La Contessa lawsuit....

Post by **Sham** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:08 am

http://www.rgj.com/article/20090311/NEWS/90310068/1321

The artists that created La Contessa sue the owner of the property where it was stored. Article published 3/11/09
**************************************
Two San Francisco artists are suing a Gerlach farmowner, claiming he torched La Contessa, a replica of a 16th century Spanish galleon that often appeared at the annual Burning Man festival.

Artist Simon Cheffins and Greg Jones, the mechanical engineer who helped build the piece, said in their suit that Mike Stewart, owner of Orient Farms, considered their creation â€œjunkâ€

bx1 · Post by **bx1** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:01 am

That's really horrible that we won't be seeing La Contessa anymore (at least not the version we all know). I think the outcome of this case in the end might come down whether or not Stewart made a reasonable effort to try and contact the artists about La Contessa (or if he didn't know them, to find out who it belonged to), to find some way of removing it before he decided to destroy it. By what I just read, it doesn't appear that he did...

Also if Quade can show the court Stewarts reason for the destruction was anything but what he claims (i.e. Stewart is an outspoken opponent of Burning Man for which La Contessa is a well known part).

Regardless, this should definitely set some case law about the destruction of artwork.

oneeyeddick · Post by **oneeyeddick** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:53 am

http://www.rgj.com/article/20090310/NEW ... eakingnews

Here is the link you tried to provide ( I think ?)

Some of the responses make me pretty mad.

Post by **Elderberry** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:05 am

I'll be interested in hearing the outcome.

JK

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:08 am

There is a federal law prohibiting the destruction of artwork?

Post by **Sham** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:29 am

oneeyeddick wrote:http://www.rgj.com/article/20090310/NEW ... eakingnews

Here is the link you tried to provide ( I think ?)

Some of the responses make me pretty mad.

That link worked this morning and then somehow it was taken down. I was glad I did a cut and paste as well!
I was invited to go on the la contessa on one of the last nights that it sailed. That was the night it had the big accident and hit a mountain out in the deep playa. I was too tired to go and many of my campmates were aboard. What a shame that it's gone!
[youtube][/youtube]

Post by **mdmf007** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:03 am

All the land owner had to do was simply call the sherrif and report an abandoned vehicle.

He admitted he knew it was a bus therefore it had a registered owner associated with the VIN or plate.

Sheriff would send a letter to the owner ordering removal, and bam - problem solved.

There is a legal process to remove abandoned property.

Even with the problems Contessa had with BMORG it was an icon, that hundreds of thousands had seen and enjoyed.

littleflower · Post by **littleflower** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:15 am

i'm curious to know what joan grant has to say about this .... she must have known the artists, if she let them store the bus on her property ... ? did she just leave without a word about it? i can imagine that she was pretty upset after her house burned, but that ship was huge ....

Post by **Elderberry** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:26 pm

http://www.ivanhoffman.com/vara.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_Artists_Rights_Act

I wasn't aware of the Visual Artist Rights Act, but here are a couple of the many links returned by a quick Google search.

JK

Post by **Sham** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 8:33 am

The article says that Joan Grant's house burned down. I wonder if that should be investigated? She was given permission to live there and then her house burned to the ground! Was it insured?
There is also the case of the missing figurehead from the ship. I'll bet that Mike Stewart has that safely stored away somewhere.

Kinetik V · Post by **Kinetik V** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:50 am

I love the fact that VARA exists...I didn't know about it until reading this thread yesterday. As for the lawsuit....part of me sides with the property owner in that you should have the right to do pretty much whatever you want with your land, as long as it doesn't involve water rights. (If you live out West water rights trump EVERYTHING else). But part of me is glad to see this suit go forward against such an outspoken critic who has made life hell for the ORG. In short....I'm split on this one...and it will be interesting to see how it plays out in the courts.

little.lemonade · Post by **little.lemonade** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:35 am

what I heard from the galleon builders was that they had permission from Mike Stewart to be there, met him personally, and that there were a variety of ways he could have reached someone from the team if he'd tried. He could have contacted Joan Grant, who was in touch with the group, he could have contacted the sheriff's department as someone else mentioned above, he could have contacted the BM offices for a phone number, or just called 411. Instead the arson came as a complete surprise to everyone. I think it was still a working artcar that was just a bit disassembled temporarily and there were plans for that galleon that were erased in the blink of an eye. A lot of people were affected and it's not right.

Post by **Elderberry** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:39 am

Kinetic V wrote:as long as it doesn't involve water rights. (If you live out West water rights trump EVERYTHING else).

Isn't it interesting how there always has to be some exception for some group? Water, Art, what else? I'm sure there are people that feel that if water is on their property it is theirs too. So, how can you be split--if you believe that water doesn't count when it comes to property rights, wouldn't logic have it that art wouldn't count either? and Visa versa.

JK

little.lemonade · Post by **little.lemonade** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 8:57 pm

It looks like the galleon crew is soliciting personal stories, possibly to support their case and prove the work wasn't a "pile of junk."

Here is the Group link:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Friends-o ... 1518360152

and the page link:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Friends-o ... 6913417858

littleflower · Post by **littleflower** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:53 pm

i bet the jerk didn't consider the idea that it might be considered art ...

i wish i had seen it, so i could tell a story. i feel like making one up.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:46 pm

I hope the state takes action too.
The arsonist should be in prison.
This is why my respect for the police is so boundless.

