Bad burners at SF decom!
-
technopatra
- Posts: 727
- Joined: Mon Jun 16, 2003 3:04 pm
- Location: SF, CA
- Contact:
Ok Bob, I agree that the "marketing" - 1 flyer and a couple of email announcements - for Decom is that of a party, because it is. For the event the promotion created by the Project does try to educate that it is much much more than that, but that promotion is now only a teeny bit of the exposure people have, what with all the news articles & tv soundbites that do focus on the party facet, and the fact that the Ibiza party circuit folks now have it down as a must-see destination.
So the question is: how can we use the resources we have to help change that message?
I think Badger's idea of a real community forum on the eplaya is a start. The board memebrs who used to be on the eplaya were basically scared away by the overwhelming cruelty and personal attacks they experienced on the old eplaya. A moderated forum where the participants agree beforehand to keep the conversation at a mutually respectful level could create a safer atmosphere, not just for the Board, but for anyone who wants to stick with the issues and avoid wading through a ton of off-topic ramblings.
Utilizing the Flambe Lounges in SF to educate for LNT , and encouraging the Regional parties to do the same (if they aren't already, which I am sure at least some of them are, as many of them are, as I understand it, way ahead of the SF crowd in this), would I think be huge.
I think it's all about learning by example. I learned how to conduct myself on the playa not from the communicatoin from the Project but by the conduct of the people I camped with , talked with, walked past on the playa etc. There was a consistent reinforcement of the culture even as recently as 2000, which I am afraid has declined as the newbie-to-veteran ratio has increased.
What else can we do?
Speaking to your point about restricting the invite...well we know we can't do that, but it is true that the participant base is shifting. It used to be that almost everyone who came to Burning Man was brought to Burning Man by friends or family. Now we have groups of newbies who come on their own, with little guidance.
Someone I was recently speaking with likened this to the paradigm shift of the influence of the dotcommers in the mid 90's. The culture of Burning Man changed at that point (no judgements about better or worse) with the influx of moneyed participants. My first year was '98, so I can't speak to that, but would be interested to hear your thoughts, Bob, and those of others who were around to see that change.
Did you feel the same way? What at that point, if anything did you do to help them understnad and be part of the culture?
(BTW I don't know if I made this clear but I had a blast at Decom. I think there were more people in costume there than on the playa, the tourist factor was remarkably low, everyone seemed familiar and the overall vibe was really excited and friendly and inspiring. I saw no vomit flowing in the gutters. Tho I should qualify that by confessing that I did leave early, at 10pm, because I don't like the sardine aspect of the evening portion and I had to work in the morning.)
So the question is: how can we use the resources we have to help change that message?
I think Badger's idea of a real community forum on the eplaya is a start. The board memebrs who used to be on the eplaya were basically scared away by the overwhelming cruelty and personal attacks they experienced on the old eplaya. A moderated forum where the participants agree beforehand to keep the conversation at a mutually respectful level could create a safer atmosphere, not just for the Board, but for anyone who wants to stick with the issues and avoid wading through a ton of off-topic ramblings.
Utilizing the Flambe Lounges in SF to educate for LNT , and encouraging the Regional parties to do the same (if they aren't already, which I am sure at least some of them are, as many of them are, as I understand it, way ahead of the SF crowd in this), would I think be huge.
I think it's all about learning by example. I learned how to conduct myself on the playa not from the communicatoin from the Project but by the conduct of the people I camped with , talked with, walked past on the playa etc. There was a consistent reinforcement of the culture even as recently as 2000, which I am afraid has declined as the newbie-to-veteran ratio has increased.
What else can we do?
Speaking to your point about restricting the invite...well we know we can't do that, but it is true that the participant base is shifting. It used to be that almost everyone who came to Burning Man was brought to Burning Man by friends or family. Now we have groups of newbies who come on their own, with little guidance.
Someone I was recently speaking with likened this to the paradigm shift of the influence of the dotcommers in the mid 90's. The culture of Burning Man changed at that point (no judgements about better or worse) with the influx of moneyed participants. My first year was '98, so I can't speak to that, but would be interested to hear your thoughts, Bob, and those of others who were around to see that change.
Did you feel the same way? What at that point, if anything did you do to help them understnad and be part of the culture?
