about the power plant

[theCryptofishist]

No Action Alternative
The Council on Environmental Quality's (CEQ) regulations require that an agency ``include the alternative of no action'' as one of the alternatives it considers, 40 CFR 1502.14(d). For DOE and BLM, ``no action'' means neither of the proposed transmission lines would be constructed and the environmental impacts associated with their construction and operation would not occur. In the case of Sempra, lack of the requested transmission line would preclude the powerplant from operating because there would be no delivery path for the electricity generated. Similarly, in the case of Intergen, as discussed more fully in the Draft EIS, only a portion of the electricity generated inside Mexico would have been available to be transmitted to the United States because of powerplant design. One of Intergen's generating units designated for export to the United States would be connected solely to the proposed transmission line. Its other generating unit designated for export to the United States normally would be connected to the proposed transmission line but also could be connected to other transmission lines within Mexico for export to the United States over an existing international transmission line. If the permit is denied, the electricity produced by the generating unit connected solely to the proposed transmission line would not have a transmission path.
The Draft EIS analyzes the potential environmental effects, or impacts, of Sempra and Intergen constructing and operating the proposed transmission lines. CEQ's regulations require that an EIS contain a description of the environmental effects (both positive and negative) of the proposed alternatives. The regulations also distinguish between direct and indirect effects (40 CFR 1508.. Direct effects are caused by an action and occur at the same time and place as the action. Indirect effects are reasonably foreseeable effects caused by the action that occur later in time or farther in distance. Both direct and indirect effects are addressed in the Draft EIS. CEQ's regulations also require that an EIS contain a description of the cumulative impacts of the proposed alternatives (40 CFR 1508.7). CEQ's regulations define cumulative impacts as those that result from the incremental impact of an action when added to other past, present, and reasonably foreseeable future actions, regardless of what agency or person undertakes such other actions. Cumulative impacts are addressed in the Draft EIS.
The Draft EIS presents information on the potential environmental effects of the construction and subsequent operation of the transmission lines on land use and recreation, visual resources, biological resources, cultural resources, socioeconomics, geology and soils, water resources, air quality, noise, human health and environment, infrastructure, transportation, and minority and low income populations. The Draft EIS also includes a Floodplains andWetlands Assessment, in accordance with E.O. 11988, Floodplain Management, and E.O. 11990, Protection of Wetlands.

Availability of the Draft EIS

DOE has distributed copies of the Draft EIS to appropriate Members of Congress, state and local government officials in California, American Indian tribal governments, and other Federal agencies, groups, and interested parties. Copies of the document may be obtained by contacting DOE as provided in the section of this notice entitled
ADDRESSES. Copies of the Draft EIS and supporting documents are also available for inspection at the locations identified below:
1. U.S. Department of Energy, Freedom of Information Reading Room, Room 1E-190, Forrestal Building, 1000 Independence Avenue, SW., Washington, DC.
2. Bureau of Land Management, El Centro Field Office, 1661 South 4th Street, El Centro, California.
Comments on the Draft EIS may be submitted to Mrs. Russell (see ADDRESSES, above) or provided at the public hearings (see DATES, above). After the public comment period ends on June 30, 2004, DOE and BLM will consider all comments received, revise the Draft EIS as appropriate, and issue a Final EIS. DOE and BLM will consider the Final EIS, along with other information, such as electric reliability and national policy factors, in deciding whether or not to issue Presidential permits or right-of-way grants.

Issued in Washington, DC, this 5th day of May, 2004.
Anthony J. Como,
Deputy Director, Electric Power Regulation, Office of Coal and Power Import/Export, Office of Coal and Power Systems, Office of Fossil Energy.
[FR Doc. 04-10656 Filed 5-10-04; 8:45 am]
BILLING CODE 6450-01-P

http://www.epa.gov/fedrgstr/EPA-IMPACT/ ... i10656.htm

[Badger]

Where the coal source?

Ever heard of Wyoming? Most likely the subbituminous fields out there will provide the primary source. Traditionally conisdered a dirtier coal than the bituminous beds associated with the east because they have a lower carbon content.

