Guns, Love Em or Leave Em

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:20 pm

That sounds nutty. This site thinks it's a hoax. I think it is too. But dumb dumbs everywhere may get all riled up about it.

http://patricksperry.wordpress.com/2009 ... il-a-hoax/

Not .45, just venerable .40

Wolf ammo from Russia is shit. Doesn't shoot straight (50'). Hollow points are that way too, but I wouldn't want to walk in front of one at 20'.

Apollonaris Zeus · Post by **Apollonaris Zeus** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:20 pm

can't sit still wrote:Here's another gun poll;
http://www.parade.com/news/intelligence ... tening.htm
"Texas may welcome guns into bars" You have to draw the line somewhere. Guns in bars is going way too far. I've been in bars in Chicken Alaska and Apache junction Az that had signs on the door; Gentlemen, Check Your Guns
I've seen what happens when you mix guns and alcohol. Fucking hot lead everywhere :evil:

"What do you mean I'm cut off?"

"Tell that to my little friend!"

[youtube][/youtube]

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 6:29 am

cowboyangel wrote:That sounds nutty. This site thinks it's a hoax. I think it is too. But dumb dumbs everywhere may get all riled up about it.

http://patricksperry.wordpress.com/2009 ... il-a-hoax/

Not .45, just venerable .40

Wolf ammo from Russia is shit. Doesn't shoot straight (50'). Hollow points are that way too, but I wouldn't want to walk in front of one at 20'.

one theory is that crooked bullets work better.........
that, if you flinch, and, the bullet pulls the other way, it'll be right on target.............

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:07 am

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:03 pm

"The legislation that takes effect July 14 retains an existing ban on consuming alcohol while carrying a handgun" You don't want to spill any.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/0 ... 11710.html

Apollonaris Zeus · Post by **Apollonaris Zeus** » Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:12 pm

Pastor Urges His Flock to Bring Guns to Church

LOUISVILLE, Ky. â€” Ken Pagano, the pastor of the New Bethel Church here, is passionate about gun rights. He shoots regularly at the local firing range, and his sermon two weeks ago was on â€œGod, Guns, Gospel and Geometry.â€

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 8:19 am

I want to make a black powder cannon.........

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 9:22 am

YGMIR, the black powder is cool. I watched the re-enactment guys firing away. Smokeless powder is more available because of insurance regs for sellers of black powder. Smokeless needs to be confined to reach a fast propagation speed. You can just use a wooden dowel pounded down the barrel. A gasoline cannon would be cheaper.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 9:53 am

black powder leaves mucho residue

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:08 am

can't sit still wrote:YGMIR, the black powder is cool. I watched the re-enactment guys firing away. Smokeless powder is more available because of insurance regs for sellers of black powder. Smokeless needs to be confined to reach a fast propagation speed. You can just use a wooden dowel pounded down the barrel. A gasoline cannon would be cheaper.

are you sure about the regs of black powder?
My understanding is black powder is easier to get,............

Smokeless usually has far to high a pressure to use in home made canons............

and, if need be, you can make black powder yourself.......or, I can anyway..........pretty simple.

gasoline cannon, IMHO, would not have the power needed.......you have to have a good air/fuel ratio or max effect. Propane is easier to meter and mix.

I just like the black powder idea:
boom, flame, smoke............maybe even a projectile...........and, simple.

the powder is easier to move and store than gas or propane........

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:53 am

Yeah, gaseous fuel is easier to use. It's killed a million potatoes. Acetylene and oxygen works quite nicely. You just need good wall thickness. The old 'Bangsite" cannons were powered by calcium carbide and water,,, acetylene and air.
The ultimate is probably RDX which has a super-high speed of propagation. Since it's hard to get, you can just use water. Make your own HHO gas. The speed of propagation is not referred to as "explosive", it's rated "concussive".. Everybody is selling hydroxy producers. I have an 11 gallon cell. the bubbler is welded 1/4 stainless steel. You could make a cannon out of old well-drilling tube [rod] It will take the strain. If you shoot potatoes,,, expect potato puree.
If you just want smoke and bang,,,, black powder. If you want a GOOD flash, put a Molotov in the barrel. Aahhh, I just love the smell of napalm in the morning.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 1:17 am

I need to decide on a backup carry weapon.
Looking at the P32, P380 and possibly the PF9, though it seems a bit large by comparison.
Burn, weren't you advocating the 32 over the 380?
Convince me.
Why the 32?

