Deep Insights (Gimme)

spectabillis · Post by **spectabillis** » Sat Oct 23, 2004 7:53 pm

Rian Jackson wrote:you now no longer exist merely for my entertainment but to give to me Deep Insights. I'm waiting....

Hmmm... I wonder it this is what Observers grow up to be?

sonic · Post by **sonic** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:48 am

You are not responsible for other peoples reactions to your actions. And conversely, other people are not responsible for your reactions to thier actions.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 6:13 am

remember to turn off these silly machines before you take yourself too seriously.

robbidobbs · Post by **robbidobbs** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 7:22 am

My brain's full.

johnboy1953 · Post by **johnboy1953** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:40 pm

Love everyone unconditionally. Including yourself. If you can you're free.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Mon Nov 01, 2004 9:42 pm

this is the deep thread ain't it?

Live Webcam/Video .November 2 Election Day Fire Ceremony Streamed Live Here! http://www.brightpathvideo.com

Positive Prayer is the core of realized intention.
Positive prayer derives its unfailing energy from focused thought held to the desired feeling one wants to experience. Divine creative thought possesses no qualitative function, therefore for those in perfect or near perfect alignment with absolute energy, the power of the thought attracts like unto itself. Use the words "if", may", or "please", and you get if, may or please. Use the words "I know", "I call forth" or "I realize" and you are now in the realm of the cosmic idiom. Here now is our intention and prayer for this election. You may use it too.

There is nothing separate in this great mystery called life. We, plant and animal life, the oceans, rivers, mountains and cities are all connected by our ultimate sameness. As a voice for that sameness, that immutable unity, I call forth now into this particular creation called the United States of America, the nurturance, protection, and special love for all living things in the soul of all voters. All living things planet wide as well. I call forth this creation now and the forces and manifestations of love, love that cherishes all of the people and the environment of this planet, love that is manifested in those whose intention it is to honor all of life and by their policies do the highest good for everyone and everything. I know for the whole of creation that this is so. I claim the incredible happiness that accompanies this movement of life! I know for all of creation that the presidential candidate most closely matching this calling will be elected the next US president. The complex establishment of this truth I now offer into the Law of the universe where perfection and clarity take their unique and special course and for this I give great thanks and release this prayer with perfect confidence that its fulfillment is already accomplished!

And so it is!

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:40 am

if bullshit were gold, you'd be a rich man CA.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 7:35 am

Good thing for you there is such a thing as forgiveness
when you think negativity...you get negativity

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:47 am

cowboyangel wrote:Good thing for you there is such a thing as forgiveness
when you think negativity...you get negativity

#1 what do you think i have done that requires forgiveness?

#2 it isn't so much that i profess negativity, it is the prostitution of positivity for your own personal wishes which disturbs me...

Main Entry: pos·i·tiv·i·ty
Pronunciation: "pä-z&-'ti-v&-tE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -ties
1 : the quality or state of being positive
2 : something that is positive

#3 however, on your last point... i concur with "when you think negativity...you get negativity"

#4 allow me to paraphrase your comment to say "when you think pragmatism, you get pragmatism"

Main Entry: prag·ma·tism
Pronunciation: 'prag-m&-"ti-z&m
Function: noun
1 : a practical approach to problems and affairs <tried to strike a balance between principles and pragmatism>
2 : an American movement in philosophy founded by C. S. Peirce and William James and marked by the doctrines that the meaning of conceptions is to be sought in their practical bearings, that the function of thought is to guide action, and that truth is preeminently to be tested by the practical consequences of belief
- prag·ma·tist /-m&-tist/ adjective or noun
- prag·ma·tis·tic /"prag-m&-'tis-tik/ adjective

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:12 am

funny that you would be disturbed by my positivity...... oh well
check out http://www.ggcsl.org for more explanation

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:55 am

cowboyangel wrote:funny that you would be disturbed by my positivity...... oh well
check out http://www.ggcsl.org for more explanation

joel wrote:#2 it isn't so much that i profess negativity, it is the prostitution of positivity for your own personal wishes which disturbs me...

you may be as positive as you wish, the part i am concerned about is in bold and underlined

and another point, off topic and somewhat unrelated... i have issues with other people posting service records of public officials with an opinion on another thread, yet those same people never served themselves...

that activity seems... hypocritcal.

CoworkerLurker · Post by **CoworkerLurker** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:16 pm

Simply Joel wrote:and another point, off topic and somewhat unrelated... i have issues with other people posting service records of public officials with an opinion on another thread, yet those same people never served themselves...

that activity seems... hypocritcal.

