Bike Security

Elorrum · Post by **Elorrum** » Sat Nov 14, 2009 8:56 pm

Elliot wrote: I'm saving myself for the Saddle That Rises As You Pedal.

OMG! some sort of jack screw? I confess I haven't been thinking of this for a while. I did find my chopper bike to have a steeper learning curve than I expected. with narrow handlebars it would be in the untamed range for steering, as it does not track like a regular bike. how about half a handlebar?

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sat Nov 14, 2009 9:09 pm

Some chopper motorcycles are technically unridable. That is, you have to force it to go straight. Probably not so much any more, with better knowledge of steering geometry, but "in the old days" there were some wicked ones.

Yes, screw jack in the seat tube. I have set aside a Gary Fisher for it, because it already has a sprung (telescoping) seat stem. But I have not looked at the details yet. I figure screw from automobile scissor jack (or all-thread), bevel gears from lawn tractor differential. Entirely doable, and totally invisible. Definitely a Bait Bike, but fun in the Corral also.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:48 pm

All right, here is the Parallell Pedals bike. I have toe clips for it, for the up-stroke.

We ought to try this at 90 degrees also, for that Harley Davidson rythm. May not need toe clips that way.

When we get bored with it, it becomes a normal bicycle in two minutes flat. It's dusty but stored dry and generally undamaged.

Meanwhile, this Magna Great Divide (I think it said) is assigned to the Wild Bike Corral.

Elorrum · Post by **Elorrum** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 4:18 pm

parallel pedals as a bait bike... it would be funny to see somebody looking at those pedals.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 4:53 pm

Yes, but I doubt we would get to catch him red-handed in the act of stealing.

Now.... The Gary Fisher is safe for the moment, because the suspension seat post has only an inch or two of movement. So I'll us some other bike. Here are most of the key parts:

Three piece crank (only one crank arm present), bevel gears from a lawn tractor, all-thread, telescoping sizes of square tubing (sorry about the rust on one of them.) The one important piece not in the picture is the nut for the all-thread.

This is going to take some time, and probably machine-work. But I think you can see the potensial?

penguin · Post by **penguin** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 5:36 pm

Now if only there was a way to not only raise the seat, but also raise the handlebars and the pedals at the same time -- I could just see it now; go tearing off across the playa and the next thing you know you're five feet up in the air!

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 7:47 pm

That shouldn't be all that difficult -- just make the whole bicycle like one big scissor mechanism. Starts low with long wheelbase and ends up tall with short wheelbase. But we would need a large swimming pool (or some such) for the victim to dismount into!

Deb Prothero · Post by **Deb Prothero** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 8:33 pm

This is the best thread on eplaya. Although I don't always comprehend exactly how you are accomplishing things, I appreciate the ingenuity involved.

penguin · Post by **penguin** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:17 pm

Elliot wrote:
That shouldn't be all that difficult -- just make the whole bicycle like one big scissor mechanism. Starts low with long wheelbase and ends up tall with short wheelbase. But we would need a large swimming pool (or some such) for the victim to dismount into!

Hehe, might actually be more fun in the reverse -- make for a rude stop when the pedals dig into the ground!

Okay my next silly idea: rather than the slowly rising seat, put a fairly stiff spring in the seat tube -- keep it compressed with a release trigger connected to the brake lever....

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:17 pm

Thanks, Deb! What tipped you off to this alleged ingenuity thing... my avatar?

Gotta have some fun in this world!

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:27 pm

Penguin: An ejection seat is a fine idea. Triggering it with a front brake lever is evil genious at its best!

But seriously, this is a "not-a-survivable-incident" kind'a thang. Internal injuries stuff.

That said.... We DO have plans for ejection seats on a Kinetic Racing Skulpture, to be deployed on water, in front of hundreds of Glorious Spectators. But that will not happen for at least a couple more years.

Elorrum · Post by **Elorrum** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 4:29 pm

oh penguin. you are one devious flightless bird. I could barely stifle a maniacle chuckle at the image of the brake lever launching the rider off. Some of these ideas should be a Rube Goldberg poster.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:54 pm

Only mildly off topic -- since I lost track of the bike maintenance thread:

I bought a metric wrench set the other day; 8 mm thru 17 mm. But there were no 9 mm, 11 mm or 16 mm. I figured there must be some Geneva Convention eliminating those sizes from all use. Not so. To work on bicycles you can expect to need the 9 mm wrench! Don't seem to have any immediate use for 11 and 16, but I suggest... do not buy a wrench set with any size skipped. Likely to be "false economy".

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:18 pm

5/8" = 15.9 mm.

