Black Rock "Ecosystem"

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:38 am

Black Rock City can be thought of as an Ecosystem with many factors. Environmental, Political, Legal, Financial, Public Awareness; all of these (and more) interact with the event. Individuals are attracted or repulsed from the event based on these factors (or at least as they see them).

As these factors change, the end result (our experience at BRC) also changes. Some of these factors are beyond anyone's control (ie-weather). Some are beyond most people's control (ie-location). Some are within our control (ie-our behaviour at BRC).

For example, if the ticket price was raised to $1000, only the rich would attend. This would undoubtably alter the end result (maybe good, maybe bad). Alternatively if the ticket price was lowered to $10 there would be an end effect (probably alot more attendees).

What factors tend to result in a higher percentage of "Yahoos" (and what factors discourage "Yahoos")?

What factors tend to result in a higher percentage of "Participants" (and what factors discourage Participants)?

Note: some may have effects all around; for example, fewer rules could both attract more Yahoo's and more Participants.

So what are the key factors that engourage "Particpants" while discouraging "Yahoos"? Identify those, and maybe we can "save" Burningman in the years to come.

Thoughts?

geekster · Post by **geekster** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:02 am

Interesting question, and difficult to answer. I would say reduced ticket prices for purchases through regional/local groups affiliated with BMorg would help along with higher prices for general public sale. That would tend to make it easier for "community members" to go yet not excluding anyone. People could join the local/regional groups if they are so inclined at any time. The majority of the day trippers that just come out for the burn and leave are probably not involved beyond attending the event itself and not likely to offer much in the form of participation. So I don't have any problems charging them more.

Don't tolerate creepy behavior. If you see someone doing something that doesn't "feel" right, call them on it. Interact with them. If they ARE really doing something slimy, the last thing they want is a spotlight. I am not saying to get nasty with them, just ask them why they are doing what they are doing and if it is an honest mistake, suggest an alternative way that person could get their needs met. This is born out of an incident where I saw a person standing on the street talking with some members of a camp. What he was really doing was palming a small camera and snapping pics of any exposed women that walked up the street. I walked over and said that what he was doing looked kinda creepy and maybe he should just be a little more obvious about his picture taking so that people would have a chance to decline if they wished. He got embarrassed and left. The woman with him gave him a nice scowl too. If a person isn't willing to be obvious in their activity, then they KNOW what they are doing might be illegal or embarrasing. I have NO problem with someone wanting to take pictures of the people at BRC, they are interesting and it makes wonderful subject material.

Factors that discourage Yahoos are higher barrier of entry than for non-yahoos and lack of tolerance for Yahooism. This might also increase the percentage of participants. Getting the yahoos to join local/regional groups might also convert them to participants.

tisha2 · Post by **tisha2** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:42 am

Nicely put, Geekster. The subtle, "Hey fuckhead, just what do you think you're doing?" works like a charm.

Last year I caught some yahoos (who looked like they came straight from a frat party) on a very plain golf cart at dawn on Sunday putting the grab on a SpongeBob statue from Kid's Camp for chrissake's. At first I was gonna go on by, but the BM spirit took hold and I just turned my bike and said, "HEY! Whaddayadoin'?" They froze and giggled and I continued, "You're STEALING...*AND* your stealing ART!...*AND* you're stealing art from KID'S CAMP!!! This is BURNING MAN, YOU JACKASS!!!!" cheers erupted all around us as the jerks sulkily put it back. Best case result: they suddenly *got* it and returned with a costume and an art car. Worst case: they decided we are all assholes and they'll never come back. aww.

Another suggestion - I've been thinking they should close the gate a lot earlier than Friday to keep the weekend warrior/tourist/clueless fuckhead quotient down. Like maybe Wednesday. Those of us who actually watch the city bloom on the playa for a week (or 'weeks' for some of you, thank you *very* much!) and have to actually work at surviving and co-existing out there for more than a couple o days are a lot less likely to rip it to shreds just cuz we're still drunk at 6am on Sunday.

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 12:00 pm

So clearly how we interact with one another is an important "factor". If we all avoided eye contact, did not speak to each other, etc. an environment that anyone could get away with anything and no one would no who did it would exist (I assume this would be considered bad).

The opposite, if everyone knew everyone else intimately and talked all the time, would create an environment (like a small town) where everyone knew everything about everyone.