I think there's still validity in the activity. It's not even hypocritical as long as they are not trying to suggest that there's something wrong with a lack of military service per se. To me, it's about the pattern and its meaning. Is it a coincidence that the most most gung-ho supporters of the war never saw combat themselves? Is there a value in having plenty of key foreign policy decision makers who understand the military and war firsthand? Is the hypocrisy really in the group who didn't serve, when they question the patriotism and courage of those who did? Are these questions that can only be validly asked by current or former members of the armed forces? Is this a topic that belongs in a different thread?

(In the interest of full disclosure, I've never served in the military, never intended to, glad I haven't- in most ways. I worked in a 90%+ Navy environment for a year and a half, and that was enough. I have a lot of respect for people who serve in the military in what I consider a positive way.)

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:19 pm

Simply Joel wrote:
cowboyangel wrote:funny that you would be disturbed by my positivity...... oh well
check out http://www.ggcsl.org for more explanation

joel wrote:#2 it isn't so much that i profess negativity, it is the prostitution of positivity for your own personal wishes which disturbs me...

you may be as positive as you wish, the part i am concerned about is in bold and underlined

and another point, off topic and somewhat unrelated... i have issues with other people posting service records of public officials with an opinion on another thread, yet those same people never served themselves...

that activity seems... hypocritcal.

prostitution of positivity??? I have no idea what you mean have you read the prayer????

johnboy1953 · Post by **johnboy1953** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 6:28 pm

Yo friends and lovers, So easy for me to miss the point when I try to defend the things I say. Often I don't even really mean them in the sense that it wasn't my completed thought process, and only a quick reaction, often without enough time to think things through. I've been arguing for years and it hasn't changed things much and didn't matter if I was right or wrong about the details. I'm willing to see that I've always taken my ego thought process very seriously, when I really shouldn't have given a damn about it. So what is this world? All this fuss and fight? Having had the experience of unconditional love for just a little while (a few uninterupted hours), To me it's all about love now. Me loving myself the way I am. When I pull that off, I have no arguments with any other point of view. I see through it. To me it's not who we are. And that's just my point of view and only worth that much. Everyone here has something important to share, and I know what it is. That's why I'm spending my time pressing on these little keys. Burning Man changed me in a very positive way. Because you were there, with me. Your energy was so uplifting, that I was uplifted. I hope I see you there next year, and I'm glad to know you all. [u[/u]

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:24 pm

I got this email from a dear friend today. I'm publishing it here with my reply

I am numb, appalled, dismayed. How at variance are my own values with those of my countrymen! Now greater reign than ever is given to arrogance,violence, ignorance, narrowness, deceit. I guess if we are to find consolation, it's going to have be with those who believe as we do and are striving for greater tolerance, awareness, and creativity. It may be time to turn to the Stoic philosophers and the Chinese poets who were exiled and found strength and joy in nature, in the mountains, the waterfalls, the clouds. I wish I were in Greece or France. But I'm glad I live at least in New England, in an open, caring, intelligent community. I'm glad I have a lot of woods around. Before going to teach this morning I walked for an hour to clear my mind and lift my spirits. Most of the trees are bare but there are still a few with yellow and golden brown canopies. The scent of the dying ferns was intensely sweet; I saw three deer, a fox, and a hawk and I realized I was going to have to take more refuge than ever in nature during the next four long bleak years.

Hey Good to hear from you! I share all of your sentiments. In looking for reasons for this catastrophe, I see a few things that stand out; a
hopelessly corrupt media machine that has infected the public mind like a fateful drug, opposition leaders who drink at the same corporate trough as the party in power and for the most part, lack the courage to take on these bastards, a religious fanaticism that has warped
Christianity into something unrecognizable and galvanized many millions of voters around a few cultural issues at the sacrifice of truly noble
and earth crucial causes, and last but not least, the toxic fear that all these defects combined have taken hold of in the majority of the
voting publics' consciousness.
I see good things too. Like intense solidarity in those of us of like mind, a growing effective progressive movement that is beginning to make
serious inroads to the problems mentioned above and the appearance of a totally new spiritual activism that's making its presence felt all over
the globe.
As I look at that sad blue/red map of the US election, I see a wounded nation, bleeding from its vital center and lower chakras, held together
by the higher mind represented on the coasts and Great Lakes region. I am going to believe that something good is working its way to the
forefront in all of this, only because I have seen so much good already manifested by these higher mind blue regions. Ignorance and fear are
powerful forces and they can be turned around. I agree wholeheartedly with you that now is the time to stand for life in what ever way suits you best.
Keep the peace, Love
JP

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:28 pm

I think it has something to do with ocean currents, the St. Lawrence River and the Great Lakes. Perhaps all that water helps to keep a clear mind. I noticed that all the land locked states went Bushy.

Or, maybe it's the Canadian influence?

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:48 pm

cowboyangel wrote:

I got this email from a dear friend today. I'm publishing it here with my reply

I am numb, appalled, dismayed....

