wh..sh wrote:junglesmacks!!!!!!!!!!!junglesmacks wrote:Knock yourself out with all that. I'm hanging with Elmo and Doogie. Don't hate.
Savannah wrote:It sounds freaky & wrong, so you need to do it.
Good point. But I think that this really gets to the heart of the issue. We say Bach is a great musician. We don't know exactly with what sort of feeling he lifted his fingertips off the keys. We have a bunch of dots on a page indicating which note to play at what interval - and it is effectively completely digital. If we were left with a recording of a computer playing the Goldberg Variations, our collective opinion of Bach would be no different - it is in the position of those notes that he expresses himself.theCryptofishist wrote:Bach was an organist and composer as well as a harpsichordist... And it is only as a composer we know him. There are no recordings of him at any keyboard. We don't even know exactly how that Klavier was tempered.
This I respect.theCryptofishist wrote:I just don't like the computerized sounds.
This I respect tremendously.theCryptofishist wrote:And I'd hate edm a whole lot less if I didn't hear it all the time.
Also this.theCryptofishist wrote:Okay, I'd maybe hate it the same, but I'd feel less resentful.
Savannah wrote:It sounds freaky & wrong, so you need to do it.
new_world_order wrote:... after checking all the forums I can't find how to volunteer. I was also wondering that if you volunteer is it possible to get a cheaper BM ticket?
Bravo! I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord. Very true about the technique of the harpsichord. It was a primitive piano and slightly more practical than a pipe organ.5280MeV wrote:It would really be cool if you would consider bringing either a cheap harmonica or guitar or both - but not your best instruments.new_world_order wrote: Electronic pisses me off; being a musician, it is a cop out to say that mixing random sounds to a beat suddenly makes you a musician. To me, musicianship takes skill and a life time of practice at mastering not only an instrument and the technique, but the theory of why things sound pleasing to the ears. I can sit at home and make electronic shit on my lap top in two seconds. Playing my harmonica, the piano or guitar takes so much more than clicking buttons of sounds that you are not actually producing with your body.
As much as I prefer electronic music, there is really not enough other music on the playa - and hearing a harmonica out in the deep playa is really pretty cool. You have probably read enough to know that this is nothing at all like a summer music festival, it isn't even about music, unless that is what you want. But you are the performer, so if you are good at the harmonica, it would be a really great gift to get to hear it.
I don't mind people hating electronic. My wife hates a lot of the music I listen to - because it gives her a headache. I think that this is a perfectly appropriate and fully understandable criticism, who wants a headache? It makes me want to move, it sets my mind on fire. There are a lot of basic patterns - a kick drum explicitly thumping out 4-4 time at 135 beats per minute with a bit of swing, or the celebrated amen break, that work on a subconscious level. Some people hear only these repetitive forms, and the rest of the piece just dissolves into random sounds. For me, these basic dance patterns need to be there in order to act as a sort of ignition. With them in place, the rest of the piece really starts to work on my mind. If the piece is not very good, then the beats become boring and repetitive. When the entire piece is interesting - when it works - everything is on fire. Although I greatly enjoy "regular" music, for example Monday I am seeing a concert and lecture on Thelonious Monk at the local University, none of this music provides the explosive power that I get from sequenced combinations of generated waveforms.
I find it interesting that you brought up Bach - a harpsichordist - in this thread, after saying the following about instrumental technique, "Playing my harmonica, the piano or guitar takes so much more than clicking buttons of sounds that you are not actually producing with your body."
On the harpsichord, you are basically clicking a button. There is zero dynamic control. You depress the key, and either the plectrum plucks the string or it does not. The produced sound is entirely disconnected from the motion of the body. It does matter when you lift your finger, as the legato is of prime importance. But this is the same as depressing the left mouse button and letting go!
I do believe that connecting the motion of the body to the dynamic of the produced note allows for a degree of improvisation and expression that is lost when notes are sequenced or played with an instrument that does not accept nuance. However, removing one degree of freedom does not remove all capacity for expression and technique. I could play Bach's fugues through a computer, and Bach's genius and humanity would shine through the sequence of the notes.
Skrillex and Deadmau5 are not representative of electronic music as a whole. Their live play style should not be taken as an indication that electronic artists cannot play real instruments. One can learn to barf out boring techno in a month with ACID Pro 7, but a set of four teenagers can learn to form a crappy garage band by spending six months with their instruments. Six months or one month is really immaterial, I agree that to make great music typically takes years of work - an order of magnitude more time than required for proficiency with this or that instrument.
I therefore consider your criticism to be unfair, and far more objectionable than someone simply hating electronic dance music. It is one thing to say that it is bangy and repetitive, it is another to make a broad declaration about what is or is not art and representative of the human spirit.
As for the ability to play real instruments:
[youtube][/youtube]
It isn't. :/junglesmacks wrote:The only part that I "respect" is that she said "I don't like" instead of "It's not real music."
Not that I don't "respect" what anyone has to say or their right to say it. I just don't find the poster above you to be earth shattering in said statements.
