Radiation

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:02 am

I'm splitting this off from the Japan quake thread. It's admitted that the Fukushima reactors will be giving off radiation and radioactive particles for a long time to come. Here's a link to the RadNet monitor;
http://www.epa.gov/radiation/rert/radnet-data-map.html
Here's a bit more for discussion;

California, Northwest, B.C. Canada under radiation as high as Japan

* By Alfred Lambremo..., Seattle Exopolitics Examiner
* April 4th, 2011 8:35 pm PT

Independent scientist Leuren Moret, MA, PhD (ABT) has stated in exclusive April 4, 2011 interviews with reporter Alfred Lambremont Webre that the effects of the tectonic nuclear war against the populations and breadbaskets of North America (Canada, United States, Hawaii, and Mexico) are being intentionally covered up by the administrations of Barack Obama in the United States and Prime Minister Stephen Harper in Canada.
The radiation effect of this false flag global radiation war intensified this week as radiation maps produced by the Norwegian Institute for Air Research (NILU) now confirm that the Midwest of the United States, all of California, the Northwest including the states of Oregon and Washington and the western part of Canada are under a radiation threat with radiation levels as high as that in Japan in areas adjacent to the six units of the Fukushima nuclear power plant that started in melt-down on March 11, 2011.
View exclusive April 4, 2011 interviews with independent scientist Leuren Moret
Readers can view the April 4, 2011 interviews with independent scientist Leuren Moret embedded in the article above or at the URL below:
Part 1. VIDEO: Leuren Moret - Coverup! California, Northwest USA, B.C. Canada under radiation threat as high as Japan

http://exopolitics.blogs.com/breaking_n ... japan.html
Part 2. VIDEO: Leuren Moret - Scientists declare northern 1/3 of Japan uninhabitable and should be evacuated - BREAKING NEWS

http://exopolitics.blogs.com/breaking_n ... oret-.html

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:16 am

how could the particulate matter, go from Japan, across the pacific, spread out across the vast area from B.C. to Mexico, and, to the mid west, and still have radiation levels as high as near the plant?

Simon of the Playa · Post by **Simon of the Playa** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:17 am

please stop feeding chicken little....he'll just make more chicken shit.

BBadger · Post by **BBadger** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:14 pm

EL OH EL. Leuren Moret? Really? Why don't you just quote Rense.com while you're at it.

The only place I could find anything on Moret's credentials was this site. I guess she got a degree in geology, an MA in Near Eastern Studies, and never finished a PhD in something in "geosciences." ABT means "all but thesis" meaning she never finished the dissertation for the degree but (supposedly) the coursework and maybe some research.

Usually the cause for an ABT is some extraordinary circumstance like a death in the family. I wonder what Leuren Moret's excuse is? Probably the lucrative market of wacko conspiracy theory campaigning. You know, like Tectonic Nuclear Warfare. The fact that she puts "PhD" at all, even with the "ABT" is just to make the "independent scientist" seem more credible.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 5:24 pm

Keep it real BBadger. I guess that I should have been more careful, especially about the first post. Now, I know what "ABT" means. Since the Japanese reactors aren't going to be completely contained for quite a while, I expect that there will be periodic updates. The current problem seems to be limited to an area northwest of Fukushima;
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/27_10.html

The reason for vigilance is that various official groups are telling us that radioactivity doesn't matter NEAR as much as previously believed. This is a note to that effect from Greenpeace; http://reliefweb.int/node/397989
Truth is, I don't trust the bastards to be honest about exposure.
â€œIt is utterly outrageous to raise the exposure levels for children to twenty times the maximum limit for adults. "
I'll try to post honest, relevant stuff and you can enforce the honesty. There seems to be a fair amount of censorship. This blog has several mentions from people in the business; http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/node/3118
Look at the figures for exposure from the FDA versus the EPA.
" * EPA does not allow drinking water to contain more than 3 picoCuries per liter of radioactive istotopes like iodine-131 and cesium-137.
* FDA allows up to 4,700 picoCuries of iodine-131 in a liter of milk and up to 33,000 picoCuries of cesium-137."

http://blogs.forbes.com/jeffmcmahon/201 ... -than-epa/
Like I said; vigilance.