...Keep the peace, Love
JP

Please note, the omission of the part of the above quote was to ensure the readership didn't actually have to suffer through such absolute nonsensical load of balderdash in my entire life.... OK, a bit of an overstatenment... yet... who are you to discount the votes of other people, their beliefs, the values... just because they don't actually fall into line with yours...

you know, i am numb from all this crying about how unfair the election had to be... why, well, because of George Bush the Boogey Man....

you know, i am appalled that all of you (if the shoes fits, that means you) would see this election as the end of all ends... that there isn't any method by which to ensure your voice is heard since the anti-Bush wasn't elected. give me a break... pick yourself up by the bootstaps and go fix something within your grasps (Jimmy Carter and Habitats for Humanity comes to mind)... are you waiting for an invitation?

you know, i am dismayed that actual intelligent thinking people thought the anti-Bush was a sure bet. and after all the credit you give the administration for misdeeds... the democratic party simply failed to deliver the votes (please be assured, both parties had the best lawyers money can buy).

so, if you don't get it (this is a great democracy, you can make a change, there is another election in 2 years, and then 2 years after that)... well, you have company... 'cause i don't get your fatalistic perspective or your inability to see beyond minor setback and failures... not one bit.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:34 pm

you may be beyond hope my friend. 55 million + people disgree with you and disagree with your support for the most obviously toxic presidency ever seen in this country. When progressives start talking about how moderate Nixon was you know something is seriously wrong with the current white house crew. For an intelligent person, your ignorance of the "nature" of the truly deep divide in America is un- excusable. This is like the second term of Nixon as a matter of fact. This current crew is so hopelessly dishonest and corrupt that it is bound to catch up with them as it did for Nixon. Your gloating over the widespread republican victories is like the Roman Senate, partying with Nero as the city burned. It's not about the electoral system not working so much as it is about the burden to the entire world of 4 more years of people toxic, earth toxic policies from this divisive gang. Listen to what Larry has to say about our American society on my web site. Advertised it here many times.
The "openess" with which he invites you and your party into the Burning Man festival is something your friends in the republican party are antithetical towards. And please don't lecture me about social service like Habitat for Humanity. I've done enough volunteerism to last several lifetimes.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:49 pm

CA, you are not being very gracious this evening i can see....

i guess kindness and positive thinking do have their limits, eh?

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 8:08 pm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
November 3, 2004
Living Poor, Voting Rich
By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

In the aftermath of this civil war that our nation has just fought, one result is clear: the Democratic Party's first priority should be to reconnect with the American heartland.

I'm writing this on tenterhooks on Tuesday, without knowing the election results. But whether John Kerry's supporters are now celebrating or seeking asylum abroad, they should be feeling wretched about the millions of farmers, factory workers and waitresses who ended up voting - utterly against their own interests - for Republican candidates.

One of the Republican Party's major successes over the last few decades has been to persuade many of the working poor to vote for tax breaks for billionaires. Democrats are still effective on bread-and-butter issues like health care, but they come across in much of America as arrogant and out of touch the moment the discussion shifts to values.

"On values, they are really noncompetitive in the heartland," noted Mike Johanns, a Republican who is governor of Nebraska. "This kind of elitist, Eastern approach to the party is just devastating in the Midwest and Western states. It's very difficult for senatorial, Congressional and even local candidates to survive."

In the summer, I was home - too briefly - in Yamhill, Ore., a rural, working-class area where most people would benefit from Democratic policies on taxes and health care. But many of those people disdain Democrats as elitists who empathize with spotted owls rather than loggers.

One problem is the yuppification of the Democratic Party. Thomas Frank, author of the best political book of the year, "What's the Matter With Kansas: How Conservatives Won the Heart of America," says that Democratic leaders have been so eager to win over suburban professionals that they have lost touch with blue-collar America.

"There is a very upper-middle-class flavor to liberalism, and that's just bound to rub average people the wrong way," Mr. Frank said. He notes that Republicans have used "culturally powerful but content-free issues" to connect to ordinary voters.

To put it another way, Democrats peddle issues, and Republicans sell values. Consider the four G's: God, guns, gays and grizzlies.

One-third of Americans are evangelical Christians, and many of them perceive Democrats as often contemptuous of their faith. And, frankly, they're often right. Some evangelicals take revenge by smiting Democratic candidates.

Then we have guns, which are such an emotive issue that Idaho's Democratic candidate for the Senate two years ago, Alan Blinken, felt obliged to declare that he owned 24 guns "and I use them all." He still lost.

As for gays, that's a rare wedge issue that Democrats have managed to neutralize in part, along with abortion. Most Americans disapprove of gay marriage but do support some kind of civil unions (just as they oppose "partial birth" abortions but don't want teenage girls to die from coat-hanger abortions).

