My Letter to the DMV

[Kind Herb]

I sent this to the DMV, and I thought I would share it with all of you.

Kind Herb

From: Kind Herb
To: [email protected]
Subject: New Regs on Art Cars

Dear DMV & Burning Man,

This letter is in response the the article in the BM Journal
about the new regulations pertaining to art cars.

While I applaud the efforts made to increase safety and the overall
experience of Burning Man, I feel that the solutions put forth
will not solve the problems you are trying to address, and
will result in the "loss of culture" that you are desparately
trying to avoid.

I believe firmly that safety should be the highest priority, as it
was my friend Omar who was run over while sleeping in his tent
at BM '96.

However the feelings I was left with after reading the article is that
safety was not the highest concern, but that art cars conform to
the phantom art standards to be determined by the DMV, and BM's Art
Dept.

If safety is BM's primary concern then it needs to enforce speed limits not
just for art cars, but for all vehicles on the playa. In all of my years of
attending BM, the biggest problem speeders were not the art cars, but the
DPW and BR Rangers.

One year after asking one of them to slow down, he proceeded to get out
of his vehicle and yell at us. He said that he had been out there for
months and that he could do whatever he wanted. And that if we didn't
like it we should go f**k ourselves and leave.

So I ask what is BM doing to address that problem?

Granted this is somewhat of an isolated incident, but if BM is
going to ban art cars for multiple violations, then I feel the same should
apply to the DPW and BR Rangers.

Judging what qualifies as art at Burning Man, should not be the job
of anyone associated with BM. Especially the DMV. If this is where
BM is heading then I believe that BM is no longer representing the
spirit that inspired the festival to exist in the first place.

One year, we happened to camp nearby the DMV, and I got to personally
witness the process first hand, and I was appalled by what some of
the participants had to go through to get their art car approved. Not
saying it was widespread throughout the DMV, but art is subjective, and
to have someone tell you straight to your face that your vehicle isn't
art, should never be an occurance at BM!

And I have had friends who have been attending BM for years, who
were denied art car permits, not because their car wasn't "art"
enough, but due to personal/political reasons between them and
personnel within the DMV.

The solutions put forth in the article only seem to exacerbate this
problem, by making the whole registration process a judging of what
is/isn't art. If this attitude increases then do not be suprised if
participants defy the regulations and operate their art cars anyways.

Wasn't Burning Man founded on the spirit of rebellion and disobedience to
the rules and standards put forth by everyday society?

What is/isn't art is up to the individual participants to decide.
And more so, even if someone doesn't like it, it doesn't mean
it is any less art.

The article makes a hasty generalization about art cars, "...it is not
enough to do a chop job on a beater, decorate it with paint and tinsel,
and call it art..."

This term could be used to describe 99% of the art cars on the playa. 100%
if the beholder is someone who doesn't attend BM or never heard of it.

And I would argue that even bad/ugly art has it's place on the playa. If
someone sees an art car, and thinks "Hell, I can do better than that!"
and proceeds to build their better art car, isn't that the inspiration
that BM is trying to promote?

The article goes on to say "...call it art in order to obtain a ride for the
of the event." And asks participants "Am I creating this vehicle to have a ride
or give a group of friends a ride?"

Not saying that creating a piece of art isn't the primary motivation for
creating an art car, but I know for a fact that one of the reasons that
people create art cars is so they can have a mode of transportation for
themselves and their friends.

If there is going to be a registration process then it should be a
safety inspection on the vehicle more than a judgement call on
whether or not is it art.

We all don't have the time or money to make "... the most beautiful
and visionary work possible" And a lot of times it is a work in progress.
We do what we can, and hope that everything will turn out as we envisioned,
but that isn't always the case.

What I would like to see happen, is for BM to make the art car
process as simple and easy as possible. However, that every person
who wants to operate an art car on the playa, obtain a Playa Permit
before hand. BM could charge $5-$10 for the permit, which can help
handle the new overhead associated with sharing information between
the DMV, BM, and the BR Rangers.

