Reasonable Arrival Time?

LostMachine · Post by **LostMachine** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 10:38 pm

My group has a large structure (30’ diameter) between that our cars and tents I would guess we need a plot 60-70 foot square.

I would like to camp on Earth or Mars between eight or nine o’clock.

What would be a reasonable time to get this type of location?

If we are waiting to get in Sunday at 8:00pm would we be able to pull this off? If not what would be a good time to show up?

Will the first 8 planets be riddled with tents such that a vacant 60’ plot is unavailable?

Will no one desire this spot and it will go unused throughout the week? (j/K)

Having never been I don’t know what to expect at the Gate.

I would be grateful for any feedback.

Thanks in advance

LostMachine

Piper · Post by **Piper** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 11:01 pm

Question, are you a registered theme camp? If yes, then go in when you asked on your paperwork, as your spot is assigned. If no then you are not getting in until 12:01 Monday morning, along with everyone else in line at that time. At that point I woud say you have a good chance of finding a spot big enough, it just might not be where you want.
But I would bet something either further out the radial or along on of the planets would be open,

SealBoy · Post by **SealBoy** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 11:31 pm

Machine, great job on the dome structure, by the way. It's great to see a unique dome design as opposed to the gazillions of standard geodesic domes out on the playa. Can't wait to check it out!

About getting there, you won't have a problem finding a good spot in the 8-9:00 area if you get there on Monday. Realistically, you'd probably find something decent on Tuesday if you're a little flexible about clock position.

A piece of advice though: try to get in during daylight. It'll make your life much much easier.

-SealBoy

LostMachine · Post by **LostMachine** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 11:32 pm

I'm not with a theme camp, but I still wanted to bring something for people to hang out in.

I've seen the Map

Where I want to camp there aren’t theme camps. I imagine that people working on theme camps are going to set their stuff up outside of the designated theme camp zone. Will there be room for me?

I know that I'm not getting in until after midnight. I imagine cars lined up to get in at that time. How many cars I have no idea.

I'm asking when a good time to arrive is? If I plan on getting to BRC at 12:01 as you say do I expect to drive on through. Or is the road going to be a 5 mile parking lot? I don't mind waiting a few hours in front of the gate, unless this is highly frowned upon.

I hope this cleared things up a little.

Thanks for the input.

LostMachine · Post by **LostMachine** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 11:34 pm

Thanks SealBoy

that was just what I was looking for.

: )

Stormy · Post by **Stormy** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 11:46 pm

I know that I'm not getting in until after midnight. I imagine cars lined up to get in at that time. How many cars I have no idea.

I'm asking when a good time to arrive is? If I plan on getting to BRC at 12:01 as you say do I expect to drive on through. Or is the road going to be a 5 mile parking lot? I don't mind waiting a few hours in front of the gate, unless this is highly frowned upon.

While there are no guarantees, Judge says he hasn't heard of pile ups at Midnight on Sunday. Guess not too many people want to set up camp in the middle of the night if they can help it.

headquarters · Post by **headquarters** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:14 am

i've pulled in right at dawn in 2002 well actualy about an hour before dawn. we were pulling into the camping area just as the sun started to peak and we found a pretty large spot like 4 roads back. the wait was like an hour to get in

in 03 we got there like 90 min later then the year before and it took almost an hour long in line.. whats the point to my post.. that there could be lines anytime but i guess early early monday morning is pretty good..

it's nice to get there when it's still cool outside but just the peak of the sun, so you can get a good start on camp without the heat.

Piper · Post by **Piper** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:15 am

I should never post tired, I didn't mean too sound that sharp.
Sealboy said it, the only thing change might be say as far out as Jupiter or 9:15/8:45 on the clock, depending on who is in front of you in line, they all might head for 9:00.
I think I read the frontage on the esplanade was 520" so it gets a bit bigger as you go out. 60" should not be that hard to find.
When I went out last year, on Monday night, the first 4 ring roads were fairly full. I would also agree with getting there in day light, why pound rebar when you are tired and in the dark.
There might be a five mile parking lot BUT Gate and Greeters are awesome in getting people through.
good luck and see you out there

Icepack · Post by **Icepack** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 1:56 pm

Stormy wrote:
I know that I'm not getting in until after midnight. I imagine cars lined up to get in at that time. How many cars I have no idea.

