Art Car/MV advice/tips

LeChatNoir · Post by **LeChatNoir** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 9:28 pm

A Source For Wire Mesh

Easy folks to deal with too.

poisenloaf · Post by **poisenloaf** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 9:39 pm

Dork, is that thick EL wire in red you used for night lighting or what?

Dork · Post by **Dork** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 10:35 pm

poisenloaf wrote:Dork, is that thick EL wire in red you used for night lighting or what?

Yes. I think the current incarnation has on the order of 400 feet, which is barely enough these days. The nice thing about using fabric over a wire frame or mesh is you can light it from behind using lots of cheap lights.

tubahurl · Post by **tubahurl** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 10:56 pm

I don't know if this helps,

During the "Tub's" construction I used Jetcoat 24 gauge steel as a base for the planking and to provide incredible sheer strenth for hull. The beauty of Jetcoat is that it is weldable, resistant to rust and is ready to paint. 3/4" square tubing is a great material to use for base frames. It rolls nicely into smooth curves. Both items should be available at any real steel yard.

Below is the "Tub's" page. There are constuct pic's to maybe get some ideas.

Enjoy

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:25 pm

A small group of us in Portland, Or are in the beginning stages of designing a sandworm MV based on a short bus. There would be a platform added to the top for "worm riders".

We were thinking about burlap or erosion cloth , or shade cloth for the skin.

1. Does anyone have a source for massive quantities of other suitable materials, including lycra for a large MV skin?

2. Any info on attatching spandex/lycra to ribs?

Thanks in advance.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:36 pm

I just found this thread.

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... ight=lycra

which was helpful, any more suggestions of sources or other materials I should look for.

For example theatre scrim?

Post by **mdmf007** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:42 pm

Latex would make a great texture as well. can be tinted to any color and applied by brush, roller, or sprated.

You can apply it 1/16 of an inch thick, or multi layers to make it a couple of inches thick if desired.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:04 pm

Can't apply latex it has a tubing frame.

Ballpark fabric skin estimate 200 square yards, or less if stretchy Lycra 60" wide = 100 yards.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:13 pm

Has anyone used this privacy fence screen stuff?
Looks kinda like shade cloth, but on a roll.

This actually looks ideal
http://www.fencescreen.com/View.aspx?ProductID=168

Available in standard 6 or 8' high x 50' rolls,
has some stretch
available in colors brown, tan, grey, black, etc.
allows air to pass through
88% view blockage

"as low as 1.74 per lineal foot"
= $3.74 per yard

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:51 pm

stormfeather wrote: "as low as 1.74 per lineal foot"
= $3.74 per yard

When I do the math, I end up with $5.22 a yard. It looks like it goes over standard chickenwire fencing. Would it have enough stability to stand on its own?

Edited to add: Oh, it's going over a frame.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:57 pm

Hi Fishy--I bow to your mathiness... And that was a sale price for green I think...

Price is still within reason.

Yes, i think it would cover the ribs just fine as long as it didn't have to span too far....it has some stretch. Think standard shade cloth- it looks basically the same.

wonder who has used something like this?

Maybe paint it in mottled tones with spray paint.

On the other hand I have found lycra locally for $3-5 per 60" wide x 36" /yard. (purchase 50 yards or more) Lycra would be more more opaque and easier to paint.

At Rose City Textiles
http://www.rosecitytextiles.com/product ... word=lycra

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:23 pm

on the idea on geotech erosion control fabric, there is a factory in Washougal: BBA Nonwovens; that you might check out.

any fabric, watch for sags between the ribs.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:33 pm

Hi you- long time no see. Thanks for the tip.

swampdog · Post by **swampdog** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:38 pm

not sure if this is relevant, but have you thought of using used billboard vinyl? Cheap and resilient. Heavy, though. Boogie Universal built a pyramid out of the stuff in '07.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:44 pm

Are you talking about this structure at Critical Massive?

http://picasaweb.google.com/BoogieUnive ... 0483733842

and here on the playa in 2007

I'd heard that Clear Channel was less than helpful up here .

It is on the list, but we were thinking we needed something that allowed for air to pass through. I suppose we could cut holes.

The white color would require it to be completely painted, rather than just adding a mottled texture. Therefore more paint expense.

swampdog · Post by **swampdog** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:01 pm

Yeah, that's it. Paintability and breathability would definitely be concerns. If it's a serious interest for you I can put you in touch with the guy who drove the project.

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:02 pm

stormfeather wrote:...Maybe paint it in mottled tones with spray paint...

Take care here - I painted shade cloth covering my Dragonfly Lounge in 2003 with flourescent green spray paint (looked great at first). Luckily it broke down en-route, never making it to the Playa, because most of the paint flaked off leaving a huge mess on my trailer. I shudder to think what would have happened on the Playa...

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:07 pm

good point.. There is plastic friendly spray paint now

Fusion by Krylon for plastic
http://www.krylon.com/products/categories/plastic/

It says "hard vinyl" would have to test.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:11 pm

Thanks everyone--- BTW that is an awesome video on Boogie Universal.
I so missed them in 2007.

I'll ask the builders if they want to seriously consider the vinyl...
I'm procurement, textiles/costuming/web

keep the ideas coming..Shai-Hulud needs a skin!