The article talks about how two art cars will not be allowed back to BM
due to multiple violations. And with safety in mind, I agree with
the decision, however did it really solve the problem? If the operators
are allowed back on the playa with a different vehicle, then I say
that it has not only failed to solve the problem, but has resulted in a
loss of culture, because now those two vehicles, which many participants
have tied to BM will not be there.

The article also states that it will not be possible to shrug off 2,3,4
warnings from the rangers. Well was it the same operator driving the
vehicle each time the warning was issued? And if not what is BM doing
to address the problem?

Art cars are just vehicles, that can't do anything without an operator. And
I feel that BM is going about it the wrong way by targeting art cars, rather
than art car operators.

BM and the DMV should never be in the position to judge what is and
what isn't art. If that is where it is heading then it is no longer
about free expression and the creation of art, but rather the promoting
and marketing of the Burning Man image.

I hope that this doesn't fall onto deaf ears, as I do truly love BM
and what it represents, and to see it heading in this direction is
saddening to say the least.

Many thanks for all of the hard work and effort that everyone has put forth
to make Burning Man possible and I wish all of you the best!

Sincerely,

Herb Woodruff

[Badger]

However, that every person
who wants to operate an art car on the playa, obtain a Playa Permit
before hand.

The only suggestion which you offered up in all of your criticisms is one that is currently in place. I'm sure that you're not the only one with complaints about enforcement of a policy which has been around for several years but honestly, hurling complaints without providing suggestions on how to correct or even address them is often looked upon as just so much whining.

Seriously, as a volunteer my reaction to the "Why aren't Rangers/DPW/DMV doing x" or "Ranger/DPW/DMVs don't do x right" or (my fave) "Rangers/DPW/DMV really ought to think about..."

So the question I'd ask is this: if you feel so damned impassioned about something you see needs correcting or changing about the event or its policies then why the hell aren't you stepping up to the plate to affect the changes you'd like to see take place?

[allanon2]

are not \allowed outside the boundaries of the evnt. I ave almost been run over or had my forward motion stopped by BM rangers and DPW in previous years.

why does everyoen in this world have to offer suggestions. they are informing them of what they think.
and letting BMORG hopefully come up with a betetr option.

why does everyone have to spend hundreds of hours reinveting the wheel
can't people offer comments on what thye think? or is the 1st amendment not allowed on EPLIYA and at BM?

herb dont let people yell at you and tell you what to do. Your letter was very well written and will gegt many peopel to think
thank you for sharing it with us.

ttyl
rex

quote="Badger"]

However, that every person
who wants to operate an art car on the playa, obtain a Playa Permit
before hand.

The only suggestion which you offered up in all of your criticisms is one that is currently in place. I'm sure that you're not the only one with complaints about enforcement of a policy which has been around for several years but honestly, hurling complaints without providing suggestions on how to correct or even address them is often looked upon as just so much whining.

Seriously, as a volunteer my reaction to the "Why aren't Rangers/DPW/DMV doing x" or "Ranger/DPW/DMVs don't do x right" or (my fave) "Rangers/DPW/DMV really ought to think about..."

So the question I'd ask is this: if you feel so damned impassioned about something you see needs correcting or changing about the event or its policies then why the hell aren't you stepping up to the plate to affect the changes you'd like to see take place?[/quote]

[Kind Herb]

->The only suggestion which you offered up in all of your criticisms is one that is currently in place.

This is to clarify.

I am not talking about art cars getting permits, but operators getting permits. That means that if you want to drive an art car, any art car, yours or a friends, that you need to get a Permit, or a playa driver's license if you will.

That way responsibility falls upon the operator of the art car, and not the art car itself.

Kind Herb

[dragonfly Jafe]

Sorry about your friend - a tragedy for sure.

