Generators

[ygmir]

I made a good score last year.
I found an old Kohler generator from a RV, propane powered, 4KW.
It runs at 1800 rpm, so, is pretty quiet.
It's heavy, but, I'm sure that helps keep it quiet, too.
An advantage it has, is, it has it's own airflow, via a squirrel cage fan on the crank, ducted through the engine and generator.
That allowed me to build a well insulated box, with a filtered air intake, and, send the outflow along with exhaust straight up. It's pretty quite, IMHO....
and, being propane, they last a long time, and, the exhaust is not very smelly at all......

the best part:

it was 35 dollars, and, took me about an hour to get in good running shape.

Just a thought, about finding something and recycling it..........

[poisenloaf]

Oh and I'll add my own experience.. My camp brought a Yamaha 4000 wt genny last year..built a nice box for it and I would say it was still a bit too loud so we tried not to run it all that much. We had a seal dome that we have a few ACs in as our community area for a fairly large camp so sound wasn't too much of an issue (just pissed ourselves off). Plus the box cost extra and just became burn material..over a few years, that is just extra money you should have jumped into a Honda EU2000 to begin with.

Look for them on ebay or craigslist..should be able to find a used one for ~$800. Worth every penny, especially if you attend regional BM type events or camp, etc and can make more use out of it than just once per year.

[CompositionB]

An advantage it has, is, it has it's own airflow, via a squirrel cage fan on the crank, ducted through the engine and generator.

Are you talking about a supercharger or is it just a cooling fan? If the fan blows into the engine's intake manifold then it's a supercharger. Sounds like a pretty decent generator.

[ygmir]

An advantage it has, is, it has it's own airflow, via a squirrel cage fan on the crank, ducted through the engine and generator.

Are you talking about a supercharger or is it just a cooling fan? If the fan blows into the engine's intake manifold then it's a supercharger. Sounds like a pretty decent generator.

nope, cooling.............They're made to sit in a compartment under the RV, so, need to provide their own cooling airflow......it's all shrouded to keep it flowing over the critical heat components,and, has an exit duct, so, I just made a short piece of ducting, plugged the exhaust in (after the cooling), and, it all blows straight up.........

[mdmf007]

This year we're planning on bringing up a generator. We need one that is between 1500-2000 continuous Watts. However, we really don't want to spend a grand to buy one of the Honda eu series the ones that I see people recommending on other posts. Has anyone had good luck with other brands? Like, they work the whole week.

Also, what do you all think is an acceptable decibel level?

Thanks

Cheapest way to get 1500 - 2000 watts is probably an inverter for your cars system.

If you need to run it 24/7 though your going to run into other problems like overheating. As far as fuel consumption it wont be all that bad either.

i can idle me ford truck in Alaska all night on a job site (cant shut them off int hat cold without a block heater plugged in) for about 2.5 gallons over 12 hours. thats 5 gallons a day. You could always experiment in your driveway over a 3 or 6 hour period to determine fuel consumption.

Problems I see -
Dust infiltration over a week (bring a spare filter to swap out, and clean the other one out.
overheating
if you have a shitty alternator - its going to get shittier and then stop working

benefits -
all you need is an inverter
decent fuel consumption
ease of use
as loud as your car is idling
cost - do a google search for "2000 watt inverter" range in price from 119.00 to 1320 bucks for a marine grade. (buy two sheapos and alternate their use)

just a thought for you.

later and good luck

[gyre]

Some are heat sink cooling instead of fan cooling.
Much more stable.
Many are intended for continuous use.

Mdm, they make a propane block heater.


This lists a few better units.
http://www.solardyne.com/inverters.html
http://www.majorpower.com/xantrex/prosine_charger.html

Sealed inverters usa made
http://www.outbackinverters.com/product1.htm

[mdmf007]

Some are heat sink cooling instead of fan cooling.
Much more stable.
Many are intended for continuous use.

Mdm, they make a propane block heater.

I havent seen the propane block heaters, would certainly save wear on the powerstroke. But, its a company rig as well. They run them into the ground then surplus them every two years. Would be nice though.

