Sidestepping Marriage and Children

RangerTurtleDove · Post by **RangerTurtleDove** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:45 pm

Okay, so after a good amount of time I have decided marriage is not for me, and children definitely aren't for me. I like kids, just don't need to have one running around my house all the time. I like married people, but I also know if I am with someone and it is working I don't need a legal document telling me now it should always work, unless I want to end it (for a fee). I get that some (most) people want one, two, or most likely both of these things. I do not. Personally I feel like I am dodging bullets on this one. However all people that are either married or have children seem to think I am crazy (and a good majority of the ones that aren't for that matter). Why does one life choice seem so easy for everyone to understand and even expect, and the other just create dubious feelings and doubt?

Ah well, I envision a lifetime of travel and friendships. Sounds good to me.

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Post by **Elderberry** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:00 pm

Whatever works for you! Live life and be happy! That's all that counts.

JK

maryanimal · Post by **maryanimal** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:17 pm

I've been married twice and doubt I'll marry again. I agree with you in that if you love someone and know that you'll be together, then a piece of paper means very little. When two people want to live together and have that same love that make people want to marry, then that's all that matters. The love and respect, the trust and companionship, the harmony that exists between each other...I suppose some people need the legality of joining as a couple. And that's ok!

ok...th-th- th-th- that's all folks! *que Loony Tunes theme song*

RangerTurtleDove · Post by **RangerTurtleDove** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:34 pm

jkisha wrote:Whatever works for you! Live life and be happy! That's all that counts.

JK

True enough.

Risky · Post by **Risky** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:42 pm

I'm not childproofed.

Post by **AntiM** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:54 am

Marriage is good for some people in some circumstances. Military members who want benefits for their dependents for one. Although I didn't marry MyLarry for the benefits, we were both Navy and it gave us something of a chance to be together. 24 years now. No kids, the attempt nearly killed me, so we gave up that idea.

But hey, if you don't want to marry, don't.

The stats say married men live longer, but is it being married, or being with someone to look after each other?

pinemom · Post by **pinemom** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 8:32 am

From the bottom of the heart of a 3 times married with 2 children.
Dont Do IT!

Not because mine is bad, on the contrary, Im in bliss.

But for the world around you to be giving you a hard time about not indulging in those 2 items....Is cheeky at best.

It is even better to me that you KNOW what you want and what you dont!

Society is a real bad place for peer pressure, It makes Homicidal maniacs have kids just so they can kill them!

end...strange morning rambling.

daratheresa · Post by **daratheresa** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:29 am

i hated kids. til i had one. then i discovered that it's just other people's kids i don't like.

similarly, i never really thought i'd be married, but that happened, too. my husband and i have known each other for 12 years, have been married for five and a half. we disguised it as a financial thing, but in reality we are as cheesily and desperately in love as we were 12 years ago.

i guess what i'm trying to say is that sometimes these things sneak up on you even if you're not looking for them. it's admirable to be able to admit to yourself that it's not something you need to be happy. and it may turn out that you never get married and/or have kids. but don't turn down a good thing if it should happen by... it's almost always when we stop looking for love that we find it. or it finds us.

seriously, though, cheers for being able to say that you don't want it, that you don't need others to reach happiness and fulfillment.

*highfive*

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:47 am

RangerTurtleDove wrote:I don't need a legal document

As a widow, I am so grateful for that legal document. (And if you've heard the horrors that some same sex couples go through...)

daratheresa · Post by **daratheresa** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:00 am

theCryptofishist wrote:
RangerTurtleDove wrote:I don't need a legal document
As a widow, I am so grateful for that legal document. (And if you've heard the horrors that some same sex couples go through...)

good. point.

i'm not a widow, but i do spend up to a year at a time away from my husband, every other year. as she said, without that document i wouldn't have housing, health insurance, or even be able to handle our joint finances while he's away. and god help me if the car were to break down. actually, without that document, i wouldn't even be able to reach him in case of an extreme emergency, like a death in the family or some such. i'd have to go through the red cross to get him a message, and they won't take that message without a marriage document. it's pretty essential to our lifestyle.

tamarakay · Post by **tamarakay** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:23 am

never say never. i told kenman that i'd live with him forever, but i'd never marry him. men turned to idiots when they get married (in my experience). but five years down the road i showed up to take pictures of a staged wedding at a bed and breakfast and our families were all there and guess what? it was MY wedding. best thing i ever did. There is something powerful about standing up in front of all your loved ones saying I pick THIS ONE and he picks me. When it's the right one anyway. and here we are another 15 years into it and still just as nuts about each other.

now, kids on the other hand, I knew i'd have lots of them. Kenman and i have raised six delightful, wonderful, diverse young adults now. They were delightful as children, maddening as teens, and amazing adults.

I fully support you to do whatever it is you want to do with your life.

weirdscience · Post by **weirdscience** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:57 am

im 20 in 5-6 years i would like to be married and have a little version of me running around causing havoc .. maybe fate will smile upon me

Sail Man · Post by **Sail Man** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:10 am

weirdscience wrote:im 20 in 5-6 years i would like to be married and have a little version of me running around causing havoc .. maybe fate will smile upon me

God help us if it does

just kidding! LOL

2 marriages, 1 boy from each. 17 yrs apart. Older boy got his GF pregnant. She wants to give the baby up for adoption which my wife and I have discussed. We shall see. But if we do, I'll be retired long before I'm done with children in the house

geospyder · Post by **geospyder** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:50 pm

Married off and on 46 years. Two kids and four grandkids. Almost made it to 10 years the first time. Just passed 36 years this time. Told my wife the second time is definitely better but she's not going to find out

RangerTurtleDove · Post by **RangerTurtleDove** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:13 pm

tamarakay wrote:never say never.