The article you mention left out a few things. The application process was very detailed this year, requiring "essays" on subjects such as design safety, lighting, entrance/exit, etc. The DMV has made it very clear during the application process that the person who's name is on the application is responsible to DMV for the vehicle at all times, regardless of who is driving. If the vehicle does bad things, both it and the owner can be punished (as well as the driver).

Art is subjective, but I get the feeling that improvements have/are being made also. If things are as bad this year as they have been in the past, I may re-read what you have to say. But I predict things will be better. Not perfect, but better. YMMV.

[allanon2]

blm has required in their site stipulations all the things you just mentioned
the problem is that it has been in the stipulations for years but as i see has not been inforced. This year it looks like BMORG is triying to follow their rules that have been put in place..

ttyl
rex

Sorry about your friend - a tragedy for sure.

The article you mention left out a few things. The application process was very detailed this year, requiring "essays" on subjects such as design safety, lighting, entrance/exit, etc. The DMV has made it very clear during the application process that the person who's name is on the application is responsible to DMV for the vehicle at all times, regardless of who is driving. If the vehicle does bad things, both it and the owner can be punished (as well as the driver).

Art is subjective, but I get the feeling that improvements have/are being made also. If things are as bad this year as they have been in the past, I may re-read what you have to say. But I predict things will be better. Not perfect, but better. YMMV.

[Stormy]

Didn't someone write on Eplaya, that the Department of Mutant Vehicles is only offering permits to mutated vehicles? Sounded like it wasn't just a matter of aesthetics, but whether the vehicle had been seriously altered.

[Dork]

I am not talking about art cars getting permits, but operators getting permits.

How would you recommend enforcing that? Would I need a "Mutant Operator" sticker bonded to my forehead so people know that I'm licensed? Can I drive anything I want if I'm licensed?

Are you suggesting that if someone drives so dangerously that they get their car impounded that it's easy for them to find another mutant to drive? That mutant owners will just let anyone drive the thing they spent hundreds or thousands of hours and dollars creating? When there are cars running wild, they can just keep switching drivers until their whole group runs out of permits rather than just shutting them down right away?

I fail to see the advantage.

The only changes I would make to the current process would be to add a negotiation step to the process where they give some feedback about problem areas and extending the final deadline by a month.

[ckburn]

And if not what is BM doing to address the problem?

Wow, now there's some insight... Do you subscribe to the JRS newsletter by any chance? If so, please go back and re-read the issue that was distributed on 14 July, entitled "Special Driving Edition". In there, it clearly lays out what "BM" is doing to address the safety problem. Here's an excerpt:

In 2004, unauthorized vehicles (unmodified ones not registered with DMV) caught driving in Black Rock City may be fined by outside law
enforcement agencies, removed by escort or towed by the Black Rock
Rangers. Repeat offenders may be evicted. Further, unsafe operation of
licensed mutant vehicles (speeding, recklessness, impaired driver, etc.)
can result in revocation of your ability to operate your vehicle and
will be subject to the same sanctions as outlined for non-approved
vehicles.

Seems pretty clear to me that the organization is taking the safety matter quite seriously and has every intention of removing the problem vehicles this year. I have to agree with Dork that an operator's license would seem to serve no better purpose. If you want your art car to stay on the Playa this year, you'd better make damned sure it's being driven by someone with a brain. And someone who is committed to being sober while behind the wheel. Or joystick. Or whatever.

Finally, if you want to know what "BM" is doing about it... FIND OUT. Go volunteer to be a Ranger. Go volunteer at Playa Info. Get involved and help make your beloved city a better place. Not to say you aren't already involved... It just didn't sound like it.

I completely agree that DPW and BRR should drive carefully and within the standard driving rules except in emergencies. I see people from both groups doing exactly that all the time, but there are exceptions. Those should be dealt with. You can help by reporting them.

And as far as this art judging bullshit goes, that, in my opinion, is a crock of ka-ka. With all due respect, of course.