So our INTERACTION WITH EACH OTHER is an important positive factor in the end product known as Burningman. And (lo and behold!) this is definately in our control.

Good example, let's keep it going!

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 12:14 pm

What factors tend to result in a higher percentage of "Yahoos" (and what factors discourage "Yahoos")?

I'd argue with the contention that BRC constitutes a ecosystem. It is a very insulated social system. I get your point though.

What factors tend to result in a higher percentage of "Yahoos" (and what factors discourage "Yahoos")?

Negative feedback loop. If asstard behavior are checked by the larger body (system) the tendency to see the negative behavior grow like an algae bloom on a pond of shit tends to reduce (at best) or not get much worse.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:17 pm

Alas, some of us organisms camouflage ourselves as yahoos just to frighten you away from the watering hole.

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:22 pm

One of the biggest disappointments ive had at burning man (kinda sorta related to the topic) was the prevalence of outdated, rather environmentally damaging technology in the form of cars that cant pass smog in most places, lawnmower engines putting out exhaust by the buckets, and all sorts of small creations based on gasoline powered motors and such. I rationalized it to myself as the costs of creative flow and all the wonderful art, but Im starting to wonder if perhaps there isnt a better way.

My field of study relates at the University delves heavily into the conversion from our current American Infrastructure revolving around crude fossil fuel dependency, to that of an infrastructure powered by renewable resources and energy efficient processes.

Burning man has come to embody the model of human interaction (for me) in the open ability to communicate effectively by lowering the walls between strangers, allowing them to coexist in a wonderful "ecosystem" of mutual benefits in a gift economy. Yet as with pollution in the real world, steps need to be taken to ensure that not everyone shares in the pollution of the individual at BM, the whole tradegy of the commons theory.

The mindset is progressive enough in my opinion that most would love to participate in being a cleaner more energy efficient BM just because its a good place to be in addition to the tons of intangibles that go along with it.

At this point in economic development and availability, solar power can provide a good solution to energy needs and save a ton of money in both short and long term on gas, not to mention storage and transport of the fossil fuel. Even hybrid engines, which are becoming more available and flexible in use can bring a new element to the playa artists ability to run their displays for longer unchecked periods of time. I can even think of a few ways to begin a model hydrogen economy camp which produces water vapor as exhaust for energy gained. Dont think anyones gonna mind a little more water in the air.

This is all just rough spur of the moment thought, and as I am very intrigued by your post I will think it over carefully and respond again. If anyone is interested in learning a little more, one of my favorite websites is the US Department of Energy EERE webpage, with tons of good information for those studying the field and ordinary citizens who care about the world.

http://www.eere.energy.gov/

I dont know if this relates directly to how to get rid of yahoos and increase participants but seems to fit the theme of improving burning man as an experience for us all. Have a good day all.. talk to u again soon.

geekster · Post by **geekster** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:27 pm

Uhm, do you know where about 99.99% of the hydrogen in this country comes from?

Also ... we are talking about a few hundred machines in the middle of a huge open expanse. Burning 10 lbs of wood is probably 1000% more polluting than a small gasoline engine running for a year.

Non-issue as far as I am concerned. I can't exactly seem to find a reason to get myself worked up over it.

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:29 pm

InvisibleMan wrote:I dont know if this relates directly to how to get rid of yahoos and increase participants but seems to fit the theme of improving burning man as an experience for us all. Have a good day all.. talk to u again soon.

To tie it back in, what effect would there be if greater restrictions were placed on gasoline engines at BM (both generators and mutated vehciles). Would this tend to increase Yahoo's or decrease them?

Would solar systems (or other alternative) then cost too much (and thus effectively be an increase in admission)? Would giant rave camps become improbable due to lack of energy density? Would the size of the city have to increase to allow fields of solar panels? Or would the enforcment efforts override all of these issues and drive away the true "Participants", leaving it all to the "Yahoo's"?

Badger - you definately "get it"! Love your pond analogy!

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:36 pm

Bob wrote:Alas, some of us organisms camouflage ourselves as yahoos just to frighten you away from the watering hole.

