Experiences in Center Camp

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 4:27 pm

So...here in the midwest where we are challenged to get anything.....is this stuff available...I'm picking up that it is yet it isn't...Someone mentioned Ouzo No 12.....I'm willing to try it if I just knew what it was that I'm looking for.

Flux · Post by **Flux** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 4:31 pm

Do some searching on the Internet. I gather that it can be imported -- technically illegally, but without much in the way of ramifications or interdiction as a practical matter -- from Europe.

(It is technically illegal in the US because of the wormwood. One of those "illegal to buy or sell but legal to possess and consume" sorts of things, I think.)

jaywalker · Post by **jaywalker** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 4:34 pm

mail order from Europe.

Some extremely economical ways but it's airmail, so it can take a month to arrive.

Or some more exspensive ways, but it'll show up via courier in 3 days.

Either way, it's always nice to find boxes of booze at your doorstep

I could send ya some links off site if you'd like. All dependable after 5 years of hosting cocktail parties on the playa. Actually, I think I'm quoted on one of the sites about that. I love being a good customer.

icarus · Post by **icarus** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 5:01 pm

Okay, according to Tawnee...

The proceeds from the sale of coffee go to the local area schools.

According to PJ* there is a net deficit from the sale of coffee.
------------------------------------------------------------------

ERGO, money must be taken from local area schools
to pay off the deficiit created by Center Camp's coffee sales!

Think about that next time you're sucking down that cappuchino foam... think of the illiterate and unclothed gerlach children each sip produces. For the love of God, think of the children!

*actually, i don't know if PJ mentioned this, but since he's posted a record 250 times, it's as good a guess as any to credit him.

jaywalker · Post by **jaywalker** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 5:07 pm

icarus wrote:Okay, according to Tawnee...

The proceeds from the sale of coffee go to the local area schools.

According to PJ* there is a net deficit from the sale of coffee.

*Sigh*

Profits from ice sales are given directly to the Empire/Gerlach school system.

Profits from the café go directly to the commissary to sustain the onsite nutritional needs of our kick-ass staff.

Which explains why they're always driving around yelling at you to go home. Notice the cafe workers don't get passes to the comissary generally, it's the folks doing the real work (donning nomex suit).

So when you tip these folks, your stealing food from the folks who've been there for a month. Put that money towards more dry ice and bring up a pork shoulder to donate.

Dammit!

But i just love Icarus' theory. Let the children volunteer for tips for there schools. Let the starving artists work perimeter and gate.

jay
slacking-off smartass

PetsUntilEaten · Post by **PetsUntilEaten** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 5:45 pm

Jay: I never thought about the fact that having no coffee at center camp would cause more cross-camp interaction. Really good point.

Ivy: Adore you.

Tawnee: Girl! Admittedly sometimes I go looking for a fight. When the mood hits me I try to pick on the most erractic & irrational person I can find who seems to also be looking for a fight. Since my beloved, Joseph Dunphy isn’t around – this really leaves you. Care to dance? Ivy & Jay, mind if I cut in? You know I’ve been trying to stick to highly personal & semi-rational discussion in the sexual violence thread – but this is looks like a great place to just get it all out of my system. Tawnee – you wanna lead?

Ivy · Post by **Ivy** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 6:51 pm

Pets: the feeling is mutual.

I'm not good at sharing, but for you, I'll make exceptions.

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 7:22 pm

Pets: I like your posts and I don't want to cross swords with you...but you might want to check out Tawnee and her website a bit...she's going through a lot right now, and that might be where the tension and other emotions are coming from. I'm not offering excuses, maybe just an explanation....she might need love and attention more than flames right now if my opinion and analysis means anything. (Actually if you read her latest post...YOU WILL UNDERSTAND. AND FOR EVERYONE ELSE, I'D STRONGLY ENCOURAGE YOU TO CLICK ON THE LINK, GET PAST THE ADULT CONTENT BOX AND TAKE A LOOK. If you do, I guarantee your replies will be much different next time she posts.

Jaywalker: I'm interested in those links or contacts. I get scripts from Canada via Arkansas, why not fine spirits from Europe? If it gets through Customs, it's their problem, not mine.