- CK

[Captain Goddammit]

A lot of people are criticizing the DMV for "judging art" this year. But even more people were complaining about all the ATVs towing party barges, the golf carts with a string of Christmas lights, the Toyotas with trinkets glued all over them, and other assorted piece of shit "art" cars driving all over the place. If all you have to do is spray paint a penis on the side of your Lexus (an old DMV example of what doesn't qualify) to be able to drive on the playa, why bother with driving regulations at all?

Really, guys, you all saw a lot of bullshit "art cars" driving in past years. Glue some fur on your golf cart/ATV/old Corolla and presto, you get to drive your car at BM. Because you called it art.

They had to do something, and requiring the vehicles that are allowed to drive at BM to show some real effort sounds like they're trying to solve the problem we were all bitching about last year.

[ckburn]

And as far as this art judging bullshit goes, that, in my opinion, is a crock of ka-ka. With all due respect, of course.

Just realized I wasn't all that clear here... What I intended to say was that whining about the DMV judging art is a proverbial crock. In general the freakin awesome stuff gets in, the crap doesn't. And that's the way it should be. Yeah, it's possible some semi-crap gets in by virtue of blatant bribery with liquor or sex... but I think that's the way it should be too. We don't have to conform to established norms out here, thankfully.


- CK

[Rob the Wop]

My $.02

There have been art car camps for years at Burning Man. It was always one of the trippier aspects of the event. Now they aren't 'cool' enough to qualify. These are all cars that regularly star in art car parade and events off the playa. Cars that have been worked on for years.

In 99' a buddy tried to get a DMV sticker for his Grande Mutant. It was a statement of the over-hype of the 'American dream' with 16 headlights and various other modifications (welded, chopped, amd permenant) to make the uber-consumer car. It had won first prize at one of the bigger art car events. Didn't get a sticker.

Off the top of my head I can name about seven art car folk that won't be going this year. I could probably triple that number with a few phone calls or asking around. These are folks that do this on a regular basis outside of the event.

The requirements sound more geared towards 'party barges' and less towards truely artistic expression. At least that was my impression seeing what was driving around last year.

So I guess the answer is- let the DMV give stickers to whoever they want. The event's changing, art is no longer the driving force.

I'm bringing a pacifier and glow in the dark cockring. I'm assuming I'm then considered a participant.

[Dork]

Another point about judging of art.. my (approved) application showed little about the quality of the art I was bringing. I sent in a picture of a chopped up car with a bunch of square bar welded to it and a description of what I had left to do. Although the tail did look kind of cool, it was not what I would call asthetically pleasing. It won't be until the shell is finished.

What was painfully obvious in my application was the scope of what I was attempting and the fact that I had thought seriously about safety and how it will operate on the playa. Also, I was far enough along that there's a good chance I would get done.

[bdongray]

OK... I'm backtracking to discuss the real underlying basic problem with all this...

So what is wrong with a "Lexus with a penis painted on the side" driving around BRC?
a) Is it the rest of us are jealous they get a nice ride? While we all get sweaty, sore butts on our bicycles.
b) Is it we don't consider that art? And we wish to push what <b>we</b> consider as art to only exist at BLC.
c) Is it that if this trend was pushed to the limit, BRC would have too many cars driving around? Thus... unsafe. Although a single vehicle itself is not unsafe, and probably would be amusing to see drive by.

Thoughts and other reasons?

It was suggested to pose solutions...

Solution idea 1. Do not allow *any* motorized vehicles allowed to drive around BRC without an explicit need, such as arriving/leaving to your camp, water trucks, JOTS. This includes rangers & LEOs not driving, unless they have a specific destination, such as being called to an emergency. I'd prefer to see LEOs on bicycles - instead of cruising.
If people are uncomfortable with just showing their art vehicle at their camp, and want it to be moving to exhibit some feature, then maybe there should be an art car enclosure, where art cars would be on show parked, and perhaps a part designated as a place to drive around.