Gyre - I was thinking about the car itself overheating? 107 on some days, with no airflow? Of course if it is all working well it shouldnt be a problem. I just pictured that those radiator fins filling with dust and loosing cooling efficiency.

later

[poisenloaf]

Penny Arcade described it best with Gabriel's Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory which states:

Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad

Considering that there is an annual meet-n-greet, there is no anonymity; so that sort of puts that equation out of balance.

JK

Mandatory attendance for all eplaya registered users? Didn't think so..

[Sail Man]

Every year people ask the same thing...

post links or I call bullshit

...that way it's gonna be fucking loud like the piece of shit you're probably going to subject the rest of us to...

It seems pretty stupid to assume that a person who asks for recommendations regarding generators is going to end up bringing something that's loud and causes problems? I would expect the opposite to be true.

My post was funny.

not really, it was just sarcastic and rude.

Great, that makes 2 noobs in this thread that don't get our sense of humor, or appreciate good snark.

Try not to take that the wrong way

Penny Arcade described it best with Gabriel's Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory which states:

Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad

Considering that there is an annual meet-n-greet, there is no anonymity; so that sort of puts that equation out of balance.

JK

Mandatory attendance for all eplaya registered users? Didn't think so..

Not mandatory, but highly anticipated by myself (as well as many others) as I didnt know about it last year.

[CompositionB]

This year we're planning on bringing up a generator. We need one that is between 1500-2000 continuous Watts. However, we really don't want to spend a grand to buy one of the Honda eu series the ones that I see people recommending on other posts. Has anyone had good luck with other brands? Like, they work the whole week.

Also, what do you all think is an acceptable decibel level?

Thanks :D

Cheapest way to get 1500 - 2000 watts is probably an inverter for your cars system.

If you need to run it 24/7 though your going to run into other problems like overheating. As far as fuel consumption it wont be all that bad either.

i can idle me ford truck in Alaska all night on a job site (cant shut them off int hat cold without a block heater plugged in) for about 2.5 gallons over 12 hours. thats 5 gallons a day. You could always experiment in your driveway over a 3 or 6 hour period to determine fuel consumption.

Problems I see -
Dust infiltration over a week (bring a spare filter to swap out, and clean the other one out.
overheating
if you have a shitty alternator - its going to get shittier and then stop working

benefits -
all you need is an inverter
decent fuel consumption
ease of use
as loud as your car is idling
cost - do a google search for "2000 watt inverter" range in price from 119.00 to 1320 bucks for a marine grade. (buy two sheapos and alternate their use)

just a thought for you.

later and good luck

good point. In 2007 my generator broke down so I couldn't run my AC. In the hot afternoons I'd get in the truck and run its AC. I was surprised by how little fuel it took.

Since the truck AC compressor runs off the engine, having the engine at an idle turned the compressor somewhat slowly and it never really got the truck cold. Definitely took the edge off though.

I'd be hesitant to use my vehicle as a generator mainly because if it does overheat or get clogged with dust I wouldn't be able to walk the 900 miles back home in time to get to work. ;)

I keep a 150W inverter in my glove box for miscellaneous small loads, phone chargers, etc. and its come in handy a few times.

It should be noted that larger inverters need to be connected directly to the battery. Cigarette lighters can't handle much current.

[BAS]

Some are heat sink cooling instead of fan cooling.
Much more stable.
Many are intended for continuous use.

Mdm, they make a propane block heater.

I havent seen the propane block heaters, would certainly save wear on the powerstroke. But, its a company rig as well. They run them into the ground then surplus them every two years. Would be nice though.

You should see the State of Wisconsin's vehicles when they finally get around to selling them as surplus! Even the falling apart 1980's Mercury Sable I drove for a while was better! The State's surplus vehicles really are run into the ground-- generally not running, suspension no longer attached (due to the location being missing), seats collapsed/missing, and rusted parts holding on only through sheer willpower. (The Wisconsin government tends to be rather tight fisted with its vehicle budget, at least for low level folks like us.)

[Elderberry]

Penny Arcade described it best with Gabriel's Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory which states:

Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad

Considering that there is an annual meet-n-greet, there is no anonymity; so that sort of puts that equation out of balance.

JK

Mandatory attendance for all eplaya registered users? Didn't think so..

Certainly not mandatory, but I'll bet that all the heavy hitters here on eplaya will be there will bells on. (Well maybe not bells, but I'll bet they'll all show up.)