And as for the school system thing, I'm sure that Center Camp proceeds are not the only source of funds that the ORG gives to the local schools. And if it operates at a loss, there are other funds that more than offset it...sometimes the social value outweighs the financial. If we lived life as the accountants wanted us to, America would be a very miserable place.

precipitate · Post by **precipitate** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 7:27 pm

You know, I like you, but I totally disagree. Behaving like a horse's ass is inexcusable. I assume she's an adult, she can be expected to comport herself like one. Or she can be expected to apologize when she comes to her senses. Until then, plonk.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 7:31 pm

"Absinthe makes the heart grow fondle."

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 7:35 pm

After reading Tawnee's reply and hearing from others, I'm exercising my right to pull a previous post. My apologies to Tawnee and anyone else I might have offended with my actions.

Kinetic

PetsUntilEaten · Post by **PetsUntilEaten** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:02 pm

kinetic - I don't know that I'd have posted that - - - i know it was with good intentions - - - hmmmmmm.

Well wether she asked for it or not - I'm sorry that Tawnee's having this kind of trouble. She seems like a fighter in all the good & bad ways. Certainly admirably taking charge.

The rough thing with being emotional as she is - is that I'm sure she can't hear herself & will unwittingly continue to draw fire. What's gonna happen when people don't know that she's under stress?

a totally random aside about this concept:
A while back I had a problem with another department's coordinator who essential worked beneath me & my assistants (I work within in a heiracy, not a democracy) - this guy picked bad, uneducated fights with us over & over until my assistants were calling for his head. I tried talking him down, setting him straight, & talking to his immediate boss - nothing worked. Finally his boss caught him crying in a corner one day - seems his father was dying. I was sympathetic but one of my assistants who had lost her father while on a job was even more enraged by him. I didn't want to see him lose work at such a hard time, but had to ask that his boss remove him from futher interactions with us for everyone's sanity.

but at least the eplaya is a better place to have it out than the real world.

so come on tawnee! lets tango!!!! - you know you wanna . . .

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:09 pm

Her post stired up a maelstrom of emotions as this is my annual week of hell. The 9/11 memories, the 2 year anniversary of the loss of my best friend, my mom's continuing battles....and then I came across her post and I lost it.

Maybe I shouldn't have posted it...it was something deeply personal. However she put it out on her site to share. It might have been a subconscious cry for understanding.....and in my own situation I felt a connection. The results are splashed across the thread for all to see.

That being said, when I was in my dark days a year ago, it took a good challenge to snap me out of it. So if she responds to you, go for it. You might be giving her just what she wants.

If nothing else as I sit here thinking about Tallinn and 9/11, her post gave me another perspective.....and another reason to wonder why life can be so damn cruel sometimes.....

If I can just get through 9/11 and 9/17. That's all I want to do. I miss my best friend so much.

Ivy · Post by **Ivy** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:10 pm

I had in fact seen her website before.

Question: if you read the same thing about me, or pets, or precip, or anyone, would you take the same stance?

Look, I'm sorry she's got problems, but she ain't the only one. I could blame my jaded, cynical actions on shit that has happened to me (and believe me, there is a big pile), we all could, as I'm sure we all have troubles (clearly, you can relate). Everyone's got a "woe is me" sob story.

Perhaps heavy emotion clouds her thoughts and affects her posting. that is the most I can afford her. Emotion and logic usually aren't found hand in hand. But I'm with precipitate on this one. When she comes down off "her cloud" and wants to have a reasonable, logical conversation, then I'll reevaluate my standpoint.

Tawnee Lynne · Post by **Tawnee Lynne** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:23 pm

First off. This is a string about center camp. Keep it there. I did not bring any of you in this thread into my personal life, and if you took the inititive to look into who I am, at least keep it to yourselves. Ivy, kiss my fucking ass, I just wanted you to quit bitching about center camp, to keep it real. Post legitimate complaints and quit seeking sympathy for your bad time. Get it? I am not mad that my battle was mentioned outside my website, I am however offended that it was used in an enviroment that leaves me feeling somewhat naked, and I am sorry, I don't feel comfortable being that naked among the misery driven souls that seek to complain about their woes instead of offering constructive discussions. I am no longer participating in this thread so all of you can bitch all you want, tear apart my name in the assumption that any of you have a clue as to who I am. You read between lines that are only lines in the game you play, not the life I lead.
Sincerely
Tawnee Lynne

Lydia Love · Post by **Lydia Love** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:35 pm

Erm...