Solution idea 2. Disband DMV licensing. BUT... strictly enforce speed limits, and crackdown on dangerous driving.

Solution idea 3. Only have the DMV looking for unsafe features, like sharp objects that can impale passers by who don't move out of the way. And let's hope only a few people drive their Lexus cars around. And again strictly enforce speed limits, etc.

Personally, if people are driving their golf cart with (or without) a bit a fur glued to it, is ok with me.
I'm 50-50 about ATVs but think they should have at least SOME minimal art effort.
I *do not* like electric scooters as they seem to constantly break the 5mph speed limit.

This year...
I do hope to go see the impound lot with my camera, as I'm sure there will be some impressive vehicles who tried getting in. Does anyone know if that'll be possible?

[Piper]

OK... I'm backtracking to discuss the real underlying basic problem with all this...

So what is wrong with a "Lexus with a penis painted on the side" driving around BRC?
a) Is it the rest of us are jealous they get a nice ride? While we all get sweaty, sore butts on our bicycles.

One of the main themes of BM is participation, in a unmodified vehical(just painted), you become the observer. A parked unmodified art car is art and as people come to see it and you get to explain and show off, you participate. Hot August Nights http://www.hotaugustnights.net/ would be a good examlpe of this, people come to look at the cars parked around town and talk to the owners. While HAN is also a place to cruze your car, the Playa is not really, IMO, a venue for driving around all buttoned up just to be seen with no interaction

b) Is it we don't consider that art? And we wish to push what <b>we</b> consider as art to only exist at BLC.

I do not think its a valuation of art so much as keeping the numbers of vehicals down for safety etc. If you brought the said Lexus and parked it you are not licenced and, IMO again, welcome. The licence is to drive around the city, nothing about static displays.

c) Is it that if this trend was pushed to the limit, BRC would have too many cars driving around? Thus... unsafe. Although a single vehicle itself is not unsafe, and probably would be amusing to see drive by.

I would go with this. from the BM FAQ
Black Rock City is a pedestrian-friendly city that is easy to navigate with a bicycle or on foot. We encourage you to decorate your transportation. You may not drive your car at the event. This is a serious safety issue - moving cars create large clouds of dust, reducing visibility dramatically. Please recognize the importance of this rule

It was suggested to pose solutions...

Solution idea 1. Do not allow *any* motorized vehicles allowed to drive around BRC without an explicit need, such as arriving/leaving to your camp, water trucks, JOTS. This includes rangers & LEOs not driving, unless they have a specific destination, such as being called to an emergency. I'd prefer to see LEOs on bicycles - instead of cruising.
If people are uncomfortable with just showing their art vehicle at their camp, and want it to be moving to exhibit some feature, then maybe there should be an art car enclosure, where art cars would be on show parked, and perhaps a part designated as a place to drive around.

Not a bad Idea and I agree with most of it, I would just add that we still allow truly mutated vehicals to be on the inner playa.

Solution idea 2. Disband DMV licensing. BUT... strictly enforce speed limits, and crackdown on dangerous driving.

where would we have parking, I can see a giant parking lot just off the Esplanade at 6 .. ie. "I am just going to Center camp for bit, be back soon" and cars cruzin the streets looking for that "cool" camp we heard about last night

Solution idea 3. Only have the DMV looking for unsafe features, like sharp objects that can impale passers by who don't move out of the way. And let's hope only a few people drive their Lexus cars around. And again strictly enforce speed limits, etc.

see above

Personally, if people are driving their golf cart with (or without) a bit a fur glued to it, is ok with me.
I'm 50-50 about ATVs but think they should have at least SOME minimal art effort.
I *do not* like electric scooters as they seem to constantly break the 5mph speed limit.

Carts and ATVs for handicaped persons, LEO etc. unless very mutant
I 100% agree with the scoooters, both electic and gas powered

[dj big E]

Thank to everyone that brings they're art cars. One of my favorite parts of bm is all the art cardriving around just before and after the burn. It's great.

