OCCUPYWALLSTREET REINFORCEMENTS!

[Bob]

[youtube][/youtube]

[Ugly Dougly]

The arson, grafitti and vandalism that occur alongside these movements are normally brought about by punks who want to have fun destroying things and hide behind the legitimate movement.

At worst, the punks are sent in by the opposition (agents provovateurs) to tar all by the same brush.

That is a pretty narrow status quo view in my opinion UD.
Seeing as I am sure that you don't consider Billboards and public handbills, advertisements or the constant and prevalent "media presence" as graffiti, or the litter and visual noise as vandalism. but folks that live constantly under the signs and pressure to buy, and to consider themselves less than human because they don't own the newest...
Painting their neighborhoods/city's and spaces with their Ideals and their slogans is empowering. the fact that one group of us would view them as punks only shows how much we have become numb and tolerant of a form of graffiti and disrespect because of market value, and that to think otherwise is to be socially irreverent.
Bankers are Punks, petty jerks that want to catch you not "obeying" or depositing your money with them.

as far as the agents provocateurs angle. that is the SOP of a tyrannical regime and is to be expected.

edit to add:
or to put it diffrently;
If I'm a punk, you are a complacent citizen who will standby as the fascist once again attempt to seize/maintain power.

How do you stand on starting random fires, looting and breaking windows? How does this advance the cause?

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_19255461

10:20 a.m. Tent city to talk about destructive anarchists

The campers will be discussing at their morning meeting how to keep out the destructive anarchist element.

"It's not us, it's a bunch of guys who wear black masks," said Michael Porter, 24, who works full-time selling DirectTV and has been camping at the Occupy Oakland site. "It's messing with our movement. They leech off our numbers -- they only show up when there's a rally."

Porter will be leading a discussion at the meeting starting soon.

"There's a handful of us trying to confront them but they just gang up on you."

[Ugly Dougly]

How is Whole Foods a corporate boogie man?

[junglesmacks]

How is Whole Foods a corporate boogie man?

Being directly involved in the natural products industry myself and having to have dealt with WFM for years, I can tell you that have no idea what hypocritical kooks these people are. I could go on and on and on.


From the BS they pump about how they support local economies when they really place products due to crony-ism and pay no attention to local-ism, to demanding outrageous amounts of free product just to place in their stores, to requiring free labor from sales reps/brokers/merchandisers to stock/reset their own stores if they are to carry their brands, to a long, long list of industry bastardization. A prime example of attempted monopoly and a corporation getting way too big for their britches.


Fuck Whole Foods. Support your local locally owned co-op/corner natural products grocer/retailer!


/end rant




NOW.. that is still no excuse for vandalism. I was replying to the question at hand.. not justifying the action taken in the picture.

[Bob]

Occupy Oakland Clean up today

Bring your graffiti clean up gear, brooms and a good attitude and lets clean up the mess made by the anarchists last night. Lets not let those people destroy the wonderful protest we had yesterday!

JPEGs or it didn't happen.

[lemur]

lol

"its not us!!"


good luck with that one..

It's not us, it's a bunch of guys who wear black masks..It's messing with our movement. ..They leech off our numbers -- they only show up when there's a rally. There's a handful of us trying to confront them but they just gang up on you.

good luck trying to separate the "anarchists" from the "protesters" when you all are the 99%!!

[Bob]

[Bob]

[Elderberry]

How is Whole Foods a corporate boogie man?

Being directly involved in the natural products industry myself and having to have dealt with WFM for years, I can tell you that have no idea what hypocritical kooks these people are. I could go on and on and on.


From the BS they pump about how they support local economies when they really place products due to crony-ism and pay no attention to local-ism, to demanding outrageous amounts of free product just to place in their stores, to requiring free labor from sales reps/brokers/merchandisers to stock/reset their own stores if they are to carry their brands, to a long, long list of industry bastardization. A prime example of attempted monopoly and a corporation getting way too big for their britches.


Fuck Whole Foods. Support your local locally owned co-op/corner natural products grocer/retailer!



/end rant




NOW.. that is still no excuse for vandalism. I was replying to the question at hand.. not justifying the action taken in the picture.

Actually, the reason that Whole Foods became a target was because of a false rumor that said that they were threatening to fire any employees that took the time off to go to the rally.

[Bob]

And the Men's Wearhouse got smashed up *despite* announcing support for the fleabaggers, why? Because they ran out of black hoodies?