[Maia]

My husband says,,, Typically under the gravels in the grabens lies glacial water, prehistoric water, lots off it, They plan to drill, draw and recharge... Squaw is not actually offensive indian nomenclature but comes from duck hunting... When one shoots a duck it begins to saa Squawk!!! but dies before it gets the k and exclamation points out,,, so all one hears is Squaw.... It is a common misconception that it has to do with female indians....

[Bob]

Source?

Union Pacific RR, I'd think.

[Badger]

My husband says,,, Typically under the gravels in the grabens lies glacial water, prehistoric water, lots off it, They plan to drill, draw and recharge...

Also referred to as fossil water. Usually pretty damn pure as it suggests that the water has not seen the surface since lat it lay there. Nor has it recycled in any way since it drained into the basin. Hell, with enough creativity and marketing savvy someone could make a fortune pumping and bottling the stuff.

Your husband is pretty much on-target with his take on things. I imagine there is a damn huge aquifer below Lahanton with plenty of water to draw from. As I've mentioned several times before on this board that there are at least three spots on the main playa where the sediments in the primary graben extend down 7000 meters although no coal company that I know of wants to foot the bill for drilling a 7 kilometer well for water.

[Maia]

out in Nevada are pretty deep, but 3,000 gallons a minute is not unusual.. Get yourself 30 flat acres,, put in a well, a pivot system, you can gross, 30,000 an acre on high nitrogen alfalfa the California Dairymen pay a premium for, Beats working for a living. We are actually going to move one of these days to a valley and grow alfalfa and taters... Ric grew up a farmer he misses it, and whacking people on the head for a living is getting old...

[Apollonaris Zeus]

I still don't think that there is a major dependable 18,000 GPM source. The bedrock in that area looks very shallow making the tapping into vast undergound of ancient lake lahontan questionable. It would may have to relying on Squaw Creek (duck pussy, yeah) and that might more unreliable than the surmerged lake flows of the Black Rock. What ever the price of drilling, pumping, washing, cleaning and if so repumping the water- whats left of it for there won't be much after all the evaporation is not going to be cost effective. Add that the coal if its coming from WY is going to be very expensive to ship and the plant will be fighting the rising cost of supply and demand of the coal!

And time is running out!

We're building alot of powerplants here in montana and WY and not only those but the wind mill farms are going up here and in North and South dakota. these buggers are the future of electric production. So the electric high rates of our time may not be there for long. The production cost for building a plant in the Black Rock Desert will be the deciding factor.

I still see it as a speculators dream- "Death Valley and the Amargosa" all over again.

Have any one ever read that book. Its great! Every one should should read it right along with Cadillac Desert- The real desert guides of the West!

But if you want more emotional grabing headlines go with this:

Oh you stinking environmentalists!

How could you have brought up that the Squaw Creek is a major headwater recharging source for pyramid lake. Its depletion would drastically reduce the flow to the lake increasing the salinity therefore killing the endangered trout populations and brown pelican nesting site on pyramid lake.

There you are one for those money bankers and the other for the environmental activists.

Good Luck

where do you want me to send my Review Letter to Go:

A II Z

[Maia]

Trainloads of coal head west everyday over the tracks,, either there is a coal fired plant in California, or the coal is going to our asian brethren. I think the shipping costs of coal are pretty low.

The water is what may sink the project, although there is more water than many think, but perhaps not as much as some believe. There is a ranch in the Smoke Creek Desert that is no longer habitable as there is a foot of water in all the buildings... How did that happen? Las Vegas believes there is a huge aquifer in north central Nevada that will take care of their needs. Texas Spring in Death Vally is a 3,000-+ spring that drains out of the test site,, which is handy, you can find the water in the dark....

Squaw Creek feeding Pyramid? Where did that come from?

[theCryptofishist]

I have heard from someone I consider a reliable source that the Notice I posted yesterday reguarding another Sempra project has an interesting history. Apparently, an attempt to file only an EA was made and they had to be sued into filing an EIS. The project is supposedly already up and running, so this is all very after the fact, but it seems to me that if the push for the EA came from Sempra instead of thier partner, that--in the right hands--could be used as a goad or a weapon to make sure that they are on better behavior with the local plant.

