Welcome President Obama

[ygmir]

I'm not saying he's not posted something, or, that you've linked to it.
I just wonder, has he actually provided proof, if he's supposed to, to, whomever checks those things officially?

I think I'm wondering, above all, who would support his being in office, if, he were proven ineligible?........

I don't so much care, but, out of curiosity.......

Fuck, I had my answer all written out and somehow my browser hiccuped and I lost it all...

Anyway, long story short; he has provided all the necessary proof to the necessary authorities.

As those that want him discredited in any way possible realize that they have nothing to back-up their claims, they are taking whatever advantage they can from keeping the rumor alive; knowing how some people just can't resist those conspiracy theories.

JK

dang those hiccups........

Ok, I always accept your research........so, if he has actually provided said proof, it must be ok........no one would hide or suppress it.

And, what you say, I also agree with: That people will do whatever they can to discredit someone they don't like.......

But,
I do love a good conspiracy theory..............

Are you, perhaps, a Grey?.............

[Elderberry]

Are you, perhaps, a Grey?.............

A Grey???

JK

[ygmir]

from Roswell................

[theCryptofishist]

Why does no one talk about his other name, Barry, (I forget), and, if he attended college under that name and or got aid........

No one talks about "Barry," an obvious nickname that "Americanizes" his birth name, because anyone who spends five minutes thinking about it, realizes that blending in with your peers when you are a child is an important thing and that it is perfectly possible that when you hit your mid-twenties or so you usually lose that urge for camoflage and start becoming who you actually are. The only people who care are desparate right-wingers who cannot find anything else to attack him with, unless they make up "facts" like "he's a muslim."

[ygmir]

Why does no one talk about his other name, Barry, (I forget), and, if he attended college under that name and or got aid........

No one talks about "Barry," an obvious nickname that "Americanizes" his birth name, because anyone who spends five minutes thinking about it, realizes that blending in with your peers when you are a child is an important thing and that it is perfectly possible that when you hit your mid-twenties or so you usually lose that urge for camoflage and start becoming who you actually are. The only people who care are desparate right-wingers who cannot find anything else to attack him with, unless they make up "facts" like "he's a muslim."

I agree with you on this.

I was trying to illustrate the irony of these things, and probably rightly so, being glossed over a, such, for the messiah, when, I'd bet, were he a right winger, it'd be all over the news.........

[Ugly Dougly]

No, he wouldn't have been elected.

[ygmir]

I don't think I agree.
I see that, as with most politicians, "their" people overlook almost anything in order to get them elected........Both sides do that, and, fry the opposition over the same stuff.........

I think so many wanted anything but "4 more years of the same" that, they'd overlook a lot.

Not saying they did, just saying, I think a lot would........

[littleflower]

i think a lot of moderates and balanced-budget voters who believed obama's campaign baloney are regretting their votes right now ...

[theCryptofishist]

Why does no one talk about his other name, Barry, (I forget), and, if he attended college under that name and or got aid........

No one talks about "Barry," an obvious nickname that "Americanizes" his birth name, because anyone who spends five minutes thinking about it, realizes that blending in with your peers when you are a child is an important thing and that it is perfectly possible that when you hit your mid-twenties or so you usually lose that urge for camoflage and start becoming who you actually are. The only people who care are desparate right-wingers who cannot find anything else to attack him with, unless they make up "facts" like "he's a muslim."

I agree with you on this.

I was trying to illustrate the irony of these things, and probably rightly so, being glossed over a, such, for the messiah, when, I'd bet, were he a right winger, it'd be all over the news.........

While agreeing that there are some people are a little to head over heels about the man, when you think of the people who loved Sarah Palin, I think it becomes clear that the right can make the same mistake. And then there's the "God made sure that GWB won in Florida so that when 911 happened he'd be in the White House" crowd which is a form of craziness that scares me deeply. Very deeply.

[Elderberry]

i think a lot of moderates and balanced-budget voters who believed obama's campaign baloney are regretting their votes right now ...

The most recent polls would seem to dispute that.

JK

[littleflower]

i think a lot of moderates and balanced-budget voters who believed obama's campaign baloney are regretting their votes right now ...

The most recent polls would seem to dispute that.

JK

they have polls of balanced budget voters and moderates?

i think the stock market is indicative of how investors feel about obama right now. it's gonna sit down there, too, i suspect. darn it. i'm gonna have to go back to shit work....

