Wild Horse Roundup, Black Rock area

[skibear]

The BLM thinks the Calico Mountains area of the Black Rock Range
(Just North of Black Rock City sites) is overrun with wild horses.

BLM says 3040 horses in the area is too many and plans to have
contractors with 2 helicopters chase down and capture 250 horses
over the next 3 months.

see: http://www.recordcourier.com/article/20 ... ofile=1049

or also: (may require free signup)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 02294.html

Activists with In Defense of Animals recently protested this in the Red Rock Canyon area near Las Vegus NV. Another protest is on for tomorrow
in San Francisco outside Sen. Diane Feinstein's office.

[Ugly Dougly]

I want a pony for Christmas.

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[LostinReno]

I love that commercial, that little girl has "stink eye" soooo down!

[AntiM]

The round-ups are nothing new, I've known about them in various western states for decades. There are too many horses for the available food and water. These horses are cared for, and some are adopted. It isn't like they are killed!

[quote]Horses removed from the range will be offered

for adoption to qualified individuals. Unadopted horses will be placed in

long-term pastures where they will be humanely cared for and treated, and

will retain their “wildâ€

[motskyroonmatick]

Yep! Herd em up and head 'em out. YEEEEHHHHAAAAAAWWWWWW!!!

[LostinReno]

The BLM does not sell or send any horses to slaughter.

Allegedly......
250 horses out of 3K isn't going to make much of a difference. Sounds like a ploy for the BLM to make a little money and keep some people employed more than anything. The wild horse issue has been around for as long as I can remember. I live near a neighborhood where the wild horses frequent. People constantly bitch and moan, "The horses ate my plants and grass, waaaahhhh". You know what, the horses were here way before your McMansion. I say let them stay!

[lonestoner916]

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[Ugly Dougly]

They're no more "wild" than a stray dog. The word is "feral".

[AntiM]

The BLM does not sell or send any horses to slaughter.

Allegedly......
250 horses out of 3K isn't going to make much of a difference. Sounds like a ploy for the BLM to make a little money and keep some people employed more than anything. The wild horse issue has been around for as long as I can remember. I live near a neighborhood where the wild horses frequent. People constantly bitch and moan, "The horses ate my plants and grass, waaaahhhh". You know what, the horses were here way before your McMansion. I say let them stay!

That would be 2,500 horses, not 250. THAT makes a difference.

[thisisthatwhichis]

Darn, and I thought we were talking about the WildHorse Saloon Bunny Ranch round-up......


Yeeehawww!!... Giddy-up!!!

[AntiM]

Mom?

[Deb Prothero]

Not sure about the need for this - it may be better than having too many in one area and having them starve for lack of resources.

My opposition would be to the idea of using helicopters to round them up. Seems to me a few people could be put to work for a few weeks to round them up and it would be a heck of a lot cheaper than hiring two helicopters to do the job. The helicopters would scare the wits out of those horses if they had to get in close enough to round them up. Can't for the life of me understand why we have to always go with the high tech solution when a few cowboys could do the job and would appreciate making a bit of extra money.

[oneeyeddick]

These horses can be dangerous....use the helicopters.

[ygmir]

yeah, it is better to leave the horses, an introduced animal, alone. Let them overgraze, destroy habitat and water sources, and push the "native" deer and antelope, etc out...........

or, maybe, we can fly food in to support the natives, perhaps, make certain areas only they can be.........fence the horses out............

oh, yeah, don't forget the donkey/burro's either..........

