Berg Video...

technopatra · Post by **technopatra** » Wed May 19, 2004 2:57 pm

If you've been following the hearings, the officers in charge have verified that of the roughly 9000 Iraqis arrested and detained, 7000 were done so 'erroneously". Most of them are still being held, but the Army is making an effort to expedite their releases.

7000 people rounded up, imprisoned, beaten, starved, sleep-deprived, and locked up with real criminals - the guards holding them.

And a goodly portion of these people have been imprisoned for over a year.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Wed May 19, 2004 2:59 pm

and just think,

The female gaurd is about to bring another one of those dumb dumbs into the world.

Last Real Burner · Post by **Last Real Burner** » Thu May 20, 2004 6:36 pm

The backlash has the government looking at our stateside prison system.

mr smith

SED · Post by **SED** » Fri May 21, 2004 8:24 am

I was thinking more about the prisoners we saw in the photos and what they had done. There weren't thousands of them. I'm well aware of the mass detentions and all I can say is that war sucks, and better to be detained than buried en masse.

What I haven't heard are accounts of the truly despicable acts committed by insurgents and terrorists. Stuart and Techno write as though these were not occurring on a daily basis. They also seem unaware of the vast improvements in Iraqi infrastrure which have taken place and are under continual attack by insurgents.

Still there is silence among muslims and Arabs regarding the atrocities carried out in the name of Islam. It's a tragic irony that both muslims and the Bush Admin seem to have hired the same PR firm.

I don't deny for a second that our MPs should have behaved like humans and not animals. I'm a bit shocked at the short prison terms I think they'll get.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Fri May 21, 2004 10:11 am

SED,

I would love to answer your question but it was not directed to me. Plus I really don't want to seem like I'm causing shit.

I hate to tell you, but Dood, you've been hoodwinked and lied to by this administration and the media. The despicable acts committed by insurgents and terrorists you speak of are from the point of view of those that want you to believe that the foes are despicable insurgents and terrorists.

First off, in most cases the insurgents and terrorists are people that were originally trained by the CIA as they did in many cases such as Israel, south America and so on. Then these so called despicable insurgents and terrorists come back to the Americans for retribution for atrocities Americans have done in their countries. Classic example is The Taliban and Sadam. The U.S. created these people, trained them, loved them, and financed them with money from yours and my taxes. The same people in office now in America are the same people that created these despicable insurgents and terrorists.

I now will let Stuart and TP speak for themselves.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Fri May 21, 2004 10:27 am

Same administration that loves to deal with fucked up people delt with Ahmed Chalabi. I can't wait for that whole story. It's a funny one.

( this is getting tough without the delete button. and I thought the edit button was gonna be kinda tough.)

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Fri May 21, 2004 12:15 pm

and better to be detained than buried en masse.

I agree, good thing we are doing the latter in Afghanistan. I would hate to feel we had yet to excersise an option. But rest assurede, with Negroponte in Iraq, it is only a matter of time. Afterall, look at the fine job he did in Honduras.

Last Real Burner · Post by **Last Real Burner** » Fri May 21, 2004 12:53 pm

http://uhpdistro.webcindario.com/tortura%20irak.htm

"Pray for Antdisestablishmentarism!"

perferably,
mr smith

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Fri May 21, 2004 12:56 pm

Last Real Burner wrote:http://uhpdistro.webcindario.com/tortura%20irak.htm

"Pray for Antdisestablishmentarism!"

perferably,
mr smith

I saw that site. some of the pictures have been proven to be altered.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Fri May 21, 2004 1:57 pm

I got a copy of the video if anybody still needs to see it

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Fri May 21, 2004 2:01 pm

[As a side note, we here in country, didn’t even find out about that prison situation until somewhat later and didn’t even realize it had been so heavily reported in the States. A majority of the troops here are pretty much incommunicado. Regardless, everyone here hopes those soldiers get locked away for many years as they only place those of us in the field in real jeopardy. We already don’t expect to be treated too fairly if taken, but the actions of those Abu Ghraib soldiers really opens up a can of worms we’d rather not have to think about.]

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sun Jul 11, 2004 8:34 am

Here's a stupid one for ya,

The Phillipino worker that got kiddnapped's family is going to Iraq at the request of the Phillipino government. Can we guess how this story is gonna go.

think I'm kidding?

http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pi ... world_news

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Mon Jul 19, 2004 3:59 pm

guess the family going to Iraq worked.

shitmouse · Post by **shitmouse** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:17 pm

SED wrote:I saw the video. I've seen worse and more impressive stuff.

i'm at a loss for words here. impressive?

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:30 pm

shitmouse wrote:
SED wrote:I saw the video. I've seen worse and more impressive stuff.
i'm at a loss for words here. impressive?

what do you expect from SED.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 10:12 pm

I heard that Geraldo Rivera got fooled first and the rest of the news media followed.

Man fools media with fake beheading
22-year-old politico posted the clip on Kazaa in May; Arab television picked it up Saturday.

