HexaYurts

[Elderberry]

Might be off topic, but what size RU all building?


So, I guess I'm still dubious on 8' walls--but who knows, next year we might add a third room with 8' walls--or figure out how to put a second story on the thing!!! Oh the possibilities.

A second story! LOL now that would be prone to wind damage.

That sounds like an awesome yert! It would be cool if i could stop by and see it. This is my first time building one so i'm expecting things to not go as well as planned. I'm bringing a tent just in case.

The highest point on my Yert is 8'. The main walls are only 4'. I'm guessing that the basic Yert right?

OH, I mis-read or mis-understood your first post. Yes, 4' high walls are standard. Somehow I'm thinking that the peak of the roof is a bit higher than 8', but my memory could be wrong on that.

I think you'll be surprised how easy the yurt is to put together. It would be best if you could get some friends together and do a trial setup prior to the playa. It just helps to build your confidence.

The only thing you need to worry about on the playa is wind while you're trying to put it together. The first year we put it together it was calm and there were no problems.

Last year, we got on playa really early and it was calm too (mornings are usually more calm), but we had to wait several hours for a placer; so by the time we got placed and were ready to assemble the yurt it was too windy--the panels sort of take off like airplane wings. It didn't calm down again till after dark, so we lit the lanterns and got a bunch of guys together and had it together in under an hour. With no wind, my partner and I can assemble it ourselves. It's better with three people--for placing the roof. If there's a 'slight' breeze, a few more people can make it manageable.

I smiled when you mentioned bringing your tent as back-up. We thought of doing that too the first year, but figured we could sleep in the back of the truck for a night if conditions didn't allow for assembly the first day.

Also, I think I mentioned this before, but you will find a 6" or 8" squeegee on a long pole helpful too--for smoothing down the tape when you run it over the roof.

We camp with The Mudskipper Cafe at 7:30 and D this year. Stop buy anytime--there will be several Yurts in the camp. We server root beer floats from 2PM to 4PM tuesday through friday, so that might be a good time to drop by.

JK

[kman]

So my friend and I are planning on using 2 ratchet strap tie downs over the top of our stretch yurt and hooking them to rebar candy cane stakes as our main tie downs...anybody have thoughts on this? We are just trying to have as little stakes to put in and take back out as possible.
http://imgur.com/AbOxJ.jpg

That's a pic of it on our dry run the other day.

The foam boards are not very strong when it comes to stress placed on a small area... the strength comes from the structure as a whole. Tape anchors do a good job of distributing the pressure over a pretty good area, and in a pretty strong area, as well. Standard 1-2" wide tie downs would be pressing much harder in a less-strong place on the yurt.

Might be fine, I've never tried it. But I'd hate to find out you're wrong on the playa, and have a split yurt to deal with.

[kman]

I too am building a Hexayurt this year, am in the final stages right now. Actually, I bought the panels early last year and was ready to go but there was a family emergency, so I had to cancel the whole trip. This year is on for sure, though!

I'm going with the standard 8 foot model and got all the panels from a foam shop here in Burbank that stocks them. They did the big diagonal cuts for me, but I need to bevel them myself. I like the big orange ground sticks from Home Depot, hopefully the local store has them in stock.

I plan to do a couple of small filter windows. Not sure about the door yet, but I think I'll do proper hinges with thin plywood backing. No swamp cooler or A/C because were in AEZ, which (bless them) does not allow noisy stinking generators. (I do have a solar system, but it's not quite beefy enough to run a swamp cooler.)

We'll be doing the final assembly on Tuesday at the park. Great to see all the Hexayurt enthusiasm here. Kman, your yurt looks superb and I'm jealous of the height! (Maybe I'll "expand" next year.) Hello to the Kman from the Key Man.

See y'all on the Playa!

Swamp cooler in the AEZ is totally do-able without a genny. You just need a decent-sized deep cycle marine battery. Costco has 115 amp-hour batteries for $70. Charge it up before you leave, and you have 57.5 amp hours to play with.