[dj big E]

Thank to everyone that brings they're art cars. One of my favorite parts of bm is all the art cars driving around just before and after the burn. It's great.

[Bob A]

a) Is it the rest of us are jealous they get a nice ride? While we all get sweaty, sore butts on our bicycles.
b) Is it we don't consider that art? And we wish to push what <b>we</b> consider as art to only exist at BLC.
c) Is it that if this trend was pushed to the limit, BRC would have too many cars driving around? Thus... unsafe. Although a single vehicle itself is not unsafe, and probably would be amusing to see drive by.

If you read all the history on the main site from old Blackrock gazettes stories and piss clears etc you will have all your answers.

Way back in BM history they did not regulate cars, the camp was spread out, not in the circle it is now. People drove from camp to camp partied in their car and drove fast and drunk on the way back to their camp. As the event grew this came to a critical mass, people were afraid to walk the playa because of crazy drivers so they drove too. So to save the event from imploding they made a pedestrian city and limited cars to the really cool art cars that had been mixed in with all the regular cars.

Go forward a few years’ people have figured out the loop hole and the city is again at risk of imploding on itself from car problems. So the change to mutant vehicles instead of art cars. Which means really cool street legal hot rods are no longer welcome, they have their own events, just as the Open DMV letter says. They wanted to reduce the number of cars and hopefully the number of accidents but did not want to set a max number of cars, just letting in the first 500 or whatever and stopping. They choose to allow as many as can meet the rules they have set forth. If you did not put in the kind time and energy they were looking for then you were part of the problem they were trying to get rid of.

I like this way better than seeing the first 500 pieces of crap or real mutant vehicles get in and then have a really cool one get told sorry we have our quota, better luck next year.

They could have said no mutant vehicles too, but they wanted to keep the ones that add to the flavor of event. The event would be less without them.

I love cool hot rods and art cars with 16 head lights as much as the next guy, buy I can see those down at Automart every other Saturday at home. The truly odd contraption or party barge (done well) is unique to the playa.

My two cents. Some opinion and content from things burning man related.

bob A

[Burnmudgeon]

in 1995 my head was nearly squashed by a drunk art car driver as I slept.
In 1996 a fellow burner was KILLED by another car at night. something had to be done. What do you think is the solution?

[nipples]

"in 1995 my head was nearly squashed by a drunk art car driver as I slept.
In 1996 a fellow burner was KILLED by another car at night. something had to be done. What do you think is the solution?" (Burnmudgeon).


A department of keeping people from sleeping?

Department of Waking People (DWP).

Blame Canada!

It is so OBVIOUS, the sleeping hordes (!) recipient of kindnesses seldom acknowledged. What about the vigilantees?! Whom will stave the night?!

[nipples]

That was in jest, and in poor taste.

Sorry about that, Burnmudgeon & others, to have suggested parody/sarcasm of the sanctity of refuge & life.

Yes, freedom includes civility. I am sorry to have used sarcastic "wit" in place of agreement.

Oh, and wear the blue tommorrow. Or the green. Not sure on that!

[Captain Goddammit]

That was in jest, and in poor taste.

Sorry about that, Burnmudgeon & others, to have suggested parody/sarcasm of the sanctity of refuge & life.

Well, there's NOTHING wrong with blaming Cananda.

[Captain Goddammit]

blaming Cananda.

or Canada...

[The CO]

Ok, here is a little fuel....

Is MOVEMENT critical to art cars/mutant vehicles? Is your art car artistic when in is sitting still, or only when driving, or the same either way? I would propose that vehicles like the Shark Car (have not seen it there in a while) or the Flaming Man that is towed behind bike/car (not sure), or "So Long and Thanks..."(EL wire dolphin-Towed) are truly art CARS as they incorporate the motion of the vehicle into the art itself. (lemme know if I'm being vague)

None of those vehicles has much in the way of passenger space, ie not "party barges". But making them sit in one place would ruin the effect of the art. (maybe not Shark, but I love seeing the tail wiggle when it drives)

I would rather see more like that than another overloaded RV made to look like a pirate ship.