[knowmad]

so can we hit cops or not?

[Elderberry]

And the Men's Wearhouse got smashed up *despite* announcing support for the fleabaggers, why? Because they ran out of black hoodies?

There were 7,000+ people (that's SEVEN THOUSAND PEOPLE)out marching; is it any wonder there would be some bad apples in the group? Why do you have to focus on the negative?

[Sola Gangsta]

so can we hit cops or not?

If they hit you first and you did nothing wrong, fighting back is self defense (whether it is the law or not).

[Elderberry]

I just did a quick Google search and wasn't able to find a news article on Men's Wearhouse being vandalized; but I did find this:

I just did find an image that looks like one of their windows did get smashed. Not sure if it's the same store. Unfortunate.

[Sola Gangsta]

And the Men's Wearhouse got smashed up *despite* announcing support for the fleabaggers, why? Because they ran out of black hoodies?

There were 7,000+ people (that's SEVEN THOUSAND PEOPLE)out marching; is it any wonder there would be some bad apples in the group? Why do you have to focus on the negative?

And where do you envision this going if there is no disruption or inconvenience to those running the show? Business as usual...

[lemur]

Why do you have to focus on the negative?

what positive stuff did they do?

i dont count just gathering in large numbers as positive..
i dont count people hampering the legal business activities of one of the nations largest ports as positive..

[Elderberry]

And the Men's Wearhouse got smashed up *despite* announcing support for the fleabaggers, why? Because they ran out of black hoodies?

There were 7,000+ people (that's SEVEN THOUSAND PEOPLE)out marching; is it any wonder there would be some bad apples in the group? Why do you have to focus on the negative?

And where do you envision this going if there is no disruption or inconvenience to those running the show? Business as usual...

There are lots of ways (like blocking the port and bringing business to a halt) that will disrupt and inconvenience yet not be violent and destroy property.

[Bob]

Hey, look over there, two guys with jobs -- Oakland is full of win today!

[junglesmacks]

Interesting. My rant was my own, but it doesn't surprise me. As I stated before..

Fuck Whole Foods.

How is Whole Foods a corporate boogie man?

Being directly involved in the natural products industry myself and having to have dealt with WFM for years, I can tell you that have no idea what hypocritical kooks these people are. I could go on and on and on.


From the BS they pump about how they support local economies when they really place products due to crony-ism and pay no attention to local-ism, to demanding outrageous amounts of free product just to place in their stores, to requiring free labor from sales reps/brokers/merchandisers to stock/reset their own stores if they are to carry their brands, to a long, long list of industry bastardization. A prime example of attempted monopoly and a corporation getting way too big for their britches.


Fuck Whole Foods. Support your local locally owned co-op/corner natural products grocer/retailer!



/end rant




NOW.. that is still no excuse for vandalism. I was replying to the question at hand.. not justifying the action taken in the picture.

Actually, the reason that Whole Foods became a target was because of a false rumor that said that they were threatening to fire any employees that took the time off to go to the rally.

[Sola Gangsta]

And where do you envision this going if there is no disruption or inconvenience to those running the show? Business as usual...
There are lots of ways (like blocking the port and bringing business to a halt) that will disrupt and inconvenience yet not be violent and destroy property.

I hate to break it to you, but the only reason that it didn't get too violent is because a shutdown for a day or two is not a big enough threat. They're waiting you out hoping for it to go away. The only other way to win being a protester is to suddenly make your numbers so large that govt officials don't even bother to attempt force due to fear (I've never seen a historical incident of this but Tsun Tzu hints that it is possible to win without a fight). The more realistic thing to do is prepare yourself because everything in between comes to violence one way or another. Train protesters to deal with it and to recognize military tactics and everyone will be much better off. You are potentially going into a combat situation attending one of these, so it is the responsible thing to do. Excessive spreading of pacifist ideas will lead to you or your friends getting hurt due to not realistically facing the situation objectively.

Had the port been shut down for a few weeks, SWAT and cops in riot gear would come out and forcibly remove people and martial law would be imposed. If you had AR-15s like the guys in Phoenix, then you probably have civil war if the balance of power is even. These are just the probable facts.

[ygmir]

And the Men's Wearhouse got smashed up *despite* announcing support for the fleabaggers, why? Because they ran out of black hoodies?

There were 7,000+ people (that's SEVEN THOUSAND PEOPLE)out marching; is it any wonder there would be some bad apples in the group? Why do you have to focus on the negative?

