Paper lantern style dome.

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Crimson13
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Paper lantern style dome.

Post by Crimson13 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 12:32 pm

I'm hoping to go to burning man 2010 so, I have been looking at all the burning man pictures I can find and one of the coolest things I keep seeing (camp/structure wise) are the domes!

I know everyone does geo domes, hexayurts, and others like them, but I like to be different and think outside of the box a bit.

From your experience with domes/the playa environment, what do you think about a paper lantern style dome?

The dome would be supported by a pillar with a ring (or what ever shape i decide on) in the middle. Then rings of ascending greater size would hang from the main ring. A pole would also extend above the dome for guy wires and shade material. Once the rings are hanging I would attach some sort of cover (thinking about billboard vinyl). I would also attach my solar panel and vertical access wind turbine that I'm working on to the top ring as well.

The below images are a very rough idea of what i'm thinking.

Image
Image

So do you guys think that it would be stable enough? Would the hanging rings actually "flow" with the wind reducing drag?

Thanks!

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Fire_Moose
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Post by Fire_Moose » Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:32 pm

cool concept. With enough tie down straps as guy lines i would imagine it would hold up....but im not an engineeroligist
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Post by AKAparttime » Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:38 pm

If you do a search of the Burning Man webb page, look for a camp called
Shade Bearers they had a tent conceot similar to your's but had straps
running down from top to bottom, the pole in the middle had cable hoists like a sail boat. 2008 I believe

Crimson13
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Post by Crimson13 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:12 pm

Thanks for the comments!

And thanks AKAparttime, I emailed the head of that camp so I'm hoping they get back to me at some point.

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gyre
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Post by gyre » Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:50 pm

Image
ImageImage

Crimson13
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Post by Crimson13 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:18 pm

Those are sure some interesting and huge domes there gyre.

Unfortunately it doesn't help me much without knowing/seeing how they are built.

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gyre
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Post by gyre » Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:21 pm

I can't find those details.

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Elorrum
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Post by Elorrum » Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:08 pm

I was thinking of jiffy pop popcorn. Thinking about the shape of it, and how it is folded, and how it expands. I haven't gotten to the point of really figuring anything, but it's a nice round dome, and it sure starts off flat. I like the lantern idea. a nearly full sphere?

Image

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:59 pm

I hope that comes together well. I'm sick of geodesic domes, and they have access problems that could be (I think) designed out of existence in your construction.
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Crimson13
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Post by Crimson13 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:46 pm

Elorrum wrote:I was thinking of jiffy pop popcorn. Thinking about the shape of it, and how it is folded, and how it expands. I haven't gotten to the point of really figuring anything, but it's a nice round dome, and it sure starts off flat. I like the lantern idea. a nearly full sphere?

Image
I like the jiffy pop idea! I'm thinking it will either be a hemisphere or soemthing along the lines of 5/8's of a sphere.
theCryptofishist wrote:I hope that comes together well. I'm sick of geodesic domes, and they have access problems that could be (I think) designed out of existence in your construction.
What access problems do you see with geos? And I'll see what I can come up with to solve them.

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Post by gaminwench » Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:20 pm

the triangles in geo domes prohibit wheelchair access...

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Post by gaminwench » Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:20 pm

the triangles in geo domes prohibit wheelchair access...

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Post by robotland » Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:08 am

Then you're not building 'em big enough!

I remove one of the ground ("equator") struts from my PutterDome to allow access from wheelbarrows, lawn tractors and now, since I now own a couple, wheelchairs. Gotta watch yer head on the way in, I'll admit.
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Journeyman
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Post by Journeyman » Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:11 am