[theCryptofishist]

The state of Nevada will require a mix of alternative energy sources in the future, and Nye County hopes to become a major producer of green power. The hope is that light industry will move to the county because of the availability of low-cost and environmentally friendly energy sources. These new companies will help support the economy of the county, which has suffered from the boom-bust effects of mineral mining and defense activities over the years.

http://makeashorterlink.com/?F3DC52A58

[Apollonaris Zeus]

Squaw Creek feeding Pyramid? Where did that come from?

The Smoke desert is only separated from the pyramid about a hundred feet or more gravel. I am not sure about it but there may be underground channels connecting the two.

A II Z

[Maia]

The closest point between the 4,000 foot level of Pyramid and the 4,000 foot level of the Smoke Creek desert is about 5 miles, 4.918. The ridge between the two points is 4800 feet. The lowest point between the the Smoke Creek and Pyramid is Emerson pass, but the distance there is 8 miles. The 4,000 foot level is near the historic level of the lake. Currently the lake level is nearer 3600. Concievably there could be drainage from the Smoke Creek Desert to Pyramid, except for the geology of the intervening range.

Historically there was overflow from Pyramid to Winnemucca Lake (that is the large playa in the right, which you pass on the way to desecrate the Black Rock Desert). In fact there is a boat on Winnemucca Lake. Sarah Winnemucca as an infant was a survivor of a massacre by US forces while camped at a fishing camp on the lake.

Derby Dam wiped out Winnemucca Lake, and the Pyramid Lahonton Cuthroat trout.

[theCryptofishist]

A new wave of Yucca Mountain preparation is starting.

http://www.epa.gov/fedrgstr/EPA-IMPACT/ ... i11569.htm





(btw--ever wonder if rexanon would be quite so supportive of nuclear power if his sacred spot was Yucca instead of BRD?)

[Badger]

A new wave of Yucca Mountain preparation is starting.

Finally.

[Apollonaris Zeus]

The closest point between the 4,000 foot level of Pyramid and the 4,000 foot level of the Smoke Creek desert is about 5 miles, 4.918. The ridge between the two points is 4800 feet. The lowest point between the the Smoke Creek and Pyramid is Emerson pass, but the distance there is 8 miles. The 4,000 foot level is near the historic level of the lake. Currently the lake level is nearer 3600. Concievably there could be drainage from the Smoke Creek Desert to Pyramid, except for the geology of the intervening range.

Historically there was overflow from Pyramid to Winnemucca Lake (that is the large playa in the right, which you pass on the way to desecrate the Black Rock Desert). In fact there is a boat on Winnemucca Lake. Sarah Winnemucca as an infant was a survivor of a massacre by US forces while camped at a fishing camp on the lake.

Derby Dam wiped out Winnemucca Lake, and the Pyramid Lahonton Cuthroat trout.

The historical 4,000 foot lakeshore is still above Emerson Pass at 3,980'. It is quite conceivable that during the last pleistocene ice age that a river ran throught it carving a deep gorge that is now covered by hundreds of feet of alluvium deposited since that period. It is through that buried gorge a surmerged river now flows fed not only by the underground river from the Black Rock other sources north, but also Honey lake and the many springs coming from the sierra mtns.

I offer this as an argument for your purpose to protect the Granites from the power plant. Use it if you wish.

A II Z

PS- When I go to desecrate the Black Rock, I do so from the east or north and not from the west or the long route from Winnemucca!

[Badger]

It is through that buried gorge a surmerged river now flows fed not only by the underground river from the Black Rock other sources north,

...Use it if you wish.

I'll pass. Although creative in its imagining, the science suggests nothing even remotely similar to what you're suggesting.

[Maia]

The De Lorme CD I used is in accurate, obviously the historic level of Pyramid would have to be lower than Emerson Pass or it Pyramid would have had an outlet there.. the historic level was closer to 3600..

Consider that Pyramid, Smoke Creek and the Black Rock desert are all lake bottom of Lahonton, the chance of stream flow of any significance through the pass area is minimal, the chance of erosional fill is minimal,, Lake Lahontan has not been gone that long.. There were people living along its shores.. There is a great slump that closed off High Rock lake's outlet, that was a huge earthquake slump north of the Black Rock,, but that was 11,000 BP

[Apollonaris Zeus]

"The De Lorme CD I used is in accurate, obviously the historic level of Pyramid would have to be lower than Emerson Pass or it Pyramid would have had an outlet there.. the historic level was closer to 3600.."

