New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

[Simon of the Playa]

Dear Gyre perhaps we should ban assholes who whine and.complain about non existant slights to th BORG to force other eplayans to retire from their position...just sayin'.

I do not forgive.
I do not forget.

[Simon of the Playa]

Just ban djs and amplified music.


That will help solve the population issue.

see above....Grrrrrrrr..Dont even start or i will bury you.

Im not as polite as some people and i will talk.


edit: other members real name removed: Eric, Mod

[lemur]

Just ban djs and amplified music.


That will help solve the population issue.

see above....Grrrrrrrr..Dont even start or i will bury you.

Im not as polite as some people and i will talk.

dont cut off his access to sparkle ponies !


edit: other members real name removed: Eric, Mod

[Simon of the Playa]

not even the most vapid and low self esteemed pony would have him...


i think that may be part of the problem.

[pinemom]

wow 31 pages...impressed.






~not~

[gyre]

Dear Gyre perhaps we should ban assholes who whine and.complain about non existant slights to th BORG to force other eplayans to retire from their position...just sayin'.

I do not forgive.
I do not forget.

So you'll believe any lie, Simon?

[Ugly Dougly]

One of the critisisms of Burning Man is that the "expiremental community" is a failed experiment because it encourages people to gift whatever they can to benefit each other- thus the gift economy. A gift economy, according to the critics, could never exist because of SCARCITY...

Anthropology: Cargo & Potlatch. Successful.

Sounds good. 2012?

[Ugly Dougly]

Just ban djs and amplified music.


That will help solve the population issue.

Bold, inspired, inventive, and possibly effective.
No wonder Simon hates it.
zing!

[Simon of the Playa]

the main problem is with Californians....

Just ask any Nevadan.


and gyre, if you want to get into a pissing match with me, i suggest you put on a haz-mat suit right now.

[Ugly Dougly]

the main problem is with Californians....

Just ask any Nevadan.

Yes, too much money, I've been told this.

Are your slots loose enough?

[Simon of the Playa]

don't you talk about my mom that way....

[cariannshimsham]

we started a petition to stop the Lottery System, please sign it if you support the idea and please pass it on...

http://www.change.org/petitions/stop-th ... et-lottery

[Rice]

we started a petition to stop the Lottery System, please sign it if you support the idea and please pass it on...

http://www.change.org/petitions/stop-th ... et-lottery

Lets stop something we don't know anything about. LORAFO (lets over-react and freak out)

Change is constant... Change or die.

Love Rice

[portaplaya]

we started a petition to stop the Lottery System, please sign it if you support the idea and please pass it on...

http://www.change.org/petitions/stop-th ... et-lottery

There are some factually inaccurate statements in that petition.

The event is owned by an LLC, not a corporation. And it is transitioning over the next year or two to be owned by a 501c3 non-profit.

As for this sentence:
"Given that much of the very attraction of the event is based on participants working long in advance in groups to create Burning Man this new system will unfortunately dismantle the initiative to create the event in the first place because there is no guaranteed admittance even to the most committed to creating the event."

That seems to assume that the lottery will not be completed well in advance of the event. If the event were to sell out this year in March, which is not unreasonable given that people now know they cannot wait, or if the lotteries were completed by May, there would be no difference. That's five months to prepare, either way. It the event were to sell out in one week, which is entirely possible since so many people failed to get tickets last year because they waited, that actually increases the uncertainty of going for those that don't have funds ready that first week.

And the assertion it makes is by no means true for everyone. [Also, that sentence is pretty atrocious from a writer's point of view.]


It the theme is announced does this petition get to claim a partial victory? It seems weird to me to diverge from the main topic by also making complaints about the theme not yet being announced. Especially since history as shown that most themes are announced by the end of the year anyway.

[Eric]

Everybody:


Back off on the personal attacks.


Thank you.

[moonrise]

the main problem is with Californians....

Just ask any Nevadan. <snip>

I'm both, now I'm utterly confused Fuuuuuck!

[A Jester]

Yes, your tickets are about as uncertain as they were before the announcement.

Although, now you're supposed to be very worried over nothing, mention that theme camps can't exist under the new system, and then ask why we don't have a three day wait at the gate with non-transferable tickets.

I think this is a really sad decision. Tickets did not sell out last year till July I am told. Most people who participate book their tickets much earlier.

I live in London and we were going to come to Burning Man to get married next year. Our flights are booked and the deposit on the RV has been paid.

As we now can't be sure we'll get a ticket we are having to look at other plans.

If you are local to they bay area getting to Burning Man is a huge organisational challenge. If you travel from abroad as many do, there are many more logistical challenges such as needing to book an RV as early as possible.

For large groups of people this makes coming to Burning Man almost impossible.

A better system would be to keep tiered tickets and spend on IT resources for ticket sales.

[remi]

we started a petition to stop the Lottery System, please sign it if you support the idea and please pass it on...

http://www.change.org/petitions/stop-th ... et-lottery

There are some factually inaccurate statements in that petition.

The event is owned by an LLC, not a corporation. And it is transitioning over the next year or two to be owned by a 501c3 non-profit.

As for this sentence:
"Given that much of the very attraction of the event is based on participants working long in advance in groups to create Burning Man this new system will unfortunately dismantle the initiative to create the event in the first place because there is no guaranteed admittance even to the most committed to creating the event."

That seems to assume that the lottery will not be completed well in advance of the event. If the event were to sell out this year in March, which is not unreasonable given that people now know they cannot wait, or if the lotteries were completed by May, there would be no difference. That's five months to prepare, either way. It the event were to sell out in one week, which is entirely possible since so many people failed to get tickets last year because they waited, that actually increases the uncertainty of going for those that don't have funds ready that first week.

