Don't like Nirvana, don't care he killed himself? Fine. So why post at all? Why post nasty shit like "I'm glad he's gone"? I know in this era of Rush Limbaugh and Michael Savage it's normal behaviour to reflexively attack anything you disagree with, but I guess I'm old-fashioned and think that kind of behaviour is fucked up. And it should be called when it happens.

BTW, thanks Robotland for saying something in the spirit of what as was trying to say in the first place. I'll miss Spalding Gray a lot too.

And just because, here's something by Dan Bern, who's far better with words than I.

When Kurt Cobain blew out his brain,
All the little girls they cried like rain.
And as for me, I felt the pain,
But I got no t-shirts left to stain
For Kennedy, and Jesse James and
Joan of Arc and Kurt Cobain.

You can hear them crying down the lane
From Portland to Maryland, from Greece to Spain.
And as my life drips like coffee down the drain,
My eyes dry up like a rusty chain.
So Kennedy, and Jesse James
Will have to cry for Kurt Cobain.

It's a hard life and no one's to blame
When God's not on the morning train.
If Cain don't kill Abel, Abel kills Cain
And tears now shed are shed in vain
For Kennedy, and Jesse James
And Joan of Arc and Kurt Cobain.

There's three new roses growing in the lane.
It was a long hard winter but now there's rain.
If you want my tears, tell me your name.
Give me your hand, let me feel your pain.
But for Kennedy, and Jesse James
There's Joan of Arc and Kurt Cobain.

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 2:13 pm

And thanks to Lydia too. You posted while I was looking for the lyrics, I'm guessing.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:06 pm

Suicide is the ultimate,"look at me, I hurt so much!" cop out. I think most people with feelings have thought of suicide, but then those with feelings for others don't do it. Cobain left a child fatherless? He goes to Hell, he does not pass go, he does not collect $200.00. He gets the special corner of Hell reserved for parents who quit their job.

There was a joke some years ago.. Goes something like this, What is black and white and pink and lumpy all over?

Kurt Cobain's bedroom wall

III · Post by **III** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:22 pm

>>Suicide is the ultimate,"look at me, I hurt so much!" cop out.

in your tiny little head, maybe. i'm quite sure that most people who commit suicide are too overwhelmed by their own thoughts to even consider engaging in the sorts of attention getting machinations you ascribe to them.

DangerMouse · Post by **DangerMouse** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:29 pm

Kelly, now you're simply making assumptions about me and my character.

As for being glad he's gone. That's simply because I have no respect for him. He brought a child into this world, he screwed up his life and his child's, and then he took the easy way out. I'm sorry if that concept seems alien to you, but I actually believe that parents have a responsibility to their children.

As for what I would or would not do in the 'default' or 'really real' or whatever some people want to call meatspace. I told someone at work who was discussing the very same thing exactly how I felt about the whole non-issue of the anniversary of his death when they were discussing the matter.

If I knew him as a person instead of some lyrics on paper, or perhaps actually thought he was talented I may have cared.

I didn't attack anything I disagree with. Nor did I attack you. I simply posted an alternate point of view. You were the one who decided to personally attack me and be spiteful about it. I'm sorry if I do not share your viewpoint or personal pains. However I'm allowed to do as such.

Lydia, I've had friends and relatives commit suicide. Hell, like most anguished teens at some point I considered it myself when I was younger. However I had the courage to keep living, if for no other perverse reason than to see how much worse it could get. I'm sorry to hear about your loss of a friend. That's always difficult. That doesn't change the contempt I feel for people who commit suicide. Even my friends and relatives, while I miss them so. I am insulted that they would do something so stupid.

However this is a dicussion forum is it not? I offered a differing point of view. That's it. I didn't attack anyone, or deny them their pain or mourning. I didn't tell them they were stupid for thinking so. I simply stated my differing point of view.

The funny thing is. As screwed up as his life got, he brought it all upon himself. It's hard to pity someone who creates their own misery.