Historical is just a temporary state of the past. We thinking over a 10,000 year period here. A time then Glaciers poured almost into the basins from the Sierras and Granites and the alluvium was thousands of feet shallower. A Time when there was a great lake covering all of the basins. As they were filling up and when they were one lake to when the water levels were dropping water was flowing all though the that canyon where emerson pass is up until the last several thousand years.

Since I won't be back in that area until BM, you will have to some field research. You can start right where you are near Girl-lack. Look on the permanent slopes around the lower parts of the mountain side for ancient shorelines. You may have notice them and know what they are, but look for step like formations. Tufas are the other formations to look for. They can only form underwater, but they need a salty solution to form in and the waters of lake Lohantan were fresher then the waters of today's Lake Pyramid. So if you see Tufa formation they will be below the lakeshore formations. So I must contradict you when you claim that the historical elevation of Lake pyramid was 3600 because it's 3800 today and it was over 4400 within the last several thousand years because Anaho Island is at least that high. The largest Tufa formation in north america that I know of. So the Lake's salty period is relatively recent. And Lake Lahontan could have been near 5,000 feet.

Pyramid Lake is now about 100 feet lower then then the Smoke Desert, but its bottom is much lower then the 3800+ Smoke and the water is going to flow in that direction which is way there is water in the pyramid!

Look on emerson pass for water erosion, but that too may have eroded away. I think the alluvial deposits there are over several hundred feet deep.

So who do I send the letter about the Plant to?

A II Z

I

PS- Yes I too use the DeLorme Topos. I think they're great!

[Apollonaris Zeus]

Coal-fired plant looms over Black Rock Desert
Insane is the best way to describe one of the newest threats to Nevada's wild places. SEMPRA Energy is proposing a huge coal fired power plant at the base of the Black Rock Desert. Former Nevada Governor Bob List is one of SEMPRA's lobbyists hoping to shaft Nevadans. Nevadans would get polluted skies and used up water while southern California would get the power. Ironically, the first step to approve the coal power plant is proving that the air is clean and clear enough to allow the dirty plant. If built, winds would spew this pollution over the Black Rock Desert-High Rock Canyon National Conservation Area and wilderness areas and forever harm the awesome vistas. This region was given protection in 2000 by Congress for its beauty and nationally significant historic, prehistoric and wilderness values.

In April, the Washoe County Planning Commission and County Commissioners gave the OK for a 650 foot air monitoring tower to be built. Shaaron Netherton, Executive Director of Friends of Nevada Wilderness testified at the County Commissioner hearing and presented 110 letters from folks opposed to the air monitoring tower and power plant. "We will continue working with other groups and local residents to fight this proposal every step," she vowed.

What can you do? Visit our website at www.nevadawilderness.org to learn more or call us at (775) 324-7667 for more detailed fact sheets. Write the Washoe County Commission at
Washoe County Commission
PO Box 11130
Reno, Nevada 89520
FAX: (775) 328-2037
Email: Go to www.co.washoe.nv.us and click on "Contact Us" for an email form.
Let them know you are totally opposed to this proposed Grantite-Fox Coal Fired Plant.

[Apollonaris Zeus]

What happened to this proposal?

Green power threatens the Black Rock
by Jane Braxton Little

A proposed geothermal plant in a newly protected Nevada desert sparks a fight

History buffs and environmentalists fought for 40 years to safeguard the stark desert landscape of northwestern Nevada and the emigrant trails that cross it. In December, they finally succeeded, winning legislative protection for 1.2 million acres of federal land 100 miles north of Reno.

But their celebration was short-lived. Less than a month after Congress approved the Black Rock Desert-High Rock Canyon Emigrant Trails National Conservation Area, a new fight erupted over a proposal to build a power plant in the heart of the unspoiled region.