[theCryptofishist]

I think that it's a terrible decision to have to make. It's classic Malthus. Even if horses were killed, I think it's an easier death than starvation or thirst. Shipping them off to France to become dinner does seem like a far way from the local foodshed. The proper thing to do is eat them ourselves or else bring back wolves. Now that's a stink waiting to be raised.
One environmental advantage of bringing wolves back to Yellowstone has been an increase in plant diversity. Apparently, moose--or maybe it was elk--does would hang out by the streams and eat up the willow and other tender young trees. Now that the wolves are back, the moose just can't hang out and snack there, because that's a place where wolves can easily grab the fawns. (Calves?) Of course, if the BLM is going to have grazing out there, then they don't want wolves out there, too.
I do know that they are feral, but the truth is that the horse evolved on this continent and their absence has changed the ecology. Okay, we can't reconstruct the ecosystems that were here 15, 20 thousand years ago. But I find the whole idea of re-wilding to be very intriguing.
The reason we don't eat horses is because eating horse--perhaps specifically the liver--was a sacrament in nordic culture, so the church outlawed it. It is possible that for those of us who eat red meat that the whole "oh, we can't eat poor Dobbin!" aspect of these horse round-ups might not be at play if history had played out differently.
And I don't know why England retained the horsemeat taboo when France, and apparently Scandinavia, didn't.

[ygmir]

well, yeah, horses did evolve here, but, went extinct 15K or so (IIRC) years ago. And, they were nothing like what's here now, brought by Spanish? explorers..........

their absence for thousands of years, did allow other competing animals a better foothold......and, this "new" species, is more competitive and damaging, regarding our indigenous grazers and browsers.

I'm with you, though..........why are they different than deer or cows, as far as hunting and eating?

Flicka (sp?), of course.

PETA? maybe.

[Deb Prothero]

I've never considered eating horse meat but there are enough starving people in America that I'm sure the BLM could find 250 families that need a side to get through the winter. We're gradually overcoming other prohibitions imposed by the church, why not this one?

My real objection relates to the waste of resources in using helicopters to scare the daylights out of these animals when a simple cull could be arranged.

[geospyder]

Horse meat actually tastes rather good. I've had it in the form of luncheon meat in the Netherlands and as actual steaks in Luxembourg.

[ygmir]

I've never considered eating horse meat but there are enough starving people in America that I'm sure the BLM could find 250 families that need a side to get through the winter. We're gradually overcoming other prohibitions imposed by the church, why not this one?

My real objection relates to the waste of resources in using helicopters to scare the daylights out of these animals when a simple cull could be arranged.

it may not be as simple as a roundup......Deb........

I'm not a cowboy, so, can't speak to it.
But, especially with budgets what they are, I'd think (hope) they'd be doing it the most cost effective way............


By "cull" do you mean a hunt?

[LostinReno]

The BLM does not sell or send any horses to slaughter.

Allegedly......
250 horses out of 3K isn't going to make much of a difference. Sounds like a ploy for the BLM to make a little money and keep some people employed more than anything. The wild horse issue has been around for as long as I can remember. I live near a neighborhood where the wild horses frequent. People constantly bitch and moan, "The horses ate my plants and grass, waaaahhhh". You know what, the horses were here way before your McMansion. I say let them stay!

That would be 2,500 horses, not 250. THAT makes a difference.

My bad, read that one completely wrong! (too much multi-tasking at work) At any rate, should some of them be captured....most likely (2500 seems excessive). Are they destroying the desert as bad as they claim??? I have my doubts. The wild horses I see on a regular basis in Southern Washoe County do not look malnourished. The BLM gets money from ranchers who let thier cattle roam/graze on BLM land. They'd rather collect the money from them then let the horses and burro's be. As far as them not sending them off to slaughter, no the BLM isn't doing it directly, but the people that purchase these animals can pretty much do what they wish with them. With the current economy, not that many people are adopting or doing much else for that matter, sooo we pay to keep them in pens or preserves in the mid west?? It just doesn't make that much sense to me.

[oneeyeddick]

These horses are going to be up for adoption, not for dogfood, or for french food, for that matter.
It's all over the news here.

And "cull" means throw it away, even in Canada.

[mdmf007]

The horses are all available for adoption and go quickly. Thinning the range out keeps them in check for resources.