DangerMouse · Post by **DangerMouse** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:32 pm

DangerMouse wrote:I didn't attack anything I disagree with.

Must...learn...to...proofread. AUGH!

Post by **actiongrl** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 6:27 pm

Further evidence of what a misunderstood disease chronic depression is.

III · Post by **III** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 7:07 pm

my take as well.

thanks, ag...

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 7:46 pm

III Your post held a touch of assholeitis. Research on Suicides who did not complete it indicate that in a high percentage of cases they see themselves floating above looking at those who are now saddened by their loss.. Chronic Depression is not a stranger to myself, contemplation of suicide is not a stranger to myself, I certainly have been down that road as far as spinning the revolver barrels, I have lived with Depression for 33 years, but,, it is sheer vanity to think that Chronic Depression, or anything else allows you to fuck up the lives of your children. We think we have such tough lives, it is worth looking at the coal miners in nineteenth century America or Britain.. Their lives were truly miserable. For us to think we have it rough is just our over active imaginations.

Everyday we have a choice as to what we do with ourselves each day, Kurt Cobain, you, I, each of us make our choices. Once you have children, you and your psychosis and neurosis take a back seat to the job you have.. My daughters are actually my step daughters. They have a bio dad, he lives in Chicago, he sees them three times a year, he gets to go to Hell too. He made that choice.. He left them.
Yesterday, Rachel and myself took our dirt bikes and went for a long ride through the hills. That is what dads do with their daughters and sons, stuff,,, not important stuff, just stuff, they don't blow their brains out, they don't go away from their children.. They have the most important work in the world. Cobain blew it.. hope you didn't,

Lydia Love · Post by **Lydia Love** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 7:54 pm

However I had the courage to keep living, if for no other perverse reason than to see how much worse it could get.

and *cannot*, apparently, imagine that someone could hurt more than you did. that at some point for some people it no longer comes down to courage or lack thereof. we aren't necessarily talking an attack of teenage angst here...

I would define contempt as the opposite of compassion - so my comment pretty much stands.

III Your post held a touch of assholeitis.

Got irony?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 8:13 pm

No Irony, Lydia (one of my favorite names) I am an asshole, it is how I make my living, my "clients" hate me.. But my wife and kids love me,, and I have no sympathy for weakness of any sort.

DangerMouse · Post by **DangerMouse** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 9:13 pm

Lydia Love wrote:and *cannot*, apparently, imagine that someone could hurt more than you did. that at some point for some people it no longer comes down to courage or lack thereof. we aren't necessarily talking an attack of teenage angst here...

I would define contempt as the opposite of compassion - so my comment pretty much stands.

I'm sorry Lydia. What do you want me to say? That I dated a woman for several years who found her father after he'd comitted suicide? That I saw first hand what it did to her and ruined what was a very loving and caring person? I'm sorry, I wish I could empathize with the recently deceased's pain, however I had to care for someone who had to live with the aftermath of a person's inconsiderate and selfish act.

I've been on the other side of the coin, and I'll admit it has biased my view just a teensy bit. Nothing like having a 7 year relationship evaporate like a presidental candidate's promises the day after the election.

I know people hurt more than I do, and more than I can understand. I even stated such previously in this thread. However, I think I'm done with this thread.

Kelly, I'm sorry if I insulted you. I simply have a differing point of view on the events that transpired. I did not mean to belittle your feelings of loss over the death of Kurt Cobain 10 years ago.

phoenix13 · Post by **phoenix13** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 10:25 pm

III wrote:>>Suicide is the ultimate,"look at me, I hurt so much!" cop out.

in your tiny little head, maybe. i'm quite sure that most people who commit suicide are too overwhelmed by their own thoughts to even consider engaging in the sorts of attention getting machinations you ascribe to them.

the simple truth is successful suicides aren't a cry for help. they're something a lot more deeply ingrained in the person that makes them need not to exist. i do feel for frances bean. but it's not necessarily kurt being an asshole because he couldn't deal with it. if you ever listened to interviews with him, he would often say that he would rahter be behind the scenes.
so, he couldn't hack it. but there are other psychological aspects that it would be grossly negligent to gloss over. the truth was that he had chronic severe depression. it's hard to be in the right mind when the right doesn't exist in your own mind.