Rancher John Estill wants to construct a geothermal power plant that would produce energy by pumping hot water from deep beneath the earth’s surface. Typical geothermal plants involve one or more multi-story buildings, surrounded by a tangle of pipes and cooling towers. Estill says his 120 acres near Double Hot Springs could produce as much as 300 megawatts of electricity - enough to supply a city of 300,000 houses. The electricity would be used to prevent energy shortages like the one now crippling California, he says.

In a Jan. 14 letter to California Gov. Gray Davis and Nevada Gov. Kenny Guinn, Estill offered to assign half the royalties to California if state officials assist in developing the geothermal energy.

The idea of a power plant at Double Hot Springs, with electrical transmission lines crossing the Black Rock Desert, appalls Chuck Dodd, a member of the Oregon-California Trails Association who spent a decade working for protections. Congress created the national conservation area (NCA) to preserve the vistas the pioneers saw when they traveled through the region to California between 1846 and the 1860s, he says.

"Congress said, ’Don’t screw around with that place.’ Anything that does would be disastrous," Dodd says.

"The NCA world"
The conservation area, at least 30 miles from a paved road, is stunningly spare, a remnant of the ancient Lake Lahontan, which extended from central Nevada north to the Oregon border and west into northeastern California. Remote, rugged and inaccessible much of the year, it features vast canyons, mountain crags and North America’s biggest ephemeral desert lake, or playa. The landscape is largely unchanged since the days of the pioneers. The immigrants who crossed it on the Applegate-Lassen Trail left wagon ruts and historic inscriptions still visible today.

In December, Congress protected the last nationally significant segments of the California emigrant trails. It also established safeguards for the endangered desert dace, a fish that lives in the fragile desert springs, and other threatened species unique to the area. The legislation also preserves the area’s views of austere peaks and sage-covered washes more than 50 miles away.

Around 120 miles of emigrant trails - from Rye Patch Reservoir through the Black Rock Desert, Fly and High Rock canyons - are within the national conservation area. In addition, Congress created 10 wilderness areas surrounding portions of the trail. The federal Bureau of Land Management manages the entire area.

The land Estill bought five years ago is along the emigrant trail near the southern boundary. The adjacent federal land is not wilderness but part of the 795,000 acres designated for more flexible conservation management. Because it is private property, Estill is not bound by any of the regulations restricting activities within the NCA, says Rich Hoops, a BLM official who specializes in geothermal issues.

"He is free to do what he wants on his private land," Hoops says.

Estill has not requested a drilling permit from the Nevada Division of Minerals. Although that would be the first step "in the real world," this is "the NCA world," he says. He is first pursuing BLM rights-of-way permits for power lines carrying the electricity he hopes to generate from the geothermal plant to a major transmission line 30 miles away.

BLM officials have just begun developing a new management plan for the NCA and have not yet adopted regulations for aboveground transmission lines, Hoops says. Under the current plan, however, aboveground transmission lines are prohibited.

Estill considers that an encroachment on his private property rights.

"If I can’t get power out, that obviously diminishes my land as an owner. Most people agree that’s a ’taking’ of my private property rights," he says.
Help from the state
Estill is optimistic that Gale Norton, the newly appointed secretary of the Interior, will loosen the restrictions. Norton has said she will consider softening or eliminating protections for the national monuments designated by the Clinton administration. Estill hopes her review will include the Black Rock National Conservation Area.

"With all the power demands we face, it would be foolish not to utilize this resource," Estill says. "Geothermal energy is, after all, the only 100 percent green energy. You pump the hot water out, put cold water back, and it just keeps on running - self-sustaining forever."

His project has the support of the Nevada Division of Minerals, says John Snow, state geothermal programs manager. If test wells prove the resource is worth developing, state officials say they’ll help Estill find a way to do it.

"What’s unfortunate from a geothermal standpoint is that this renewable resource is on private property that is now landlocked by the NCA," Snow says. Nevada now generates about 200 megawatts of electricity from geothermal plants - less than 4 percent of the state’s total electricity supply.

The environmentalists and history buffs who supported the federal legislation are not opposed to geo-thermal energy, says Marge Sill, a spokeswoman for the Reno-based Toiyabe Chapter of the Sierra Club. "We welcome it - just not in the middle of the Black Rock National Conservation Area," she says.