I was also wondering how come size matters? If the BLM was thinning out the gopher population people dont seem to mind.

is the gopher any less alive than the horse?

[AntiM]

Those herds are scattered and we've all seen the terrain... they aren't running the flat playa. Helicopters are effective.

The folks who are adopting are screened, if you don't have the resources and the ability to care for one, you don't get one. We have BLM pens and a ranch here in Utah, the state prisoners are trained to care for the horses and to gentle them for adoption. Good for the horses and the prisoners.

[LostinReno]

Those herds are scattered and we've all seen the terrain... they aren't running the flat playa. Helicopters are effective.

The folks who are adopting are screened, if you don't have the resources and the ability to care for one, you don't get one. We have BLM pens and a ranch here in Utah, the state prisoners are trained to care for the horses and to gentle them for adoption. Good for the horses and the prisoners.

They have the prison trainers here too, which I think is an awesome program. We also have a huge holding pen just past Palomino Valley on the way to Pyramid Lake. (They've mentioned on our news that adoption is WAY down due to the recession and a lot of people that currently have non-feral horses are struggling to afford the ones they have) I personally don't have a problem with them rounding them up with helicopters. I don't have a problem with them rounding up some of them in problem areas. I am by no means a PETA freak. I just find it hard to believe that these horses are over grazing 48 million acres of BLM land in our state alone. I also suspect that they are not that thorough on who gets to adopt one. Sure Joe Schmo has a ranch, it doesn't mean they will take care of it or not sell it to a 3rd party for whatever purpose. (Which really is the case with most anything) Look at all of the people who have children that really shouldn't?? I guess my main point is land mass vs. horse population... I really don't see the problem. Just MHO.

[theCryptofishist]

In the articles I've seen there's a huge jump in population in the coming years, 10,000 within five, I think. It's easier to gather them now, than when they have to process numbers that will overwhelm their corral and other resources. If the BLM are good land managers, and good stewarts of public money, then doing it now is called for. Nip it in the bud, if you will, that stitch in time saving nine. Like I said, this isn't easy.

[ygmir]

the acres per animal, as far as grazing and browsing, in Nevada, is really large.

[oneeyeddick]

They have the prison trainers here too, which I think is an awesome program. We also have a huge holding pen just past Palomino Valley on the way to Pyramid Lake.

They moved to Carson City some while ago, where there is more/better land, and not as much security issues(whatever that means).

[theCryptofishist]

A September count showed more than 3040 wild horses were living in the area - about three times the land's capacity.

Without the round-up, the horse population in the area would grow by 20 per cent to 27 per cent annually, passing 6000 mustangs within four years, according to the bureau.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/ar ... d=10617813

Also, we are possibly entering a fourth year of drought in the Sierras. That could mean I don't know what as regards to food and water for the animals. Maybe I should be forced to watch videos of culls and others can watch videos of horses dieing of thirst.

No easy choices.

[LostinReno]

In the articles I've seen there's a huge jump in population in the coming years, 10,000 within five, I think. It's easier to gather them now, than when they have to process numbers that will overwhelm their corral and other resources. If the BLM are good land managers, and good stewarts of public money, then doing it now is called for. Nip it in the bud, if you will, that stitch in time saving nine. Like I said, this isn't easy.

Even if it were to jump to 10K (which I do agree that may be a little excessive), there are roughly 6 million head of privatly owned livestock currently grazing on BLM land (vs. the current 25,000 horses). It all boils down to somebody in Washington filling their pockets.

[LostinReno]

They have the prison trainers here too, which I think is an awesome program. We also have a huge holding pen just past Palomino Valley on the way to Pyramid Lake.

They moved to Carson City some while ago, where there is more/better land, and not as much security issues(whatever that means).

They were out on Pyramid Hwy back in Sept?? Wow, I wonder what possibly would be a security issue on Pyramid Hwy, that would be any different in Carson?? Ok, I could name a few, but I just won't go there. LOL!