Details on the placement process?

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Dr. Pyro
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Dr. Pyro » Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:35 pm

My God, some people worry way too much. What the hell is the matter with you?

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ygmir
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by ygmir » Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:37 pm

Savannah wrote:
FossaFerox wrote:So it's standard for newly registered/placed theme camps to have performed their theme for one or more years without being placed ...
Yes.

"Standard" isn't precisely the word; "very common" or "pretty normal" is better.

*this one speaks a strange tongue, using strange sounding words,,,,,,,,methinks a witch she be*
*runs to find a duck*



However, no one knows what'll happen to your camp, and being new is not a ticket to the outer rings, but it's not weird at all for a new camp not to get placed, and sometimes even older, established camps have been denied placement (where they'd had it before) because they didn't ramp up.

Part of the reason my camp got placed this year--besides actually trying, for the first time--is because we'd been seen/known/recognized for years, had hosted events and served food, provided many hours of services and volunteerism, and cleaned up very, very well.

Having to prove yourself isn't strange on the playa. This happens in Burn volunteer positions too--supervisory positions, choicest shifts, etc--they gotta know you can do what you say you can. There are a lot of ambitious flakes out there that get in early and do diddly squat.

You might be incredible, but know one knows what you're capable of yet.
... or highlighted in the WWW?
Compilation of the W/W/W is a separate approximately 3-week-long process in June, during which anyone can submit an event. The first 1,000 or so events, unless legally problematic or otherwise impossible, are generally accepted.
I'm not looking for a red carpet or special treatment, I'm trying to understand what NORMAL TREATMENT entails.

I said six hours would be enough because that's the shortest amount of EE time you can be granted from what I've been told. It would take, at a minimum, three hours for the art project to be set up safely with just me and one other person working on it and I'd want to do all of it in full daylight. That means if I get in right when the gates open at 6 PM we couldn't have it working until Monday. If we got Sunday EE we'd get the art built, and START working on the rest of our camp, yes, but we'd still be building the bulk of our camp in the dark right alongside genpop once the gates opened.
That's not considered unusual.
Last year we got in at about 7:30 and stopped building our camp at around midnight with a considerable amount of work left to do. We didn't finish until Monday daytime. This year we're going to be even bigger without gaining more reliable muscle. Even with Sunday EE we'll be finishing our camp throughout the day on Monday. That's not what I care about. I want to have the interactive display portion done by the time the sun goes down on Sunday so that while I'm shredding my cuticles tying out guylines, rendering my hands unable to perform delicate work, I know the art I spent an entire year designing and building is already out for people to enjoy. If I don't receive placement I'll find another way to make it work, but I will be a little sad at every minute that goes by that my project isn't setup.
Welcome to being a theme camp. :)

BBadger didn't steer you wrong.
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Simon of the Playa
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Simon of the Playa » Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:41 pm

FossaFerox.



show us your tits.
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FossaFerox
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by FossaFerox » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:59 am

Dr. Pyro wrote:My God, some people worry way too much. What the hell is the matter with you?
I value understanding and thoroughness. I'm actually not that worried. I was satisfied (and quite optimistic) before BBadger even deigned to reply.
Simon of the Playa wrote:FossaFerox.



show us your tits.
Image
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by BBadger » Sun Nov 10, 2013 2:23 am

FossaFerox wrote:Last year we got in at about 7:30 and stopped building our camp at around midnight with a considerable amount of work left to do. We didn't finish until Monday daytime. This year we're going to be even bigger without gaining more reliable muscle. Even with Sunday EE we'll be finishing our camp throughout the day on Monday. That's not what I care about. I want to have the interactive display portion done by the time the sun goes down on Sunday so that while I'm shredding my cuticles tying out guylines, rendering my hands unable to perform delicate work, I know the art I spent an entire year designing and building is already out for people to enjoy. If I don't receive placement I'll find another way to make it work, but I will be a little sad at every minute that goes by that my project isn't setup.
I'm going to have to invoke Larry once again:

Image

It's going to make you stronger, give you better credentials, and help you streamline your camp and project setup. That whole radical self-reliance shit? It means dealing with having no outside help -- including special access.

If your project is not up by Monday evening, so be it. Lots of shit isn't up by then. Some people don't even target the first half of the week. Hell, the art car we brought in 2011 wasn't even fully built until mid-week. We spent the afternoons from Monday to Wednesday drilling, screwing in rails, and dusting. Not all that "fun," but something to do. By Friday we were pretty sick of driving and managing it.

