Survival

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Mon May 18, 2009 6:07 pm

Lots of people are counting on the Chinese to continue to support the US. The Chinese aren't blind or stupid. MSM is ignoring indicators that show that all is worse than GOV lets on. GEAB, however is looking at these indicators;
http://www.leap2020.eu/GEAB-N-35-is-ava ... a3248.html
I'm sure that the Chinese are equally informed.

"Beijing has been disposing USD exchange reserves since the fourth quarter of 2008, at the rate of USD 50 billion per month(swap agreements included). In addition, they have nearly put a complete end to their purchase of US Treasuries.

Buy the end of summer of 2009, China will have disposed of nearly 600 billion worth of USD denominated assets AND it will have failed to purchase between USD 500 and USD 1,000 billion worth of US Treasuries. These two amounts added together give a clear idea of Beijing's impact on the 'USD'. This represents a shortfall of between USD 1,100 billion and 1,600 billion in United States financial needs...perhaps the US should put the IMF on speed dial."

It's not China that is caught in a "dollar trap". It's the FED.... and Japan. The US has 11 carrier battle groups. That might be what it take to keep OPEC from dumping the dollar.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:59 pm

An advisor to the Chinese central bank has said that the assets of the FED are rubbish. The dollar is dropping close to a point a day. Lots of central banks are buying dollars to support it. The dollar went as low as 72 but, rebounded. Millions of people had to close out positions that were denominated in dollars. That lead to a demand,, for a while. That demand is fading away.
Lots of entities are happy to sell their dollars to the central bankers who are buying. 81 was supposed to be a support number. it blew through that in a few hours. The saying goes; "don't start a panic" ,,,,,,,,,,, "but if you do start a panic, make sure that you're the first one to the exit."
It's hard to say just how far the dollar will drop;
http://broadcast.ino.com/education/doll ... mpaignid=3
Recently, there hadn't been a defined alternative to the dollar. The West is trying to push some other fiat bullshit. The East wants a commodity backed currency.
Reportedly the East is quite pissed off about the bullshit in South Ossetia.
http://news.goldseek.com/GoldenJackass/1243491300.php The East has also pulled their gold out of London.
The West and NWO may want to run the world but, they're going to have to do it without money. The US gold is gone. If the East can bust COMEX, it will show that the West is just like a piÃ±ata,,, full of debt and ripe to be busted.
Oil is on it's way up. If the assets of the FED are proved to be worthless as the Chinese assert, there won't be any reason for OPEC to sell to us. That will leave Canada as our sole foreign supplier. Mexico is about dried up. They have big fields but, no money to bring them to production.
Our technological society is a big edifice held up by many pillars. The central pillar is the carbon economy. History says that we're screwed.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:20 pm

After rereading most of this thread, I don't think most of you could survive a broken shoe lace..

Right NOW.. Your driveway has caved in to a big hole(no exit), water, lights, phone and sewer are cut. The whole city is in the same shape..Every one is cut off from everyone else. It looks like this is the way it's going to be for weeks,months maybe years.. So what you going to do?

FIRST?

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:49 pm

I'm going to run down to wal mart and get a new shoe lace. Or, alternately, I'm going to drop in on ygmir. I'm prepared to be a hunter-gatherer as long as I can do it in a super market.

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:25 pm

unjonharley wrote:After rereading most of this thread, I don't think most of you could survive a broken shoe lace..

Right NOW.. Your driveway has caved in to a big hole(no exit), water, lights, phone and sewer are cut. The whole city is in the same shape..Every one is cut off from everyone else. It looks like this is the way it's going to be for weeks,months maybe years.. So what you going to do?

FIRST?

Drain the hot water heater. That fifty gallons will keep you going for a while.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:56 pm

can't sit still wrote:I'm going to run down to wal mart and get a new shoe lace. Or, alternately, I'm going to drop in on ygmir. I'm prepared to be a hunter-gatherer as long as I can do it in a super market.

Streets are damaged and power is out so no Wally world for you. Super market it dark and closed..

Post by **AntiM** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:15 pm

SilverOrange wrote:
Drain the hot water heater. That fifty gallons will keep you going for a while.