Post by **Elderberry** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 5:57 pm

What difference does it really make how much radiation is spewing from the plant? If you can't fix it and you can't escape from it, why worry about it? Everybody is going to get sick and die from something some day anyway.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:21 pm

Use an umbrella. Doubt that it does any good but, that's what the Koreans are doing.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42469812/ns ... a-pacific/

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:41 pm

Can't Think Straight, you're a mentally crippled jackass of the first order.

No, seriously. You're a blathering, shit-for-brains, alarmist troglodyte who serves as a prime example of why the mothers of some animals eat their young. Too bad your mother didn't do us the same courtesy thereby sparing us your alarmist lies that episodic cerebral brain shits masquerading as an informed point-of-view.

For what it's worth my colleagues and I have been been assiduously monitoring and assessing the current situation in Japan since the March 11 tsunami paralyzed the Fukushima reactors. Suggesting a direct conspiracy or even an indirect participation in one on the part of these committed, dedicated professionals is a slap in the collective face of women and men who take their tasks quite fucking seriously. As with the truth itself you do these people no favor in your paranoid postings.

I'll not get into detail - but suffice it to say the detectable activity of the various isotopes associated with the forensic analysis of the plants has consistently remained well below the trigger levels for any intervention by fed/state/community emergency response agencies. There is no danger to life, health or well-being to anyone on the west coast from the effects of the tragedy that has struck Japan. Providing you with detailed specifics of modeling, monitoring, analysis and interpretation of the data not written in crayon would be a waste of my time.

I'll leave it at that. You deserve no more of my precious time.

You pathetic idiot.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:48 pm

You get points for clarity.

Post by **Elderberry** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:13 pm

can't sit still wrote:You get points for clarity.

LOL

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:45 pm

how could the particulate matter, go from Japan, across the pacific, spread out across the vast area from B.C. to Mexico, and, to the mid west, and still have radiation levels as high as near the plant?

Ygmir, the answer is because isotopes such as I-131 and the decay daughters such as Xenon, Krypton, etc aren't particulates. They're gaseous elemental isotopes. Easily injected into and distributed in the atmosphere.

Box Burner · Post by **Box Burner** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:08 am

OK folks. Lets get a little perspective on this. Radiation 101.

Just for the sake of argument lets say we have an activated piece of uranium 1/4 inch in diameter. Everyone get out you colored pencils and draw a red circle 1/4 inch in diameter. Now lets say that this particle has a dose rate of about 25 particles per second on contact. so then, using your ruler, draw 25 yellow 20 inch lines through the circle, equal distance apart, with the 10 inch mark in the middle so that they look like the rays of the sun. This will give you 50 "rays" along which our particles are traveling. 1 per second along each ray. Now draw a 4 inch blue line right next to the circle, on the right side of it, so that the 2 inch mark is just touching the edge of the circle. This is the target area for our radiation to strike. You will notice that less than 1/2 of the yellow rays are hitting the blue line. The number of yellow lines passing through our blue line is the dose rate, per second, on contact. If you draw a second 4 inch blue line 1 inch to the right of the right of the first one you will see that fewer yellow lines are hitting it. Draw a third blue line 1 inch farther to right and the number of yellow lines hitting that line will be even fewer. In fact if we continue to draw blue lines 1 inch to the right of the last line drawn we will see that the number of yellow lines hitting each subsequent blue line drops off rather quickly. So we see that the dose rate drops off quickly as we move farther away from the source.