Finally, grizzlies - a metaphor for the way environmentalism is often perceived in the West as high-handed. When I visited Idaho, people were still enraged over a Clinton proposal to introduce 25 grizzly bears into the wild. It wasn't worth antagonizing most of Idaho over 25 bears.

"The Republicans are smarter," mused Oregon's governor, Ted Kulongoski, a Democrat. "They've created ... these social issues to get the public to stop looking at what's happening to them economically."

"What we once thought - that people would vote in their economic self-interest - is not true, and we Democrats haven't figured out how to deal with that."

Bill Clinton intuitively understood the challenge, and John Edwards seems to as well, perhaps because of their own working-class origins. But the party as a whole is mostly in denial.

To appeal to middle America, Democratic leaders don't need to carry guns to church services and shoot grizzlies on the way. But a starting point would be to shed their inhibitions about talking about faith, and to work more with religious groups.

Otherwise, the Democratic Party's efforts to improve the lives of working-class Americans in the long run will be blocked by the very people the Democrats aim to help.

Copyright 2004 The New York Times Company

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 8:27 pm

Simply Joel wrote:CA, you are not being very gracious this evening i can see....

i guess kindness and positive thinking do have their limits, eh?

I don't think I've ever been unkind to you Joel. This is political banter....you know what Harry Truman said about that.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 8:35 pm

Kristof's article is pretty good. I'm not a democrat btw, I'm a green. George Lakoff states pretty much the same thing in his analysis. http///www.rockridgeinstitute.org

Democrats have repeatedly failed to grab the hearts and minds of the majority, even though much of what they stand for benefits the majority.
I think Lakoff is really on to the solution if only the democrats would listen.

Silver 2 · Post by **Silver 2** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 8:35 pm

But a starting point would be to shed their inhibitions about talking about faith, and to work more with religious groups

I will quote Heinlein, "It is better to die on your feet than on your knees".

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:38 am

cowboyangel wrote:
Simply Joel wrote:CA, you are not being very gracious this evening i can see....

i guess kindness and positive thinking do have their limits, eh?
I don't think I've ever been unkind to you Joel. This is political banter....you know what Harry Truman said about that.

you mean this quote?

Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
- Harry S. Truman

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:46 am

or this quote?

If you can't convince them, confuse them. -- Harry S. Truman

helitack · Post by **helitack** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:49 am

Bad thing is, bush policies threaten my job. He and his minions (norton and mainella) have literally raped my agency with their backward policies. Wanna visit the Park? Well we might not be open today. Crash your car? Lose your kid? your Gramma? We might be able to help IF we have the money to do it. Need some directions? Sorry the self service entrance station will take your 10 bucks, give you a reciept but it can't tell ya how to get to the visitor center, if its open. Damn I am glad I'm flying this morning, it will help take my mind off this.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 7:27 am

Simply Joel wrote:or this quote?

If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. -- Harry S. Truman

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 7:34 am

Joel wrote:

you know, i am appalled that all of you (if the shoes fits, that means you) would see this election as the end of all ends... that there isn't any method by which to ensure your voice is heard since the anti-Bush wasn't elected. give me a break... pick yourself up by the bootstaps and go fix something within your grasps (Jimmy Carter and Habitats for Humanity comes to mind)... are you waiting for an invitation?

you know, i am dismayed that actual intelligent thinking people thought the anti-Bush was a sure bet. and after all the credit you give the administration for misdeeds... the democratic party simply failed to deliver the votes (please be assured, both parties had the best lawyers money can buy).

And.... I agree. I despise Bush, but he won. Now... Let's do something about it other than complain. Jimmy Carter often comes to mind to me: he did go out and do something (and Habitat for Humanity is about the only 'charity' that I contribute to). No, the Anti-Bush was not the answer; hell, most of us on the boards voted for him while holding our noses; so, lets get out there and WORK for change. I know I will, and I am probably the most politically cynical person around... well, except for DVD. If I can be politically active, when I dislike politics and everything that it stands for, then so can you.

And, Joel... I refuse to stop slamming Bush. I accept him as President (the people have spoken) but I don't like it. I will work to change it in the ways that best suit me, as is my right and duty as an American.

And what the hell are we doing talking about this on the "Deep Insights" thread? This is not "Deep Insight".

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 7:42 am

samtzu wrote:what the hell are we doing talking about this on the "Deep Insights" thread? This is not "Deep Insight".

i don't know, ask CA.

and you are correct, most of the previous comments regarding politics on this thread has not been deep insight.

cowboyangel · Post by **cowboyangel** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 9:35 am

Simply Joel wrote:
samtzu wrote:what the hell are we doing talking about this on the "Deep Insights" thread? This is not "Deep Insight".
i don't know, ask CA.

and you are correct, most of the previous comments regarding politics on this thread has not been deep insight.

your opinion

Deep Insights (Gimme)

Re: Deep Insights (Gimme)

deep insight

hhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?