Over 8 days (unless you're in early for the build), that means without ever recharging the battery even a little, you can run use 7.18 amp hours per day and not hurt your battery in the slightest. The max power draw for the little swamp coolers we're building (see this thread) is 1.5 amps, that means roughly 4.8 hours of cooling per day... and you really only need it when you're indoors sleeping during the heat of the day, so that's probably enough. Feed whatever your solar panel can produce back into the battery, and you'll have extra power for longer runtimes, even if the panel isn't strong enough to directly run the cooler by itself.

Beveling is only needed if you're building a folding yurt for faster on-playa assembly. If you're doing all the taping on the playa, instead of just the last bits, mostly connecting the roof, there's no need to bevel unless you simply really like it better.

jkisha, with an offering like that you can be sure I'll be swinging by for a visit. (Plus we're close, 8:00 and Esplanade)

[Elderberry]

Beveling is only needed if you're building a folding yurt for faster on-playa assembly. If you're doing all the taping on the playa, instead of just the last bits, mostly connecting the roof, there's no need to bevel unless you simply really like it better.

jkisha, with an offering like that you can be sure I'll be swinging by for a visit. (Plus we're close, 8:00 and Esplanade)

Great--get there early, if it's anything like last year, the line gets pretty long!

Hey, have you had any experience with the pop-up yurt? I watched one of Vinay's videos and it really didn't seem like it performed all that well--hard to pop-open and close. Also, I didn't think you could make a full size pop-up yurt. Am I wrong on that?

Thanks,

JK

[capjbadger]

Beveling is only needed if you're building a folding yurt for faster on-playa assembly. If you're doing all the taping on the playa, instead of just the last bits, mostly connecting the roof, there's no need to bevel unless you simply really like it better.

jkisha, with an offering like that you can be sure I'll be swinging by for a visit. (Plus we're close, 8:00 and Esplanade)

Great--get there early, if it's anything like last year, the line gets pretty long!

Hey, have you had any experience with the pop-up yurt? I watched one of Vinay's videos and it really didn't seem like it performed all that well--hard to pop-open and close. Also, I didn't think you could make a full size pop-up yurt. Am I wrong on that?

Thanks,

JK

This one seems to work pretty well...

[youtube][/youtube]

-Badger

[Key Man]

Double post, not sure what's going on here.

[Key Man]

(Quote function doesn't seem to work for some reason)

Kman, regarding swamp coolers, etc...

That's very interesting. I already have a complete solar system and inverter that I use for laptops and little stuff, which has a large marine battery and beefy inverter. I "assumed" that a swamp cooler would suck too many amps for my fairly small system but have never looked at them (or their power consumption) closely. I'm going to check out some evaporative coolers at Costco etc. and see what is available. Thanks for the idea.

[Elderberry]

Thanks Badger.

That's a folding model that I've never seen before. There actually is a true "pop-up" version where you don't disassemble anything, nor do you have to tape anything (except for maybe one wall seam, to put it up either.

Also, this one isn't full size either. But it seems to be a good, functional design, which is important.

JK

[kman]

Hey, have you had any experience with the pop-up yurt? I watched one of Vinay's videos and it really didn't seem like it performed all that well--hard to pop-open and close. Also, I didn't think you could make a full size pop-up yurt. Am I wrong on that?

No, not referring to the pop-up yurt. A folding yurt. Still needs some assembly.

I'll see if I can put up some photos I took of the model that fknsellers made, which is the same as our actual yurts, but smaller (and lacking the 2' height add-on).

But essentially, the walls are pre-taped and fold up into a flat stack of boards. Two people (one, probably, but easier with two) simply pull the two full boards apart and the whole thing opens up. Add strips of tape (vertically) to four interior walls, and the walls are done.

The roof stacks into two sections for ease of transport (the usual triangles that form a rectangle), but they're otherwise pre-hinged as well. Just tape the two sections together in the correct orientation, and the whole root unfolds. A couple of seams have to be done on site, but nowhere near as many as the full assembly.