Benjamin Vanderford, 22, videotaped a fake video of his own beheading at a friend's house using fake blood.
Ron Harris, the Associated Press

By Ron Harris
Associated Press

San Francisco — An aspiring politician and video game designer who faked his own beheading by Iraqi militants set off a short-lived media frenzy Saturday after media around the world began showing his homemade video of the gruesome hoax.
Benjamin Vanderford, 22, said he posted the 55-second clip, which shows a knife sawing against his neck, on an online file-sharing network in May. It circulated in cyberspace before crossing over to major media, airing on Arab television.

"It was part of a stunt, but no one noticed it up until now," Vanderford told The Associated Press after being awoken at his San Francisco apartment early Saturday and informed that much of the world was suddenly under the impression he had been decapitated.

Federal Bureau of Investigation agents interviewed Vanderford Saturday morning and an investigation has been opened, said FBI spokeswoman LaRae Quy. She said the agency initially became involved while trying to verify whether anyone had, in fact, been beheaded.

"We are collecting all the facts at this point in this process and we will pursue any and all legal avenues," Quy said, adding that it would be up to the U.S. attorney to determine what, if any, charges are filed.

Shrugging and taking a drink from a diet soda, Vanderford said he originally made the video as a way to draw attention to his campaign for a seat on the San Francisco Board of Supervisors. He filmed the footage at a friend's house, using fake blood.

When his political aspirations waned, he decided to distribute the footage on Kazaa, which is used to trade millions of audio, video and software files daily, "to just make a statement on these type of videos and how easily they can be faked."

Although the video went for months without drawing attention, it spread quickly after it was posted on a militant Islamic Web site that has previously carried claims of violent acts that eventually were verified.

The clip aired Saturday on the Arab television before Western news organizations, including The Associated Press and Reuters, published news of the unverified beheading.

On the tape, which carried an Arabic title that translates as "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi Slaughters an American," Vanderford sits on a chair, his hands behind his back, rocking back and forth.

"We need to leave this country alone. We need to stop this occupation," he said on the video, adding that he had been offered for exchange with prisoners in Iraq. "Everyone's going to be killed this way."

The tape then shows a hand with a knife cutting at the motionless man's neck, but it did not show any militants.

Vanderford, who opposes the war in Iraq, said he understood if relatives of those killed there thought his stunt was misguided, but offered no apologies.

"I see how it could be considered disrespectful," he said.

diane o'thirst · Post by **diane o'thirst** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 11:20 pm

I have not seen the Berg video.

Nor will I ever, if I can help it. And not just because I don't have a television.

There is an infinitely vast number of things to program my synapses and load my mindspace with in preference to <b>SNUFF FILMS.</b>

And it doesn't make an ounce of difference whether the people who made it speak with Arabian accents, it's still a snuff film.

madmatt · Post by **madmatt** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 11:43 am

I watched it. It sickened me, but I needed to bring it home so it's reality and not like an episode of 24 on Fox.

I think they did the right thing to show edited versions of it. We need to see the reality, to see it is real and see what these fuckos are capable of.

But you get the main idea seeing just part of it, because it still hits you in the gut because you know it's real and that that guy died right there, and that those terrorists are not figments of a rightwing conspiratorial imagination or propaganda. (there's plenty of that around though too).

I think they should tell where you can go to see the complete video if you want to seek it out. What the FCC and the Supreme Court have in mind in deciding on decency is whether kids or people who just find it totally shocking and offensive will be "ambushed" when it appears unexpectedly on tv or radio. Sometimes that's a good method, sometimes it's just censorship. In this case, I think it's good.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 12:59 pm

madmatt wrote:I watched it. It sickened me, but I needed to bring it home so it's reality and not like an episode of 24 on Fox.

I think they did the right thing to show edited versions of it. We need to see the reality, to see it is real and see what these fuckos are capable of.

But you get the main idea seeing just part of it, because it still hits you in the gut because you know it's real and that that guy died right there, and that those terrorists are not figments of a rightwing conspiratorial imagination or propaganda. (there's plenty of that around though too).

I think they should tell where you can go to see the complete video if you want to seek it out. What the FCC and the Supreme Court have in mind in deciding on decency is whether kids or people who just find it totally shocking and offensive will be "ambushed" when it appears unexpectedly on tv or radio. Sometimes that's a good method, sometimes it's just censorship. In this case, I think it's good.

http://www.thememoryhole.org/war/decapitation_video.htm

let's pray for peace and an end to this stupid war

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 1:20 pm

cowboyangel wrote: let's pray for peace and an end to this stupid war

Pray all you want. War is very attractive to idiots just like a good fight is attractive to bullies. People have a tendacy to belive what particular indivisuals tell them.

It's human nature that humans do stupid things.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 6:06 pm

DVD Burner wrote:
cowboyangel wrote: let's pray for peace and an end to this stupid war
Pray all you want. War is very attractive to idiots just like a good fight is attractive to bullies. People have a tendacy to belive what particular indivisuals tell them.