Kiamix hon, I don't think I'd do that... I think it's best if we look into eachothers personal life on our own. Her website is out there, public and all but still... it's a little awkward.

Tawnee - ya know K was trying to cut you some slack doncha? He meant the best.

Tawnee, I'm glad you had a magical time out there. But you should know that many of the people who helped create that world are cantakerous, and hate to have anything dictated to them. And you don't get to dictate the tone, or frankly, the content of any thread. It don't work that way - too many diverse minds contributing.

No one is trying to make your experience any less fabulous. Not everyone's every moment out there is fabulous. Some burners have completely unfabulous burns. Does it really harm you to know that? You can know that your first burn was absolutely the best and that you're doubly blessed because not everyone gets to have that.

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:40 pm

While I can be a cold hearted SOB, especially since I can be the road rage poster child, to answer your question Ivy, yeah, I would take the same stance. She is going through a lot right now...and I can relate to her story. I'm still fighting a battle over here with my mother on a daily basis.

I did use the edit feature and removed the quote from her website...it served it's purpose and there's no sense in leaving it out there...

Excluding my driving habits, one thing I am good at is playing the role of the diplomat and bringing sides together. Sometimes I try to do it subtly, othertimes I use the baseball bat approach....but I try. It's a weakness I guess. But I've done it for years, why stop now? I've had some good successes with it.

My true intent is that I love BM, and excluding the one guy in Playa Info this year, I have not met a burner that I didn't like. I might not agree with them, they may be my exact opposite on everything, but hey, they hauled themselves out to BM, they are part of my experience, and so if I can help in some way give back what they give me karma wise....well I do it. It's the spirit of BM manifested in a different way, but also done year round.

Forgive me for ranting...I'm in a melancholy state right now...maybe if I give of myself I can get enough karma back that it will pick me up again.

Ivy · Post by **Ivy** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:40 pm

Note that I never brought your website up, even thought I knew about it; but you have to know that absolutely anything you put on the internet will be found and read. if you don't want people to see it, don't put it out there. on your personal webpage or the eplaya or anywhere.

You wanted me to quit bitching about center camp, well too fucking bad. I want you to stop praising it. I posted legitimate reasons about why I did not like the things I did not like about the cafe ( I never had a beef with center camp in general). Show me where I am seeking sympathy for my bad time. Please. I'd like to see specific examples.

I brought up a logical arguement that the cafe is "anti" Burning man if BM is indeed "no-commerce." I also proposed things that I would do, politically and artisitically, to display my opinion. While I don't expect or even want everyone to agree with me, I don't see how this is not constructive discussion. What I don't see as constructive discussion is: "quit your whining about center camp." That is not constructive.

Take your own medicine and don't complain about the taste.

Hoopes · Post by **Hoopes** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:41 pm

Kinetic wrote:So...here in the midwest where we are challenged to get anything.....is this stuff available...I'm picking up that it is yet it isn't...Someone mentioned Ouzo No 12.....I'm willing to try it if I just knew what it was that I'm looking for.

You have to know someone who makes it. As to what you're looking for, check out http://www.gumbopages.com/food/beverages/absinthe.html

We had some in our camp. I enjoyed the taste, with the blend of exotic herbs, but it's mostly about getting drunk fast.

Hoopes · Post by **Hoopes** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:44 pm

Kinetic wrote:Forgive me for ranting...I'm in a melancholy state right now...maybe if I give of myself I can get enough karma back that it will pick me up again.

You're doing so here on the E-Playa. That's what it's for. If what you give is mindful, honest, and filled with compassion you will get good karma in return.

Lydia Love · Post by **Lydia Love** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:47 pm

If what you give is mindful, honest, and filled with compassion you will get good karma in return.

Awwww shit. I am so screwed.

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:52 pm

In memory of the old e-playa.....

My 100th post! Wheeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Some habits or traditions die hard......
Now where's Zane when I need him?