Like Sail Man, I'm looking forward to it with eager anticipation. With only one exception, there isn't anyone I've crossed paths with on eplaya that I wouldn't want to meet in person; and I've had some pretty heated discussions with several.

But in most cases, there has always seemed (at least to me) to be an underlying respect that is there underneath all the snark. I think some use it as a sort of 'test of fire', especially with newbies.

(Maybe this should have been posted in the "my mind begins to wander" thread.)

JK

[gyre]

Does humidity affect cooling?
I forget.

Bear in mind that all inverters have less capacity in heat, unless they are overbuilt to start with.
Most won't tell you that though.

When the better ones say continuous, they mean it.
So a 2000 watt $2000 inverter may actually run at rated power.
On the forums, no one thinks the cheapos can, much less last long.
You don't have to have true sine wave for everything, but a minimal industrial grade is called for.
Usually these are built for direct wiring, but not always.

The better ones are far more efficient and at more power levels and the best ones shut down without a draw.

[EB]

Considering that there is an annual meet-n-greet, there is no anonymity; so that sort of puts that equation out of balance.

JK

Mandatory attendance for all eplaya registered users? Didn't think so..

Certainly not mandatory, but I'll bet that all the heavy hitters here on eplaya will be there will bells on. (Well maybe not bells, but I'll bet they'll all show up.)

Like Sail Man, I'm looking forward to it with eager anticipation. With only one exception, there isn't anyone I've crossed paths with on eplaya that I wouldn't want to meet in person; and I've had some pretty heated discussions with several.

But in most cases, there has always seemed (at least to me) to be an underlying respect that is there underneath all the snark. I think some use it as a sort of 'test of fire', especially with newbies.

(Maybe this should have been posted in the "my mind begins to wander" thread.)

JK

This is some pretentious bullshit. ePlaya is a discussion board, not Delta house. "Heavy hitters" snarking newbies as a "test of fire" is not only inaccurate, it's entirely sad.

Most of the true "heavy hitters" use this board as a means to impart wisdom for a complicated week in the desert. Many have made friends through the board and, yes, many of us meet each other at the Meet-and-greet or otherwise. Big fucking deal.

Do you need to break it down into "us vs them?" Really?

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: Get a life. It's a camping trip.

[Boijoy]

I want to come to the "meet and greet". can I hu? can I ?? I'm NOT shaking JK's hand though... or anything else on him.

[ygmir]

I'm looking forward to meeting everyone there...........

[Elderberry]

Mandatory attendance for all eplaya registered users? Didn't think so..

Certainly not mandatory, but I'll bet that all the heavy hitters here on eplaya will be there will bells on. (Well maybe not bells, but I'll bet they'll all show up.)

Like Sail Man, I'm looking forward to it with eager anticipation. With only one exception, there isn't anyone I've crossed paths with on eplaya that I wouldn't want to meet in person; and I've had some pretty heated discussions with several.

But in most cases, there has always seemed (at least to me) to be an underlying respect that is there underneath all the snark. I think some use it as a sort of 'test of fire', especially with newbies.

(Maybe this should have been posted in the "my mind begins to wander" thread.)

JK

This is some pretentious bullshit. ePlaya is a discussion board, not Delta house. "Heavy hitters" snarking newbies as a "test of fire" is not only inaccurate, it's entirely sad.

Most of the true "heavy hitters" use this board as a means to impart wisdom for a complicated week in the desert. Many have made friends through the board and, yes, many of us meet each other at the Meet-and-greet or otherwise. Big fucking deal.

Do you need to break it down into "us vs them?" Really?

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: Get a life. It's a camping trip.

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: GO FUCK YOURSELF!

JK

[BAS]

I saw a guy on YouTube who was flexible enough to actually FUCK HIMSELF! Really.




(Does Burning Man, much less Eplaya, actually have heavy hitters? )

Ultimately, I think both these forums and Black Rock City are large enough for a wide variety of people, or even a variety of wide people, or... What was I talking about again?

I think I have fried my mind... Time for bed!

[wedeliver]

Certainly not mandatory, but I'll bet that all the heavy hitters here on eplaya will be there will bells on. (Well maybe not bells, but I'll bet they'll all show up.)