And then I will shoot my neighbors and drain their hot water heaters, because they're too dumb to think of it. Their cats can eat their dead bodies.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:42 pm

Start setting the squirrel traps.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:54 pm

SilverOrange wrote:
unjonharley wrote:After rereading most of this thread, I don't think most of you could survive a broken shoe lace..

Right NOW.. Your driveway has caved in to a big hole(no exit), water, lights, phone and sewer are cut. The whole city is in the same shape..Every one is cut off from everyone else. It looks like this is the way it's going to be for weeks,months maybe years.. So what you going to do?

FIRST?
Drain the hot water heater. That fifty gallons will keep you going for a while.

Fifty gal, That should be good for about 25 days.

We have a 2000 gal fish pond. Also have a 25$ in line RV potable water filter. And a hand crank water pump.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:59 pm

Bob wrote:Start setting the squirrel traps.

Squirrel brought there young out to play yesterday.. counted 12 in one tree.. I give em treats in a gallon gar. Just have to spring and latch the door.

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:59 pm

unjonharley wrote:After rereading most of this thread, I don't think most of you could survive a broken shoe lace..

Right NOW.. Your driveway has caved in to a big hole(no exit), water, lights, phone and sewer are cut. The whole city is in the same shape..Every one is cut off from everyone else. It looks like this is the way it's going to be for weeks,months maybe years.. So what you going to do?

FIRST?

I thought we were discussing politics. Isn't this the "Ain't It Awful" thread?

Me, I am at home in the woods. Neander valley, in particular.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:05 pm

Might want to turn your water heater *off* first.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:08 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote:
unjonharley wrote:After rereading most of this thread, I don't think most of you could survive a broken shoe lace..

Right NOW.. Your driveway has caved in to a big hole(no exit), water, lights, phone and sewer are cut. The whole city is in the same shape..Every one is cut off from everyone else. It looks like this is the way it's going to be for weeks,months maybe years.. So what you going to do?

FIRST?
I thought we were discussing politics. Isn't this the "Ain't It Awful" thread?

Me, I am at home in the woods. Neander valley, in particular.

I'm not in the woods but I have food and shelter to cover my ass for a long time. Include seeds for fresh food and good dirt (some dorment stored) Also a worm farm to make more plant food..Still have taters in a dry mond from last fall..Just dig em as I need em..

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:12 pm

Bob wrote:Might want to turn your water heater *off* first.

Power and water is off for a long time.. Use the water heater for a rain, holding tank.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:21 pm

Can't do that. The squirrels are mad;
http://www.greysquirrel.net/brain.html

Actually Harley, I am prepared in many ways. IF the San Andreas fault lets go, that will set one set of plans in motion,,, assuming that I'm not squished. The first thing is to get away from the city. I have a six wheel drive diesel camper with 90 gals of fuel. I'm sure that someone would be willing to shoot me for it

I also have a Trail 110 Honda with 2 tanks and dual range. I imagine that someone would be willing to beat me over the head for that too.

We don't know what is coming our way. If the oil stops, I'm prepared. If somebody bombs Iran, that will be a different story. Various plagues will be everywhere. I have a gas mask but, I really don't want to live in it.
A descent into hyper-inflation would be manageable,,,, assuming that someone doesn't beat me over the head.
I have a standby plan to run out to the deserted islands just off the coast. I can live off fish like an eskimo;

Having traveled in very poor countries, I'm well aware of what it's like to shed just about everything. I've spent many a night on a pillow of blue jeans wrapped around my .44 Breakfast, lunch and dinner was tortillas and a can of beans. You never passed up an opportunity to fill your canteen.

Most people have never had to downshift that far. I traveled by road across India on a camping trip. I lost 35 lbs. That was certainly a downshift.
A lot of people just won't be able to do it.
I, on the other hand, have extra shoelaces.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:39 pm

can't sit still wrote:Can't do that. The squirrels are mad;
http://www.greysquirrel.net/brain.html

Actually Harley, I am prepared in many ways. IF the San Andreas fault lets go, that will set one set of plans in motion,,, assuming that I'm not squished. The first thing is to get away from the city. I have a six wheel drive diesel camper with 90 gals of fuel. I'm sure that someone would be willing to shoot me for it I also have a Trail 110 Honda with 2 tanks and dual range. I imagine that someone would be willing to beat me over the head for that too.