Too true. All too true. But in the end, what is the prize? A pond of shit...enjoy!

geekster · Post by **geekster** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:46 pm

Solar is pretty environmentally unfriendly to produce. The panels require basically a semiconductor plant along with an assembly line not much different than a car plant in the pollutants it produces such as paint fumes, etc. Also, every acre of deployed solar panels modifies/destroys an acre of habitat under them unless they are mounted on top of something that has already modified/destroyed that habitat. And it is pretty darned expensive.

Wind might be useful for some power, but probably not on the individual camp scale.

I think BRC should have its own nuke plant. We could store the waste in Cleveland, I think. Oh, and hydrogen comes as a byproduct from oil refineries.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:47 pm

. . . to get me to argue against sustainable energy use, but IMHO we'd be better off getting people to have sustainability in their daily life and let them slide on their vacation. True, if you have a portable solar system you can unhook it from your house, and set it up in BRC, but if it gets too complicated you're going to start skipping things. How many people want to set up BOTH a wind tower and a shade structure? And how much is it gonna cost in gasoline to drive that equipment up to the playa anyway? Truth is, Mutant Vehicles don't mutate off hybreds because there aren't 1000s of hybreds for sale under $3000. Income in burners varies, but few of us have the sort of luxury to spend tens of 1000s in our playa projects. In fact, spending that in order to improve our homes' energy efficiency might be a big bite if done all in one year. But spread over 4 or 5 and we could be saving on a day to day basis at home and the energy splurge on playa would matter less. Teh truth is that there are plenty of available gennies resonably portable and reasonably foolproof and gas is available readily and unfortunately cheaply. If energy prices were to rise significantly, some would turn to more sustainable alternatives. Others wouldn't attend. I have a problem with that.

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 3:35 pm

Education Packet : A Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Infrastructure
by the invisible man

What is Hydrogen

Hydrogen is the third most abundant element on the Earth’s surface, where it is primarily found in water and organic compounds. When burned as a fuel, or converted to electricity, hydrogen naturally joins with oxygen to again form water.

Hydrogen is the simplest element; an atom consisting of only one proton and one electron. It is also the most plentiful element in the universe. Despite its simplicity and abundance, hydrogen does not occur naturally as a gas on Earth, it is always combined with other elements.

How can Hydrogen be produced if it does not occur naturally?

Hydrogen can be made by separating it from hydrocarbons through the application of heat, a process known as “reforming.” Currently, most Hydrogen is made this way from natural gas. An electric current can also be used to separate water into its components of Hydrogen and Oxygen.

What is a Fuel Cell?

Hydrogen is high in energy and an engine that burns pure hydrogen is known as a Fuel Cell. These engines are highly regarded as environmentally friendly because they produce steam (water in a gaseous form) as a byproduct instead of pollution. NASA has used liquid Hydrogen since the 1970’s, and Hydrogen-based Fuel Cells power our space shuttles electrical systems, producing pure water that the crew drinks as a byproduct.

What are the realistic applications of Fuel Cells in America?

Fuel cells are a promising technology for use as a source of heat and electricity for buildings, and as an electrical power source for electric vehicles. Although these applications would ideally run off pure hydrogen, in the near term they are likely to be fueled with natural gas, methanol, or even gasoline. Reforming these fuels to create hydrogen will allow the use of much of our current energy infrastructure—gas stations, natural gas pipelines, etc.—while fuel cells are phased in.

What are the practical advantages of Hydrogen-based Fuel Cells?

In the future, hydrogen will join electricity as an important energy carrier. An energy carrier stores, moves, and delivers energy in a usable form to consumers. Renewable energy sources, like those gathering energy from the sun, can't produce all the time. The sun doesn't always shine. But hydrogen can store this energy until it is needed and can be transported to where it is needed.

Hydrogen-based Fuel Cell technology is being incorporated into the basic American energy infrastructure through US Department of Energy efforts, and will gain economic and consumer feasibility as cost effective implementation program take effect and result in widespread availability, providing an environmentally friendly alternative/supplement to fossil fuel use.

Are Hydrogen-based Fuel Cells safe?

Hydrogen has an excellent safety record, and is as safer for transport, storage and use than gasoline and many other fuels.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 3:46 pm

Would solar systems (or other alternative) then cost too much (and thus effectively be an increase in admission)? Would giant rave camps become improbable due to lack of energy density?

yes
yes, though some would find this beneficial

Isotopia · Post by **Isotopia** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 3:52 pm

Uhm, do you know where about 99.99% of the hydrogen in this country comes from?