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 4:35 pm

One can always fail to mantain proper torque on the bolt that holds the seat to the seat post, such that the seat has worn thin and weak. Too much weight on the seat may cause it to be punctured by the seat post....

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 5:12 pm

Elliot wrote: I bought a metric wrench set the other day; 8 mm thru 17 mm. But there were no 9 mm, 11 mm or 16 mm. I figured there must be some Geneva Convention eliminating those sizes from all use.

Actually it's the Warsaw Convention, as demonstrated by typical commie ineptitude.

Be very, very quiet. I'm hunting commies! Let's look under the bed.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:23 pm

15.88mm actually.

0.75 " = 19.05 mm

penguin · Post by **penguin** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:42 pm

Okay, going back to the original idea of security..

Replace the rear tire and tube with a (I dunno) mile of thin substance (rubber/cloth/whatever). As the person rides away the "bread crumb" trail is left behind for whomever to follow. If they ride too far the whole thing will unspool and they'll be on the rim and would probably just dump the bike at that point.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:12 am

Fun idea, but I don't know how I would time the "fuse".

I DO have an idea for the material: a solid rubber tire -- if we could come up with a way to slice it into a long thin ribbon. That way it would look like a real tire when lightly glued back together. Butcher shop meat slicer? I do have such a tire around here somewhere.

Now.... A new idea.... How do we create a small amount of fire when a bike begins moving? Just enough fire to light a string of firecrackers.
....
....
I think I know, but I'm keeping it to myself.

(And I have a way to contain the moop while allowing combustion pressure to escape.) Have a couple of bricks of firecrackers also, around here somewhere.

Does anyone know how much of a fireball would result if a disposable cigarette lighter ("Bic"?) were to go off, all at once? Can they be deliberately drained to near empty and still work reliably?

My new shop is almost finished, and it is fireproof, outside and inside.

penguin · Post by **penguin** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:53 am

Bic lighters exploding - bad things

As to lighting a fuse, can think of several off the top of my head. But, rather than a string of firecrackers; how about a balloon filled with flash powder attached under the seat...

Fire_Moose · Post by **Fire_Moose** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:02 pm

i throw disposable lighters into fire pits all the time, just a fun little pop

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:53 pm

NOW NOW boys,

NO Bic lighters.. That makes "shrapnel" and much crying and nashing of teeth..

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:19 pm

A flash powder pop is good and well, but two seconds later nobody can tell where it came from. So I was thinking more like a sustained barrage of crackling. Maybe 10 seconds -- enough to draw attention from all directions. Combine this with a bike that will roll only so far before grinding to a halt, and we'd really have something.

For ignition, a rifle cartridge primer might work. A .22 shell with the bullet removed? Just stuff the fuse in where the powder was, and the primer compound should light it. Starter-pistol shell?
I've been thinking a match and a rubber band or some such, but that does not seem very reliable. We would need something very safe, yet sure to throw a good spark or small flame. The idea is to let the weight of the rider on the saddle trigger it inside the bike frame. (Yes, the frame would have to be well vented. No problem -- I can "swiss cheese" a frame.)

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:27 pm

Jon is right. No shrapnel. The idea is to contain it all inside a sleeve of steel mesh, inside the well-ventilated bike frame.

ibdave · Post by **ibdave** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:35 pm

How about one of the bike light generator that when you walk away from the bike you set it to turn and have the generator wired to the handle bars for a little jolt..( I have no idea of the juicing powers those little bike light set put out) Then the joy rider would let go of the bars, and well you know what might happen... Yes??

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:54 pm

Hmmm... Yes... The perp would go ass-over-applecart to the ground, break his neck, sue everybody in sight, and The Burning Man Art Festival would cease to exist.

If we could be reasonably sure to limit it to the tail-over-teakettle-to-the-ground part, I'd be all for it.

penguin · Post by **penguin** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:25 pm

For "fuse" lighting I was thinking a rocket igniter, a charged up capacitor and a switch tripped by some action.

Actually rather than the firecrackers, you need to stuff the frame with bacon, after the fuse lights the bacon would start to sizzle and you'd have people coming from everywhere following the smell!

(whodathunk, bacon as a security device)

penguin · Post by **penguin** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:36 pm

I need someone with more math/physics background to tell me if this would actually work...

Mount a gyroscope to the bike at a 45 degree angle, drive the gryo off of the pedals, the faster you pedal the harder it is to stay upright?

or, how about :

Not that we want to hurt anyone or anything, but, how about mounting a Wimshurst generator to the rear wheel...

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:40 pm

Attack cat in a spring loaded basket.

ibdave · Post by **ibdave** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:47 pm

gyre wrote:Attack cat in a spring loaded basket.

WINNER......CHICKEN DINNER.......