Lift the full roof on top, and the structure is in place. Tape the band around, and do the top seams same as usual.

I haven't put all of my photos from the build online yet, because I was hoping to combine my shots with fknseller's to provide the complete story. Perhaps I'll stick them somewhere temporary, though, so I can link them in the meantime.

[kman]

(Quote function doesn't seem to work for some reason)

Kman, regarding swamp coolers, etc...

That's very interesting. I already have a complete solar system and inverter that I use for laptops and little stuff, which has a large marine battery and beefy inverter. I "assumed" that a swamp cooler would suck too many amps for my fairly small system but have never looked at them (or their power consumption) closely. I'm going to check out some evaporative coolers at Costco etc. and see what is available. Thanks for the idea.

Commercial swamp coolers are going to use a LOT more juice than the little home-built ones we made. Ours used two small 120mm computer fans (0.6 amps each) and a small 12v pump (0.3 amps), so only 1.5 amps total. Commercial systems usually assume ready access to power, or cooling whole houses or whole RVs, so they tend to be less thrifty.

[Key Man]

I commend you for building your own low power swamp cooler but my pre playa to do list was already overwhelming me! I found a small 60 watt portable swamp cooler at a So Cal supplier for $99 though, and decided to give it a shot. http://www.atrendyhome.com/portableswampcooler.html

The solar panel in my system is 80 watts and the marine battery is pretty big, so should be able to support a 60 watt appliance for a few hours a day.

Will it effectively cool an 8 foot Hexayurt or just a corner of it? Maybe. Is it made in China? Probably. Will it die after a day or to of use? Maybe, but seems worth a try!

[FIGJAM]

You will need an inverter for that unit.

If it breaks down you will still have the basics.

Just replace the fan motor and pump with 12volt units.

[kman]

I commend you for building your own low power swamp cooler but my pre playa to do list was already overwhelming me! I found a small 60 watt portable swamp cooler at a So Cal supplier for $99 though, and decided to give it a shot. http://www.atrendyhome.com/portableswampcooler.html

The solar panel in my system is 80 watts and the marine battery is pretty big, so should be able to support a 60 watt appliance for a few hours a day.

Will it effectively cool an 8 foot Hexayurt or just a corner of it? Maybe. Is it made in China? Probably. Will it die after a day or to of use? Maybe, but seems worth a try!

I'm quite curious to see how it works out.

My back of the envelope calculations say that thing will pull roughly 5 amps from a 12v power source. Actually, more like 5.5 amps once you run the power through an inverter (assuming you get a properly-sized inverter close to the actual power needs so it doesn't waste more power, something like a 70w inverter, since inverters reach their peak efficiency... i.e., only wasting 10% of the power converted... only right near their max continuous output).

If you're running it 5 hours per day, you're pulling 27.5 amps per day. If your battery is big enough, and your solar panel's output can keep up with recharging during the day, you might do fairly well.

If we don't meet during the event, be sure to report back here and let us know after!

[Key Man]

I agree that it may or may not work well. My inverter is 1000w so that's not an issue. It will just be a matter of charging capacity of my 80w panel vs. the number of hours I run the cooler (and other stuff) each day. And to what degree the cooler is a piece of junk.

The panel is 80 watts (maybe a little more under the blazing sun of the playa!) and the cooler is 60 watts. Losses though the inverter and the cables might be 10-15%. So the panel should barely be able to run the cooler under a strong sun without tapping the battery. (If I had a second 80w panel I'd be rockin' -- maybe next year.)

But also the cooler has a 3 speed fan, so it can probably run at around 30 watts at the lower setting. I expect try it out here in Burbank before packing the U-Haul next week, so I should have an idea how viable the rig is before my wife and I leave. Drop by the AEZ and say hello if you have a chance. We're David and Cholada camp, and we'll be sort of behind the main AEZ tent and tower, looking from center camp.

