How feasible are Scooters (either Gas or Electric)

Rage · Post by **Rage** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 5:35 pm

Who knows anything about the feasibility of using the larger 10" wheel variety of scooter for transport. The electric ones go at a reasonable clip on flat surfaces. What about the gas ones with a good air filter? (The dust issue again...)

They weigh a little more but take up less space than a bike.

And one step up from that...seen any old Vespas done up Mod-style?

Chai Guy · Post by **Chai Guy** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 5:40 pm

Try here:
http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... ht=scooter

and here:
http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... ht=scooter

and here:
http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... ht=scooter

III · Post by **III** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 5:52 pm

>>Vespas done up Mod-style

are not permitted by the dmv.

_tears_ · Post by **_tears_** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 7:23 pm

they have off-roading scooter thingy-ma-doos

polzicons · Post by **polzicons** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 5:21 am

Wow! There ARE alot of scoot-threds, see Chi Guy above, but to answer "how practical" motorized scooter are is to open a BIG can of worms. I've bought and stripped down in prep of mutating a 350 watt electric scoot. Now I wonder if I'll bring it after all. Sure I'd transform it into something beyond a lazy fat-ass excuse for "Art" (a few blinkies and some el-wire), but how will I be received at BR this year? INHO Very Practical in some ways, foolish in others.
I've looked all over the DMV links and as far as I can tell, you do not have to register scooters for playa use at BMan...and as long as they have brakes, lights, and a horn and fallow the speed/no wake policies, I guess they're O.K. with the DMV...
I strongly suggest modifying/mutating any scooter you bring, so as to not be mistaken for a lazy fat-ass! --I'm torn between an Elvis-headed Pez dispenser or styllized Incan "Chariot(s) of the Gods..."
I'd bring a bike, too. Drive your sculpturescooter to Center Camp and check out impromptu parades, but use the bike for crowded places and like to the loo.
The Amazing Karnack foresees a multitude of moto-scooters of all shapes and colors on the playa this year. They are sold everywhere these days. And CHEAP, too! Some will be fantasticly decorated and unrecognizable as scoots, some will have a token light string or stuffed animal hanging off the handle bars, but Karnack sees many people that do not even bother to try... So in 2005 they will be banned at BRC (as in much of the country.) So if you plan to bring one this year, please, please,please plan to mutate it. The reward for your efforts could be as simple as a smile from a passer by, and aint that what life's all about? :-} -POL

III · Post by **III** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 9:36 am

note that the dmv draws a line between the lil standup scooters, and things like vespas or the honda stepthroughs. the former are allowed and not regulated (albeit under somewhat negative social stricture) while the latter are subject to the exact same rules as art cars.

Tancorix · Post by **Tancorix** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:02 am

I remember reading somewhere that the Vespa types were restricted due to a power to weight formula they use for safety reasons. Anyway I wonder what they would think if you took one of the small stand up scooters and modified it into a sit down type model....I was going to build a space frame and shell around it.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:10 am

April 6 to April 27, 2004
Black Rock City Polls

How do you plan on getting around the playa this year?

[list] I will pedal the playa on my trusty tricked-out playa bike, of course!
I will dazzle my fellow participants with my fabulously decorated mutant vehicle!
I like to get around on a gussied-up (but muffled) scooter.
I'm going the old fashioned way ... foot power!
I shall rely on the kindness of strangers! [/list]

http://www.burningman.com/polls/polls.php

I shall laugh.

World's first road death

On August 17, 1896, Bridget Driscoll, became the first road fatality in the world. She was a 44year old mother with two children who had come to London with her teenage daughter and a friend to watch a dancing display.

While the driver was reported to be doing 4 mph, witnesses described her at being hit by a car travelling at "tremendous speed". The crash occurred on a terrace in the grounds of Crystal Palace in London

The car was owned by the Anglo-French Motor Car Company who were offering demonstration rides to the public.

At the time of the crash, the car was being driven by Arthur Edsell, an employee of the company. He had had been driving for only 3 weeks (no driving tests or licenses existed at that time). He had apparently tampered with the belt, causing the car to go at twice the intended speed. He was also said to have been talking to the young lady passenger beside him.

After a six-hour inquest, the jury returned a verdict of "Accidental Death". At the inquest, the Coroner said "This must never happen again". No prosecution was proposed or brought against the driver or the company.

http://www.roadpeace.org/articles/WorldFirstDeath.html

Ha.

Tiara · Post by **Tiara** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:25 am

I wonder what they would think if you took one of the small stand up scooters and modified it into a sit down type model....

Disclaimer: I haven't read all the new rules & regs regarding Mutant Vehicles that have been released to cover the 2004 event yet.