Anyway, concentrate your efforts on bringing something great, not the logistics of having it up in a day or two. Just make sure it impresses during the time that it is up and running.
FossaFerox wrote:I was satisfied (and quite optimistic) before BBadger even deigned to reply.
Well remain that way. Just realize that maybe the time isn't now that you get the special treatment. Next year when you've expanded your project, as well as secured more funding and support, you'll be able to point to your efforts this year to justify additional time flexibility (EE) for your camp and project.
FossaFerox wrote:Image
Hahaha! Props to you for that!
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by GreyCoyote » Sun Nov 10, 2013 5:04 am

I would have mooned him. :mrgreen:
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Simon of the Playa » Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:57 am

nice nips.
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Ratty » Sun Nov 10, 2013 7:08 am

FF, We were all getting ready to say what Simon said. (I'm speaking for all the people that live in my head.) And, we were all going to reply the way you did. Ooooooooooommmmmm. We are one with the universe. We would like you to go forward with confidence. Apply for your VIP, fast track, diamond lane pass. Whether it's granted or not you should bring your best. It's all about giving.



Look around the city this year. Everyone is unpacking, building, arranging. Things may get built faster once the camp is populated. Be flexible. Make it work. I can't wait to see your project.
Those aren't buttermilk biscuits I'm lying on Savannah

Pictures or it didn't happen Greycoyote

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by theCryptofishist » Sun Nov 10, 2013 9:17 am

Savannah wrote:BBadger didn't steer you wrong.
Indeed. That was a very cogent analysis.
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by atomicray » Sun Nov 10, 2013 11:08 am

An outside looking in thought...the OP seems to have a fair amount of expectation and even bringing a bit of real world problems into the equation.

The first thought that came to my 25+yr OSHA inspector brain was the mention of "chemicals"...and I would think this will also weigh heavy on the powers that be. Especially since you note the worry of working with them in limited light, fearful of shaking the containment, etc.

This...this should be your concern also.

I would hate for you all to invest so much time and money into a project that could be rejected right out or have additional and severely restrictive safety measures attached to pass inclusion.

Look at the mundane aspect of the fuel issues required to be dealt with for MV and generators...containment, playa protection, fire protection, spill protection, area restriction, etc.

The idea of a unique and undiscovered interactive piece sounds intriguing...a little less so for my overly cautious brain when it is noted that you were not intimately familiar with the process and required some research.

And I mean to say, as noted a dozen or more times in former posts you want to make the best impression on the placement staff as possible...based upon what I have read so far here by your comments, I would be less than convinced it is familiar or safe.

Now I am sure some of this is my natural caution, my extensive years of being an inspector, and in part because you are being evasive so not to reveal to much about your project...which again sounds most interesting.

So I would think to address the unfamiliarity, the chemicals, and let the rest of it go by the way side...if it is all that you hope and plan for it to be, it could be in deep playa and gain much interest and access.

Make it spectacular and they will come...regardless of camp location.

Wishing you and your group the best and most success with your plans and project!

:D
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Elliot » Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:45 pm

*visualizes 40 gallons of mercury in a fish tank*

Ya know, FossaFerox, I have finally built up the courage to suggest you might share this invention with us. The expertise here is enormous. We just heard from an OSHA inspector. I could name two nuclear physicists, for crying out loud. I'm thinking you are investing so much in this, it would be folly not to take advantage of the skills that are available to you, to maximize the likelihood of success.

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by BBadger » Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:53 pm

If you do share details, share it with people in PM. I want to be surprised if I make it this year and you make it with the project.
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Elliot » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:11 pm

That means anyone with relevant knowledge would have to speak up first, and so far all we know is "chemicals", which isn't much. But... I'm just thinking out loud.

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by GreyCoyote » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:17 pm

Fossa: dunno if it helps, but I have extensive training and certifications in storing, transporting, distribution, and even the weaponization of dihydrogen monoxide in all three of its phases. :mrgreen:
"To sum up my compassion level, I think we should feed the unwanted animals to the homeless. Or visa versa. Too much attention and money is spent on both."
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Elliot » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:44 pm

Here in Lake County, there has recently been several "unexplained" explosions of Plastic Soda Bottle Acid Bombs. :lol:

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by GreyCoyote » Sun Nov 10, 2013 2:33 pm

Clearly the work of a network of terrorists. :mrgreen:
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by atomicray » Sun Nov 10, 2013 2:37 pm

I am more than happy to consult on any aspect of the mystery chemical project...I do not even need all the details, just a materials list...to help.

PM works for me as well it seems for others :)
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Ratty » Sun Nov 10, 2013 4:17 pm

And let's not forget Foxfur. He's certified to blow it up.
Those aren't buttermilk biscuits I'm lying on Savannah

Pictures or it didn't happen Greycoyote

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by EspressoDude » Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:59 pm

FossaFerox wrote:I prefer to not handle chemicals by lantern light.

So what are these 'chemicals' ?? something dangerous that you do not want on your hands and body? Make sure you let ARTERY know about hazardous "I Don't want to spill" stuff when you register your art..
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by trilobyte » Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:54 am

You'll also need to detail the use of any kind of hazardous (or just MOOP hazardous) chemicals you'll be using or storing at your camp, as well as provide details on handling and cleanup (in the event something hits the playa).