Here are a couple photos of my solar panel and inverter. Inside the Tupperware tub is a big Costco Inverter with fuses etc. The panel plugs into the inverter section via a big twist-lock connector. The banana jacks on the front allow me to easily monitor the battery voltage with a DVM.

[kman]

I agree that it may or may not work well. My inverter is 1000w so that's not an issue. It will just be a matter of charging capacity of my 80w panel vs. the number of hours I run the cooler (and other stuff) each day. And to what degree the cooler is a piece of junk.

The panel is 80 watts (maybe a little more under the blazing sun of the playa!) and the cooler is 60 watts. Losses though the inverter and the cables might be 10-15%. So the panel should barely be able to run the cooler under a strong sun without tapping the battery. (If I had a second 80w panel I'd be rockin' -- maybe next year.)

But also the cooler has a 3 speed fan, so it can probably run at around 30 watts at the lower setting. I expect try it out here in Burbank before packing the U-Haul next week, so I should have an idea how viable the rig is before my wife and I leave. Drop by the AEZ and say hello if you have a chance. We're David and Cholada camp, and we'll be sort of behind the main AEZ tent and tower, looking from center camp.

Here are a couple photos of my solar panel and inverter. Inside the Tupperware tub is a big Costco Inverter with fuses etc. The panel plugs into the inverter section via a big twist-lock connector. The banana jacks on the front allow me to easily monitor the battery voltage with a DVM.

I'll do my best to swing by. (playa may have other plans, who knows?) The AEZ is definitely on my list of places to visit since I went solar this year. It'll be nice to avoid the noisy gennies I've heard way too clearly in the past.

You sound like you know what you're talking about, but you do know about inverter efficiency being best when near it's maximum working wattage, right? Unless you're running a bunch of other stuff, using a 1000w inverter to run a 30-60w device is like swatting a fly with a gas-guzzling Hummer. I can't recall the specific percentage, but I seem to recall that such a setup wastes quite a lot of electricity... and you don't have a huge amount to spare, it seems. I'll see if I can dig up some more solid numbers.

[Shoeshine]

On that 6' stretch foldy that was posted:

does one need to bevel the cuts on the insulation board to make it work?

anyone have any experience with this mod?

---shoeshine

[mikep_95133]

[quote="capjbadger"][quote="jkisha"][quote="kman"]

Beveling is only needed if you're building a folding yurt for faster on-playa assembly. If you're doing all the taping on the playa, instead of just the last bits, mostly connecting the roof, there's no need to bevel unless you simply really like it better.

[u]jkisha[/u], with an offering like that you can be sure I'll be swinging by for a visit. ;) (Plus we're close, 8:00 and Esplanade)[/quote]

Great--get there early, if it's anything like last year, the line gets pretty long!

Hey, have you had any experience with the pop-up yurt? I watched one of Vinay's videos and it really didn't seem like it performed all that well--hard to pop-open and close. Also, I didn't think you could make a full size pop-up yurt. Am I wrong on that?

Thanks,

JK[/quote]
This one seems to work pretty well...

[youtube][/youtube]

-Badger[/quote]

I like the folding aspects of his yurt in the video. So much easier to do and only looked like one person was needed. Nice job! That's why my yurt has each wall and roof section hinged as one piece. 15 minutes to stand up the whole, full sized, yurt, with one person doing the assembly and another using just one hand to hold things in place. Or just one person and a ladder to hold things in place.

[img]http://rotordesign.com/bm/yurt/roofwallsetsfinished.jpg[/img]

[Elderberry]

Mike, is this your design? I'd like to see it on the playa. Where will you be camping?

JK

[mikep_95133]

[quote="jkisha"][quote="mikep_95133"]
[img]http://rotordesign.com/bm/yurt/roofwallsetsfinished.jpg[/img][/quote]

Mike, is this your design? I'd like to see it on the playa. Where will you be camping?

JK[/quote]

Yes JK. That's my folding yurt design. You walked into my yurt when I was not home in 2009 and walked away disappointed, per your post earlier in this thread.