We can compare our red circle to the Fukushima reactors, and the blue line to represent a 20 mile radius around the Fukushima reactors. So, to say that the entire west coast is getting the same amount of radioactive fallout as the area adjacent to the reactors is a bit alarmist. Even if the same amount as is being distributed in that 20 mile radius just out side the Fukushima reactors is being distributed all along the west coast of Canada and the US we can see that because distance, and the relative sizes of the areas of distribution, that the amount will be very low. Take into account that some of that is going to end up in the ocean, some on the coast and some will go farther inland. It would, of course, be different if all of it was landing on San Francisco. But it is not.

I realize that this comparison is somewhat crude, but really folks, most of the people reporting on this have no idea what they are talking about. they are reporters, and their first job is to get a story. Accuracy takes 2nd place.

BoxB

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:30 am

Badger wrote:
how could the particulate matter, go from Japan, across the pacific, spread out across the vast area from B.C. to Mexico, and, to the mid west, and still have radiation levels as high as near the plant?
Ygmir, the answer is because isotopes such as I-131 and the decay daughters such as Xenon, Krypton, etc aren't particulates. They're gaseous elemental isotopes. Easily injected into and distributed in the atmosphere.

see, that helps. thanks Badger.
I also wonder at the "half life" of many of these isotopes. (note isotope is not capitalized, she, is fun)

Are the gaseous radioactives shorter lived? maybe due to mass?
IIRC, iodine has a pretty short half life.

ETA: also, thanks BB, that is also very helpful.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:54 am

"Accuracy takes 2nd place" This is true from both perspectives. Everybody is exaggerating or diminishing the danger.
The miners lie. The processors lie. Kerr-Mcgee {"particularly serious violations of fundamental ethical norms".[4} WIKI
The reactor operators lie. TEPCO has lied consistently.
Who gives a shit if Iso or anybody else is monitoring this crap? I'm sure that there were plenty of monitors during all the years of above-ground nuclear tests. There are plenty of monitors for all the hundreds of tons of DU being vaporized on a continuing basis in war zones.
GOV just raises the danger threshold 1000 fold,,, presto, there is no danger. That isn't any consolation to those who contract disease as a result.
http://www.alphaweb.org/files/CWMOHJC_Mar2011.pdf
Monitors don't mean crap if the danger guidelines are useless. GOV and industry are doing their best to confuse and downplay the whole issue;
http://www.rense.com/general93/bull.htm

Lassen Forge · Post by **Lassen Forge** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:02 am

Box Burner wrote:OK folks. Lets get a little perspective on this. Radiation 101... I realize that this comparison is somewhat crude, but really folks, most of the people reporting on this have no idea what they are talking about. they are reporters, and their first job is to get a story. Accuracy takes 2nd place.

+100, BB. Nicely put.

Rule #1, of course, is to increase your market base by liberal and judicious use of rule #2 so you get a higher ratings share so you can get more ad revenue.

Rule #2 in media 101 is to make the story as big and flashy as you can, and find a "hook" to keep people tuned in, to grab and hold the consumers intrest to support Rule #1. Sensationalization is the key, to give the people entertainment so they won't look for it elsewhere.

Ever notice how most real stories fade after a while? You think Christchurch, NZ, is miraculously cured, that the 70+% of their buildings put themselves back together? It's no longer a shock story (like Fukushima) that will keep you glued to the advertizers, er, media outlet, so it's not selling ad space like the "you're all gonna die of radiation" story.

Ask Fox. They're masters at the Pseudonews Infotainment business. Their "NEWS ALERTS" and flash screens and multi-tickers and crap, even their idiot lines coming from their "talent"? All designed to hold you so you watch those ads over and over again. They win, playing you for the sucker. "Fair and balanced"? Yeah, they're fair to their stockholders, and their books are balanced. Their entertainment is just that - entertainment. Never forget that.

Now returning you to your media sponsored panic.

BBadger · Post by **BBadger** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 10:37 am

can't sit still wrote: Monitors don't mean crap if the danger guidelines are useless. GOV and industry are doing their best to confuse and downplay the whole issue;
http://www.rense.com/general93/bull.htm

HAHAHA, you did post a link to Rense.com. Now you've lost all credibility (as if there was much to lose).

