sand flames

moesgurlie · Post by **moesgurlie** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:12 pm

last year there was this fire, not only did it feel good more than once i thought it was pretty cool. it was , if i remember right, a large round steel or metal container and it was filled with sand. the flames came up thru the sand or burned on top of the sand, whichever i thought it was pretty cool. does anyone know anything about this? i would love to have one of these at our camp.
thanks sharon aka brc optical camp
im thinking some kind of propane maybe.

Post by **AntiM** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:01 pm

I don't know if these are available commercially. There was something similar at our regional, a zen sand garden on a table, full of glass "rocks" and fire sand. Propane, yes. What was cool was there were rakes and scoops so you could make patterns in it.

My pics aren't good, I'll ask genius to post a better one.

phil · Post by **phil** » Tue Aug 18, 2009 10:12 pm

Obligatory flickr link: http://www.flickr.com/photos/civex/3735988523/

Lots of people do it. This is Dodger's at the Fire Arts Festival in Oakland, but Pyroboy does one, too.

You get a big washtub and bend a pipe in circles. Punch holes in the pipe, put it in the bottom of the washtub with a rubber hose running to it, fill it with sand or cat litter, turn on the gas, and light the gas. You can see the components in the photo - look on the flickr page for bigger photos.

Good luck and have fun.

sun4all · Post by **sun4all** » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:09 pm

Jon Sarriugarte, an Oakland,CA artist makes them:

http://www.formandreform.com/wordpress/?page_id=143

Absolut Jeenyus · Post by **Absolut Jeenyus** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 3:26 am

This?

Its called The Flaming Zen Garden.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 6:56 pm

I saw one with glass feeding the flame.

Ranger Genius · Post by **Ranger Genius** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 8:36 pm

TomServo · Post by **TomServo** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:08 pm

Just a thought...adding powdered copper or some other element, to create colored flames? I know copper turns fire green...lost my list of fire effects, but saw. It done a few years ago. Damned impressive!

Dustdevil · Post by **Dustdevil** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:23 pm

Wally Glenn, AKA Pyro Boy has been bringing Flaming Zen Gardens to BM and other events for many years. To color his I use several different chemicals. Green works well using boric acid, (ant & roach powder from Home Depot), red is best done with Lithium Chloride. Blue is difficult as a chlorine donor is required and the by products are a little nasty. We also add -100 to 325 mesh Titanium sponge. This gives a long lasting sparkle effect when the sand is stirred. Lavendar can be created with Potassium Iodide, but it is very subtle. Orange requires calcium chloride and yellow is sodium chloride. Most of the above are salts and none of them produce any noxious vapors unless you add a chlorine donor such as muriatic acid or perchlorethylene. The red is a deep color and is really stunning. We generally use the blue only with ghost mines as the vapors go way above the heads of the audience. You might have seen some of our blue coloring during the Gothic Rocket Lift-Off. We shot a ring of blue mines mid show.

Ranger Genius · Post by **Ranger Genius** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:46 pm

You might have seen some of our blue coloring during the Gothic Rocket Lift-Off. We shot a ring of blue mines mid show.

You mean these?

Looks like some titanium shavings were employed there, too.

First of my photos to be converted over from RAW. Going to have to do lots of dust deletion. Cleaned my sensor without making a reference frame. Oops.

Dustdevil · Post by **Dustdevil** » Fri Sep 11, 2009 8:36 am

Exactly. We add titanium sponge to the black powder lifter charges. We have mixed feelings about using the Ti. A couple of us feel the sparkle detracts from the color effect, but the Ti serves another purpose. The sparkling bits burn very hot and assist in complete combustion of the fuel. That prevents raindown of unburned fuel on the audience. That we feel is more important than a pure color effect.

**burn** · Post by **burn** » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:01 am

Dustdevil wrote:That prevents raindown of unburned fuel on the audience. That we feel is more important than a pure color effect.

Which I appreciate! Got rained on at Shiva Vista - it was worth it for the front row seat.

Ranger Genius · Post by **Ranger Genius** » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:43 am

I've seen magnesium shavings used too. Then your sparkles are just a nice pure white.

Dustdevil · Post by **Dustdevil** » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:56 am

We do not use Ti shavings. We are using Ti sponge. Each granual looks like a tiny sponge under a microscope. The problem with mag is that it burns too fast for what we are using it for. The flash effect is useful in many applications, but a longer burn works better for ignition purposes. Also, Ti won't flash back like magnesium will. The Ti shavings will work as will Ti spheres, but the sponge is the best for easy ignition.