I've been looking at some others, but they all seem to be way too expensive or too heavy and large.
But I'm open to ideas.

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/p32.htm
http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/p3at.htm
http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/pf9.htm

**burn** · Post by **burn** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 1:55 am

The 380 is the bigger caliber over the 32.
But these days there is so much specialty ammo that either caliber has effective stopping power.

I preferred the 32 over the 380 in this specific ammo line as the fps and flbs were actually better (about 8 years ago, or so).

Check out the current stats of this favorite ammo manuf:
http://rbcd.net/Personal%20Defense-%20Ammo.htm

I have all three of those in the Kel-tec line. The 9mm is pretty light weight, even tho bigger. Still very compact.

Be safe.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:33 am

So what are your feelings now?

I carry a P11 now and the PF9 seems a little redundant, although very practical.
I'm still very impressed with the incredible ease of carry with the smaller ones.
I used to carry a Beretta that way, but they don't make the same calibers.

The P380 is still rated at 25% more barrel load than the P32, and that seems to be the real limit now.
I have been using the Barnes rounds and they don't have a 32 yet.
I miss having a slide stop though.

What do you think of the Magsafe ammo?

**burn** · Post by **burn** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:54 am

I havenlt used the Kel-tec's for everyday carry for some time.
I usually use a baby glock for normal everyday carry.
I don't use the MagSafe ammo, so I can't help you there either.

I'm sure someone will come forward with an opinion, tho.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 7:06 am

one of my small ones is a Walther PPK, .380

I think, at times, people get way to carried away in the minutia of ammo power, one vs another, if they're close.........

a hit with .380 or .32, will for the most part, do the same thing........to many variables, IMHO, to discriminate.......even related to "explosive, vs, fragmenting, vs, hollowpoint"

sure, if it's .22 vs .357, I see it.........

Guns size, too, IMHO, if they're close, who cares?........

If I don't so much care about hiding it, I have an EAA witness, .45 ACP.......
really don't care, SW m29 8 3/8 bbl.
or, the PPK on the other end.

I'd say, the most important, is, what you can hit something with?

"a hit with a .32 is better than a miss with a .44"

Just my 2 cents........

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:34 am

I like the Walther, but I haven't seen a good buy except on the smaller calibres.
I need something that isn't in the way for all I have to do this summer.

We tested ammo ourselves and the differences are quite striking in some cases.
The smaller the size, the bigger the differences are in use.

I was surprised at how comfortable I am with the 45 in even a very lightweight weapon.
Firing a small shotgun shell in the same gun left my hand sore for days though.
A very effective defense weapon though.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 6:42 pm

gyre wrote:I like the Walther, but I haven't seen a good buy except on the smaller calibres.
I need something that isn't in the way for all I have to do this summer.

We tested ammo ourselves and the differences are quite striking in some cases.
The smaller the size, the bigger the differences are in use.

I was surprised at how comfortable I am with the 45 in even a very lightweight weapon.
Firing a small shotgun shell in the same gun left my hand sore for days though.
A very effective defense weapon though.

I understand how testing can show the differences.......I just think a hit is good, no matter what, and, much better than a miss..........

so, did you fire a .410 from a .45 gun? Was it a Thompson?
there were, at a time, some handguns made in .45 long colt that would also accept a .410 shell.....but, IIRC, they were single shots.........

The thing about a Walther, IMHO, is, that they hold their value very well, and, even go up in price. mine is worth 3 times what I paid for it 20 years ago.........

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:10 pm

It was a reproduction of an antique gun, built to modern specs in Tennessee.
The barrel swivels horizontally.
The gun has some beautiful safeties and is a single shot.

I looked at a revolver today that fires both.
Not the easy to conceal thing I'm looking for though.