Hydrogen Camp ya dumass.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:05 pm

dragonfly Jafe wrote:
Bob wrote:Alas, some of us organisms camouflage ourselves as yahoos just to frighten you away from the watering hole.
Too true. All too true. But in the end, what is the prize? A pond of shit...enjoy!

All depends on whose wildebeest is being Al-Gored, doesn't it? I'd take a dozen locals over one latter-day hippie confused as to whether they're yokels or yahoos. No small wonder that at the mere mention of "ecosystem" this thread got sidetracked into a niggling debate over power and its consumption.

geekster · Post by **geekster** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:26 pm

Isotopia wrote:Hydrogen Camp ya dumass.

Good one!

Actually, around here most hydrogen is produced from a local oil refinery. They also produce dry ice and CO2 for soft drink bottlers.

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:38 pm

one very crude example;

P x In x W
Fy = K x ----------------------
Ip x Q x C x B x F

where;

Fy = "Yahoo Factor"
K = a constant of some sort
P = Population of BRC
In = degree of "negative Interaction"
W = Weather (better weather is larger)
Ip = degree of "positive Interaction"
Q = degree of Individual Self-Reliance
C = Ticket price
B = amount of BMllc "Red-Tape"
F = amount of "Family Values"

Factors on top tend to increase "Yahooism" when they get big, decrease it when they get small. Factors underneath tend to decrease "Yahooism" when they get big, increase it when they get small. Of course, each Factor has it's own formula (which sometimes include other Factors), making for a very complicated relationship in real life.

So if this model accurately predicted "Yahooism" (and assuming that "Yahooism" was an inverse indicator of how "Burny" a burn is) it would simply be a matter of optimizing the right Factors to minimize Fy.

What are other Factors that affect our "Ecosystem"? The price of a barrel of Crude? The Unemployment Rate in the Bay Area? The number of dot comms that are hiring? A Supermarket being built in China? The cost of ELwire?

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:47 pm

dragonfly Jafe wrote: K = a constant of some sort

Henceforth to be known as the Jafe Constant, or "J"

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:53 pm

Education Packet 2: Its not your fathers Solar Technology

Solar technologies use the sun's energy and light to provide heat, light, hot water, electricity, and even cooling, for homes, businesses, and industry. A pretty simple concept really, nothing to oppose here.

Photovoltaic solar cells are useful in large scale energy gathering projects but are at this point are unreasonably expensive to consider for the average persons use, which effectively rules them out of Burning Man for the most part.

However, there are a wide variety of solar technologies, of which the dish engine system could be useful in the right hands.

Reflective materials such as mirrors are used to concentrate the sun's energy. This concentrated heat energy is then converted into electricity.

Specifics: A dish/engine system uses mirrors in the shape of a dish to collect and concentrate the sun's heat onto a receiver. The receiver transfers the solar energy to a heat engine—usually a Stirling cycle engine—that converts the heat into mechanical energy, which drives a generator to produce electricity. The receiver, heat engine, and generator are integrated into one assembly that is mounted at the focus of the mirrored dish.

More Specifics: An alternative approach, called the open Brayton cycle, passes air through a porous medium in the receiver, causing the air to heat and expand rapidly. The hot air is then fed into a separate gas turbine that drives a generator to produce electricity.

We already have tons of generators, may as well get more efficient and renewable use out of a few of them if it becomes reasonably cost effective to do so in the near future. May take some hard work, effort, and learning, but then what doesnt.

Mirror technologies are advancing quickly. Concentrators use reflective surfaces of aluminum or silver on the front or back surface of thin glass or plastic. Researchers are developing new reflective materials, such as advanced polymer films, that are less expensive to produce than glass. Stretched membranes are thin reflective membranes stretched across a rim or hoop. Another membrane stretched on the back creates a partial vacuum. This forces the membranes into a spherical shape, which is the ideal concentrator shape.

Researchers are working with utilities on experimental hybrid power towers that run on solar energy and natural gas. A similar solar/fossil fuel hybrid is being developed for dish/engine systems. The advantage of hybrid systems is that they could run continuously.

Concentrating solar power is the least expensive solar electricity for large-scale power generation, and has the potential to make solar power available at a very competitive rate. As a result, government, industry, and utilities have formed partnerships with the goal of reducing the manufacturing cost of concentrating solar power technologies. Once this happens, small scale renewable energy generators will be consumer friendly in addition to being more environmentally friendly.