Shai-Hulud the Sandworm MV
------------------------------------
"Some of us think that a huge sandworm would be the sine qua non of
mutant vehicles, yet I don't think it has been done yet. I have a bus
that would do for the motive power (and first few segments). Say,
50-100' long? A crowd in stillsuits, you plant yer thumper, call the
worm, stand to the side, climb on top, ride it with ropes. Nasty big
teeth in front, a red glow inside, and a stench of cinnamon and smoke.
A god-awful loud roar.

"Nah, too much work for just a couple of people. That would be half a
year's work for 20 nutcases. It'll never happen.

"Will it?"

-PW 2009-01-15

Note: We are in Portland, OR.

If you are in Portland, Oregon and would like to work on this project/camp
here is our yahoo planning group...
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shai-hulud/

Post by **mdmf007** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:37 pm

stormfeather wrote:Can't apply latex it has a tubing frame.

Ballpark fabric skin estimate 200 square yards, or less if stretchy Lycra 60" wide = 100 yards.

This duck has a metal frame similar to what you have drawn. It came out awesome as well ans is wrapped in Lycra I believe.

Just wondering - how do you plan on steering with the front end completely covered? Seems like it will have some huge blind spots.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:59 pm

great close up of the duck. Wasn't it wonderful?
How did they see to drive that? Driver in the beak?
Where was this built and assembled?
I read that the money behind it was from Germany and it cost 100-150 grand.

I think we will have to use more ribs than drawn.

How to see? Good question, The worm mouth will have to be open when we are moving- yes it would open and close.
and partially see-through shade cloth will be in an elipse behind the maw.

Additionally we would have a spotter with radio on top.

wish we could afford a laser!

SpacemanSpliff · Post by **SpacemanSpliff** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 6:08 am

I can only answer a few of those questions. The driver can see because he's driving based on video cameras and monitors, and the base is an amphibious military vehicle. What a "car."

Igneouss · Post by **Igneouss** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 6:49 am

Large (relatively cheap) sheets of fabric.

Constructions supply:
Tyvek house wrap is light, woven, not very strong. Generally in white with logo all over it...
Mirafi makes several types of 'geotextiles' both woven and non-woven that are very strong and inexpensive. They are generally black and might be available in a few other colors. The non-woven 'filter fabric' looks like it would be easy to work with and should be spray paintable.

Tyvek might be availble at Home Depot/Lowes. The other stuff you would have to go to a real construction supply place.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 3:00 pm

Anyone have any contacts with builders of fabric covered MVs ?

Does anyone here have experience with covering such a large vehicle in fabric or know who I can talk to?

I'm in the lycra camp, some of the other wormies are thinking wrapping with burlap. I thin stretchy is better and can be painted for texture.
Burlap is heavy and gross and itchy to work with and overpriced.

could use some practical advice from them that's been there done that.

I found several dozen fabric covered vehicles in pictures on the BM site but it often does not have the name of the builder or the MV name just the photographer.

When I google the ones I find names for, I have found mentions like- "we are applying lycra skin today", but no real DIY how-tos.

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:36 pm

A lot of the fabric choice will depend on how round you want the appearance to be. I have used shade cloth which has little stretch, but does give a bit over time. That means that there will be saggy "facets" between the ribs.
This was for a dome (non buckyball) and needed more ribs than in the original design plus crosswise straps.

Burlap has almost zero stretch. Shade cloth is minimal. Lycra has a lot. A trade off would be more ribs and straps running from front to back.

What is the rib material?
How is the framework supported to keep the ends from drooping?
Will the covering be installed on the playa or subject to freeway towing speeds?

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 8:27 pm

Expresso Dude, you're local (BTW we are in Portland, Oregon), join our yahoo planning group and join in the worminess! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shai-hulud

thanks for the lead, though I doubt PW is ready to buy skin yet...

The plan is to assemble the ribs and skin on the playa.

The ribs are heavy duty black 1 1/2" PVC bent and put in sockets.

I think we need more ribs than shown.

We aren't sure we can make it the playa with the beast this year. Funding and committed folks are the issues. We have some expert welding help for the upper platform from Martin (the mech. spider from Salem that was at 08 & BurnOut). The skin and mouth still need to be worked out.

I will be coordinating "the sietch" (Fremen of Dune term for community shelter/cave) Camp anyway. We will be having a "species" parade and serving up the "water of life"!

Maybe we'll just have to make a chinese dragon style worm this year and drum up more contributors for the MV next year.

In the next few weeks we need to establish a budget and time table and will then we'll see how far we can get this thing this year.

poisenloaf · Post by **poisenloaf** » Sun Apr 12, 2009 10:57 am

Anybody have any tips/suggestions on how to go about making an eyeball similar to the one on this mutant vehicle?

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1437/133 ... 17.jpg?v=0

Oldguy · Post by **Oldguy** » Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:12 pm

weather balloon, paper mache'.

stormfeather · Post by **stormfeather** » Sat May 16, 2009 7:21 pm

Sandworm Update!
We received preliminary approval from the DMV, based on our Mutant vehicle application.

We've started building, and costuming,etc.A piece of the shade fencing has been ordered to determine if that will work...

I just finished the website!

Shai-Hulud the Sandworm Mutant Vehicle
http://sandworm.tikimojo.com

for anyone in Portland, Oregon area we are havng a funraiser party
June 6th
http://sandworm.tikimojo.com/events.html
Dune movie remix, live music, djs, food, beer, and probably BACON!
Dress in desert wear!

Art Car/MV advice/tips

billboard vinyl?

That's it

Been Busy building a mutant sandworm