Champagne Lounge 2011

Minxy · Post by **Minxy** » Thu May 12, 2011 8:59 am

Thanks!

It's still a fuzzy line because I'm sure some of the Kickstarter money for the temple and other similar projects might go for TOOLS which are items of monetary value that would be kept.

Just still really rubs me the wrong way.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Thu May 12, 2011 9:01 am

Minxy wrote:Fundraising, in the way I believe it's generally used for BM IMO, is when you're raising funds for a non-profit, selfless purpose. Say, the 2011 temple. Will those people get to keep large, costly items for themselves after raising $20k? No, it's going to be set up for a week for thousands to enjoy and then burned for thousands to see.

I would argue that fund-raising parties do work like that. Not that that makes it "okay" but that the wickets seem to have jam on them.

Post by **Elderberry** » Thu May 12, 2011 9:14 am

theCryptofishist wrote:
Minxy wrote:Fundraising, in the way I believe it's generally used for BM IMO, is when you're raising funds for a non-profit, selfless purpose. Say, the 2011 temple. Will those people get to keep large, costly items for themselves after raising $20k? No, it's going to be set up for a week for thousands to enjoy and then burned for thousands to see.
I would argue that fund-raising parties do work like that. Not that that makes it "okay" but that the wickets seem to have jam on them.

I think fund raising parties/events are OK, for reasons I have previously explained.

C.f.M. · Post by **C.f.M.** » Thu May 12, 2011 9:17 am

I'm not sure how I feel about it, but I blogged a bit about it (click on the link in my sig) and used some quotes from this thread.

Well, I know how I feel about it. It's commerce; there's no diffrence between "give me ten bucks and I'll give you a hat" on Kickstarter and "give me ten dollars and I'll give you a hat" on Etsy. As long as it's not pretending to be anything else, I'm OK with camps using Kickstarter.

Minxy · Post by **Minxy** » Thu May 12, 2011 10:25 am

Angst! Angst! Angst!

I'm not sure why this fills me with angst.

I read C.f.m.'s blog and was reminded that buying a Dusty Swan/Ludo's mug didn't phase me at all although it's a similar situation.

I have figured out that the reason I don't mind Kickstarter for projects such as the temple and even other large scale projects is they are EPIC.

Sometimes as in the case of the temple they are traditional. They will serve thousands. From what I've seen, you don't get a super VIP happy hour invite or pass to ride our cool art car (that you should be able to ride without having to pay...it's a gift to the community, right?)

Dusty Swan's mug sale/camp donation was brought to my attention this year by one of C.f.m.'s posts which may be why it didn't trip my switch like this camp did.

Do they have a right to beg on Kickstarter? Sure, if it's not against the rules. I personally won't support them in that way but /shrug.

Trishntek · Post by **Trishntek** » Thu May 12, 2011 10:47 am

but, But, BUTTTTT

To actually DO something to raise funds is admirable. Producing a service or good for a "profitable" return (usually, labor is gratis) to fund your project or camp is entirely different than asking for unconditional money to fund a pie-in-the-sky idea which may or may not even materialize.

Our camp IS OUR GIFT to BRC. How can it be the sponsor's "gift" if the treasury is everybody else's GIFT? The vast majority of stuff in our camp is MY PERSONAL STUFF which I choose to make available for the enjoyment of all. Is that not what a GIFT is?

HandJamMasterC · Post by **HandJamMasterC** » Thu May 12, 2011 10:54 am

Wow, why didn't I think of this before ? We have a champagne bar / theme camp too. But now I think I'll start a Kickstarter fund drive to make my champagne theme camp a Rolls Royce limo / art car! We can pick Burners up at their camp, pour them fine French champagne in crystal stemware while cruising across the playa ( at 5 mph of course ) and drop them off wherever they desire ! I just need to raise $ 250K for my " art car " !

And I'll need this chauffeur............

C.f.M. · Post by **C.f.M.** » Thu May 12, 2011 11:02 am

I do love champagne....

It all boils down to philosophy, like I blogged about. The principle of the thing. LNT, RsR, gifting...it's a principle, not a rule, and therefore open to interpretation.