Like Sail Man, I'm looking forward to it with eager anticipation. With only one exception, there isn't anyone I've crossed paths with on eplaya that I wouldn't want to meet in person; and I've had some pretty heated discussions with several.

But in most cases, there has always seemed (at least to me) to be an underlying respect that is there underneath all the snark. I think some use it as a sort of 'test of fire', especially with newbies.

(Maybe this should have been posted in the "my mind begins to wander" thread.)

JK

This is some pretentious bullshit. ePlaya is a discussion board, not Delta house. "Heavy hitters" snarking newbies as a "test of fire" is not only inaccurate, it's entirely sad.

Most of the true "heavy hitters" use this board as a means to impart wisdom for a complicated week in the desert. Many have made friends through the board and, yes, many of us meet each other at the Meet-and-greet or otherwise. Big fucking deal.

Do you need to break it down into "us vs them?" Really?

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: Get a life. It's a camping trip.

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: GO FUCK YOURSELF!

JK

My opinion?? For what it's worth, Jkisha, if we were standing on the playa having a talk and it went along the lines above, I don't think you would tell someone to go fuck themselves, (although i have always wondered why we tell someone to have sex when we are pissed) it seems that you are escalating the issue with an unnecessary, uncalled for comment.

The guys opinion is less snark. and unless it's coming from me, I agree.

[Elderberry]

This is some pretentious bullshit. ePlaya is a discussion board, not Delta house. "Heavy hitters" snarking newbies as a "test of fire" is not only inaccurate, it's entirely sad.

Most of the true "heavy hitters" use this board as a means to impart wisdom for a complicated week in the desert. Many have made friends through the board and, yes, many of us meet each other at the Meet-and-greet or otherwise. Big fucking deal.

Do you need to break it down into "us vs them?" Really?

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: Get a life. It's a camping trip.

Seriously, dude, and I mean this with all sincerity: GO FUCK YOURSELF!

JK

My opinion?? For what it's worth, Jkisha, if we were standing on the playa having a talk and it went along the lines above, I don't think you would tell someone to go fuck themselves, (although i have always wondered why we tell someone to have sex when we are pissed) it seems that you are escalating the issue with an unnecessary, uncalled for comment.

The guys opinion is less snark. and unless it's coming from me, I agree.

Yes, but if we were standing on the playa, we whouldn't have even been having this conversation to begin with.

Of course I'm escallating the issue, what fun would this be otherwise? Duh!

JK

[wedeliver]

Yes, but if we were standing on the playa, we whouldn't have even been having this conversation to begin with.

Of course I'm escallating the issue, what fun would this be otherwise? Duh!

JK

I am trying to analize the meaning of your word "whouldn't" Who being the first part uldn't being the second part it kinda makes sense.

Humm, I suppose what you are saying is that we would be either drunk or somehow fucked up on the playa and then it would all make sense?

[mdmf007]

Talk about thread drift -

Eplaya is a community like any other, fueled by banter, wit, sarcasm, lots of snark and lots of advice as well.

Like any community there are active people, and there are lurkers, and there are newbies.

Ribbing or hazing the newbies is expected when joining any communuty why would this be different. Difference here is that it takes a bit of reading to realizing that it is all done in fun. Do i think I actually own a thread and am pissed when people post to it???? (cant say) but, I do know that NOWHERE else do I dig up information for someone I do not know and then send them links to help them out.

take it as it is - an online community with no real course.

so cant we all just get along?

later

[Elderberry]

Yes, but if we were standing on the playa, we whouldn't have even been having this conversation to begin with.

Of course I'm escallating the issue, what fun would this be otherwise? Duh!

JK

I am trying to analize the meaning of your word "whouldn't" Who being the first part uldn't being the second part it kinda makes sense.

Humm, I suppose what you are saying is that we would be either drunk or somehow fucked up on the playa and then it would all make sense?

Nothing mysterious--it's a typo.

All started when someone said people here were more snarky and rude because of the anonymity factor.

I don't think that has much to do with it because the majority of people that post here will actually meet (or already know) each other at the meet-n-greet.

I have rarely been offended by anyone on eplaya and in those rare instances when I might have been, things were always clarified and worked out in PM's.

