Guns, Love Em or Leave Em

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:52 pm

some of my favorite guns:

3"/50 caliber
5"/38 caliber
6"/50 caliber

caliber is the ratio of barrel length to bore 3" x 150"; 5" x 190"; 6" x 300"

3" 13# projectile, 14,600 yards
5" 105# projectile, 17,500 yards, 2600fps, (15 lbs powder)
6" 105# projectile, 26,000 yards, 1200fps, (55 lbs powder)

shot them all...1970's US Navy

Oldguy · Post by **Oldguy** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:06 pm

3 BAND ENFIELD, .58 Caliber Black Powder Rifle... I meant .58 cal. not 58 cal., my bad. Those pesky decimals get me every time, I never went to MIT. The closest I came to navy guns was working on analog targeting computers, the ones with plug-in capacitors and resisters, in an engineering class at Davis. That was when photomicronization of integrated circuits was starting, we used sliderules, not calculators.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:30 pm

Some chinese stores sell it as a cooking supply.
Most grades are poor, but some are usable in black powder.

I ordered the theoretical Keltec in hard chrome, but teflon plating has been suggested as a superior coating rather than hard chrome.
I did find another shop to transfer FFLs for me, as my two have both vanished.
They can do black chrome too, but recommend the teflon, which is used on all internal parts except the barrel and on the outside too.
Any opinions?

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 8:49 pm

look closely at the ingredient label of Stump Remover sold at garden supply stores and some box hardware stores

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 4:57 pm

The Teflon suggested to me is called Black-T.
Interestingly, the green variant is naturally infrared reflective and the FBI asked them to knock it off.

http://www.snipercentral.com/birdsong.htm

**burn** · Post by **burn** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 5:42 pm

What a great time shooting the Frogbat.
Definitely find footage on youtube.
There must of have been 80 on the firing line.
I would finish a magazine, someone would want to shoot my gun, we would switch, and then someone else would switch again.
We murdered it!
Really the highlight of my weekend.

**burn** · Post by **burn** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 5:43 pm

What a great time shooting the Frogbat.
Definitely find footage on youtube.
There must of have been 80 on the firing line.
I would finish a magazine, someone would want to shoot my gun, we would switch, and then someone else would switch again.
We murdered it!
Really the highlight of my weekend.

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 7:45 pm

So my mom has mentioned wanting a handgun for personal protection a few times, and so I've decided that it's time to set her up with one as well as some shooting lessons. Due to some arthritis issues that she deals with and ease of use I'm pretty set on a revolver. I'm also thinking about going the hammerless route due to the fact that she seems interested in getting a CCW. Any suggestions on calibers and revolvers to check out. I've always been a S&W guy and have only owned .357 and larger weapons.

**burn** · Post by **burn** » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:29 pm

I would only do shrouded/hammerless if she can work the trigger.
Otherwise, the hammer would be helpful.
Or a trigger job.

I think 4 inch barrels are easier to shoot than 2 inch.
If she is good under duress, I would consider shooting with a 38
and then loading 357 for self defense.

How does she plan to conceal this? Purse? Hip holster?
That will have some affect on size.

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 12:01 am

I don't think she would have trouble with the trigger pull and like you said, that could be adjusted. I do think she would have a problem with a slide, that's why I'm thinking revolver. As far as hammerless, I was thinking that route because if she was going to carry concealed I'm pretty sure she would be carrying in her purse. Whatever it ends up being would probably be home defense 95% of the time. She's retired and really doesn't go out a lot, but does get nervous being home alone as there have been a couple of incidents at her house. There are shotguns and rifles in the house, but she's just never been comfortable using them and they're not readily accesible as they're kept locked in a gun safe.

What in your opinion would be an adequate caliber? She's shot my .357 before but didn't seem totally comfortable with it. (I am planning to take her to the range to try out some guns, but was just trying to get some suggestions to narrow down the field.)

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 12:46 am

Make sure she has panic switches available in the house.
I can help you with setup.
They should be by doors and in the bedroom at a minimum.
Wireless is an option.

Practice is essential, moreso with someone lacking confidence.
Offer to practice with her.
I think a rifle or shotgun is always more useful when possible.
More accessible gunsafes and locations can be done.
Give her a chance to try the options, as to size and type.

There are purses designed for carry that are very useful.

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:17 am

gyre wrote:Make sure she has panic switches available in the house.
I can help you with setup.
They should be by doors and in the bedroom at a minimum.
Wireless is an option.

Practice is essential, moreso with someone lacking confidence.
Offer to practice with her.
I think a rifle or shotgun is always more useful when possible.
More accessible gunsafes and locations can be done.
Give her a chance to try the options, as to size and type.