Interesting question, JK, from one who pigeon holes anyone not a democrat, and paints with a broad brush, the same.
Just pointing out, that, you make some pretty broad based statements, and accusations, relating to folks of "other" political persuasions than yourself, often based on a headline, and probably pertaining to just a few "bad apples".
It'd be neat, if all were treated, the way we'd like to be treated, ourselves.......

oops...did I say that?

[Elderberry]

And the Men's Wearhouse got smashed up *despite* announcing support for the fleabaggers, why? Because they ran out of black hoodies?

There were 7,000+ people (that's SEVEN THOUSAND PEOPLE)out marching; is it any wonder there would be some bad apples in the group? Why do you have to focus on the negative?

Interesting question, JK, from one who pigeon holes anyone not a democrat, and paints with a broad brush, the same.
Just pointing out, that, you make some pretty broad based statements, and accusations, relating to folks of "other" political persuasions than yourself, often based on a headline, and probably pertaining to just a few "bad apples".
It'd be neat, if all were treated, the way we'd like to be treated, ourselves.......

oops...did I say that?

Interesting that I don't feel I paint with a broad brush when talking about the right. They can all be drawn with a fine tip marker. (At least all those that are currently making news and running the show.)

[knowmad]

so can we hit cops or not?

If they hit you first and you did nothing wrong, fighting back is self defense (whether it is the law or not).

was kinda being facetious there Gangsta.
like I need permission to justify my self.
tell ya what though, all those cops showed up to the riot in cars, cars that are parked somewhere in the area, lastime i checke cars burn.

Now this is where you say " [*in falsetto sans concern*] "Oh but don't do that it will cause problems for the whole movement... ", or some other hooie.

[ygmir]

Interesting that I don't feel I paint with a broad brush when talking about the right. They can all be drawn with a fine tip marker. (At least all those that are currently making news and running the show.)

snickering.

we'd need another thread for this discussion. I was just making a point, that we can discuss somewhere else (IMHO), because, this thread is doing so well, I don't ( I know, I know, surprise) want to drift very much.

[Sola Gangsta]

equipmentburnersalreadyhave.jpg

[Sola Gangsta]

Now this is where you say " [*in falsetto sans concern*] "Oh but don't do that it will cause problems for the whole movement... ", or some other hooie.

I'm not saying that violence is a good thing, only that with crowds its probably unavoidable (but I reserve the right to break my boot off in SOTP's ass).

[cowboyangel]

How is Whole Foods a corporate boogie man?

Being directly involved in the natural products industry myself and having to have dealt with WFM for years, I can tell you that have no idea what hypocritical kooks these people are. I could go on and on and on.


From the BS they pump about how they support local economies when they really place products due to crony-ism and pay no attention to local-ism, to demanding outrageous amounts of free product just to place in their stores, to requiring free labor from sales reps/brokers/merchandisers to stock/reset their own stores if they are to carry their brands, to a long, long list of industry bastardization. A prime example of attempted monopoly and a corporation getting way too big for their britches.


Fuck Whole Foods. Support your local locally owned co-op/corner natural products grocer/retailer!


/end rant




NOW.. that is still no excuse for vandalism. I was replying to the question at hand.. not justifying the action taken in the picture.

Whole Foods CEO John Mackey is an Ayn Rand disciple and opposes health care reform and organizing efforst within WFM

wikipedia

Mackey opposed the public health insurance option that ultimately did not become part of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. Mackey thinks a better plan would be allowing consumers to purchase health insurance across state lines and use a combination of health savings accounts and catastrophic insurance, as Whole Foods does.[16] Mackey's statement that Americans do not have an intrinsic right to healthcare led to calls for a boycott of Whole Foods Market from the Progressive Review and from numerous groups on Facebook.[17]

As Clarence Thomas of the ILWU said today on KPFA regarding the vandalism [paraphrase] I wish they covered the huge theft by the banks of our homes, cities, tax payers etc with as much zeal as they cover the vandalism by the few stuff....

[knowmad]

Talk about your thread drift.

yeah how about them Patriots?




-1 if you thought I was talking NFL

[Sola Gangsta]

NoamChomsky.jpg

[Simon of the Playa]

I'm not saying that violence is a good thing, only that with crowds its probably unavoidable (but I reserve the right to break my boot off in SOTP's ass).

you and what army, Fat Boy?