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by BBadger » Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:18 am

Camp Superfund!
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Elliot » Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:39 am

BBadger wrote:Camp Superfund!
:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by theCryptofishist » Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:46 am

BBadger wrote:Camp Superfund!
That's going to make one hell of a kickstarter!
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by FossaFerox » Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:09 pm

I really don't want to post too many details before I announce what it is (if I announce it here, some of you are keen on the mystery it seems). That's just talking about what info I provide here, of course. The camp registration questionnaire will have full details on materials, MSDS, intended handling, and disaster mitigation. That being said, I mostly used the word "chemicals" to avoid being specific. None of this stuff is particularly dangerous.

The most dangerous material in play is similar to diesel fuel and safer in every regard. Less than 1L will be in use and all of it will be in containers which are themselves sealed in larger containers which will still have catch pans underneath. The container assembly and sealing will take place INSIDE a vehicle (probably the box truck) over a pan to mitigate both spills and dust during assembly).

The other chemicals are extremely safe. If you were patient enough, you could drink everything else I'll be using throughout the course of the burn without any side effects. Non-flammable, non-corrosive, no fumes, not even a skin irritation hazard. I'd avoid getting it in your eyes, but only because it would probably feel pretty gross. Still, the stuff will only be handled in the truck before it's sealed up to mitigate spills and avoid as much dust as possible.

As I explained to our OSHA friend in a PM, someone could take a baseball bat to my display and while I'd probably cry, the playa would be no worse for wear. Wait. Do tears count as MOOP? :P
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by pink » Sun Dec 15, 2013 5:06 pm

FossaFerox, Retrofrolic was placed its first year, also Lasciviuos' (our esteemed founder) VIRGIN year. Unheard of.

So I'll give you his answe when asked how he accomplished such a feat:
"I read the directions".
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by LowePro » Wed Feb 19, 2014 10:02 am

Well I see the placement application is pushed back a few weeks, but we're going to get a head-start anyways.

The sample checklists show a section for Placement Zone (aka the X:o'clock avenues) and a section for the length of frontage space you need, but I don't see a place to request the A,B,C,D,E.....streets (aka the distance into the City from esplanade). Anyone care to offer useful info on how the placers would like us to request our street placement, in addition to our Time placement? For example, we would like to request something near F,G,H,I streets

Thanks.

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by Just_Joe » Wed Feb 19, 2014 10:58 am

asr9754 wrote: Anyone care to offer useful info on how the placers would like us to request our street placement, in addition to our Time placement? For example, we would like to request something near F,G,H,I streets
The Placement team would have a pretty tough time pleasing everyone if it was an option. There has been a "Comments" section in years past. That would be the place to ask.
Placement has seemed to mix it up quite well the last few years- placing a lot of newer camps toward the esplanade.
They are also placing a lot of the more interactive camps on G, the "New" Esplanade.
I like to locate my camp based on frontage, wind and sun, which is more of a sector thing.
They can put me back on H/I as far as I'm concerned- the farther it is to downtown, the more I get to see on the way there.

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by trilobyte » Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:36 pm

You add any specifics or particulars in one of the places where you're able to add comments and additional information about your project. Relax, hang tight, when the forms open up you'll see.

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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by FossaFerox » Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:09 am

So for everyone who was curious about my project, sad to say it won't be making it to the playa this year. My camp is going another direction for our theme and we have limited resources (both money and room in the truck) so it's being pushed back at least a year as a possible expansion to the theme we're going with this year. I'd be sad, except I really like what we came up with as a group and actually voted against my own proposal when the time came. :wink:

Since I don't expect anyone to remember or care in 18 months about my wild panic and crazy dream, I figure I'll spill the beans.

I have a liter of commercial grade ferrofluid gathering dust under my sink. It's a black oil that responds to a magnetic field by moving towards it and taking shape. It looks like an amorphous sea urchin that can change size and shape and be played with in all kinds of ways. The stuff looks AMAZING, especially when lit with color shifting RGB LEDs as the different wavelengths of light play off different depths of the fluid.

The short of it is I was going to have 5 large cylinders (4-6" diameter, 12" tall) that would basically be giant versions of this with 3-4 magnets of different strengths tethered near each one:

[media]


There was also going to be a flat pan in the center of the table to view it "top down" with several magnets underneath and two BIG center pieces. One was going to be something very much like this where a knob would control the field strength so a random burner could pull the fluid up and down the sculpture:

[media]


The other was going to be a mix between the two. It was going to be in another water filled cylinder tank (though larger) with a small pump moving ferrofluid from a reservoir at the base to be released in small droplets at the top. The drops would rain down and get pulled to a magnetized sculpture shaped like the man where they'd form spikes and "crawl" down towards the base where they'd rejoin the reservoir and be circulated continuously.

Sadly, this will have to wait at least a year. Though I'll probably be bringing a single large container for myself to play with when I'm less than sober, because this stuff is seriously mesmerizing to see first hand. And again, I have a damn LITER of the stuff.
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Re: Details on the placement process?

Post by lucky420 » Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:00 am

Fantastico FF!
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

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