(BTW I don't know if I made this clear but I had a blast at Decom. I think there were more people in costume there than on the playa, the tourist factor was remarkably low, everyone seemed familiar and the overall vibe was really excited and friendly and inspiring. I saw no vomit flowing in the gutters. Tho I should qualify that by confessing that I did leave early, at 10pm, because I don't like the sardine aspect of the evening portion and I had to work in the morning.)
-
Bob
- Posts: 6748
- Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 10:00 am
- Burning Since: 1986
- Camp Name: Royaneh
- Location: San Francisco
- Contact:
Sweet fucking Jesus... get out the violins. If they wanted to engage in online chatter with the hoi polloi, they'd be online and chattering. If they don't, it's obviously because they're uninterested and/or it's not part of their job descriptions.technopatra wrote:....The board memebrs who used to be on the eplaya were basically scared away by the overwhelming cruelty and personal attacks they experienced on the old eplaya. A moderated forum where the participants agree beforehand to keep the conversation at a mutually respectful level could create a safer atmosphere, not just for the Board, but for anyone who wants to stick with the issues and avoid wading through a ton of off-topic ramblings.....
Re: Decompression [tm], maybe you party people need the San Francisco equivalent of The Earth Guardians.
Amazing desert structures & stuff: http://sites.google.com/site/potatotrap/
"Let us say I suggest you may be human." -- Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam
"Let us say I suggest you may be human." -- Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam
-
DVD Burner
- Posts: 10358
- Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:09 am
- Burning Since: 1986
- Camp Name: White Trash Camp
- Contact:
"scared away by the overwhelming cruelty and personal attacks they experienced"?Bob wrote:Sweet fucking Jesus... get out the violins. If they wanted to engage in online chatter with the hoi polloi, they'd be online and chattering. If they don't, it's obviously because they're uninterested and/or it's not part of their job descriptions.technopatra wrote:....The board memebrs who used to be on the eplaya were basically scared away by the overwhelming cruelty and personal attacks they experienced on the old eplaya. A moderated forum where the participants agree beforehand to keep the conversation at a mutually respectful level could create a safer atmosphere, not just for the Board, but for anyone who wants to stick with the issues and avoid wading through a ton of off-topic ramblings.....
Re: Decompression [tm], maybe you party people need the San Francisco equivalent of The Earth Guardians.
I tend to agree with Bob. Not only that but some of the ones that were here were some of the meanest people to some of the newbie’s.
If they are not here it's because they couldn’t take what they were dishing out to put it politely. But that's neither here nor there.
As far as Technopatra's question:
The resources have been in front of everyone as long as I've known about Burningman.technopatra wrote:
So the question is: how can we use the resources we have to help change that message?
1.) One resource that BM has a dominant force in, is the internet.
2.) The second resource that BM has is talented artists, engineers, musicians....tons of talent beyond belief.
3.) Pooling all this talent together shouldn’t be hard if BM takes up on the suggestions many have been posing to the eplaya for the longest.
A 24/7 BM radio.
The Sandwich seemed to be D.J. ing a bit often; there is Greg from "Radio free Burningman". Seems to me, as well connected to the internet the BM community is already, internet radio could be a great start.
4.) Heck, you can take it a step further and do a webcast/multicast/broadcasting thing. Sir Cowboy angle seems to have a good handle on the technology from what I've seen so far. (His selection of talent……. I might just beg to differ.......
.) But from what I can see weather the org. goes with any of the above ideas/suggestions or not, it seems like the BM community would benifit going that direction anyway. It's only gonna to grow from it. The most effective way (IMHO)on " how to use the resources you have to help change any messages” …..The answer to me seems to be more obvious then realized.https://www.facebook.com/NeXTCODER
-
DVD Burner
- Posts: 10358
- Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:09 am
- Burning Since: 1986
- Camp Name: White Trash Camp
- Contact:
Just wanted to clear up something that has been bugging me all night.
At the top where I wrote:
"The resources have been in front of everyone as long as I've known about Burningman."
should have been written:
"How to use the resources you've got, has been in front of everyone as long as I've known about Burningman."
At the top where I wrote:
"The resources have been in front of everyone as long as I've known about Burningman."
should have been written:
"How to use the resources you've got, has been in front of everyone as long as I've known about Burningman."
https://www.facebook.com/NeXTCODER