Mike

[Elderberry]

Mike, is this your design? I'd like to see it on the playa. Where will you be camping?

JK

Yes JK. That's my folding yurt design. You walked into my yurt when I was not home in 2009 and walked away disappointed, per your post earlier in this thread.

Mike

Ah, right. It looks different in the picture...but I thought I recognized the canvas hinges though. Maybe I'll stop by and take another look and see if I judged it too hastily last time. Hope you'll be there this time...and not punch me in the nose if my opinion still doesn't change. The only thing I can promise you though, is that I will keep a totally open mind for the second look.

JK

[mikep_95133]

[quote="jkisha"][quote="mikep_95133"][quote="jkisha"][quote="mikep_95133"]
[img]http://rotordesign.com/bm/yurt/roofwallsetsfinished.jpg[/img][/quote]

Mike, is this your design? I'd like to see it on the playa. Where will you be camping?

JK[/quote]

Yes JK. That's my folding yurt design. You walked into my yurt when I was not home in 2009 and walked away disappointed, per your post earlier in this thread.

Mike[/quote]

Ah, right. It looks different in the picture...but I thought I recognized the canvas hinges though. Maybe I'll stop by and take another look and see if I judged it too hastily last time. Hope you'll be there this time...and not punch me in the nose if my opinion still doesn't change. :) :) The only thing I can promise you though, is that I will keep a totally open mind for the second look. ;)

JK[/quote]

I hear lots of judgments not based on experience with my style of yurt building, but based on opinions formed from some sort of theory that there is only one way to build a structurally sound yurt. I am not interested in anyone's judgments. This is not a yurt building contest.

For me the goal is to share and revel in one another's accomplishments and to enjoy the variations that each builder brings to the yurt community.

The final authority on yurt building to me, is not from you, not even from Vinay. But is from the individual builder themselves.

Based on our exchanges earlier in this thread, if you feel the need to express a judgment of my yurt, I'd prefer that you keep it to yourself.

Do stop by and look and enjoy as many others have.

Mike

[sstrak]

6' Stretch Hexayurt with 2" R-Max

Ventilation?

<a><img></a>




Whirly Bird!

I figured the normal triangle roof panels were stronger than the long (rhombus?) ones. Now I just need to cut vent holes. I figure 1 on each side. The A/C filters I'm using are roughly 1'x2'

Open to suggestions.

[kman]

I suggest painting yourself green.

Immediately.

Or was there something specifically that you wanted a recommendation about?

[sstrak]

Ventilation.

Has anyone ever used an attic ventilator like this? How should I best filter it? How necessary is fitting a filter to it? I plan on sealing it closed during the day and opening it in the evening to let things cool off. How many 1 foot by 2 foot vent holes should I put in? etc, etc.

and yes, I probably should have cropped myself out of the pic ;)

[kman]

Ventilation.

Has anyone ever used an attic ventilator like this? How should I best filter it? How necessary is fitting a filter to it? I plan on sealing it closed during the day and opening it in the evening to let things cool off. How many 1 foot by 2 foot vent holes should I put in? etc, etc.

and yes, I probably should have cropped myself out of the pic

I've used them in a dome, but not a yurt. The dome was much more open, so sealing dust out was less of a concern. I suspect if you don't seal that, though, you'll let quite a bit of dust in.

You could seal it with the piece you cut out to let the air through, just like any other window, or perhaps tape a filter over the opening? I don't know if that would impede the airflow too much to let it work or not, though.

Personally, I went with smaller filters. I found 12x12 filters at Home Despot. Two should do the trick as well as it can be done... one on the windy side, and one on the opposite wall.

Remember, any holes you cut, you're letting heat in, and the opportunity for dust.