My understanding of past policy is that any motorized vehicle which can accomodate a seated driver and/or passenger(s) required DMV approval to operate during the event. This includes all sit-down type scooters, regardless of power source or engine size.

shitmouse · Post by **shitmouse** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 3:29 pm

i don't know.
a bicycycle has so much better of a vibe. for you, and everyone else.
build a playa cruiser. it's a nice, quiet way to cruise the ocean.

-(and i am an avid gas powered dirt-rider: cr500r. but i leave it at home).
please consider it.
-b

Otisserie · Post by **Otisserie** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 6:54 pm

Tiara wrote:Disclaimer: I haven't read all the new rules & regs regarding Mutant Vehicles that have been released to cover the 2004 event yet.

My understanding of past policy is that any motorized vehicle which can accomodate a seated driver and/or passenger(s) required DMV approval to operate during the event. This includes all sit-down type scooters, regardless of power source or engine size.

From listening to Larry's remarks at the SF Town Hall meeting it sounds like they are really cracking down on all vehicles this year. He said they are going to have an impound lot and not even let in vehicles such as ATVs (and scooters?) that won't be permitted on the playa. I didn't hear all of the speech so maybe someone else can fill in the rest of it.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 7:36 pm

Why hang around the back of the horse? All your going to get is what draws flies Just go to the horses mouth and ask the DMV. If it is NOT!!..."preregistered"...with the DMV you will have to off load it. It will stay in impound while you are at BM. It can not be put any clearer than this.

Tancorix · Post by **Tancorix** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 7:47 pm

And that is exactly what I did...I sent the DMV an e-mail about the hybrid scooter idea. When one of the hotties get back to me, I'll most likely post the relevant stuff here.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 9:08 pm

From listening to Larry's remarks at the SF Town Hall meeting it sounds like they are really cracking down on all vehicles this year. He said they are going to have an impound lot and not even let in vehicles such as ATVs (and scooters?) that won't be permitted on the playa. I didn't hear all of the speech so maybe someone else can fill in the rest of it.

It's true.

No more vehicles totin trailers full of ATVs/golf carts/motorcycles/go carts/etc.

Vehicles carrying passengers into the event are exempt of course. Vehicles converted or to be converted into mutant vehicles that have pre-registered with the DMV and have proof of that pre-registration will be allowed in but still must be visually inspected prior to issuance of the BRC license. All others will be 1) turned away at the gate with instructions to make all necessary arrangements to store the vehicle or 2) agree to drop the vehicle in question in the impound lot which means that under NO CIRCUMSTANCES will the vehicle in question be allowed to be removed from the lot for the duration of the event.

Period.

These are the ONLY two options available to anyone not taking the time to follow through with DMV registration requirements for mutant vehicles.

There will be NO exceptions. None.

Chai Guy · Post by **Chai Guy** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 9:34 pm

Just so we are clear (because "scooter" was in the title of this thread, although I know some allusion was made to a vespa as well, which would seem to fall in the NOT ALLOWED section).

What Vehicles Are Allowed?
Scooters
Scooters (stand-up, one-person “go-peds”) are allowed at Black Rock City. These vehicles do have a trademark —- a very distinctive sound. Give the gift of non-noise pollution to your neighbors (and all those whom you ride by): Muffle Thy Scooter.

http://www.burningman.com/on_the_playa/ ... index.html

That said, I'm still against these incredibly noisy, and annoying means of transportation. Please don't bring them.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 9:39 pm

You can always 'gift' them by filling their gas resevoirs with your DEE-FUCKING-LICIOUS chai Chai.

III · Post by **III** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:13 pm

>There will be NO exceptions. None.

is this really really no exceptions this time?

cause it's getting to be kinda like the boy who cried wolf.

ramen · Post by **ramen** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:56 pm

I just read the allowed vehicle page and I still wonder at what's allowed and what is pushing the envelope.

Sure I get that a totally mutated 4 wheeled vehicle made over into some sublime work of art okayed by the DMV is allowed on the playa.

But what about:
the guy driving a flying carpet complete with palm tree and 2 cycle lawn mower engine
the electric wheel chair made over into a mobile mushroom
the hammock on wheels
the motorized bed
assorted mobile couches

Are these all banned now or likely to fly under the radar?

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:20 pm

is this really really no exceptions this time?

cause it's getting to be kinda like the boy who cried wolf.

I certainly hear you and I believe that it's finally been heard by others. Keep in mind that it's not gong to work 100% and there'll likely be instances in which someone gets in under the radar but the current policy and enforcement protocol that's being hammered out is definitely being geared towards a no tolerance policy for the clueless who think that decorating a golf cart with a strand of blinky lights and a few feather boas is gonna cut it as far as crusing around the playa.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:24 pm

But what about:
the guy driving a flying carpet complete with palm tree and 2 cycle lawn mower engine
the electric wheel chair made over into a mobile mushroom
the hammock on wheels
the motorized bed
assorted mobile couches

Are these all banned now or likely to fly under the radar?