We don't know what is coming our way. If the oil stops, I'm prepared. If somebody bombs Iran, that will be a different story. Various plagues will be everywhere. I have a gas mask but, I really don't want to live in it.
A descent into hyper-inflation would be manageable,,,, assuming that someone doesn't beat me over the head.
I have a standby plan to run out to the deserted islands just off the coast. I can live off fish like an eskimo;

Having traveled in very poor countries, I'm well aware of what it's like to shed just about everything. I've spent many a night on a pillow of blue jeans wrapped around my .44 Breakfast, lunch and dinner was tortillas and a can of beans. You never passed up an opportunity to fill your canteen.

Most people have never had to downshift that far. I traveled by road across India on a camping trip. I lost 35 lbs. That was certainly a downshift.
A lot of people just won't be able to do it.
I, on the other hand, have extra shoelaces.

I hope to plan not to move.. How much better can one place be over another..

Living in the NW we will be the last to loss our water.

I don't fool around with food storage.. I store and eat from the storage and replace now.. Learning more and more about growing in small lots to extend the stored food..

I learned a lot about finding food and shelter at age 5 when I was turned out into the streets for three years. I'll put a knot on your noggin before you get my stuff.. I don't fight. I bit, kick, spit, scratch and use anything at hand to keep what's mine.. Don't be talking guns at eather.. If I know your carrying, I'll get you from behind.. Been there did that

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:44 pm

3 years on the streets would certainly teach you a lot. You're correct about the advantage of staying where you are. I was living in Bend in '05 when I discovered that a crash was coming. I came to LA to get a grub stake. This has put me far, far ahead of where I would have been if I stayed in Bend. Thanks to the money, I've got my place in Bend very well provisioned. The growing season sucks bad.
I drove around the country looking for a better place. Mexico is in the process of losing 60 % of it's income so I didn't want to be anywhere near the border. Texas looked good because the state owns the open land ,,, not the feds. Also, the oil and gas. I opted out of Texas and Oklahoma because the weather is going to turn particularly violent after 2010. Oklahoma is doing great but, I don't want to live in "tornado alley".

I settled on the 'banana belt" of western oregon. Water is going to be a giant issue in the near future. GOV is legislating away many people's right to access to water. Western Oregon is far away from highway 5,,, unlike your abode. Highway 5 gets about 35 inches of rain. Bandon on the coast gets about 80in. + fog. 12 miles back from the coast, they get lots of sun and about 55 inches of rain. I'm looking in the area around Myrtle point and Bridge. Unlimited water and game. Good solar exposure. Ocean and river fish. Coal and gas in Coos Bay. No cities. 50 miles from excellent hospitals in Medford. Lots of dairy and farming.
It's 240 miles from Bend so, it won't be prohibitive to move all my junk. Just like ygmir, I don't do a lot of advertising about my preparations. If it doesn't work out, I die a little sooner than expected. No big deal.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 6:07 pm

can't sit still wrote:I'm going to run down to wal mart and get a new shoe lace. Or, alternately, I'm going to drop in on ygmir. I'm prepared to be a hunter-gatherer as long as I can do it in a super market.

drop on in anytime. just give the "high sign", to avoid the guards.........

Unjohn:
I don't quite get the tenor of your statement:

do you mean to insult some of us here and naive, unprepared, and, not as up to speed as yourself?

Are you trying to begin a helpful dialogue regarding preparations for differing disasters and forming a network of support and such?

Are you trying to illustrate the correct and best way to do so, using yourself as an example?

Some of us are undoubtedly better prepared than others.
Some will starve.
Some will thrive.
Some, will just survive.

I've done what I can to prepare, I'd like to think in a well rounded way.
I'm not sure that I'd necessarily advertise all that I've done on a public forum though........

I ask these questions and make these statements, UNJ, not as an affront, but, so determine how I might add and participate in this part of the discussion you have brought forward.

thanks

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 6:28 pm

can't sit still wrote:3 years on the streets would certainly teach you a lot. You're correct about the advantage of staying where you are. I was living in Bend in '05 when I discovered that a crash was coming. I came to LA to get a grub stake. This has put me far, far ahead of where I would have been if I stayed in Bend. Thanks to the money, I've got my place in Bend very well provisioned. The growing season sucks bad.
I drove around the country looking for a better place. Mexico is in the process of losing 60 % of it's income so I didn't want to be anywhere near the border. Texas looked good because the state owns the open land ,,, not the feds. Also, the oil and gas. I opted out of Texas and Oklahoma because the weather is going to turn particularly violent after 2010. Oklahoma is doing great but, I don't want to live in "tornado alley".