To mount the air filters, cut a hole 1" smaller than your filter (mine are 12x12, so I cut 11x11). Tape/seal the edges of both the hole and the piece you cut out. Make sure it still fits back in place... you may want to sand it a little so it still fits with the extra bulk of the tape. Now you can seal the hole anytime you want, just by putting the piece back in place. Tape it if you need it back in a truly sealed/sturdy way. The filter gets simply taped to the outside surface of the wall. Be sure to tape it all the way around to seal it as much as possible. Any time you feel too much heat coming through, pop the removed section back into place from the inside.

[Key Man]

I agree that it may or may not work well. My inverter is 1000w so that's not an issue. It will just be a matter of charging capacity of my 80w panel vs. the number of hours I run the cooler (and other stuff) each day. And to what degree the cooler is a piece of junk.

The panel is 80 watts (maybe a little more under the blazing sun of the playa!) and the cooler is 60 watts. Losses though the inverter and the cables might be 10-15%. So the panel should barely be able to run the cooler under a strong sun without tapping the battery. (If I had a second 80w panel I'd be rockin' -- maybe next year.)

But also the cooler has a 3 speed fan, so it can probably run at around 30 watts at the lower setting. I expect try it out here in Burbank before packing the U-Haul next week, so I should have an idea how viable the rig is before my wife and I leave. Drop by the AEZ and say hello if you have a chance. We're David and Cholada camp, and we'll be sort of behind the main AEZ tent and tower, looking from center camp.

Here are a couple photos of my solar panel and inverter. Inside the Tupperware tub is a big Costco Inverter with fuses etc. The panel plugs into the inverter section via a big twist-lock connector. The banana jacks on the front allow me to easily monitor the battery voltage with a DVM.

I'll do my best to swing by. (playa may have other plans, who knows?) The AEZ is definitely on my list of places to visit since I went solar this year. It'll be nice to avoid the noisy gennies I've heard way too clearly in the past.

You sound like you know what you're talking about, but you do know about inverter efficiency being best when near it's maximum working wattage, right? Unless you're running a bunch of other stuff, using a 1000w inverter to run a 30-60w device is like swatting a fly with a gas-guzzling Hummer. I can't recall the specific percentage, but I seem to recall that such a setup wastes quite a lot of electricity... and you don't have a huge amount to spare, it seems. I'll see if I can dig up some more solid numbers.

Kman: You brought up an interesting point about inverter efficiency, so I made some measurements. With no AC load and the inverter turned on, it consumes about 3.7 watts. With a 60 watt load (standard 60 watt light bulb used for test, lamp current verified) the inverter consumed 69.5 watts of battery power. So inefficiency (loss) was about 14%. Maybe a smaller inverter would be a little more efficient, but this doesn't seem bad, and I like having the 1000w available, just in case.

[kman]

Good to know, thanks for the numbers, Key man!

Btw... nice yurt!

[mayermar]

Didn't order my tape in time. This yurt has been built before. Old tape cut not removed. Do you think there is an alternative easily available tape that can be used. The good thing is that it will be tape to tape as opposed to tape to insulation panel which sucks I learned from taping all the edges the first time I used it. The first time I used 6" bi-dir tape. Can I use something else in a pinch. What do you think...thanks

[Elderberry]

Didn't order my tape in time. This yurt has been built before. Old tape cut not removed. Do you think there is an alternative easily available tape that can be used. The good thing is that it will be tape to tape as opposed to tape to insulation panel which sucks I learned from taping all the edges the first time I used it. The first time I used 6" bi-dir tape. Can I use something else in a pinch. What do you think...thanks

Can't you find someplace that will over-night it to you? There might be alternatives, but I wouldn't want to experiment with my shelter on the playa!

JK

[Korwedge]

I've used my yurt 2 years in a row now and love it. I have a question about using it over and over.

The six inch bi-filament tape leaves a residue behind when I pull it off. I usually remove it a year later after it has dried and worn out. This residue needs to be scraped of so the new tape will adhere securely to the walls.

I know some people just leave it on and let the tape layers pile up, but the glue doesn't seem to be strong enough after a year in my shed.

What do you all do?