Its not that far fetched to utitlize bits of solar technology.

So, in conclusion to why you are a moron...

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 4:58 pm

Oh poof! THe AEZ is way ahead of you. If you're not careful I'll have BRR beat you up!

geekster · Post by **geekster** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 5:02 pm

InvisibleMan wrote:Its not that far fetched to utitlize bits of solar technology.

It is at night.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 5:05 pm

dragonfly Jafe wrote:....What are other Factors that affect our "Ecosystem"? The price of a barrel of Crude? The Unemployment Rate in the Bay Area? The number of dot comms that are hiring? A Supermarket being built in China? The cost of ELwire?

Fashion... eg from reading the eplaya, one might assume that "rainbow" is the new "black".

diane o'thirst · Post by **diane o'thirst** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 6:06 pm

I think if they raised the tickets to $1000 (starting level), we wouldn't see just rich people out there. The rich have ten Ben Franklins <i>disposable</i> the rest of us would tighten our belts and "make" that $1000 disposable. At the sacrifice of several things...like, less food, limiting car driving to a radius of 20 miles from home base for much of the year, leaving lights and appliances off most of the time...

People would still go. But I think that we'd see this year's tendency become a trend: less art, more booze. It's cheaper and easier to put together a bar and record a bunch of MP3's than to do an installation or mount a performance.

The promise of free booze, an "anything goes" atmosphere and naked girls everywhere would attract the frats, who'd be spending their trust fund/daddy's stipend/beer blast fundraiser money on a $2500 at-the-gate ticket. Hey, it's the biggest party on the planet! Isn't $2500 worth it to be a part of party legendry and bragging rights? The faithful would get disgusted with their shenanigans and the lack of art, jump ship, and open up their spaces to more. Next thing you know — MTV, "Live From Burning Man!"

I think the meme of "Burning Man as the ultimate anything-goes party" in circulation is the biggest yahoo-magnet. The back of the ticket says that you assume the risk of serious injury or death by attending; that can be interpreted to mean "Hey, I could totally run someone over or kill someone and get away with it by quoting the ticket's small print!" That's probably untrue but some dipstick who takes it as a truism can do a lot of damage before the Rangers and the Sheriff's men and the lawyers get ahold of him.

I think the best way of keeping the yahoo factor down would be to stop flippantly quoting the ticket and emphasize how much work it is to getting everything out there, up and functional. If people ask me about it and mention they want to go, I always say, "Start reading up and getting your gear together NOW." Yahoos don't like to work.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Mon Sep 27, 2004 6:35 pm

Start reading and get your gear Now is my favorate line. No takers yet. 4yr.

This year was on me as a baby sitter. I missed out on some aaaah real fun. Grand father is not going any more. I plane to camp by myself. Any more lines I can use to wad off the........?

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 12:53 am

This is a BBC news report...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/2236952.stm

more to follow @ 11.

Time heals all wounds except the ones that kill ya.

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:05 am

Perhaps we could use ebola to reduce the number of yahoos.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/2776719.stm

The x factor of communicable diseases has to factor into the equation somehow.

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:17 am

if yahoos were rats we could just do this to them...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3699342.stm

InvisibleMan · Post by **InvisibleMan** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:24 am

Today in How Stuff Works... the followup to your educational packet. I hope you all got your packet in the mail and read it over. Todays subject is the Hydrogen Economy. You will be tested on the material so read the pages thoroughly.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/hydrogen-economy.htm

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 7:52 am

How do RV's factor into our little "ecosystem"? If RV's were banned (or had to pay a "tax" to enter), would that encourage or discourage Yahoo's? Encourage or discourage Participants?

Black Rock "Ecosystem"

Black Rock "Ecosystem"

Perhaps a shift in modern technology....

Re: Perhaps a shift in modern technology....

It's pretty darn odd. . .

AHEM AHEM....

YOU DONT ALWAYS HAVE TO DO AS YOUR TOLD>>>

Re: YOU DONT ALWAYS HAVE TO DO AS YOUR TOLD>>>

THE REASONS ARE OUT THERE>>>

rut ro....

verminator 4, the final chapter...

For those less trusting of my words...