I settled on the 'banana belt" of western oregon. Water is going to be a giant issue in the near future. GOV is legislating away many people's right to access to water. Western Oregon is far away from highway 5,,, unlike your abode. Highway 5 gets about 35 inches of rain. Bandon on the coast gets about 80in. + fog. 12 miles back from the coast, they get lots of sun and about 55 inches of rain. I'm looking in the area around Myrtle point and Bridge. Unlimited water and game. Good solar exposure. Ocean and river fish. Coal and gas in Coos Bay. No cities. 50 miles from excellent hospitals in Medford. Lots of dairy and farming.
It's 240 miles from Bend so, it won't be prohibitive to move all my junk. Just like ygmir, I don't do a lot of advertising about my preparations. If it doesn't work out, I die a little sooner than expected. No big deal.

2013 May will be the peak solor storms on tthis latest go around.

I have settled here in Salem for a long time. The coast is inviting.
But have figured electric use (wind).. Over the next few years will see how primitive I can live and be commfortable..

am learning more and more about growing food indoors even in a cabinet..In the future the shit in the air could fuck up your food.

At my age it's all about teaching the kids how to do all the shit I learn.

It's fun and suprising the stuff you realy do not need to be comffy.

Glad I poked this thread with a stick. Hope some one learns some thing

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:04 pm

Harley, the other consideration in Oregon is earthquakes. The pacific plate is sub-ducting under the continental plate. Oregon had a nine something quake back 130 years,,, if I recall right. There is a lot of recent info concerning "Gravity Waves"
http://www.etheric.com/GalacticCenter/GRB.html
Jennifer Lawson says that we can expect a lot of volcanism and earthquakes. I haven't read enough yet but, it appears that gravity wave are real. I don't plan to be real close to the Cascades. Bend, is a siting duck.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:06 pm

I'm glad you poked it, too.
Yes, it is good to teach the young to be self sufficient, I agree.

I'd wonder:
if the air is so bad it will screw up the vegetables you might eat, how the hell will you be able to breathe?.....just sayin'.......or drink the water?
the thing about the NW, is, although there is lots of water, since most sources there are surface water, depending on the contaminants, it can get screwed up pretty fast.......even shallow water source wells and tables can get "dirty"..........It seems I remember the Achilles heal of the NW is water storage.....that, with all the water, there isn't a ton of storage available. Is that true?
A deep well might be in order........

outside of water, wind, solar power, to me, the key is propane.
It doesn't get old or go bad. pumps it'self. With new heaters, it's 99.9% (IIRC) efficient, no CO off gassing.
It can run engines, cook food, heat water, emergency freeze something, etc, etc.

this discounts any fuel you can produce (methane, producer gas), or harvest, like firewood or grass or whatever......

Skills and knowledge are at least as important as "stuff"..........if you can work basic metals, you can make any tool you might need.....

Same with healthcare. Knowing the basics can be better than a cabinet full of valium...........and, with some chemistry.....well.......

the Foxfire books are great. no CD's, books, that can be read by candle if necessary.

mostly, staying put is best. you know the area, know your neighbors, can cooperate much better for the benefit of all. If you must "bug out", degrees of travel and equipment, like layers, is good.
a backpack with basics and firearms for a quick escape, up to a 10wheel drive, multi fuel cargo truck and trailer, if you have time to pack........
Diesel engines run on more things than gasoline engines...improvised fuels are easier........

just some thoughts........

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:11 pm

ygmir wrote:
can't sit still wrote:I'm going to run down to wal mart and get a new shoe lace. Or, alternately, I'm going to drop in on ygmir. I'm prepared to be a hunter-gatherer as long as I can do it in a super market.
drop on in anytime. just give the "high sign", to avoid the guards.........

Unjohn:
I don't quite get the tenor of your statement:

do you mean to insult some of us here and naive, unprepared, and, not as up to speed as yourself?

Are you trying to begin a helpful dialogue regarding preparations for differing disasters and forming a network of support and such?