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:25 pm

Are the gaseous radioactives shorter lived? maybe due to mass?
IIRC, iodine has a pretty short half life.

Each isotope has a very distinct, unique half-life. But to answer your question... yes. Many isotopes (solid and gaseous) have shot half lives. For instance, O 15 (Oxygen-15) is one of the gases formed in the fission process. It has a half-life of 122 seconds. Iodine 131 has a half-life of 8 days which is why we can detect it here in the west before it completely decays.

The issue with I-131 in large quantities is that when inhaled - especially in young kids - it gets take up into the thyroid gland. If enough uptake occurs there is a very real possibility of young children getting thyroid cancer. This has been borne out in epidemiological studies of people living close to Chernobyl. The idea behind taking potassium iodine tablets is that it saturates one's body with the regular element so that the thyroid is much, much less inclined to do an uptake of the radioactive version. Remember, the body is incapable of differentiating between a stable isotope of an element and a radioactive one.

If one assumes a complete fallout of the I-131 in the atmosphere and an even distribution of the isotope on the ground... followed by an uptake of the now contaminated grass by grazing cows.... who then pass it on through their milk..... to a human who then consumes it... the chances of health related remains almost inestimably small. In fact, for a person to receive a significant whole body dose of ionizing radiation due to milk consumption they'd have to drink ~ 86,000 glasses of milk... a day for a week.

But don't let me confuse you with facts.

Oh hell, try this on for fact checking... This graphic gives you an idea of relative radiation doses....

e

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:30 pm

And this one gives you a pretty good idea of health risks related to exposure. Note that the detectable amounts of I-131 (related to Fukushima) when modeled to include breathing it in a 24 hour day will give west coast persons a whole body exposure to ionizing radiation somewhere just below the Potassium exposure one would receive eating a single banana a day.

But again, don't let me confuse you with facts - especially you Can't Think Straight.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:33 pm

so, really, the danger from I-131 is inhalation?

I guess what I'm getting at, is, it seems even if these radioactive materials, are released at a high concentration (locally in Japan), by the time they cross the Pacific, get mixed with the atmosphere, disseminate/diffuse over and area thousands of times larger than were they began, decay through their half life over the week or more travel time, and still manage to stay aloft , and then fall at a dilusions rate per area that must be in the .0001 or more scale. I have a hard time imagining them being that dangerous.

But, I know you work in the industry, or think I remember that, so, appreciate first hand knowledge such as this.

thanks.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:33 pm

Iso, GREAT info. I just need to post heresy and someone will do the work.

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:41 pm

Usually the cause for an ABT is some extraordinary circumstance like a death in the family. I wonder what Leuren Moret's excuse is? Probably the lucrative market of wacko conspiracy theory campaigning. You know, like Tectonic Nuclear Warfare. The fact that she puts "PhD" at all, even with the "ABT" is just to make the "independent scientist" seem more credible.

Having watch part of her video I suspect intellectual laziness had everything to do with her not making the cut. She's a disingenuous, pretentious fuckhole. I had her flagged when she mentions alpha radiation in relation to I-131. Iodine is not an alpha emitter. It decays by electron emission (aka beta decay). Someone needs to force feed her an entire bag of Quickcrete instant cement.

Simon of the Playa · Post by **Simon of the Playa** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 3:47 pm

iso...plus one million.

CSS...you suckle turds.

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 4:54 pm

Well, I see my poodle is back

,, sniffing everything that he finds. Someone at BMORG bitch-slapped him pretty hard. He's come crawling out at last. Ready to flex his mental powers and lay claim to alpha-male on the E-playa. Anonymity makes him brave and nasty. Too bad he can't hear everyone laughing at him. Can't get attention by saying anything smart so, he has to settle for nasty.