Can't answer that question. Defining and approval of what constitutes a mutant vehicle is exclusively in the realm of the DMV folks who'll be doing the evaluation based on what's submitted by the individuals interested in pre-registering a vehicle. Having said that I get the impression that the criteria is going to be a bit more stringent which translates (in my mind) into the need for some serious creativity in order to pass muster.

ramen · Post by **ramen** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:27 pm

I don't find electric golf carts so objectionable since they are usually pretty slow moving.

It's the Ford pickup with a piece of wood on the nose to resemble the prow of a boat.
The go-carts and minibikes that go zipping past my campsite all day.
Motorcycles suddenly zooming across the playa at 60 mph.

On reflection, it's almost always the overuse of fast oil burners that crashes the party.

Rage · Post by **Rage** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:29 pm

Check out the instant Quadracycle kit!

http://www.thegrannybike.com/quadcycles ... ycles.html

This is my solution: Build a home made version of this that I can breaK down for shipping and that allows for my art attachments.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:35 pm

I don't find electric golf carts so objectionable since they are usually pretty slow moving.

It's the Ford pickup with a piece of wood on the nose to resemble the prow of a boat.
The go-carts and minibikes that go zipping past my campsite all day.
Motorcycles suddenly zooming across the playa at 60 mph.

On reflection, it's almost always the overuse of fast oil burners that crashes the party.

And like I mentioned to Trey (III) your objections HAVE been heard and are by no means a small or isolated complaint.

The Ford pickup with the piece of wood on the nose will be given exactly one warning to park the vehicle in the impound lot for the duration of the event. Non-compliance or failure to accept the warning sets the driver up for any of a number of measures/actions available to DMV/Gate/Rangers to insure that it doesn't happen again. Those actions will be relayed strongly to anyone not taking the policy seriously and include any of a number of possibilities up to and including ejection from the event.

ramen · Post by **ramen** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:40 pm

Isotopia wrote: Having said that I get the impression that the criteria is going to be a bit more stringent which translates (in my mind) into the need for some serious creativity in order to pass muster.

Never having captained an 'art' vehicle aside from my own derrier perched atop a bike, I don't know much about the small fry art vehicles. I guess my impression is that the people driving mobile sofabeds or water-cooled mushrooms don't bother getting permits, while the drivers of regular four-wheeled vehicles are compelled to.

PurpleKoosh · Post by **PurpleKoosh** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 12:31 am

ramen wrote:Never having captained an 'art' vehicle aside from my own derrier perched atop a bike, I don't know much about the small fry art vehicles. I guess my impression is that the people driving mobile sofabeds or water-cooled mushrooms don't bother getting permits, while the drivers of regular four-wheeled vehicles are compelled to.

If it has wheels, a seat, and an engine, and ISN'T a staff vehicle, it needs to be approved (and this year, PRE-approved) by the DMV.

Rage · Post by **Rage** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 1:48 am

Creeping Eye Quadra-Cycle

http://www.micrage.com/creepingeye/

(Please don't steal my idea)

Chai Guy · Post by **Chai Guy** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 8:35 am

If it has wheels, a seat, and an engine, and ISN'T a staff vehicle, it needs to be approved (and this year, PRE-approved) by the DMV.

Me thinks this is one of those "exceptions" Trey is talking about. I mean of course the staff shouldn't have to decorate their golf carts! Do you have any idea how hard they work putting this event together for YOU? They hardly have the time, and besides the leasing company where they get the golf carts would hardly approve of them being "radically altered" blah, blah, blah....

So this year my art car is going to be a plain undecorated golf cart (Oh, ok, maybe I slap a few baby doll heads on the damn thing) I'm going to dress up like Larry, smoke camels and just drive around and wave at people yelling "Sorry, Can't stop, I'm going to be late for a meeting!"

Think I'll get approved??

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 8:36 am

It's good to be the Larry.

Or me.

ramen · Post by **ramen** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 10:09 am

So, if the conveyance has some form of engine, be it electric or combustion, it has to be registered.

Staff, DPW and human powered vehicles are exempted.

Does that about sum it up?

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 10:54 am

So, if the conveyance has some form of engine, be it electric or combustion, it has to be registered.

Staff, DPW and human powered vehicles are exempted.

Does that about sum it up?

Again, I can't state categorically that that's what's been decided. But, I believe you're in the ball park - especially regarding the combustion engine side of things. The concern is that ANYTHING motorized that has the potential for speed (faster than 5 mph) coupled with mass, needs to be looked at.

Remember to take this with a grain of salt as I don't work for or represent the DMV in any way.

How feasible are Scooters (either Gas or Electric)

How feasible are Scooters (either Gas or Electric)

I have a vision!

Posting my drawings for your comments and advice