There are purses designed for carry that are very useful.

Thanks for the offer Gyre. I'll talk to her about that. I'm planning on getting her some lessons to get her started off right, and I think it'll be fun to take her to the range with me. Maybe I'll be able to get the GF to go along too.

I agree about the shotgun for home defense. I've got the Remington 870 myself.

I just don't think that after 67 years she's going to change her ways. I'll just feel more comfortable knowing she's more comfortable.

There should be an alarm that's the sound of a shell being racked into a shotgun, cause there's nothing else quite like it as far as getting your attention and letting you know that you're seconds away from serious hurt.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:31 am

I'd think a .38, you can get "light" loads, as far as practicing, and, load "big hollow points" for defense.......in an emergency, she'll not notice the higher powered loads, and, can practice with light loads with minimal recoil, to get familiar.

that's my 2 cents.......

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:19 am

Thanks Ygmir. That's pretty much what I was thinking as well. There's a great gun shop with a range here in town that has a shitload of rentals to shoot. I went this morning and got a good idea of what they have for her to try out and am thinking .38 or .32 mag. They have the S&W 442 and 662 Airweights in .38 that I think she might like and the 432PD Airweight in the .32 magnum. I'm kind of biased towards the S&W's when it comes to revolvers due to a long history of using them virtually problem free. They also offer the same basic guns from Charter Arms and Taurus. Anyone have any experience with these two companies? I've heard some negative things about Charter Arms, but have heard better things about Taurus recently. They are a little cheaper $ wise than the Smiths. Also has anyone had any experience with the .32 magnums?

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:03 am

Try to start practice outdoors.
The acoustics are always easier.

Get good hearing protection.
I use Leight's Black Leightning with inserts too.
Use that grade or better.
It matters.

The acoustics on a good range are still louder than outside.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:22 am

Yesterday.
I could post one of these every day or so from here, most involving average people.

Jewelry courier in Tenn. shoots attackers in robbery similar to previous diamond thefts
JON GAMBRELL Associated Press Writer
5:16 PM CDT, July 8, 2009
Police say a jewelry courier opened fire on four men trying to rob him in Memphis, Tenn. At least two of the robbers were armed with handguns.

Police say two of the men suffered gunshot wounds during the Wednesday afternoon robbery attempt and were taken to the Regional Medical Center.

The attempted robbery comes a year after masked gunmen and knife-wielding attackers robbed diamond couriers in Arkansas as part of a crime wave across the South. FBI and police suspected the previous thefts could be part of what the bureau refers to as "South American Theft Groups" targeting diamond couriers.

An FBI spokesman tells The Associated Press that those wounded in the Wednesday attack spoke Spanish. The spokesman said FBI agents responded to the scene of the robbery and will assist Memphis police if they request it.

FAST FACTS:
â€¢ 4 men stalk jewelry salesman
â€¢ Men attempt to rob salesman near Hobson Building in east Memphis
â€¢ Two men still on the run, two injured at the MED

(Memphis 7/8/09) A barrage of bullets cut through an east Memphis parking lot around three Wednesday afternoon. When it was over, two would-be jewelry robbers were injured, and two others were running for their lives.

The would-be robbers were hoping to attack a travelling jeweler, but they never got a chance to steal a thing. Instead, he pulled a gun, and sent two to the MED in critical condition. The foiled robbery happened behind the Hobson building on Poplar. Cops say this attempted robbery was well-planned and well-orchestrated. However, what the crooks weren't counting on -- the jeweler was ready.

"They apparently had been stalking him, tracking him and trying to find the right tim to jump him," says building manager Joseph Steffner. He says four Hispanic men with guns were stalking the jeweler who had been to other stores across town and had just finished selling to a private jeweler upstairs. A store with exclusive clients and intentionally discreet.

"No retail, no storefronts, there's no advertising, they do it privately so something like this doesn't happen," says Steffner.

Workers inside heard the gunshots, but never expected to see the victim turn the tables on his attackers. The jeweler pulled his gun and fired, hitting both men. Two escaped as their buddies lay moaning from their injuries. The jeweler's companion tells News Channel 3 that he had no idea he was being followed. Clearly, he's a man who is keenly aware of the dangers of his job.

"He's been doing it 22 years. He was attacked 4 years ago, and he does carry jewelry and things in his car, so that's why he keeps a gun," says Steffner.

Police say the jeweler has a gun permit from Alabama, which carries over to Tennessee, so he was legally carrying his weapon. The crooks were last seen going westbound on Poplar in a white Ford Fusion. People out on the scene say they're just glad the good guy got the upper hand, this time.
Copyright Â© 2009, WREG-TV

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 11:42 am

gyre wrote:Try to start practice outdoors.
The acoustics are always easier.