Hi. A tip of my hat to Ranger Parttime for the reference to my structure. It is not a dome by any means. It's a... well, it's... a tensile structure, supported by a centerpole, which does indeed have a winch hoist system. Kind of like a pleated teepee with no teepee poles. When erected, it's about 18-1/2 feet high at the center, and 38 feet in diameter, octagonal in footprint. It worked well as an experimental structure for two years, but the gusts of 2008 caused some damage. I had rather expected that eventually, because it was an experiment in tensile design, a step toward the development of a much stronger and larger tensile structure. I built it cheaply, utilizing a standard heavy-duty white poly tarp reinforced with two layers of 500 lb. test poly strapping (the stuff used in palletizing freight). The strapping is applied to both interior and exterior surfaces, and metal crimps hold them in place on each of the sixteen tension lines, running from eight anchor points and eight entry peaks. All tension lines were covered with Gorilla tape, and I cut 48 2-foot round openings in the tarp to let wind spill through. Even with all these holes, the interior remained relatively calm in high winds, due to the baffle effect of the design.
The lessons I learned were instrumental in designing the more durable structure that I hope to set up this year. Plastic deteriorates over time and exposure to UV, and I'm sure that the alkaline dust of the playa accelerates that deterioration. Rather than using poly strapping and one very large plastic tarp, the new incarnation of the structure willl be a framework of tensioned cables, with individual canvas panels filling the spaces between the cable framework.
I like the concept of suspended rings, the Japanese lantern idea, but would suggest adding a few more rings to assist in retaining the shape in playa wind. Your most difficult task in building this is gonna be shaping the cover fabric. Have fun, build it, and I will come. I'll email pictures of my original structure, as I have difficulty in posting pictures here.
Infinity = 1; since 1 / infinity = 1, zero is an absolute impossibility. The reason triangles are so unlike other polygons is that a triangle is part of a polygon bridging two dimensions.

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Post by Crimson13 » Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:16 pm

I'll keep the wheelchair thing in mind when I design the door.

And Journeyman thanks for all the great info and pictures you sent!
There will be more rings that what is shown in the pictures I have up, it will have more of a spherical shape. Granted with this design you could make any shape, cylinder, cube, or pyramid. Those are just something I threw together quickly. The final version will have more rings. I'm thinking of making the hanging rings out of pvc, and the center ring that's attached to the center pole will be steel. What I'm using for connecting the rings to the pole has yet to be determined, but I'll make sure its strong. As far as the cover goes, I was thinking of doing vertical panels that have sleeves every other ring or something. For material for the cover, I hoping to find some billboard vinyl around here to use, if not it will more than likely some sort of canvas or tarp material.

Do you guys think that a 3-sided tv antenna tower would provide enough strength for the center support?

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gyre
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Post by gyre » Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:24 pm

That depends on size.

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Post by zachass » Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:49 pm

As far as the center tower, what stabilizes the base? In-ground or above ground? Whatever method you choose, that's probably the most engineered part of the structure. That thing has to be fairly stable at the top in high winds. Some flex, of course, is expected.
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Post by Bob » Tue Dec 01, 2009 3:12 pm

They use paper for paper lanterns because it stretches to conform to a round shape. Billboard vinyl is designed not to stretch.

No idea what you plan to use for hoops.
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Post by Crimson13 » Sun Dec 06, 2009 8:21 pm

I should have a better model of what I'm thinking in a few days.

Thanks again for everyone's input!

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Post by robotland » Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:32 am

Crimson13 wrote: Do you guys think that a 3-sided tv antenna tower would provide enough strength for the center support?
If it were me, I'd use a solid pole or post buried as deeply as I could manage to help offset the VERY topheavy load. Towers are designed to either have a concrete footing or a bunch of guywires, which would screw with your design.

To keep with the Zen-like paper lantern concept, you could scout for a suitable tree (one already being cleared, please!) that could be stripped and the branches shortened to act as climbing rungs or lantern hangers or hammock supports...Of course it's easy for me, here in Michigan, to assume that you have surplus trees laying around!
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Post by Bling » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:53 am

Just a thought, but wouldn't vinyl off-gas some nasty fumes in the sun and heat? What about parachute silk? Course, there's no SPF value to that. They do sell SPF fabric... Or, maybe even http://www.radiantguard.com/ultima-radi ... 000sf.aspx

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