Are you trying to illustrate the correct and best way to do so, using yourself as an example?

Some of us are undoubtedly better prepared than others.
Some will starve.
Some will thrive.
Some, will just survive.

I've done what I can to prepare, I'd like to think in a well rounded way.
I'm not sure that I'd necessarily advertise all that I've done on a public forum though........

I ask these questions and make these statements, UNJ, not as an affront, but, so determine how I might add and participate in this part of the discussion you have brought forward.

thanks

Read your post after posting (above) Please read.

As a good person we should share our low tec knowlage. In the future hi tec is about to take a vacation. Like the Big Three that has hit a big rock in the road. They must change. But fight change they will. As they fight this change people will get hurt. The little guy that wont change will loss the most basic ei food shelter.

For myself I maintain a food storage. It's the same food I eat every day.. That way there will be no stress on my eating habits..I practice square foot gardening in containers for fresh green foods.
A supply of food it stored outside the house. Some root foods are store in the ground as they were years ago.

For cooking I have primary and secondary. The secondary is most primitive and efective. It's called a Rocket Stove and is made from old food cans lined with ashes.

For water storage we have a large fish pond. THe water could be hand pumped through a filter, bleach treated and boiled for use in the kitchen.

I use the fish poo (and they crap a lot) to break down the weeds, wood chips and lawn clippings. leaving good top soil.

Shelter is the house with a cottage 75 feet away and a livable barn. After BM09 I will be building a caravan. This, old tec rocks. To do list on shelter. collect opening cover materials for house buildings openings. Disaster control..

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:19 pm

can't sit still wrote:Harley, the other consideration in Oregon is earthquakes. The pacific plate is sub-ducting under the continental plate. Oregon had a nine something quake back 130 years,,, if I recall right. There is a lot of recent info concerning "Gravity Waves"
http://www.etheric.com/GalacticCenter/GRB.html
Jennifer Lawson says that we can expect a lot of volcanism and earthquakes. I haven't read enough yet but, it appears that gravity wave are real. I don't plan to be real close to the Cascades. Bend, is a siting duck.

Going to have to look at the wave thing.

Got dumped on good when Helen blow her top. THat's the why for, for inside gardening

This place didn't even feel the thump 12 years ago. The land is on top of a large rock formation. But shit happens. We have a second small house in the yard. And I'm working on a gyspy RV just in case

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:19 pm

Sounds REALLY good. Send me your address. I'll bring my cabinet of valium.
I was going to go south but I don't have the money;
http://costarica.en.craigslist.org/reo/1201791244.html

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:43 pm

I thought you had my address......or, were you talking to someone else?

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:54 pm

Ash, Pinatubo, 1991

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:31 am

Bob, if you like volcanoes, you should read about Paracutin. It started out as a crack in a cornfield. It eventually buried the valley with a billion tons of lava.
http://techcenter.davidson.k12.nc.us/fa ... icutin.htm

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:11 am

can't sit still wrote:Sounds REALLY good. Send me your address. I'll bring my cabinet of valium.
I was going to go south but I don't have the money;
http://costarica.en.craigslist.org/reo/1201791244.html

Valium is from the outside and not renewable..

I have seeds and soil.

A friend (years past) had his plant in topiary in the picture window.
It was formed as a giant heart with a open heart in the center. He would prune it like picking tea leaf on the inside (living room side) then turn it to the sun.

Contrary to pop belief you don't need a grow light. The blue spec. is all you need, heat can come from other.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:25 am

Bob wrote:

Ash, Pinatubo, 1991

Now that could screw up a persons day. I have 8 cube foot of dorment ph7 soil put back.

Water is in question in this case. Looking into atmoshpic water generators. One is being developed for third world use. They propose a 12v system.

I look at all this shit to get off grid. I don't like living at Gov. colateral damage standards.. Do you know where your water came from?

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:48 am

can't sit still wrote:Bob, if you like volcanoes, you should read about Paracutin. It started out as a crack in a cornfield. It eventually buried the valley with a billion tons of lava.
http://techcenter.davidson.k12.nc.us/fa ... icutin.htm

Acording to earth core drilling history. The earth cooled for six years behind a volcano and wiped out 2/3 of the homo..

With feet of ash there will be no bugging out in any thing with wheels. Might have to eat that saved bullet.