[ygmir]

No one talks about "Barry," an obvious nickname that "Americanizes" his birth name, because anyone who spends five minutes thinking about it, realizes that blending in with your peers when you are a child is an important thing and that it is perfectly possible that when you hit your mid-twenties or so you usually lose that urge for camoflage and start becoming who you actually are. The only people who care are desparate right-wingers who cannot find anything else to attack him with, unless they make up "facts" like "he's a muslim."

I agree with you on this.

I was trying to illustrate the irony of these things, and probably rightly so, being glossed over a, such, for the messiah, when, I'd bet, were he a right winger, it'd be all over the news.........

While agreeing that there are some people are a little to head over heels about the man, when you think of the people who loved Sarah Palin, I think it becomes clear that the right can make the same mistake. And then there's the "God made sure that GWB won in Florida so that when 911 happened he'd be in the White House" crowd which is a form of craziness that scares me deeply. Very deeply.

I'm sure there are many quotes about divine intervention, karma, or whatever, equally related to a democrat win.......But, since you most likely agree with them, you may not see the irony......or how scary they may be to the other side......

I too agree that both sides can and do make the mistake of foregoing critical thinking in favor of some emotional issue, or personal preference........

I don't, however, think one side is any more prone than the other.......
whichever side you're on, you think "the majority" agree with you.......,and, that your person is not nearly as bad as the "other" one.......
but, both sides feel that way, so, I'd say, it's pretty even.........

I've always wondered, if "everyone eligible" ever voted, what the outcome would be?
I wonder if it'd be some lop sided victory, or, would it pretty much reflect the fairly even split in the electorate?
It really comes down, as I see it, to two ways of looking at things.........
not so much right or wrong, but, different. Each side thinks the other is wrong, stupid, whatever..........
But, the old saying about skinning a cat holds, IMHO, and, good results can be had by different methods........

I'm still waiting and hoping the messiah does well........and, if he does, I'll give kudos where kudos are due.....
or the opposite......

[cowboyangel]

The "Real" Obama

From Dr. Michael Hudson, Dennis Kucinich's financial advisor

http://aud1.kpfa.org/data/20090304-Wed1300.mp3


Were in deep trouble

[ygmir]

CA:
can you re-post, I'm just getting a radio commercial..........maybe the link is wrong?

or, summarize?
thanks

[Elderberry]

The "Real" Obama

From Dr. Michael Hudson, Dennis Kucinich's financial advisor

http://aud1.kpfa.org/data/20090304-Wed1300.mp3


Were in deep trouble

Dennis Kucinich--isn't he the guy that sees flying saucers?

JK

[Elderberry]

Say what you will, all ye with little faith. It took 8 years to get us here, we ain't getting out of it in 8 weeks. I'll be here silently gloating when the Obama plan turns the economy around.

Don't forget it was the republican thinking and philosophies that got us here, they have admittedly failed, so by definition, their arguments against Obama's plan are specious and have absolutely no credibility nor validity, yet they still persist.

Now be quiet and keep those opinions to yourself and let the man do his job.



JK

[ygmir]

The "Real" Obama

From Dr. Michael Hudson, Dennis Kucinich's financial advisor

http://aud1.kpfa.org/data/20090304-Wed1300.mp3


Were in deep trouble

Dennis Kucinich--isn't he the guy that sees flying saucers?

JK

I think that's Louis Farrakhan........

spelling edit

[ygmir]

Say what you will, all ye with little faith. It took 8 years to get us here, we ain't getting out of it in 8 weeks. I'll be here silently gloating when the Obama plan turns the economy around.

Don't forget it was the republican thinking and philosophies that got us here, they have admittedly failed, so by definition, their arguments against Obama's plan are specious and have absolutely no credibility nor validity, yet they still persist.

Now be quiet and keep those opinions to yourself and let the man do his job.



JK

I might submit it took 40 years to get us here............

I'd also suggest, not only republican thinking, etc, but greed and corruption, which, IMHO, is evenly spread across the political spectrum.

Also, just because someone has an idea that doesn't work, are you saying they can't come up with a good idea?

[Elderberry]

Also, just because someone has an idea that doesn't work, are you saying they can't come up with a good idea?

In the case of the republicans and what I am hearing from their camp--now seemingly headed by Rush Limbaugh and some other clown (Michael Steel), the chances of them coming up with a new idea, good or otherwise, is zero...unless trying to get more hip-hop into the party is your idea of a new good idea.

JK

[ygmir]

interesting response.

I'd not expect you to be quite so closed minded............if it's a good idea, it's a good idea. Does it matter where it comes from?
Do you look past someone just because of past failures?
Even the messiah ''says'' he's soliciting opinions and input from all quarters.........