Tawnee Lynne · Post by **Tawnee Lynne** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 8:54 pm

umm ok. PLEASE quit making all these posts tearing my words apart. I made a comment that I didn't care for the bitching and then you guys have bitched at me all day for it. MY OPINION IS THAT CENTER CAMP ROCKS. My other opinions as to the way my first opinion was torn apart are as follows.
Ivy, I don't know you, prolly would welcome you as a stranger in my camp any day. that doesn't change. Nothing has changed. I believe that you were whining, I still believe that you whine. You think I ride a horse, continue thinking that. I don't care.
Kinetic, no harm.
take care, hope you guys have better experiences in the future.
Tawnee Lynne

Lydia Love · Post by **Lydia Love** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 9:01 pm

keep bitching back and this thing may *never* die down.

PetsUntilEaten · Post by **PetsUntilEaten** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 9:10 pm

Tawnee Lynne wrote:First off. This is a string about center camp. Keep it there. I did not bring any of you in this thread into my personal life, and if you took the inititive to look into who I am, at least keep it to yourselves. Ivy, kiss my fucking ass, I just wanted you to quit bitching about center camp, to keep it real. Post legitimate complaints and quit seeking sympathy for your bad time. Get it? I am not mad that my battle was mentioned outside my website, I am however offended that it was used in an enviroment that leaves me feeling somewhat naked, and I am sorry, I don't feel comfortable being that naked among the misery driven souls that seek to complain about their woes instead of offering constructive discussions. I am no longer participating in this thread so all of you can bitch all you want, tear apart my name in the assumption that any of you have a clue as to who I am. You read between lines that are only lines in the game you play, not the life I lead.
Sincerely
Tawnee Lynne

aaaaaaAAAAAAWWWW! Freak out! Le Freak . . . C'est Chic!

Damn, girl! Game on!

Continually throwing punches doesn't end a fight - two to tango & all that.

BTW - the old eplaya hit thread drift by the third post. I think its going rather well by comparison.

Halo Joe · Post by **Halo Joe** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 9:27 pm

Lots o' words from lots o' people.

Ouch, my head hurts!

Center Camp lost most of its appeal for me a couple of years ago ... BEFORE I camped with the BRCPO. Even last year, when I was at the PO 24/7 (seemed that way anyhow), the cafe just seemed to reminiscent of some large concert or something. I just didn't dig it much. Do I care if others do? Nope, not in the least. Have fun, enjoi!

Tips on the other hand ...

Now, in the interest of e-playa peace, I offer the immortal words of Rodney King: "Officer, have you seen my beer?"

jaywalker · Post by **jaywalker** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 10:13 pm

ok...I'm back. What did I miss. Wait, time for another PBR

Tawnee Lynne wrote:This is a string about center camp. Keep it there

I don't think I would ever waste my time hear if it wasn't for thread drift. Get used to it now, it only gets more interesting

Tawnee Lynne wrote:I did not bring any of you in this thread into my personal life, and if you took the inititive to look into who I am, at least keep it to yourselves.

bullshit (i am in a good mood. i just swear alot). The moment you put a link to your website, you put everything into the public domain. Doesn't matter what thread it's in. Chances are, most people post on every thread, and if you get hostile with someone in one thread, it will happen in another. The trick is to piss someone off on every thread. I think only III or contemptible russ could do that

Tawnee Lynne wrote:Post legitimate complaints and quit seeking sympathy for your bad time.

You haven't posted leigitimate complaints. I've argued with everyone, but we agree on certain concepts at different time. You seem to find it apalling, so "anti-burner" to not love center camp and all that is BMORG. That in itself by your definition is "non-burner". Your experience and epiphany seems to give you an aura where you can't be debated. I don't give a fuck about your website, or what the hell your going through, or mashed potatos. Emotions can be seperated from arguments, and should be. Otherwise you can feel picked on when people disagree with you. We all enjoy our verbal masturbation here. I don't need someone still overwhelmed telling me what it should be. I go out with newbies every year and see through their eyes. Doesn't mean we can't have our own opinions. But you better be able to defend them with reason and valid examples. Poetry is for descriptions. It's not like giving a dissertation, but please have a foot to stand on.