It's human nature that humans do stupid things.

up to 30 million people can't be wrong...that's the crowd estimate ( democracy now!) for the folks that showed up to protest the war world wide before it started. This is big and it isn't going away. I believe it's searching for a way now to make it's desire for peace felt in policy....these things take time
a thousand little steps can achieve much.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 7:04 pm

cowboyangel wrote: up to 30 million people can't be wrong...that's the crowd estimate ( democracy now!) for the folks that showed up to protest the war world wide before it started. This is big and it isn't going away. I believe it's searching for a way now to make it's desire for peace felt in policy....these things take time
a thousand little steps can achieve much.

30 million people are going to learn after November, the only way to get rid of idiots having a war is to have a war against idiots I'm afraid.
The other unfortunate thing is there are more stupid people in this world than there are smart. So 30 million smart people sounds like a lot until you see the reality of it all. there are at least 60 million idiots out there.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 7:05 pm

forgot to add,

If ya gonna start getting rid of stupid people you need to start at the top.

DE FACTO · Post by **DE FACTO** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 9:41 pm

Sounds rather contradictory doesn’t it?

Hulagu270 · Post by **Hulagu270** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 11:17 pm

Sounds rather contradictory doesn’t it?
_________________
even though...........

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 11:19 pm

a rather old tactic done before on this board.

Hulagu270 · Post by **Hulagu270** » Sat Aug 14, 2004 11:21 pm

a rather old tactic done before on this board.
_________________

Force · Post by **Force** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 10:18 pm

technopatra wrote:My mind is already haunted by the images that have been shown on tv. Carrying around the scene of a brutal murder would do nothing to expand my horror at the act, but it would increase my nausea.

Bingo. I haven't seen it and I won't. Saw a guy get killed via a knife through the throat one time via a mislabeled vid I downloaded, and seeing that had about as much positive effect as viewing this video would. And that's a disgusting, disturbing image I could have gone my whole life without seeing and been better off for that.

The one reason I might have had to see it is to try and detect any fakery, but I can tell from all the reactions I've read about here that it's real enough. Technopatra's comment here though sparks a question for me, though maybe not in the way you might think...

technopatra wrote:I'm already anti-war in general and anti-thiswar is particular. I have a hard time buying the argument that seeing the beheading, the sawing away of a person's head and life, will do anything but push folks' hate buttons instead of getting them to consider how it got to this, and instill a willful, actionable desire to avoid it.

While it could be argued that the terrorists killed him to discourage others from coming in to build the infrastructure of that country (but why wouldn't they wait, let us build up the country and then tell us to piss off?), my bullshit detector needle wavers just below the threshhold level that would set off a full-fledged alarm- wouldn't the terrorists know that beheading people would only anger people and harden their resolve and allow the military industrial complex to convince the soft-headed big fat part of the bell shaped curve that by god those heathen over there in the middle east need either killin' or civilizin' and killins a lot cheaper and quicker...

technopatra wrote:I never watched slasher movies. My junior high friends made fun of me for my conscientions objection at slumber parties. They thought I was scared but I wasn't - I was disgusted. Disgusted that seeing a human body violated and torn open was entertainment for them. It didn't matter to me that it wasn't real. To this day I shut my eyes at the gory bits in movies because not only do I not want to carry those images around with me, making me feel ill at the slighest recollection, but I don't want to be the kind of person that is entertained by it.

Have to agree with you there. I'm baffled by people who pay to see depressing shit like "Terms of Endearment" "Full Metal Jacket" "Misery" or the most recent foray into redefining human misery as entertainment, "Open Water". Why the fuck I would go pay to see someone suffer fucking baffles me. I saw the trailer for "Misery" before a comedy at christmastime, and in the stunned silence that followed, said "Jeez, Merry Freakin Christmas". Yeah, that was me.

So I won't be seeing "Open Water" since my idea of entertainment is not to watch the misery and fear of two people as they get attacked by sharks. I prefer to focus on the positive.

As for those like DVD burner who are so into finger pointing, kindly enumerate exactly when I voted for my country to do all the evil shit that it does. Your finger-pointing achieves at least one result; makes you think (think being the most important word in this sentence) you're all superior. When in fact the masses are manipulated by the same big-money players that have manipulated things for hundreds of years.

Wise up. Don't be so naive and simplistic.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 10:21 pm

Force wrote: As for those like DVD burner who are so into finger pointing, kindly enumerate exactly when I voted for my country to do all the evil shit that it does. Your finger-pointing achieves at least one result; makes you think (think being the most important word in this sentence) you're all superior. When in fact the masses are manipulated by the same big-money players that have manipulated things for hundreds of years.

Wise up. Don't be so naive and simplistic.

Dude, I dont finger point. I tell the truth. Religion and politics is for suckers.

They both use everybody.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 12:29 am

check out this site, the guy actually reports on a study as to whether or not a severed head has a few moments of consciousness......the author is also an anti-death penalty proponent...weird
http://www.metaphor.dk/guillotine/Pages/Guillot.html

Berg Video...

OOOuchhhhh....

O.k... Who's in charge here?...

Re: O.k... Who's in charge here?...

excerpt from a friend's letter on duty somewhere in Iraq