And, to get sucked into "rush limbaugh" being the leader?.....I don't think the reps all feel that way..........not sure, but, I hear a lot of them not thinking a lot of him..........

*sitting with a little sad, expression*

[can't sit still]

" I'll be here silently gloating when the Obama plan turns the economy around"
Yeah right, Why do I doubt the silent part?
I think that history has reserved a special place for president Obama.

Truth is; socialism hasn't worked. Capitalism has some serious problems.
Socialism is respect for people and not for capital.
Capitalism is respect for capital and not people.
Socialism has no outlet for greed.
Capitalism has it's center based on greed.
If Obama can find a fusion or synergy of the 2, he will have a stellar place in history. The world needs a new operating system. Capital hasn't come to any accommodation with automation. Capital has no brain. It will automate until it produces goods at the absolute lowest price. It hasn't yet noticed that automation has eliminated it's "working consumer" client base.
Socialism hasn't been tried in an automated world. Socialism is the death of incentive and greed. I suppose that there is some sort of arrangement where the benefits of capitalism can be distributed in an equitable socialist manner.
Given the human predisposition for laziness, I doubt that it's going to happen any time soon. Obama could posssssssibily lay out a foundation for reforms that would bring runaway greed into a socially productive channel.

I don't see his defense budget going in that direction. His health care reform might be just a big prize for Big Pharma. Why hasn't he rolled back the asinine drug procurement procedures for the US GOV? GOV buys in huge volumes but must buy at whatever price BIG pharma wants to charge.
We'll see.

[Elderberry]

interesting response.

I'd not expect you to be quite so closed minded............if it's a good idea, it's a good idea. Does it matter where it comes from?
Do you look past someone just because of past failures?
Even the messiah ''says'' he's soliciting opinions and input from all quarters.........

And, to get sucked into "rush limbaugh" being the leader?.....I don't think the reps all feel that way..........not sure, but, I hear a lot of them not thinking a lot of him..........

*sitting with a little sad, expression*

Ygmir, unless I am out on an appointment, I have the news on all the time; I'm not being closed minded, I'm just telling you what the situation with the republicans is right now.

Oh, yesterday I went to hear the oral arguments to the CA supreme court on Prop 8. I was captivated for the entire 3 hours. We had four attorneys on our side--three were brilliant, the one that represented the CA district attorney was almost embarrassing to listen to; which seemed strange, as his written brief was exceptional. And Ken Starr represented the opposite side--he too was very eloquent and presented a good argument as well, though I felt it weak, though I'm sure there were legal principals that he was citing that went over my head.

Some of the most brutal questioning by the justices came from those justices that were on the side of gay marriage in their other ruling, which really surprised me. There were no clues that I could pick up on that could predict which way they would rule, except maybe the number of questions on how to treat the 18,000 couples that have gotten married since it was legal.

JK

[Elderberry]

And, to get sucked into "rush limbaugh" being the leader?.....I don't think the reps all feel that way..........not sure, but, I hear a lot of them not thinking a lot of him..........

Please tell me the name of even one republican leader that has said anything negative about Rush Limbaugh since Obama has been in office that has not PUBLICALY ISSUED AN APPOLOGY OR CLARIFICATION to Mr. Limbaugh for what they said.

JK

[Elderberry]

OMG. There is a republican that just had a good idea...I just saw it while I was posting...

representative out of Georgia I believe...wants to pass legislation to prevent stupid people from having octuplets on the public dole.

I guess you were right after all ygmir.

JK

[Elderberry]

" I'll be here silently gloating when the Obama plan turns the economy around"
Yeah right, Why do I doubt the silent part?
I think that history has reserved a special place for president Obama.

Truth is; socialism hasn't worked. Capitalism has some serious problems.
Socialism is respect for people and not for capital.
Capitalism is respect for capital and not people.
Socialism has no outlet for greed.
Capitalism has it's center based on greed.
If Obama can find a fusion or synergy of the 2, he will have a stellar place in history. The world needs a new operating system. Capital hasn't come to any accommodation with automation. Capital has no brain. It will automate until it produces goods at the absolute lowest price. It hasn't yet noticed that automation has eliminated it's "working consumer" client base.
Socialism hasn't been tried in an automated world. Socialism is the death of incentive and greed. I suppose that there is some sort of arrangement where the benefits of capitalism can be distributed in an equitable socialist manner.
Given the human predisposition for laziness, I doubt that it's going to happen any time soon. Obama could posssssssibily lay out a foundation for reforms that would bring runaway greed into a socially productive channel.