If cost didn't matter, I'd get an FN.
If you know where I can get something by Walther in a larger calibre in my price range, I'd be interested.
There were a lot of choices a while back, but mostly small at a good price, then high for 9mm and so on.

I'm still leaning toward the P380 or P32.
It is just so flat and easy to wear.
And Armalaser has a good laser for it.

Not just easy to carry, but easy to forget you are carrying it.
In the 100 degree heat and 100% humidity, you can still conceal it.
I'm thinking being prepared and the element of surprize more than makes up for any lack of power.
I can certainly fire a smaller calibre faster.
I always liked my Beretta 25 for this reason.

I won't be getting rid of the 9mm, just adding a 17 round magazine to the standard 12 round ones that are already illegal in california.
But it looks like this summer will not be convenient for normal carry.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:47 pm

hell,
just carry the big gun in your jogging shorts and pretend you're happy to see them.........

come on now, think outside the box..........

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:11 pm

A friend has a cellphone case modified to carry a 380 in the open.

"Yes, I am happy to see you AND there is a gun in my pants."

A friend's two year old is very friendly and runs to hug everyone.
He ran up to hug a wiseguy standing on the corner and banged his head on the gun down the front of his pants.
Backing away rubbing his head, he pointed at the guy and said, "Oww, daddy.
Gun!"

Priceless expression on the guy's face.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 9:08 pm

that looks like it was carved outa soap by Dillinger. Now here's a baby:

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/ ... sFirearm=Y

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 2:02 am

Nice, but way too heavy and triple my budget.
Too large, too heavy and too costly.
But it would be an alternative to a heavier gun.
It's the same weight as the PF9 at $250 though.

Interesting use of scandium alloy.
More frames should be ultralight metal.

The zytel frame on the Keltec is vulnerable to failure from moisture.
On the other hand, it absorbs shock and is easy to replace.

But if you like larger, we fired the 60mm a few times tonight.
Proof loads and good bass.
The last time was close to a pound of powder and I felt the shock wave move across my body and curl around me.
That was new.

I'll get closer next time.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:13 pm

gyre wrote:Nice, but way too heavy and triple my budget.
Too large, too heavy and too costly.
But it would be an alternative to a heavier gun.
It's the same weight as the PF9 at $250 though.

Interesting use of scandium alloy.
More frames should be ultralight metal.

The zytel frame on the Keltec is vulnerable to failure from moisture.
On the other hand, it absorbs shock and is easy to replace.

But if you like larger, we fired the 60mm a few times tonight.
Proof loads and good bass.
The last time was close to a pound of powder and I felt the shock wave move across my body and curl around me.
That was new.

I'll get closer next time.

just don't put your ear to the barrel to find out when the projectile is coming...........

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:39 pm

The bigger gun weighs 300 pounds and has been known to move some distance backwards.
The smaller one went 85 feet once.
So, always to the side.
And I always wear over the ear protection, even for fireworks.
you can feel the big gun through your toes.
I think the last shot lifted us off the ground.
We had to dig the thing out.
It compressed the earth six inches with one shot.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:10 pm

By the way, there is a cheap source for potassium nitrate, for those making their own black powder.
Not lab grade, but quite usable.

Local stores are gouging so badly, it looks like I have to order anything out of state.
The only saving grace is that I could resell in an hour for what I paid, that is, if I can ever get anything in.
I'm on backorder now.

It seems there are some new color frames for Keltecs now.
I have pictures if anyone wants to help me post them.
I can email them.
Looks like tan, ivory, blue, a deeper blue and a powder blue.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:32 pm

and that cheap source is.............

?????

Oldguy · Post by **Oldguy** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:18 pm

wiki;
Potassium nitrate is also used as a fertilizer, in amateur rocket propellants, and in several fireworks such as smoke bombs.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:20 pm

Oldguy wrote:wiki;
Potassium nitrate is also used as a fertilizer, in amateur rocket propellants, and in several fireworks such as smoke bombs.

that helped..........

Oldguy · Post by **Oldguy** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:23 pm

Google can be your friend. That is my eplaya gift to you today.