Survival

[can't sit still]

FIGJAM, that building style sounds pretty good. One has to keep in mind that low-mass construction usually fares better in an earthquake... Like the bamboo and paper in Japan. In the '94 earthquake in Northridge, the brick fire stations didn't hold up very well. My general plan for marauders is to leave. Depends on the firepower. I would rather just fade back into the hills than get into a gun battle. After they eat everything and leave, then I'll come back. You can't very well keep a homestead going if someone is up in the hills picking you off.
It depends on a lot of factors. If you have a lot of kids and non-coms, you're a target for kidnapping for ransom. That would be a heartbreaker. If you have pickets, that would be a different scenario altogether. The idea is to survive, not fight. Better to live in the hills than to die in a ditch. Better to go cold than to bury your kids.
I'll have remote stashes. I'll also keep poison stashed up by the spring. If the neighbors will work together, one can gather reinforcements and flush the crap.
There is a lot one can do even in a bush camp. There isn't much one can do if one catches a hollow point in the guts.
The idea of living in an area with a long growing season is that one doesn't have to store much food. One can grow year around. That means less to steal. If someone takes over the homestead and eats all the food, they will likely move on.
I've tried to think of as many variables as possible. That's why I don't want a place that is TOO attractive or provisioned. The local sheriff may find it a perfect place for his operation.

[gyre]

Rammed earth and fitted stone can be earthquake resistant, especially with a low mass roof.
I'm thinking seriously about ferrocement construction.
As steel goes up, it's making more sense anyway.
It is very material efficient and can be very tough, or even blastproof.
It requires skilled labor though.

I do think running the numbers on super-insulation is misleading.
Consider radiant benefits and reduced infrastructure.
What is the real benefit of never or rarely needing a heat source?
It can be done by pulling a slight vacuum between two steel or concrete walls.
For those who pooh pooh the altitude on the playa, consider how little reduction in air density is needed for a dramatic effect in insulation value.

I think superinsulation pays off, if you build for it.
If energy becomes more rare, then the payoff could be much greater.

[FIGJAM]

Mike reynolds has been thinking outside the box for 35 years and doing all the research. When the tsunami hit indonisia and contaminated all the wells with salt water, the earth ship they built on the spot harvested 10,000 liters with the first rain. Thats just one of many reasons i admire his projects. Anyone thinking of self sustianing houseing should check out his web sites.

[ygmir]

Rammed earth and fitted stone can be earthquake resistant, especially with a low mass roof.
I'm thinking seriously about ferrocement construction.
As steel goes up, it's making more sense anyway.
It is very material efficient and can be very tough, or even blastproof.
It requires skilled labor though.

I do think running the numbers on super-insulation is misleading.
Consider radiant benefits and reduced infrastructure.
What is the real benefit of never or rarely needing a heat source?
It can be done by pulling a slight vacuum between two steel or concrete walls.
For those who pooh pooh the altitude on the playa, consider how little reduction in air density is needed for a dramatic effect in insulation value.

I think superinsulation pays off, if you build for it.
If energy becomes more rare, then the payoff could be much greater.

I'd disagree about the fitted stone, but, I'm not sure what you mean by "fitted stone", and, the process/design.

I agree about the ferrocement, it's a good idea, labor intensive, but, very simple.

My big question is:
how the hell are you going to create and hold a vacuum in walls?...........
I mean in a practical sense? not theory, but, getting a wall of any size to create and maintain a seal, for a length of time?
Or, are you going to have a system to pump air out, from time to time?

one drawback to super air tight buildings, is, lack of fresh air exchange.........

[FIGJAM]

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invation, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallently. Specialization is for insects.........lazorus long..........

[gyre]

I'm referring to mortarless walls.
Some south american walls were built with an awareness of seismic issues.
I think they used design to fit together like the gravity fasteners used by japanese carpenters.
No mortar to shatter with movement.
Most importantly, they were angled in from the base for stability.

They do use a compressor, probably of the gerotor type to maintain the vacuum in such walls.
The ones I am aware of use only slightly lowered pressure to increase the isolation effect.
It's good for noise reduction too.


Homes with a certain lack of natural ventilation use an air to air heat exchanger for ventilation.
Many buildings use these now.