Sill and others have questioned why Estill, who opposed the legislation, did nothing to develop his geothermal resource prior to the NCA approval by Congress.

If Estill wins the permits he needs to start construction, he could have his Double Hot Springs geothermal power plant up and running within a year, he says. Though he has written to both state governors for help, he has not yet received a reply.

Jane Braxton Little is a freelance writer based in Plumas County, Calif.

You can contact ...

* Jo Simpson, Bureau of Land Management, Office of Communications, Reno, Nev., 775/861-6586;
* Marge Sill, Toiyabe Chapter of the Sierra Club, Reno, Nev., 775/322-2867;
* John Estill, Estill Ranches, LLC, Likely, Calif., 530/233-4819.

[Maia]

John Estill and Rich Hoops, quoted in the article are people I know. Estill would like that power plant, BLM won't let him run power lines.. Since his plan calls for a large structure built right upon the Lassen Applegate trail, on a section largely unchanged since the emigrants passed through, he is unlikely to get permits.

The structure would be as obtrusive as the coal fired plant.. just no smoke.. As of 10,000 BP Lahontan was at its height, the people living along its shore left remnants. Google 'Spirit Cave Man' He was wear woven clothing, and appears structurally not to be related to indians.. He is thought to be similar to the Ainu of Japan. He has been dated to 9,600BP

I would have to walk Emerson Pass, to look at possible erosion, don't know when I would get there though.. There are bench beaches all over the area...

[Apollonaris Zeus]

Maia, I've sent the letter to your County board. Hope it adds some weight
against the coal plant.

I've been to Double Hot Springs it would be a good source of a geothermal plant just a poor location though.

Glad that the Geothermal Plant is history.

It seems that the reason for placing the coal fired plant there is the power line (which seems to originate from the Dalles Dam on the Columbia), railroad line and the possibility of a dependable water source.

Why haven't they proposed building it next to I80. There's a railroad track there as well as a powerline. Is it because the water source would basically be the abused Humbolt river?

Would like to meet you and Ranger sometime and explore the granites and other areas you spoke so highly about! Could that be possible?

A II Z

[Maia]

Hard to figure why Sempra chose that location. The Humboldt basin contains Valmy, currently northern Nevada's largest power plant, coal fired, the Truckee Basin contains Tracy another coal plant.. I think that the overall plan is to pave the west with coal plants... deranged.

Good letter... Thanks,

[Maia]

or not to meet, that is the question,, to give up the anonyminous asshole, Grinch and become a real person, likable, entertaining,, don't know if I could handle that....

[Apollonaris Zeus]

or not to meet, that is the question,, to give up the anonyminous asshole, Grinch and become a real person, likable, entertaining,, don't know if I could handle that....

I can keep a secret!

Perhaps the reason they want the plant there is because the air is clean enough to be polluted, whereas, there may be too many plants already polluting the Humbolt valley to prevent it from gaining a permit!

I don't take your defense of your backyard personally like many people do on this thread! Because I'm very defensive of my Montana backyard can empathize with you- hey its the Big Sky State not the Pig Sty State!

I think things will turn out for the better. BM maynot be the greatist thing to happen to the Black Rock, but its alot more positive then the past abuses. There are alot voices here that can help you stop the that plant, but the anti-BM wasn't the way to go about it. Alot of money is being pumped into that region from BM that should be better applied to restoring sections of the abused Black Rock then padding the law agencies and other excessive expenses!

A II Z

PS- the Cave Spirit Man was a good turn on, thanks!

[Maia]

Gawd,, next thing, TechnoNicole will want to come along and go camping in beautiful places too...

[Badger]

Hard to figure why Sempra chose that location. The Humboldt basin contains Valmy, currently northern Nevada's largest power plant, coal fired, the Truckee Basin contains Tracy another coal plant..

Agreed. Valmy has everything it needs to operate. Can't see what the problm would be for a second plant to utlize the same reasource.

[Tancorix]

While it's not the Nevada powerplant issue, these sorts of things can be fought against. We're having our own regional battle in Missouri and it's getting some good press coverage.
http://www.pitch.com/issues/2004-07-08/feature.html