I don't see his defense budget going in that direction. His health care reform might be just a big prize for Big Pharma. Why hasn't he rolled back the asinine drug procurement procedures for the US GOV? GOV buys in huge volumes but must buy at whatever price BIG pharma wants to charge.
We'll see.

I can understand your skepticism. You ask some good questions that make valid points, which I personally don't have the answers to either.

And yes, I probably won't be all that silent, but I'll also swallow the bitter pill if he should fail too.

But I'm betting all my money on him (almost literally), and am optomistic that he'll do what needs to be done for the good of the country and the people.

Again, you're right in saying...we'll see.

JK

[ygmir]

Also, just because someone has an idea that doesn't work, are you saying they can't come up with a good idea?

In the case of the republicans and what I am hearing from their camp--now seemingly headed by Rush Limbaugh and some other clown (Michael Steel), the chances of them coming up with a new idea, good or otherwise, is zero...unless trying to get more hip-hop into the party is your idea of a new good idea.

JK

I guess this is what I took as closed minded............

I bet the court arguments were fascinating..........
It's actually quite a referendum, if I use the term correctly, on the system here in CA for constitutional changes..........
Does the majority rule? Who has the ultimate power, the people, or, the court, or the capital gangsters.........

And, if a change is made due to undue, outside influence, is it not possible, for the opposition, to bring up an opposite, or negating, change in the following election? And, if they are truly in the majority, and, can muster their voters, change it back?

I understand mechanisms for making sure "the majority" don't make a mistake, but, where is that line drawn.......?

I support anyone who wants to getting married, in that I don't think it's the governments business............

[Toolmaker]

Nafta and Gatt are still around, we should have never got rid of the jobs.

[Elderberry]

I guess this is what I took as closed minded............

I bet the court arguments were fascinating..........
It's actually quite a referendum, if I use the term correctly, on the system here in CA for constitutional changes..........
Does the majority rule? Who has the ultimate power, the people, or, the court, or the capital gangsters.........

And, if a change is made due to undue, outside influence, is it not possible, for the opposition, to bring up an opposite, or negating, change in the following election? And, if they are truly in the majority, and, can muster their voters, change it back?

I understand mechanisms for making sure "the majority" don't make a mistake, but, where is that line drawn.......?

I support anyone who wants to getting married, in that I don't think it's the governments business............

It seemed that the most important part of the argument was determining if Prop 8 would be an 'amendment' or a 'revision' to the constitution. Many of what I would have thought important arguments were either absent or treated very fleetingly. It's all in how you parse the words, meaning and intent of the constitution and the proposition.

It was an interesting first-hand look into how our legal system works.

JK

[wedeliver]

I bet the court arguments were fascinating..........
It's actually quite a referendum, if I use the term correctly, on the system here in CA for constitutional changes..........
Does the majority rule? Who has the ultimate power, the people, or, the court, or the capital gangsters.........

And, if a change is made due to undue, outside influence, is it not possible, for the opposition, to bring up an opposite, or negating, change in the following election? And, if they are truly in the majority, and, can muster their voters, change it back?

....

"Who has the ultimate power"?? How about fairness, equality, logic, and inclusion.

If there had been a vote on Slavery, the "people" would have voted for it. Lincoln understood, that slavery was wrong on many levels. Denial of equality is WRONG also.

[ygmir]

I bet the court arguments were fascinating..........
It's actually quite a referendum, if I use the term correctly, on the system here in CA for constitutional changes..........
Does the majority rule? Who has the ultimate power, the people, or, the court, or the capital gangsters.........

And, if a change is made due to undue, outside influence, is it not possible, for the opposition, to bring up an opposite, or negating, change in the following election? And, if they are truly in the majority, and, can muster their voters, change it back?

....

"Who has the ultimate power"?? How about fairness, equality, logic, and inclusion.

If there had been a vote on Slavery, the "people" would have voted for it. Lincoln understood, that slavery was wrong on many levels. Denial of equality is WRONG also.

you refer to subjective criteria, IMHO..........
Fairness, equality, logic, and inclusion can be different for different people...........that, as good as it makes one feel, is hard to quantify.

Are you sure "the people" would have voted for slavery? Do you have facts to back that. Maybe in the south......but, nation wide? I'd not be so sure.

And, how "equal" do you see "equality"? I've seen many instances in which what one person thinks is equality, another completely disagrees with.....and, both have valid arguments...........

Do you suggest Lincolns only point in opposing slavery was fairness/equality?
I'd bet there was a lot of pressure from different directions, namely economic and political, that pushed him that direction........

I don't disagree with the action, or result, but, feel it's not that simple........and, if you refer to the civil war, I'd say it wasn't about slavery much if at all.........