[can't sit still]

"A human being should be able"
Yeah well, it's not gonna happen.
You guys can compare all the building designs. Are any of you building?
The bond rating agencies are talking NOW about downgrading U.S. bonds. If you look at the time lag between talking and down-rating,,, for California and Greece, it was a pretty short time. When the U.S. is downrated, interest will go up pretty fast. GOV won't service the debt for long. I'm GUESSING that the U.S. will do some kind of default within 18 months.
Have you started building yet?
The safety net will be cut loose at default,,, maybe sooner. Many millions of GOV workers will NOT receive a check. No telling how much oil the country will receive. GOV will take first cut.
Prices for new materials will go sky-high. Steel has recently gone up 170 %? If you plan to build, it would be smart to buy your materials before the prices inflate.
Are you building yet?
There's no sense building in a population center. So, even if you build with low-cost material like tires, it still takes time and fuel to transport stuff to a more remote area.
You're better off to site a shipping container now than to plan an elaborate house that would take years to build.... especially if you haven't started building yet.
When we aren't sure just what the future will bring, it's difficult to prepare. By the time the future is obvious, it's too late to do elaborate preparations.

I believe that one would do best to concentrate on food supplies rather than shelter. An old tent will get you by in a pinch. Finding food every day is more challenging. Consider what would happen if agri-business failed,,, or distribution failed or the dollar failed. 300 million hungry people wandering around looking for something to eat. Your Earthship will look quite inviting.
When agriculture collapsed in Zimbabwe, they were trying to eat grass,,, in Haiti, they ate mud pies.
Are you planting yet?

[ygmir]

yup, I'm building......yup, got my materials a while back, yup, put aside fuel and food, and other "stuff".
Am working on getting a PV system for 2500 watts of electicity.
gravity flow water.
firewood.

well.......who knows what'll happen, so, I'm fairly prepared to 'bug out', too.

I'm not much of a gardener, but, feel, if I have stuff or skills to trade, can still be ok.

[can't sit still]

This is related to survival and kinda interesting. I was talking to a girl in Oregon. It seems the weapon of choice against home intruders is,,,, wasp spray. It has very good range and will disable the eyes. Never heard of this before.

[ygmir]

yeah, but, it probably only works on Caucasian, European, protestants.........

[gyre]

The foam stuff does have range.
It would be effective if you got it in their eyes or nose...and if they don't have a gun pointed at you.

[can't sit still]

Well, this post might appear not to fit this thread. VERY SORRY, but, you will learn differently. It's somewhat convoluted as all my posts are.
America got priced out of the job market. Greenspan blew a bubble in housing because it was the main area where our labor wasn't in competition with foreign labor. We can't compete with our wage structure and our corruption structure. NO JOBS.

So, where are we now?
"“A Year or More: The High Cost of Long-Term Unemploymentâ€

[can't sit still]

Well, the feds ARE going to cut off the money;
“Since the U.S. recession began in December 2007, Congress has extended the duration of weekly unemployment benefits for the jobless three times. Now, the lawmakers may have reached their limit. They are quietly drawing the line at 99 weeks of aid, a mark that hundreds of thousands of Americans have already reached. In coming months, the number of those who will receive their final government check is projected to top 1 million.â€

[can't sit still]

This problem is more subtle. The colonies of bats are dying off, some places at the rate of 98 %. http://www.caves.org/grotto/dcg/white-nose.html

These bats consume thousands of tons of insects every night. With the bats in decline, we will have to use more pesticides to control insects.
Unfortunately, pesticides are implicated in the die off of bees. http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... s-collapse
California depends on bees for pollination for much of it's crops. Other states raise a high percentage of crops that don't need pollination. Ca receives $ 2 billion from agriculture. The bats are connected to the bees and the bees are connected to dollars.... not to mention our food supply.

[unjonharley]

This problem is more subtle. The colonies of bats are dying off, some places at the rate of 98 %. http://www.caves.org/grotto/dcg/white-nose.html

These bats consume thousands of tons of insects every night. With the bats in decline, we will have to use more pesticides to control insects.
Unfortunately, pesticides are implicated in the die off of bees. http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... s-collapse
California depends on bees for pollination for much of it's crops. Other states raise a high percentage of crops that don't need pollination. Ca receives $ 2 billion from agriculture. The bats are connected to the bees and the bees are connected to dollars.... not to mention our food supply.

Do what ""you"" can to help the bees.. I trap bugs and feed bees.. The yard has flowers, fruit trees, a gold chain tree, butterfly trees and lots of white clover plus many other flowering plants.. WE have many different birds in the yard/trees and bird houses.. They seem to know I will not harm them.. Even the damn crows and I have good relations..