I'm asking when a good time to arrive is? If I plan on getting to BRC at 12:01 as you say do I expect to drive on through. Or is the road going to be a 5 mile parking lot? I don't mind waiting a few hours in front of the gate, unless this is highly frowned upon.
While there are no guarantees, Judge says he hasn't heard of pile ups at Midnight on Sunday. Guess not too many people want to set up camp in the middle of the night if they can help it.

I was an early arrival last year, and there were lots of cars lined up waiting for the 12:01 gate opening! We could see the headlights as far as we the curving road would let us in the night sky. I think it's very realistic to expect to be stuck in traffic and waiting in line for that midnight opening time. I've been wondering the same thing... how long did those folks spend getting from moving traffic to inside the gate. It looked like some of them were parked out on the side of the highway all day on Sunday.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 2:35 pm

60x60 is a big spot. You will have to be very flexible. Don't count on Earth or Mars.

In '02 I arrived at 4:00 am on monday. We ended up finding a roughly 40x40 spot inside of the last ring road at 8 o'clock.

SealBoy · Post by **SealBoy** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 3:43 pm

Dude, if you have a sweet dome and are willing to share it, your neighbors will probably help make space for it, even if there's not a 60x60 empty area immediately available. I mean, don't expect to be able to "claim" that big a spot, but people will usually work with you if you've got a structure to put up.

Anyway, I still think a Monday arrival will work out for you. Next year you might be inspired to register as a theme camp to get prime real estate.

SealBoy.

Icepack · Post by **Icepack** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 7:39 pm

SealBoy wrote:Dude, if you have a sweet dome and are willing to share it, your neighbors will probably help make space for it, even if there's not a 60x60 empty area immediately available. I mean, don't expect to be able to "claim" that big a spot, but people will usually work with you if you've got a structure to put up.

Anyway, I still think a Monday arrival will work out for you. Next year you might be inspired to register as a theme camp to get prime real estate.

SealBoy.

One disadvantage to registering as a theme camp though... you can request a big space and then be told you are getting a smaller one. So you either deal with it or camp in unregistered/unreserved area like you are doing this year anyway.

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:53 pm

While there are no guarantees, Judge says he hasn't heard of pile ups at Midnight on Sunday.

That might be because if folks jam the main road getting into the event causing a traffic jam that big time tickets from Neveda Highway Patrol might happen. Its been alluded to in the past.

Stormy · Post by **Stormy** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:07 pm

Badger wrote:
While there are no guarantees, Judge says he hasn't heard of pile ups at Midnight on Sunday.
That might be because if folks jam the main road getting into the event causing a traffic jam that big time tickets from Neveda Highway Patrol might happen. Its been alluded to in the past.

Yep! We were threatened several times last year that if we didn't get the line moving.... So kids, what can you do to decrease your wait time and not back up onto the highway? Have your tickets in your HAND when you pull up to the Gate. Do not get into the Gate line if some of your passengers have to go to Will Call. You can also try to pack your trucks, RVs, etc. in such a way that someone can get back there without breaking their neck or having to shuffle stuff or have to pull it out. Also, if you have bikes on the back of your vehicle blocking entry into the back, take the bikes off BEFORE it's your turn for a search. So if more people do this, then the wait times will be far less getting into the city. Or at least that's the propoganda I've been told, and I'm sticking to it.

LostMachine · Post by **LostMachine** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 1:29 am

Okay, I have received mixed responses and I’m still a little confused.

It there anyone from one of the theme camps that was onsite early last year?

Can you tell me how much of the non-theme camp space was taken up before the gates opened?

I’m sure a lot of those people working to set up their theme camp pitched their own tent in a different location.

Is it worth getting there Sunday evening to wait in line?

My girlfriend and I are responsible for getting the groups camp spot and we need to tell the rest of our party roughly where we’ll be. Also after all the hard work we’ve put into building this year I’d like to get us someplace close in. If that means I have to wait outside the gate for eight hours then I’m willing to do that.

Thanks for the help again.

Lysergic · Post by **Lysergic** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 1:32 am

I too wish to know the specifics. Being this is my first time there also, I'd like to get a spot near our planet. Don't get me wrong, I love Pluto and all, but it's a little too desolate for comfort.