Get good hearing protection.
I use Leight's Black Leightning with inserts too.
Use that grade or better.
It matters.

The acoustics on a good range are still louder than outside.

Believe me, you're preaching to the choir. One night of drinking beer and shooting guns with some buddies, all without ear protection left me with ringing in my right ear for three months and I'm sure some permanent damage to my hearing.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 12:41 pm

I'm also thinking of the ease of your mother adapting to the noise.

SilverOrange · Post by **SilverOrange** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 1:19 pm

Thanks, good advice. She's pretty excited about the prospect, which is kind of wierd to me, as she's been around guns her whole life but just never got into them. I'll make sure and make it as easy for her as I can.

Absolut Jeenyus · Post by **Absolut Jeenyus** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 7:49 pm

Me baby is a Heckler & Koch .45 USP, Full size... Beautiful.

Absolut Jeenyus · Post by **Absolut Jeenyus** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 7:52 pm

With Cor Bon hollow points. Of course.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:13 am

Charter Arms and Taurus are workable guns.......
one of my early fav was the Charter Arms "bulldog" in .44 sp.
that is a very nice cartridge......similar to the .38 with more stopping power due to heavier projectile and larger caliber. IMHO.
5 shot, so, a little smaller.

I agree, Smith is a great gun. But, I'd bet, especially not using "heavy" loads, the others would be quite servicable.......

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:45 am

Love the HKs.

I talked to Walter Birdsong at length yesterday about the Black-T coating.
I've decided to use that instead of the hard chrome.
It's easier to get a blued gun coated, so I'm changing the order.
The chrome option was only $12 in my case, but the Black-T is very reasonable.
I'm still backordered, so I may not get one in until the primary reason for having it this summer has passed.
So I haven't actually found anything yet, as I'm unwilling to pay the local gouging prices.

The coating is available in green, tan and brown too.
Infra-red blocking is available, but only with a Justice Dept waiver.
Not a law, just.....

I think with HKs. they can coat the plastic too.
They haven't tested Keltecs for this yet though.
There is heat involved.

Absolut Jeenyus · Post by **Absolut Jeenyus** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 4:18 pm

Black-T is sick. HK and Sig are definitely my tip top for handguns. With HK being at the top of that list... I have never had em EVER jam on me, even with reloads... Beautiful piece of BANG BANG and a great bit of recoil, which I dunno about you guys but I get off on that shit... I have also the compact version of the USP .45 which has a bit more recoil to it, and a bit smaller, though it holds only 8 rounds as opposed to the (Cali limit) 10 that the full size holds...

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Mon Jul 13, 2009 11:41 am

I found the 40 kit for my P11.
Reasonable too and porting is available.
I think I can get 357 too.

H.G.Crosby · Post by **H.G.Crosby** » Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:12 pm

size DOES matter...

Apollonaris Zeus · Post by **Apollonaris Zeus** » Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:11 pm

[youtube][/youtube]

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:43 pm

This is the P40 with the larger Springfield XD-40 subcompact.
The Springfield weighs 8 ounces more, or the weight of an empty Keltec 380 added to the P40.
I think the P40 is still the smallest out there.
It has been hard to find.

http://www.lonedarkknight.com/Myguns/XDvsKT.htm

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 4:38 pm

This is another one of those vote sites,,, USA today, I think. It can't hurt.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/quickquest ... up5895.htm

Y'all might have seen this before but;

Subject: Fw: Guns vs. Women

Subject: Guns vs. Women

Top 10 Reasons Men Prefer Guns Over Women #10. You can trade an old 44 for a new 22.
#9. You can keep one gun at home and have another for when you're on the road.
#8. If you admire a friend's gun and tell him so, he will probably let you try it out a few times.
#7. Your primary gun doesn't mind if you keep another gun for a backup.
#6. Your gun will stay with you even if you run out of ammo.
#5. A gun doesn't take up a lot of closet space.
#4. Guns function normally every day of the month.
#3 A gun doesn't ask, "Do these new grips make me look fat?"
#2 A gun doesn't mind if you go to sleep after you use it.
And the number one reason a gun is favored over a woman.....
#1 YOU CAN BUY A SILENCER FOR A GUN!!!!

It's still funny

Absolut Jeenyus · Post by **Absolut Jeenyus** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 5:06 pm

Hey gyre, do you know anything about the HK rifles at all? Specifically the ones I'm looking at are the SL8-6 .223 Remmy, and the USC .45 ACP. I have shot the USC once, and it was nice, but I haven't shot the SL8-6 and Im trying to get some opinions on em before I purchase. I really want to get more into rifles but most people I shoot with are all about handguns.

They are beautiful rifles.
USC

SL8-6