Thank you so much! Are you going to be doing this?NessaZee wrote:Welcome to the eplaya forums. *waves*
new_world_order wrote:... after checking all the forums I can't find how to volunteer. I was also wondering that if you volunteer is it possible to get a cheaper BM ticket?
I think you can volunteer with some theme camps to get a discounted entrance ticket. the volunteer commitment may require you to either come early to set up or stay late to tear down/clean up (or both). If you have the time and want a cheaper ticket this is the way to go.
For a possible volunteer opportunity, try contacting piper(at)distriktcamp(dot)org. cool camp, you'll LOVE it there.
Somewhat agreed. Electronic just isn't quite there...YET5280MeV wrote:Good point. But I think that this really gets to the heart of the issue. We say Bach is a great musician. We don't know exactly with what sort of feeling he lifted his fingertips off the keys. We have a bunch of dots on a page indicating which note to play at what interval - and it is effectively completely digital. If we were left with a recording of a computer playing the Goldberg Variations, our collective opinion of Bach would be no different - it is in the position of those notes that he expresses himself.theCryptofishist wrote:Bach was an organist and composer as well as a harpsichordist... And it is only as a composer we know him. There are no recordings of him at any keyboard. We don't even know exactly how that Klavier was tempered.
Counterpoint is rigidly formulaic. I think of it as an algebra. I have Fux's Study of Counterpoint: From Johann Joseph Fux's Gradus Ad Parnassum, I have not studied it - but I have dabbled with it - and the rules appear to be no different than any other mathematical system.
The fugue itself is a very formulaic genre. I have actually thought of writing a computer program to autogenerate fugues, but it is one of those things that I don't really quite have the drive to do. One could even go so far to write a neural network to listen to fugues, train it on Bach and some other masters, and have it select the "best" of the random lot.
My point is that even though one can just learn the formula, download ACID Pro 7, and generate some womp womp womp, one can also appropriate formulas and cliches to mass produce music in any genre.
This I respect.theCryptofishist wrote:I just don't like the computerized sounds.
This I respect tremendously.theCryptofishist wrote:And I'd hate edm a whole lot less if I didn't hear it all the time.
Also this.theCryptofishist wrote:Okay, I'd maybe hate it the same, but I'd feel less resentful.
...........................................new_world_order wrote:
I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord.
Yeah, someone who has admitted they have never been sure has a lot of opinions on who "we" are.lemur wrote:new_world_order wrote:
I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord.
you have a lot to learn.
Positively, absolutely Not True. The one possible perk, of placed theme camps only, is the early entry pass. And those are not given out so very freely by the llc, and within theme camps they go to those who are capable of the hard work of setting up the camp so it's there when the gates open, and who have a proven track record with the camp in question so they can be trusted. Theme campers buy their own tickets, and buy the camp infrastructure. In the Booby Bar's case there was a certain expected amount of booze we were expected to bring. Some theme campers get staff tickets--by working at the llc department as well as with the theme camp.NessaZee wrote:Welcome to the eplaya forums. *waves*
new_world_order wrote:... after checking all the forums I can't find how to volunteer. I was also wondering that if you volunteer is it possible to get a cheaper BM ticket?
I think you can volunteer with some theme camps to get a discounted entrance ticket. the volunteer commitment may require you to either come early to set up or stay late to tear down/clean up (or both). If you have the time and want a cheaper ticket this is the way to go.
For a possible volunteer opportunity, try contacting piper(at)distriktcamp(dot)org. cool camp, you'll LOVE it there.
Im not sure if this says more about NWO's misunderstanding of the event or more about NWO as a person... either way it is stuck in my brain.new_world_order wrote:Bravo! I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord. .
lemur wrote:new_world_order wrote:
I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord.
you have a lot to learn.
Savannah wrote:It sounds freaky & wrong, so you need to do it.
Damn. All this time... I thought I was just lookin' in the wrong places...lemur wrote:I think i would rather people believe it is a drug fueled atheist sex orgy
LOL! Man!! kids say the darnest things.new_world_order wrote:Bravo! I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord. .
hehe, you're welcome.new_world_order wrote:Thank you so much! Are you going to be doing this?NessaZee wrote:Welcome to the eplaya forums. *waves*
new_world_order wrote:... after checking all the forums I can't find how to volunteer. I was also wondering that if you volunteer is it possible to get a cheaper BM ticket?
I think you can volunteer with some theme camps to get a discounted entrance ticket. the volunteer commitment may require you to either come early to set up or stay late to tear down/clean up (or both). If you have the time and want a cheaper ticket this is the way to go.
For a possible volunteer opportunity, try contacting piper(at)distriktcamp(dot)org. cool camp, you'll LOVE it there.
that is so contradictory. you are saying that because I don't know people at the festival means I don't know who "we" are. You are just one person man. You don't speak for the other thousands of people. Anyway, the point is, how can you say you "know" me by the fact that I have an opinion about electronic noise? Sooooo judgemental you are.Eric wrote:Yeah, someone who has admitted they have never been sure has a lot of opinions on who "we" are.lemur wrote:new_world_order wrote:
I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord.
you have a lot to learn.