Post by **AntiM** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 5:32 am

Actually, there are no specifics. Who knows what the line will do from year to year? Who says that threee mondo trucks and an RV aren't going to just drop dead in front of the gate and tie up traffic for hours. One time we coasted right in, the next year we had to wait forever because the will call folks were jumping back in line. Sounds like this has been addressed, but it happens. It was easier to get in at 7 am than 3 am actually. Haven't been there at midnight yet, but I imagine it is a zoo.

Solution? Don't fixate on the Esplanade and getting close in. If you're closer in great, but if you have to change your choice of venue, just go with it. Make your area prime real estate and attractive, potty proximity notwithstanding. There's always enough room somewhere. You'll probably find the absolute perfect spot for you and yours, but hard to do in the dark! Early land grabbing is being discouraged this year (wonder how that'll work out and how much grief the volunteers will get for that). The Land Rush overtones just sound creepy.

(easy for me to say, we're small and in a larger theme camp, on Jupiter I believe)

Now everyone take a deep breath and listen for the bell ....

Post by **AntiM** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 5:41 am

Lostmachine, you are a brave, brave person for being the scout for your camp's location. Kudos, and I hope you find a sweet spot and that your campmates appreciate your efforts.

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 8:12 am

Is it worth getting there Sunday evening to wait in line?

It sounds like your getting anxious and panicky over something that's a non-issue. Almost the same mindset that comes about when people don't think there's going to be enough gas during shortage time.

If your not camping in a theme camp then chances are VERY good that you'll find what you need anytime on Monday. We're not talking KOA camping. It is a BIG fucking city.

Remember, scouting for a camp is a reasonable thing to do but don't set up super large boundaries just because you want elbow room. You'll get called on it and asked to reduce the area or worse it will get reduced for you if you don't comply. Here's the rub... consider that if you get your area, bounder it off and have your camp show up that it's a reasonable thing to expect that if you get relatively close to the theme camps and Esplanade areas that as the week goes on most newer arrivals will tend to migrate toward the denser areas. Pack behavior. Everyone seemes to think that they're gonna miss something if they don't get closer to 'where its happening' and the perception is that adjacent to theme caamps/Esplanade IS where its happening. You can expect to have to deal with a dense neighborhood as more and more people show up. Any boundary set up at the beginning of the week cannot remain if that boundary incorporates an unused area that's there as a buffer zone for you folks. It isn't cool and again, won't be tolerated.

Finally, DO NOT come Sunday hoping to pull off the side of the road and wait it out until the gate opens. This WILL get you a ticket. A very EXPENSIVE ticket. Fish in a barrel is what the locals call it.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 12:56 pm

after all the hard work we’ve put into building this year I’d like to get us someplace close in.

Why did you not register? This is the only space guarantee and it's not fool proof either. There is always next year.

if you are really jonesing for high traffic and can stand the noise consider camping behind 2 or 10. Plenty of folks and happenings and not nearly as dense as, say, earth and 7:30.

Also, trust to the magic of the playa and your late arriving pals will find you.

2 years ago we did not end up anywhere near where we thought we'd be. We arrived early monday but my wife was coming in on Thursday. We tried the center camp bulletin board but it was a wreck. We crossed our fingers. Sure enough, while I was back at camp waiting and hoping, a campmate went on his bike to visit some other folks. On his journey he passed my wife driving in in her rental. He led her back to our camp. Problem solved. It just seems to happen that way out there sometimes.

LostMachine · Post by **LostMachine** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 4:17 pm

Badger:
Anxious, YES you bet, I can’t frigging wait.

Panicky, a little there is still a lot to do and not a lot of time.

My concern was whether this (space) was an issue to worry about. This is why I asked on the “questions and answers” section of the forum.

To help alleviate your concerns about my group taking up too much playa space, I can say: We plan on taking very little space after people arrive. I just want to make sure that there is room for all of us. We’ll even share the stakes for guy lines on our tents. There will be no need for reclamation of space on anyone’s part.

You should stop by and I’ll throw a cold one at you ; )

Stuart:
This is my first year and I felt like I should get a better understanding before I made an attempt to entertain others. I wasn’t planning on anything big. I am however addicted to projects so when the materials fell into my lap I HAD to build it. I love traditional geodesic domes but there are other types of geodesics and I feel that they’ve been largely forgotten.

Next year we’ll do a theme camp, I’m just happy to be going this year.

I’ve got a big flag pole and some blinking lights, I’m sure my party will be able to find us if they know the general direction.