So, I made the leap to say (based on my experience) that people that post here are respectful of others even though posts might appear rude or snarky.

And I don't think that BM is just another camping trip. Have you been on any other camping trip that even comes close to comparing???

JK

[ygmir]

I think you'd want at least a 1KW generator if you're going to put alligator clips on your nipples and really enjoy it........


the screaming should easily drown out the excessive exhaust and engine rattle noise......

[mdmf007]

I think you'd want at least a 1KW generator if you're going to put alligator clips on your nipples and really enjoy it........


the screaming should easily drown out the excessive exhaust and engine rattle noise......

With nipples its the Amps you want to really get them smoking.

Heres a link I just got sent to a dirt cheap genny set. 125 bucks, probably loud as hell.
http://astore.amazon.com/cheap.portable ... B000P9UOAC

[Elderberry]

I think you'd want at least a 1KW generator if you're going to put alligator clips on your nipples and really enjoy it........


the screaming should easily drown out the excessive exhaust and engine rattle noise......

With nippled its the Amps you want to really get them smoking.

Heres a link I just got sent to a dirt cheap genny set. 125 bucks, probably loud as hell.
http://astore.amazon.com/cheap.portable ... B000P9UOAC

We've used that generator for two years now at the playa. I didn't think it was loud at all. It is listed at 69 DB, which I was informed on another thread was loud; but we had a box around it and ran it all night and could barely here it--and nobody complained about it. I would recommend it highly. We need a bigger one this coming year and are now on the lookout for one that is 6000 to 10000 Watts, and relatively quiet and reasonably priced.

JK

[Captain Goddammit]

I had a 12kW and a 10kW, got rid of both because I didn't want to keep enough fuel lying around to run them!
Remember if you bring that big a set to BM that you're gonna need to bring a metric shitload of gas... which can certainly be done, but plan realistically.

[Elderberry]

I had a 12kW and a 10kW, got rid of both because I didn't want to keep enough fuel lying around to run them!
Remember if you bring that big a set to BM that you're gonna need to bring a metric shitload of gas... which can certainly be done, but plan realistically.

Maybe this is overkill...let me explain what I'm trying do...basically, I want enough power to run our air conditioner in the yurt. Last year, that little 1200 Watt generator ran it--for awhile, then the fuse would blow. We'd have to let everything cool off and start it again.

This was pretty surprising (and disappointing) since we tested everything at home (but only for about 15 minutes. I even bought one of those appliance testers that would measure the watts and amps that the AC was pulling, and everything seemed to be within the specs of the generator.

The generator worked for hours on end with a lighter load; so there must have been something wrong with my calculations--so I was thinking if I way over-shot the Watts, I wouldn't have a problem.

Maybe you could let me know how to properly determine the size generator I should get then? Any comments on this are appreciated.

JK

[Kinetik V]

You lose 3% of your power with a typical gasoline engine for every 1000 foot of altitude you go above sea level. So...with LA being close to sea level and the playa being at 3848 ft or so, you've essentially lost 16% of the engine's power to turn that generator. You did take the extra step of using a killa-watt type meter to measure the energy use, but the horsepower drop due to altitude may have been the one thing that was overlooked and not considered in the equation. In short the lower engine efficiency means your generator had less power to offer up there...and in my opinion you pushed it to the edge...and slightly over. That's why the overloads happened.

Quick link that briefly mentions the 3% power loss rule: http://tinyurl.com/a9vhg9 // Many other resources online also document the power loss factor for normally aspirated engines (ie: non turbo or supercharged engines).

[mdmf007]

Dont forget the surge loading - AC units have two motors. One turning the fan constantly and one that compresses the refrigerant as needed.

Your 1300 watt AC unit may only need 1300 watts with both motors purring away and when the compressor stops may only need 600 watts to turn the fan alone. When the compressor kicks in though it may draw 2000 watts on its own or more just to get turning then drop back down.

In the heat of the playa the compressed gas is leaked faster through the heat exchanger requiring the compressor to recompress it more often, it could be these surges that are overheating the generator head or exceeding capacity outright and shutting it off. This is why it could have worked perfectly in your yard testing, but differently on playa.

Try using a UPS (uninteruptable power supply) in line, most everyone has one for their computers. This will help alleviate the generators need to surge.