(stands back to watch flames)

[Lassen Forge]

Reading this thread made me realize just how much I miss Nipple's presence... >:~( * * * <

...
I would rather see more like that than another overloaded RV made to look like a pirate ship.

The examples I am thinking of said pyrat ships are ground-up builds. How about the party busses? How about submarines? How about motive tounges? How about TMV's? Tanks, anyone? >grins<

The point being - a Mutant Vehicle is art in the eye of the builder, much as my glasswork or a friends "grease rag paintings" or my partner's acrylic work... It is then up to the builder to convince DMV (who is the authority granted by the City of Black Rock) that their art is art, Trust me, it's NOT that hard!!!

Now... someone brought up official vehicles. Those are NOT art cars, in the same way a fire engine is not a clown car or flatbed truck. The City of Black Rock, just like every other city, needs a pool of working vehicles to operate - to go fill potholes, to move supplies, to get employees from point A to point B.

As to why they're not art cars?? Part of the reason they're not decorated is... simply.... so they stand out. You see a plain-jane pickup driving through BRC mid-event, you *know* it's someone who prolly has a radio and means to get hold of someone in case that person who impaled themselves on that rebar just won't stop bleeding. Same reason Rangers wear Khaki and cool hats, or we ESD people wear bright yellow... so you can FIND us when you need us. (And BTW, speaking as one of "them", we have a lot more stringent rules to follow than art cars, are a lot more visible, and a lot worse penalty for not following said rules...)

I know thart's drifted. Sorry. How about a new rule - ANY art vehicle, to be allowable in BRC, CAN NOT be made from any component part that was, at any time, part of a motorized form of transportation. It can be done, BTW - I even have the plans for one in my head, and almost brought it to fruition. Yeah, it'd be an MV. It'd even pass DMV inspection. But if everything were limited as such to *my* vision, BRC would be kinda boring...

And... I STILL miss Nipples!!!

bb

[capjbadger]

There seems to be alot of backlash right now against "pirate ship" art cars. I have been planning a small (built on a 4x8 trailer) ship based loosely on the Bounty.

The big idea is once I have this built and the bugs worked out of it, to give the plans to other people who want to build their own (I already have one guy that can't make it this year but wants to build his own for BM 2007). I hope to get enough people with thier own mini-ships to have full fleet battles out on the playa. (and maybe some 3-hour tours.. hehe)

The thing I'm worried about right now is I'm afraid DMV is going to look at this once I have it built and say its just another damn pirate ship and deny it entry. I've never brought a mutant vehicle before and I really don't want to sink all the time and money into this if there is no chance of even getting to bring it out.

Thoughts? Advice?

Thanks

[spectabillis]

Thoughts? Advice?

come up with something else?

[bringer]

Hey, new guy here.

come up with something else?

Umm... why?

[capjbadger]

Thoughts? Advice?

come up with something else?

That coming from you isn't a surprise SB.

I guess I'm trying to find out if the fears I have about this whole thing are well founded or if it won't be a problem.

[Isotopia]

The thing I'm worried about right now is I'm afraid DMV is going to look at this once I have it built and say its just another damn pirate ship and deny it entry. I've never brought a mutant vehicle before and I really don't want to sink all the time and money into this if there is no chance of even getting to bring it out.

Thoughts? Advice?

Thanks

You should check out the DMV web site. It should mentioned - as has been the cae for a few years now - that part of the registration process involves submitting a proposal. Basically what you do is put your idea down to words and include pics, illustrations, CAD drawings, etc. of your idea. That way if the DMV determines that yes there are wayy too many pirate ships you'll be notified before you start investing time and resources into your project.