Let me translate for you.

Police: "That's a civil matter."

English: "I'm too corrupt and lazy to do my fucking job.
And no other cop will say boo about it."

Let's hope the sheriff and prosecutor responsible for dealing with this, face consequences.
Let's all hold our breath.

I wonder how many people get killed when the police do this and leave people with no recourse except violence?

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:56 am

It's shocking to contemplate something so big and artistic being at Burning Man and then actually....burning. Especially something made of .....wood.

I've seen numerous photos from the La Contessa burning, which was attended by a sizable crowd.... Wonder why nobody stopped them?

somekind · Post by **somekind** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 7:34 am

This reminds me of another art car that was burned down last year. Was it in Seattle? Does anyone remember the name or the link?

Post by **Sham** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:17 am

somekind wrote:This reminds me of another art car that was burned down last year. Was it in Seattle? Does anyone remember the name or the link?

Monstero http://www.blogginggeorgetown.com/2008/ ... o-rip.html

somekind · Post by **somekind** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 9:35 am

Thanks, that was the one.

Post by **mdmf007** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 10:38 am

gyre wrote:I hope the state takes action too.
The arsonist should be in prison....
Let's hope the sheriff and prosecutor responsible for dealing with this, face consequences.
Let's all hold our breath.

I wonder how many people get killed when the police do this and leave people with no recourse except violence?

Nevada Statute of Limitations is 3 years. So it would be coming up soon for charges to be filed.

Post by **Sham** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 12:10 pm

To me this sounds like more of a civil lawsuit than something that involves criminal charges. Property was destroyed and now the plaintiff wants the defendant to cough up some money over it. At very least, Stewart is going to have to get an attorney to defend this case. I hope this costs him a shitload!

swampdog · Post by **swampdog** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 12:56 pm

I suspect this is all speculation to amuse ourselves with. I suspect that this will result in as much lawyering as people can afford to prove who knew what when. Was La Contessa objectively identifiable as an object of value to someone? Did the prior owner of the land clearly inform the owners of La Contessa that they had a new landlord? Did they provide a contact person for La Contessa to the new owner? Did the owners of La Contessa interact with the new landlord? Did the owner of the land make any effort to contact the owners of La Contessa to have it removed before destroying it? Can any of this be documented?

The article says that ownership of the land changed in 2004, and La Contessa was torched in Dec 2006. That means that the ship sailed at least once between those times, so there was abundant time for communication.

It's all in the details. None of which we have.

oneeyeddick · Post by **oneeyeddick** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 1:31 pm

It was the butler in the library with the candlestick.

misfit · Post by **misfit** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:38 pm

Contessa was banned from the playa in '06, (along with the land shark

), last sailed '05...

Post by **Elderberry** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:44 pm

misfit wrote:Contessa was banned from the playa in '06, (along with the land shark ), last sailed '05...

Why?

JK

Artemis · Post by **Artemis** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:58 pm

jkisha wrote:
misfit wrote:Contessa was banned from the playa in '06, (along with the land shark ), last sailed '05...
Why?

JK

On the facebook page that someone provided a link to earlier, someone posted this....I'm guessing that may be the cause of the ban:

One year it was early evening and I was standing on the esplanade gazing out across the playa. I realized La Contessa and the whale, both loaded to the rafters with people, were engaged in a race across the desert. They were side by side, gathering momentum and behind them was (by comparison) a teeny tiny ranger golf cart with a siren and a loud horn yelling, "SLOW DOWN. YOU ARE IN VIOLATION OF THE SPEEDING RULES. YOU ARE GOING TO RECEIVE A TICKET!"

Post by **Elderberry** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 3:02 pm

Artemis wrote:
jkisha wrote:
misfit wrote:Contessa was banned from the playa in '06, (along with the land shark ), last sailed '05...
Why?

JK
On the facebook page that someone provided a link to earlier, someone posted this....I'm guessing that may be the cause of the ban:

One year it was early evening and I was standing on the esplanade gazing out across the playa. I realized La Contessa and the whale, both loaded to the rafters with people, were engaged in a race across the desert. They were side by side, gathering momentum and behind them was (by comparison) a teeny tiny ranger golf cart with a siren and a loud horn yelling, "SLOW DOWN. YOU ARE IN VIOLATION OF THE SPEEDING RULES. YOU ARE GOING TO RECEIVE A TICKET!"

Thanks, I saw that. Just speculating here, but I would think that the first time might be a warning from the ranger, and there might have been other issues as well. Which leads me to believe that the owners/artists, might be a tad on the irresponsible side to begin with. Watch it turn out that they had many notices and just did nothing?

JK

little.lemonade · Post by **little.lemonade** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 3:23 pm

They were banned/boycotted in 2004, not 2006, but made amends and new agreements for 2005 and then simply took one year off in 2006. But still visited the galleon site and did a little work on it that year. I think all that is covered in that SF Bay Guardian article.

misfit · Post by **misfit** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 3:26 pm

>>>>teeny tiny ranger golf cart with a siren and a loud horn yelling, "SLOW DOWN. YOU ARE IN VIOLATION OF THE SPEEDING RULES. YOU ARE GOING TO RECEIVE A TICKET!"<<<<

that ranger was later forced to walk the contessa's plank and then eaten by the shark... don't fuck with art.!....

La Contessa lawsuit....

La Contessa lawsuit....

La Contessa and Mike Stewart

post a personal story about la contessa

all speculation