If NWO makes it to the event, and does it with an open mind, he will probably have the time of his life. From what I'm getting by reading his posts- not so much.
I love baroque. I love opera. I've never heard baroque opera?!? What are these wonderous sounds you have not introduced me to???!!!gaminwench wrote:I am currently listening to a recording of a counter tenor (burner) performing a Baroque opera; the period instruments, played by friends/colleagues/someburners, are actually in tune, the musicality is beautiful...
Agreed. I don't think I listen to any one style/artist exclusively because I just feel like it (at least when I am alone).wh..sh wrote:LOL! Man!! kids say the darnest things.new_world_order wrote:Bravo! I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord. .
Music is any agreeable (pleasing and harmonious) sounds. One person certainly cannot define it for the rest.
I am no musician and I am sure I won't fit in any of your description of "people who would like classical music". And this might be a shock to you, but I enjoy Bach, Brahms, Dvorak and such. And the funny thing is I am moved by Franz von Vecsey just as much as I am amazed by Skillex.
Atleast for me, music is very mood dependent. That's why I could never listen to just one kind of music.
???your big words just confuse me. not because I don't know what they are, but because you just don't make any sense. you completely miss understand me at what I say and you think I am being sarcastic and "ignorant". You don't know me BITCH!lemur wrote:this thread burns my bottom.............the more i think of it the more i hope NWO is joking
it pains me to the core....
I think we have all seen people misunderstand what this event is before going there themselves..
I think i would rather people believe it is a drug fueled atheist sex orgy than have someone be this misunderstood to be able to think/say this:
Im not sure if this says more about NWO's misunderstanding of the event or more about NWO as a person... either way it is stuck in my brain.new_world_order wrote:Bravo! I wouldn't even fathom that someone from a festival like this would even know who Bach was, let alone a harpsichord. .
I would have to say that of all places and things one could do, including conferences and symposiums.. youre more likely to find more experts in their field, more classically trained musicians, phd's, engineers, rocket scientists, doctors, teachers, veterans, artists at the forefront of their medium, skilled craftsman, artisans, thinkers.. do'ers.. creators.. and a myriad of other people who are at the top of their game at burning man than any other place i have ever been.
and you wont only find these people hanging out spectating. they are doing. they are creating, they are giving us more than their opinion.
it pains me to think that anyone, even one person, can miss out on this fact... even if theyve never been before.
burning man isnt a fricken "festival" in the common sense... if one shows up one will learn about it..
the idea that anyone would be so pompous as to think that someone knowing about Bach or a harpsichord is a rarity in this community, or any other is nearly disgusting to me. (surely you realize plenty of americans, and people from the 20+ other nations who are part of this community learn about this man and those instruments in grammar school). Get over yourself!
"Go into it and see it.... And seeing means without prejudice. Seeing means that you don't condemn fear as bad from the very beginning. Who knows? it is not bad-who knows that it is? The explorer has to remain open to all the possibilities; he cannot afford a closed mind. A closed mind and exploration don't go together. He will go into it. If it brings suffering and pain, he will suffer the pain but he will go into it. Trembling, hesitant, but he will go into it: "It is my territory, I have to know what it is. Maybe it is carrying some Treasure for me? Maybe the fear is only there to protect the treasure.""
that's cool...I wasn't sure about theme camps, so thanks for verifying.theCryptofishist wrote:Positively, absolutely Not True. The one possible perk, of placed theme camps only, is the early entry pass. And those are not given out so very freely by the llc, and within theme camps they go to those who are capable of the hard work of setting up the camp so it's there when the gates open, and who have a proven track record with the camp in question so they can be trusted. Theme campers buy their own tickets, and buy the camp infrastructure. In the Booby Bar's case there was a certain expected amount of booze we were expected to bring. Some theme campers get staff tickets--by working at the llc department as well as with the theme camp.NessaZee wrote:Welcome to the eplaya forums. *waves*
new_world_order wrote:... after checking all the forums I can't find how to volunteer. I was also wondering that if you volunteer is it possible to get a cheaper BM ticket?
I think you can volunteer with some theme camps to get a discounted entrance ticket. the volunteer commitment may require you to either come early to set up or stay late to tear down/clean up (or both). If you have the time and want a cheaper ticket this is the way to go.
For a possible volunteer opportunity, try contacting piper(at)distriktcamp(dot)org. cool camp, you'll LOVE it there.
Nessa, new-world-order, anyone one else reading this--there aren't any short cuts. This is all the hard way. You put your cash, your work, your heart on the line. Many of us find it worth it, but this is not a walk in the park.
You are correct- we don't know you. You could be the most interesting and wonderful person in real life, yet your online representation is combative, irritable, ignorant of the people who attend the event and the event itself and borderline trollish.new_world_order wrote:???your big words just confuse me. not because I don't know what they are, but because you just don't make any sense. you completely miss understand me at what I say and you think I am being sarcastic and "ignorant". You don't know me BITCH!