[can't sit still]

YOU have created a neighborhood nuisance. I am going to sue you. I don't like bees. YOU will have to spray everything with pesticide to make me happy. Also, I hear that you are responsible for the sky falling. A piece of it hit my roof and damaged it. YOU are going to have to pay for it. If YOU don't have any money, I will take your house.
It's the american way

[Ugly Dougly]

Non of us will survive. You are all fated to die sooner or later.

[FIGJAM]

I know my birth certificate came with an expiration date.

[Rabbi Dali Rick]

This calls for a party!





Let it all burn....

the rebbi

[EmilyD]

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invation, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallently. Specialization is for insects.........lazorus long..........

To this list I would add...and hem their pants (duct tape doesn't count).

[Mojojita]

.. Even the damn crows and I have good relations..

Hmmmm....I think I may have once had relations with an old crow......

[unjonharley]

.. Even the damn crows and I have good relations..

Hmmmm....I think I may have once had relations with an old crow......

i don't think you spell sheep, c r o w

[ygmir]

do you not like veesky, american? (quote from a russian sailor trying to intimidate me on the Ilse of Sarremaa)

[C.f.M.]

do you not like veesky, american? (quote from a russian sailor trying to intimidate me on the Ilse of Sarremaa)

[Ugly Dougly]

Cute picture, are you on the left or right?

[can't sit still]

This is a speculative reply to an article by Kunstler;

Americans are so passive politically that it's hard for me to imagine such a violent scenario.

We are in the early stages of a controlled demolition. The engineers behind the plan are confident that the destruction can be confined very precisely to the building's original footprint. Meaning, they will be able to observe the destruction of the American Middle Class from a safe distance. When the occupants of the building--those who got out in time, anyway--wake up and see open sky where once stood their homes and livelihoods, they will slowly move to slums, over time, the lucky ones taking up residence in the shadows of the high-security gated communities, while the worst-off will inhabit the cardboard boxes on the fringes.

In other words, America will collapse itself into a reality very much along the lines of what we see in India, or Mexico today. So, the rich will transport their children to exclusive schools in bullet-proof SUVs, while our kids scramble for scraps and toss-aways. The rich will fly off regularly to their vacation compounds; we will work every day of our lives, serving the wealthy. We will still gather in huge mobs around the parasitical celebrity class that holds its nose when we appear, while taking our work week's last earned dollar.

In short, if the ruling class brings this down in the right way, over time, we will see our lives implode into a the very same Third World reality that billions of people currently endure each day. No revolutions as long as the water and rice trucks appear whenever necessary; no angry mobs as long as the grinning faces of (B)hollywood stars deign to grace our lives with their thousand dollar smiles; no anger, no riots, if a few of us win the local lottery and somehow manage to rent a room on the other side of the security wall; and finally, no brave battles with the militarized police as long as the government legion's loyalty is purchased with promises of full citizenship and a comfortable retirement.

This is probably a best case scenario, sad to say. If in fact it does get ugly and all authority retreats into hiding to ride it out, I have little confidence that the people left standing in the streets will be able to set aside religious and cultural differences to build a new society. More likely these ethnic and religious communities will contract into tight little fists of resentment and anger, ready to strike down anyone who appears foreign or exotic or simply too smart for their own good. In other words, it will go down in much the same way it always has. You don't learn to build new societies by watching American Idol or the NFL. Too much garbage has been going in for too long to expect anything more than a tremendous amount of garbage coming out before anything resembling the rarefied achievement of evolved and sustainable living can finally emerge."

This is another post;

"catman306 | May 3, 2010 9:06 AM | Reply

The mega-rich have a secret weapon to stop angry mobs in their tracks.

Helicopters full of $100 bills flying low over the mobs and dumping their loosely packed loads on swarms below. Picking up handfuls of $100 bills off the ground will certainly alter the mood of the mob. Just keep gas in those 'copters and keep them flying. Hundred dollar bills will never be in short supply for the mega-rich. So "Fly, Baby, Fly!"

[can't sit still]

The soon-to-be-released new movie;

Coming to a neighborhood near you.

[Rabbi Dali Rick]

Well isn't that just dandy. It looks like downtown LA.




the rebbi

[Ugly Dougly]

The Hispanics have taken over Argentina! Where does it end?

[Rabbi Dali Rick]

you cutting your own yard.




the rebbi