What I'm interested in is how this will play out. Groups only get the money if ALL of the stated goal is reached.

So, if a group sets a goal of $1000, and they only get $251 pledged, they end up with $0.

Post by **Elderberry** » Thu May 12, 2011 11:21 am

I'm like that it seems the consensus is building on this. It has helped me clarify my thinking and I am now sure that Kickstarter for private camps and activities is definitely more commerce and a pious attempt to raise funds for a community "gift".

havoc · Post by **havoc** » Thu May 12, 2011 11:57 am

C.f.M. wrote:So, if a group sets a goal of $1000, and they only get $251 pledged, they end up with $0.

completely outside of the scope of the specifics of this debate - that's actually one of the things i like about kickstarter. if you can't get enough community support OR you set your sights too high, you have to go back to the drawing board and rethink your project, your budget or your approach...maybe all 3.

C.f.M. · Post by **C.f.M.** » Thu May 12, 2011 12:02 pm

havoc wrote:
C.f.M. wrote:So, if a group sets a goal of $1000, and they only get $251 pledged, they end up with $0.
completely outside of the scope of the specifics of this debate - that's actually one of the things i like about kickstarter. if you can't get enough community support OR you set your sights too high, you have to go back to the drawing board and rethink your project, your budget or your approach...maybe all 3.

Gonna ask you a question in the thread more related to the generals of using Kickstarter to fund a camp.

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Thu May 12, 2011 1:38 pm

Wasn't Burning Man great when everyone was free to follow their bliss?

C.f.M. · Post by **C.f.M.** » Thu May 12, 2011 1:50 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote:Wasn't Burning Man great when everyone was free to follow their bliss?

I can't afford any bliss this year. Do you have some to spare?? I will come to your camp and dance - I'm a DJ!!!!!

Bounce530 · Post by **Bounce530** » Thu May 12, 2011 3:29 pm

C.f.M. wrote:I do love champagne....

As noted in my stalker notebook.

Magiccannoncat · Post by **Magiccannoncat** » Thu May 12, 2011 3:40 pm

Well you can come dance, sing, and drink at the Champage Lounge for sure!

I guess some of you are right, Ive never thought of it in that way.

We arent trying to fund our entire camp from kickstarter, just trying to off set some of the cost. but I could see how some people would find it not kosher.
after doing all this stuff to try to make our kickstarter work, I can def say, it isnt suited the best for our kind of project. it was just one of those things, once we started it, why not let it go to end and atleast try to make it work.

As for sharing stuff or teaming up with other camps, I hadnt thought of that at all! very good idea! the most I have thought along those lines is When all the theme camps get placed I wanted to organize a day time happy hour bar crawl, either all around town or ring road bars.
But my camp is going to do all the stuff we say, with or with out money raised from fundraisers. it was just one of those why not try things.

Post by **Savannah** » Thu May 12, 2011 4:16 pm

You have a good attitude, Magiccannoncat, and I wish you good luck.

zorro sings · Post by **zorro sings** » Thu May 12, 2011 6:28 pm

Savannah wrote:You have a good attitude, Magiccannoncat, and I wish you good luck.

Agreed.

Minxy · Post by **Minxy** » Thu May 12, 2011 6:35 pm

Triple agree! I like your attitude, Magiccannoncat.

Trishntek · Post by **Trishntek** » Thu May 12, 2011 8:20 pm

I'm so glad you did not take this personally. Some of us just get a little riled when we sense a new precedent being considered which seemingly erodes the principles. Thank you for understanding!

C.f.M. · Post by **C.f.M.** » Fri May 13, 2011 6:19 am

Bounce530 wrote:
C.f.M. wrote:I do love champagne....
As noted in my stalker notebook.

I'll accidentally let slip my room number at the appropiate time...

HandJamMasterC · Post by **HandJamMasterC** » Fri May 13, 2011 8:49 am

Triple agree! I like your attitude, Magiccannoncat.

Ditto here. I'll try and wander over with a bottle of champagne to share with you guys !

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Fri May 13, 2011 9:21 am

C.f.M. wrote:I can't afford any bliss this year. Do you have some to spare??

Gallons!

You just have to know where to look.