There is just something about that mind set that gets to me (I'm not upset with you, just the frame of mind in general). When someone says "I plan to marry and have children some day"...you don't say "well, those are just plans, don't get your hopes up"...

I understand I may in fact end up married with five children...but my intention is not to...and when I get those knowing smiles from people when it comes up in conversation...or the "you just haven't met the right guy yet"....it has nothing to do with love, I can still love someone the same amount as a married woman and not be married...it's about thinking the institution of marriage is not my style.

I just wish people would be more accepting of it, instead of having to wait until I am in my 60's for people to even believe it.

weirdscience · Post by **weirdscience** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:25 pm

Sail Man wrote:
weirdscience wrote:im 20 in 5-6 years i would like to be married and have a little version of me running around causing havoc .. maybe fate will smile upon me
God help us if it does

just kidding! LOL

2 marriages, 1 boy from each. 17 yrs apart. Older boy got his GF pregnant. She wants to give the baby up for adoption which my wife and I have discussed. We shall see. But if we do, I'll be retired long before I'm done with children in the house

lol i worry for humanity if i have children

TomServo · Post by **TomServo** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:25 pm

daratheresa wrote:i hated kids. til i had one. then i discovered that it's just other people's kids i don't like. ;)

similarly, i never really thought i'd be married, but that happened, too. my husband and i have known each other for 12 years, have been married for five and a half. we disguised it as a financial thing, but in reality we are as cheesily and desperately in love as we were 12 years ago.

i guess what i'm trying to say is that sometimes these things sneak up on you even if you're not looking for them. it's admirable to be able to admit to yourself that it's not something you need to be happy. and it may turn out that you never get married and/or have kids. but don't turn down a good thing if it should happen by... it's almost always when we stop looking for love that we find it. or it finds us.

seriously, though, cheers for being able to say that you don't want it, that you don't need others to reach happiness and fulfillment.

*highfive*

My marriage failed because of Burning Man. And, she wanted to go! Fuck It! Marriage is between two people, and no one else! It works, or it doesnt! And I thank her every August for bringing me out.

tamarakay · Post by **tamarakay** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:24 am

RangerTurtleDove wrote:
tamarakay wrote:never say never.

There is just something about that mind set that gets to me (I'm not upset with you, just the frame of mind in general). When someone says "I plan to marry and have children some day"...you don't say "well, those are just plans, don't get your hopes up"...

quote]

To me, never say never, means keep ALL your options open. Any time I declare I'm never going this or that, or even I'm ALWAYS doing this or that, it bites me in my rear. And no, i don't say "well, those are just plans, don't get your hopes up.." I say, keep an open mind and be very very picky, don't settle just to have someone.

Zhust · Post by **Zhust** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:54 am

I'm in the same no-marry, no-kids boat. (And on no-kids, a couple years ago I *ahem* took birth control into my own hands, so-to-speak.)

I too get frustrated as RangerTurtleDove pointed out, when people pooh-pooh the idea of a commitment to no marriage yet fully support a commitment to heretofore unknown marriage. Isn't it just as insulting to tell someone who says they want to get married or have kids sometime in the future, "well, maybe you'll meet the right person and change your mind?"

One of the things I never liked about my past 4-year relationship was her desire to get married. I'm of the mindset that combining love and a cell phone contract is no way to have a great life together. I understand the desire to have legal rights together, I'm just pissed that it has to come as a package that encourages one party to go socially-acceptable bonkers and ruin the other's life. I'm specifically referring to the case where a couple starts out happily non-consumeristic and one party suddenly wants a house in the suburbs, the kids to go to private school, and to have 2 SUV's parked in the driveway. Because the consumeristic lifestyle is considered "normal" and "good for the kids" by the courts, the other person gets enslaved to support that lifestyle through alimony and child support. Since it is generally the woman who wields this power, as a man marriage is even less appealing. (Noting also that my statement is biased in that the U.S. hasn't grown out of grade-school name-calling concerning which genders may marry.)

Speaking of "as a man", I also get a lot of "you're just afraid of commitment". As if that's a bad thing. I have yet to meet someone who is growing in generally the same direction at generally the same rate as I am â€” and for long enough that I believe it'll last my whole life. A promise to be with someone until you die is not an improvement over mutual love and caring that naturally extends into the foreseeable future, but a gamble at best and a lie at worst. I much prefer the mindset of the year-long handfasting where you'd renew your marriage each year as it fits better with how I see reality working.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:34 am

Of course, marriage is trying to put (shove?) something into the wrong-shaped box. We are not naturally monogamous. I know that there are plenty of people, some of them on this board, who have happy marriages of some to many years standing. That is a tribute to the fact that we are a very adaptable species, as well as the strengths of the persons involved.

If it is true that small bands of hunter gatherers who rarely met other groups had, essentially, group marriages, then it may not be easy to go back to that either. The world is just too crowded; the basic circumstances in which we evolved may not be replicated too (ironically, here I am listening to Rammstein's Heirate Mich on the random play function of the ipod) easily.

I have no idea where we go from here.

But it might do to have some compassion for those who are so frightened by the conflict between what they want and what society considers "normal" that they can only react by panic and trying to force others into the prison they find themselves.

Sidestepping Marriage and Children

Sidestepping Marriage and Children

Re: Sidestepping Marriage and Children