Tawnee Lynne wrote:I am not mad that my battle was mentioned outside my website, I am however offended that it was used in an enviroment that leaves me feeling somewhat naked, and I am sorry, I don't feel comfortable being that naked among the misery driven souls that seek to complain about their woes instead of offering constructive discussions.

hypocrite. public domain again. if a misery driven soul is someone who disagrees with you, your really reaching. have you offered a constructive solution? Or was that the starving artists need cafe to be able to go? I think getting rid of it would promote more community, increase interactions among neighbors, heighten awareness of people surrounding you and who doesn't fit in.

Attempting to make a commnity focal point at center camp dilutes the community enhancing aspects. I interacted more with the people in my village and immediately surrounding streets due to not going. On walkabouts I met more camps and kick ass people, than sitting on my ass in center camp listening to someone exlain their epiphany and how they get the burning man spirit, while calling me a spectator for wearing overalls (note this did not happen this year. Instead I got this response on the playa)

If you really want to see how important center cafe is to folks, take away the trash cans. See how many of these folks would go if they were supposedly responsible for taking there trash with them. It appears to be hard enough to walk their asses off the benches or couches and throw it in the proper receptacle. Yeah instead of saying I'm whining and why didn't I just pick up the trash, I'll say I did. I walked through to see if I felt any different this year. Nope. I walked and picked up 40 cups. Why did I count? Just in case some overglowing person tried to expound on me what it is all about. Let's just start putting in dumpsters and really turn it into Six Flags over Black Rock.

Ok...another beer. Hold on

Fuck it. I'm done

Kinetic · Post by **Kinetic** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 10:41 pm

Six Flags over Black Rock?

This would make a great cross post for the Disney-fication (sic) of BM. The possiblities are astounding.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 10:59 pm

jaywalker wrote:total tunnelvision to differing opinions, and accusations of ruining the spirit of burning man.

Aah, can we get off this and back to center camp?

I spent an inordinate amount of time on Saturday sitting in the sun in front of the man, and on my way back to my camp, stopped at center camp to just see it because I don't usually hang out there and was delighted to have some kind of killer re-hydrater and a couple of chai's while I watched the burning man fashion show, an exercise in sublime ridiculusnous that I have been meaning to see for years and always missed. If they hadna been selling nice drinks, I would gone back to my camp for water and probably taken a nap. It was quite fun.

Center camp good IMHO.

jaywalker · Post by **jaywalker** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:28 pm

abeerinthemorning wrote:I don't usually hang out there and was delighted to have some kind of killer re-hydrater and a couple of chai's while I watched the burning man fashion show, an exercise in sublime ridiculusnous that I have been meaning to see for years and always missed. If they hadna been selling nice drinks, I would gone back to my camp for water and probably taken a nap. It was quite fun.

ok. You had a good experience. I'm glad (no I'm not being sarcastic)

but, was the experience limited to having a drink and watching people? Was there a sense of building a community, as opposed to walking to camp and saying Hi to another camp that worked hard to be there, maybe getting a refreshment from them? Do you throw your cup in a trash recptacle (hopefully the correct one), leave it where you drank it, or take it back with you?
e-
As long as there is a center camp, there is no self-reliance, forget the no spectator (well forget this idea completley, we all do it, no matter how much we bust our ass doing something, we all do it. Fuck we all earn it at some point. Except the people who bitch, and just set up a tent as their total participation. Same with RV renters).

Sure it may be a bad analogy, but it's like gazing at the downtown library, then wandering over to the park to sit on a bench, eat a hot dog and look at joggers. Where is the community building portion. Where are these values that seem to change every year?

Fine, hears what it can be good for. All the cracked out playa-walkers that can't find their way back to their camp. Just put a strobe light in under a 80x80 tarp, and let the e-moths all migrate there at night. It would be funner than the etard patrol spinning wheel next to the Paddy Mirage on the esplanade.

You had fun in Center Camp. Great. I've had some good times there as well. I've taken a thermos of tea to neighbors, then refilled and wandered over there to share with folks. That's where interactivity lies, not walking up and saying 1 soy matte mocha chai thingy. I think it dilutes the spirit.

Fuck, the portapotties have more community building interactions. Let's start a thread about that. Maybe we can have one for experiences inside the porta pottie, and on for just before you went inside.

An;d I love a beer in the morning too.

Experiences in Center Camp

Proceeds from Cafe...

Re: Proceeds from Cafe...

personal animosity or center camp?

Re: personal animosity or center camp?