Further evidence of what a misunderstood disease chronic depression is.

thank you actiongrl. how right you are. no one ever really understands what goes through the head of someone clinically depressed.

phoenix13 · Post by **phoenix13** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 10:28 pm

DangerMouse wrote:
Lydia Love wrote:and *cannot*, apparently, imagine that someone could hurt more than you did. that at some point for some people it no longer comes down to courage or lack thereof. we aren't necessarily talking an attack of teenage angst here...

I would define contempt as the opposite of compassion - so my comment pretty much stands.
I'm sorry Lydia. What do you want me to say? That I dated a woman for several years who found her father after he'd comitted suicide? That I saw first hand what it did to her and ruined what was a very loving and caring person? I'm sorry, I wish I could empathize with the recently deceased's pain, however I had to care for someone who had to live with the aftermath of a person's inconsiderate and selfish act.

i watched my mother try to kill herself. it didn't destroy me as a person. i learned from it. that sort of situation doesn't necessarily destroy the person. it's a matter of will to actaully turn your life around after that. i'm sorry if that sounds callous. but there is many ways to deal with the situation.
"that which does not destroy you, only makes you stronger."

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 10:45 pm

Hmmmmm,

This just may be a rather informative and therapeutic thread.

Seems like everyone may have some issues that could be hashed out here. I know I'm learning.

Ivy · Post by **Ivy** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 10:48 pm

Research on Suicides who did not complete it indicate that in a high percentage of cases they see themselves floating above looking at those who are now saddened by their loss..

cite?

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Tue Apr 06, 2004 11:18 pm

Answers demanded in epic Bay Bridge snarl
CHP to report on 13-hour standoff with suicidal man

The governor's transportation czar has ordered the California Highway Patrol to explain Friday's 13-hour standoff with a suicidal man on the Bay Bridge, an episode that caused a monumental traffic jam that lasted late into the night, and to recommend measures to avoid such problems in the future.

The man, Farhad Ajir, 38, of Carmichael was eventually dragged kicking and screaming back to safety by three rappelling SWAT team members who shot him with a bean bag as they all grappled more than 200 feet in the air.

Derring-do aside, it was the full day of gridlock on the highways and disruption to Bay Area commerce that concerned Sunne Wright McPeak, the state's business, transportation and housing secretary. She asked the CHP to provide her with a report on the incident by Wednesday.

"It is a pretty serious incident when we have traffic tied up for 12 hours,'' said McPeak, who was appointed by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger the same day he took office. "It not only inconvenienced everybody who was stuck in traffic, but it also impacted businesses and the movement of goods and services. This is the kind of cumulative impact that needs to be reviewed, to see if we can avoid it in the future."

The issue raises a host of moral and philosophical concerns. It is no small feat to coax back a potential jumper who is perched on the railing holding a knife or razor, as Ajir was. Asking him to hurry up simply won't do the trick, according to experts.

"You are constantly wrestling with that ethical issue," said CHP Commissioner Dwight "Spike" Helmick. "Some say he's distraught, so you give him all the time he wants. Others say at some point you've got to call it off. I tend to agree with the latter view. I think this thing could have been resolved quicker, but how are you going to do that? We're looking into that."

Several furious motorists apparently believed they had the answer by shouting "jump," according to Eve Meyer, the executive director of San Francisco Suicide Prevention.

{-->snip<--}

When I was a teenager, a neighbor for whom I'd done odd jobs split from his wife & kids, moved into his best friend's cabin, and a few months later blew his brains across the cabin interior.

Learned lots from him while he was alive, but I learned nothing good from his choice of death other than it can be a real bitch to leave trace.

Rest In Peace Kurt Cobain

Rest In Peace Kurt Cobain

el duce?

Saddest song ever written

Suicide

huh

l