Well, it's a tough world for the microencepheletics.

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Sun May 01, 2011 12:35 am

snore.....

ceolwynn · Post by **ceolwynn** » Sun May 01, 2011 7:16 am

hi,
I am an ex nuclear power plant and DOE site
worker with most of my experience and training
in Radiation safety. I read tons of blogs and
rarely reply but felt compelled recently where
they are making the americans think their
thyroid is gonna explode cause they are getting
free japanese chest xrays 10 times a day.

by the way... jkisha ... LOVE the emo phillips quote !!!
do I detect a bit of sam harris -or-
dawkins in you ??? hmmm. we should talk ?

and to BBadger... I do a quick research on most
people stating amazing claims,
especially as many of them as
this not-a-scientist Morte spout.
but I actually checked her after
I saw the 10th or so obvious tech
error in her video.

watch what she says at the marks... pretty funny.
13:25 Priceless !!! this one alone should be spread
everywhere to show her true reality connection...
and the 22 , 47 min marks are great too.

and to Badger : where ygmir asked,
how can particulates cross the ocean,
then diffuse greatly, and still give us
radiation levels "as high as" near the plant.

the proper answer is that they cant.

diffusion / dilution always reduces, and since
radiation decreases logarithmically as distance
from source increases it is far from the same
as a chemical dilution.

I-131 decays into a NON RADIOACTIVE
isotope of zenon, and not into anything else.

also, PLEASE read about the treatments for hyperthyroidism.
.........................................
If your doctor sends you to a nuclear medicine department
to have your thyroid function tested, he will use I-131 to test
that. The dose they give you is approximately 111,000 Bq of
I-131 to see how much your thyroid takes up....
That does is 10,000 times the amount detected in rainwater
at SFU. In 50 years of performing this test, there is zero
difference in cancer rates between tested and untested populations.
< so, if you drink 10,000 liters of the SFU rainwater.
you will experience the does of one thyroid test
but only if you drink the water really really fast>

If you go to a doctor with a hyperactive thyroid, they will
treat that with I-131, in the amount 370,000,000 Bq. This is
35,000,000 times the amount in the rainwater. Again, you
guessed it, zero difference in cancer rates, even in the 10%
of people who get a 2nd treatment.

If you come up with thyroid cancer, they will treat your thyroid
with about 5,000,000,000 Bq of I-131. Yes, 5 billion. With a â€œB.â€

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Sun May 01, 2011 8:09 am

Ceolwynn, it's contributions like your's that make the e-playa worth reading. I tend to be a contrarian and post stuff for people to shoot at. It keeps the interest going and often leads to a fairly accurate picture. I often see where the knowledgeable people keep it to themselves until provoked by heresy. Then, they grit their teeth and straighten us out. We all learn something new.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun May 01, 2011 8:15 am

interesting, and thank you for taking the time, ceolwynn.

and, thanks for addressing my quetion. Your answer is what I surmised, but, not being an expert, I wanted to ask.

Welcome!!!

Simon of the Playa · Post by **Simon of the Playa** » Sun May 01, 2011 11:23 am

can't sit still wrote:Ceolwynn, it's contributions like your's that make the e-playa worth reading. I tend to be a contrarian and post stuff for people to shoot at. It keeps the interest going and often leads to a fairly accurate picture. I often see where the knowledgeable people keep it to themselves until provoked by heresy. Then, they grit their teeth and straighten us out. We all learn something new.

OMFG....CSS is actually Donald Trump.

makes perfect sense now.....

can't sit still · Post by **can't sit still** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:27 am

Here are some comments by the most senior advisor to the Japanese Nuclear institute. It's interesting that they are posted in English and also Japanese script. He says that the tsunami did not cause the failures.
http://ex-skf.blogspot.com/2011/04/fuku ... clear.html

Simon of the Playa · Post by **Simon of the Playa** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:32 am

i'm still waiting for Canned Shit Shill to ask for isotopia's school records.