Thanks again for the input.

I’d love to meet you all out there.

LostMachine

PurpleKoosh · Post by **PurpleKoosh** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:18 pm

LostMachine wrote:I’ve got a big flag pole and some blinking lights, I’m sure my party will be able to find us if they know the general direction.

With all due respect, that's like going to a game at SBC Park and telling your buddy "Meet me by the Willie Mays statue. I'll be the one in the Giants cap."

Everybody has blinking lights and a flag pole. If you plan to array yours in a very specific pattern and/or have a highly distinctive flag to fly (ideally both), and include that in your instructions to people, that should help.

Of course, "I'm sorry, I thought you were <fitb> Camp" is the beginning of many a great friendship on the playa....

TheJudge · Post by **TheJudge** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:22 am

Yeah and while you are out there, look for me. I'll be wearing the utilikilt with the cowboy hat and goggles, with braided hair.

Captain Goddammit · Post by **Captain Goddammit** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 9:56 am

LostMachine wrote: I’m sure a lot of those people working to set up their theme camp pitched their own tent in a different location.

Generally, you live at your theme camp, it is your home.

pokiedot · Post by **pokiedot** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 10:18 am

lost machine: great dome! very cool, very unique, good job.

i basically have the same advice as badger, but i wanted to reinforce that it's really not a big deal if you're not 'close'. every part of the city is populated, and your cool camp will get foot traffic no matter where you are. and, no matter where you camp, you will still be close to lots of cool stuff and people. after a big night out on the playa, having to bike back an extra block to go home is really not that big of a deal. i'm guessing that you'll end up with a sentimental soft spot for whatever street you end up calling home.

it sounds like you have a clear understanding of just how much space you need, which is nice (for a change). it sees like people usually think they need about 2000 sq ft than they really do.

so, in that case, i think it's more important that you find a spot with enough space, where the rest of your camp can find you. post on the playa info board, and, if your friends will still be home on monday, try to find an internet connection to email them. (laptops and wireless connections out there, crazy as it may seem!)

you should be fine arriving monday. you may not get the spot you really really want, but you'll get something else and it will be fine. the playa can be very much an exercise in letting go. just roll with what you get. i know exactly how you feel. our camp produced a rather impressive theme camp our very first year, too, and we were SO stressed out about every little thing. kudos for taking on building a cool structure youf very fist year.

good luck!

LostMachine · Post by **LostMachine** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 7:26 pm

pokiedot wrote:lost machine: great dome! very cool, very unique, good job.

Thanks for the complement, I was thinking of the dome and about this years Theme at the same time. We incorporate the Theme into the structure. There was a lot of Math and a scale model, but I think it turned out alright.

About our location, I think you’re right, where ever we find out spot will be the best spot it could be in.

My girlfriend and I are going to arrive EARLY Monday Morning, but we’ll park the truck on the outer road and scout/romp around on our Bikes until the sun comes up. We can take it easy; we’ll need that after we get there.

Thanks again everyone for the great Input.

Can't wait to get there. I haven’t been this excited in years.

Post by **AntiM** » Sun Aug 08, 2004 4:40 am

hehehe, romp, you said romp. We drive (well, my Larry drives, I can't) for 13 hours to get there monday morning and immediately set up camp before it gets HOT. Larry is a no romping until the work is done type of guy, even on the playa. I usually have him wound down and relaxed by Friday, but not always.

I do hope to see the dome, it looks awesome.

Rah-Rah · Post by **Rah-Rah** » Sun Aug 08, 2004 8:22 am

JOY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! -and maybe a pat on the ass.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Mon Aug 09, 2004 3:49 pm

there are other types of geodesics and I feel that they’ve been largely forgotten

my brother does a lot of tetrahedon tensegrity stuff. I think he is putting 2 tensegrity hammocks at our camp.

swampdog · Post by **swampdog** » Mon Aug 09, 2004 4:08 pm

regarding people arriving at different times and trying to find a camp - I'd invest in some frs walkie talkies (eg, motorola talkabout). You can get a pair for $25 at radio shack, prolly less at target or whatev. They boast 2mile plus line of sight range, which oughta get you co-located with a minimum of playing "marco-polo". Just make sure you have them switched on when you expect your incoming friends!

Reasonable Arrival Time?

Reasonable Arrival Time?

heh

Expectation at the gate?

finding camp?