And the assertion it makes is by no means true for everyone. [Also, that sentence is pretty atrocious from a writer's point of view.]


It the theme is announced does this petition get to claim a partial victory? It seems weird to me to diverge from the main topic by also making complaints about the theme not yet being announced. Especially since history as shown that most themes are announced by the end of the year anyway.

Don't get me wrong, I disagree with this 'petition' because I don't know enough information on the lotto to make an informed decision, however, I do agree with the statement "Given that much of the very attraction of the event is based on participants working long in advance in groups to create Burning Man this new system will unfortunately dismantle the initiative to create the event in the first place because there is no guaranteed admittance even to the most committed to creating the event." because at this point (prior to the lotto announcement), everyone who is serious about going with an art project or a theme camp is 100% confident that they will be able to get a ticket. No matter how early the lottery is, right now, people arnt' 100% like they would be if it was 'first come first serve'. They can control their own fate in the first come first serve method.

[theCryptofishist]

When are we going to start complaining that January sales are unfair as people are recovering from the expensive holiday season.

Not much of an issue for me, actually, but burners have varied relationships with mainstream culture and expectations, and I can't believe that's not an issue for a fair number. Someone mentioned having to wait for her (?) tax refund. If tickets really would have sold out in January, then people involved in those kinds of economics (and I'm not because I'm lucky in addition to whatever skill I have--or maybe unlucky because if Scott were here and didn't get in on volunteering--he might not be well enough) I'd have to wait for that government check as well.

My point being, that as long as there are more people who want in than there are spaces for them, any system is arbitrary and unfair.

[trilobyte]

Actually, they can't control their own fate in the first come, first served method. At best it's a crap shoot to try and get the tier you want (ask anybody who was there the second tix went on sale, only to go through HOURS of frustration only to learn the first two tiers were gone). Even with behemoths like TicketBastard, on a fairly big (10K demand or greater) on-sale event it really is a gamble. And if knee-jerk over-buying (in the wake of last year's sellout) caused a dramatic increase in early demand for ticket sales, there's a very real chance that people who were planning way the fuck ahead and there at the start… might get left out in the cold.

[gyre]

We all love you, Simon.

You're always so pretty.

And I pray daily for the re-integration of your eplaya personalities.

Think things through.
Sadly, my power over the llc is severely limited. *see amplified music

Anyway, Larry Harvey is still clearly out to get me.
Whenever I see him, he greets me warmly.
But then he always calls me by a different name, John or Steve or Bob, etc.

Clearly he is pretending he doesn't have a fucking clue who I am!

[gyre]

Actually, they can't control their own fate in the first come, first served method. At best it's a crap shoot to try and get the tier you want (ask anybody who was there the second tix went on sale, only to go through HOURS of frustration only to learn the first two tiers were gone). Even with behemoths like TicketBastard, on a fairly big (10K demand or greater) on-sale event it really is a gamble. And if knee-jerk over-buying (in the wake of last year's sellout) caused a dramatic increase in early demand for ticket sales, there's a very real chance that people who were planning way the fuck ahead and there at the start… might get left out in the cold.

This is all true.

There's a lot of documentation about TicketBastards and their issues.


Last year, by the time I had money to apply for a low income ticket, I missed them by days.

You're not allowed to buy a lower tier ticket, if you're applying for low income (as if you'd have the cash anyway.)
So by that time, the other tickets were way out of reach.

Turned out I didn't have time to go anyhow, but either way, someone else was going to work my shifts.

[Simon of the Playa]

im gonna have to start charging for the whole "crazy police" role that has come to be more and more frequent.

Ok, lets start with whether or not you have medical insurance, i need to know who to bill.

[gyre]

Yah?
I bet you can't find one person who thinks you aren't pretty.


And I'm not the one with the Charlton Heston avatar.

[Nicole Hyde]

It was the shoes that did it for me, babe...

[Ugly Dougly]

And he's even more charming in person!

[tamarakay]

One.

I'd use gorgeous, brilliant, handsome, smart, but not pretty.

[vargaso]

Actually, they can't control their own fate in the first come, first served method. At best it's a crap shoot to try and get the tier you want (ask anybody who was there the second tix went on sale, only to go through HOURS of frustration only to learn the first two tiers were gone). Even with behemoths like TicketBastard, on a fairly big (10K demand or greater) on-sale event it really is a gamble. And if knee-jerk over-buying (in the wake of last year's sellout) caused a dramatic increase in early demand for ticket sales, there's a very real chance that people who were planning way the fuck ahead and there at the start… might get left out in the cold.

So hours of frustration (the result of which is a ticket, maybe not at the price tier you hoped, but still, a ticket) will, apparently, turn into weeks if not months of frustration and worry as you wait to see if your number is picked to get a golden ticket. Seems reasonable.

[trilobyte]

No, there's a very good chance you'd end up with nothing under the old system. More than half of the 2011 event tix sold in under 48 hours, after the sellout this past summer it's very likely that early sales could double as people buy earlier, or attempt to 'stock up' to cover camps, art projects, etc.

[vargaso]

No, there's a very good chance you'd end up with nothing under the old system. More than half of the 2011 event tix sold in under 48 hours, after the sellout this past summer it's very likely that early sales could double as people buy earlier, or attempt to 'stock up' to cover camps, art projects, etc.

This is true, but I'd MUCH rather know right away, than have the process drag out over weeks.