Question for battery/electrical experts

[LowePro]

Jumper.jpg

I found a jump starter battery pack at an auction for super cheap. I was hoping to use it as a 12V power supply on the playa and connect it to a solar panel.

I know there's a difference between deep-cycle and regular automotive batteries....but I don't know enough to tell what type of battery is in this jumper-pack and if it's appropriate or safe to use it on the Playa with a solar panel. (The battery is integrated inside the case)

Experts? My plan would be to use it intermittently for for some LEDs, bucket swamp cooler, and a small stereo (nothing major). Anyone know if I can clip the cables to my solar panel and let it charge? Thank you all!

[FossaFerox]

Solar is a lot less practical than you'd think out there because of how quickly the dust destroys your efficiency. Do you already have a solar setup?

If not, save yourself a huge headache and just buy one or two 100+ AH batteries from Costco ($80-90 a piece) and that should cover you. Someone (Figjam I think) also posted a cheap DIY rig to include a fuse, kill switch, and volt meter so you don't run the battery too low. You'll have to google for that one (Try: eplaya figjam battery). Basically you aim to keep the battery above 50% charge so you can top it off from a running car with a set of jumper cables (takes about an hour of idling to go from 50 to 80% capacity from what I was told).

[LowePro]

(Thanks, I already have a solar panel setup. Used it the last 2 burns on a deep cycle battery with great success and practicality. Dust issues addressed by wiping off the panel once a day with wet towel...almost full output all week. That deep cycle battery is bolted to a camp trailer. Hoping to use the Jump Starter as a *portable* power unit if I could charge it periodically. It has a built-in handle and built-in meter and cords and isn't too heavy to put in my bike cart.)

My question at hand is specifically about a Jump Starter, whether the internal battery is of appropriate type to be charged by solar and if the cables are installed in such a way that would safely allow a charge to flow back into the Jumper Battery... or any other tips regarding this type of rig. But thanks for your input anyhows.

***Any battery expert or electrical gurus, thanks for the help.***

[FossaFerox]

(Thanks, I already have a solar panel setup. Used it the last 2 burns on a deep cycle battery with great success and practicality. Dust issues addressed by wiping off the panel once a day with wet towel...almost full output all week. That deep cycle battery is bolted to a camp trailer. Hoping to use the Jump Starter as a *portable* power unit if I could charge it periodically. It has a built-in handle and built-in meter and cords and isn't too heavy to put in my bike cart.)

My question at hand is specifically about a Jump Starter, whether the internal battery is of appropriate type to be charged by solar and if the cables are installed in such a way that would safely allow a charge to flow back into the Jumper Battery... or any other tips regarding this type of rig. But thanks for your input anyhows.

***Any battery expert or electrical gurus, thanks for the help.***

Ahhh, gotcha. Sorry for misunderstanding. The one you linked is rechargeable but you'll need a good inverter and you'd better have some beefy panels to push enough power through that sucker. You'll need 60 W (0.5A at 120V) of output for that particular battery charger. At any rate, the battery inside the JNC660 is pretty wimpy. It's a 22 amp hour lead acid battery. I mean, it'll work, but considering you won't want to take it below half-charge for battery health that leaves you with ~10 AH to play with. Do you know the power draw on your stereo and lighting?

Edit: To clarify, you can't typically trickle charge a jump starter straight off solar (or any other DC source) from what I've been told. Instead, the rechargeable ones have built in chargers, but they're run off 120v AC, not 12v DC.

[FIGJAM]

I think what your saying is can you hook the cables on the unit to a power source and get it to charge.

If the unit doesn't have some kind of anti-feedback device that won't let power back to the unit through the cables, it should work.

Something that is recommended when charging multiple batteries is called balancing.

You hook all your batteries together and let them sit for a few hours so that they start with the same amount of charge when you hook up the charger.

It seems to me that you could just clamp those cables to your RV battery and it would recharge your portable unit, similar to "balancing".

[unjonharley]

Those units can be charged from a 12v,by connecting to the jumper cables..

[FossaFerox]

I was under the impression that all jump starters had anti-feedback built in. It isn't to limit their use, but rather a byproduct of the innards that let a 22 AH battery push 1-2K peak amps. That's why the ones that can recharge do so from a separate source (AC for convenience based on intended use). Am I wrong on this Fig?

Edit: Apparently I'm wrong on this. Best of luck!

[FIGJAM]

I don't know either, but a cheap unit may not have such bells and whistles.

[FlyingMonkey]

Whether it will work or not, those are intended to provide a fairly large amount of current for a short amount of time. It looks like they are great jump starters but may not be good for your use. I do like the fact that they are nice & compact but down the road if your energy requirements exceed your capacity, its pretty easy to upgrading a purpose built battery system. Besides, you can get some pretty beefy batteries for under $100.
If you are getting a great deal then it's never a bad idea to have a jump starter in the car. try it & see if it works. If nothing else you can be someone's hero when their car won't start on Monday after the Burn. They have saved my a$$ on occasion.

[FossaFerox]

FM, that particular model actually has a DC 12v outlet to power accessories which I'm guessing is what drew asr's eye. A self contained battery/outlet with a power gauge.

[unjonharley]

open the thing up and see if the jump cables go to the battery posts..

[unjonharley]

Odds are you can charge the unit off the plugin on your dash.. If it has a 12v plugin

[FlyingMonkey]

Either way they are nice to have & that model has a lot of good reviews. I say if the price is right buy it & see if it works. Big battery set-ups aren't for everyone. Especially if they are tenting it or flying to the Playa. It's obviously not intended to power a village so it may be work well.

There’s only one way to find out. If you do decide to get it, test it with your lights & stuff & let us know how it goes.

[FossaFerox]

Odds are you can charge the unit off the plugin on your dash.. If it has a 12v plugin

That's actually a good point. The 12v outlet on the battery likely bypasses the anti-feedback if there is one since that outlet isn't designed to push huge peak loads. Then you'd just need a 12v male-to-male plug. Note: This is what I suspect to be true, but I don't know that anyone knows better...

[FIGJAM]

I bought something similar when I was getting ready for my first burn.

When I read the limited capacity and a 36 hour recharge time, I took it back.

I know a lot more about batteries and charge rates now, so letting it charge off a full, larger capacity battery may be faster.

[LowePro]

Thanks everyone. I got it for $10 so I"m happy about that.

My thoughts were #1--it would be the wrong type of battery, or #2--it would have some kind of backflow blocking diode that wouldn't allow energy to charge back thru the jumper cables. Sounds like #1 is fine, and #2 just needs to be tested. I guess I just need to connect it to my solar panel and see what happens! No one said it would blow up so that's a bonus. But I'll still wear safety goggles and leather pants, just in case.

("Male-to-Male Plug" should end up as someone's playa name)

[FlyingMonkey]

IT WILL BLOW UP !!!!!

[GreyCoyote]

ASR:These are based on gel cell batteries. There is no "backfeed" preventer (aka diode). And there is no reason it wont power little stuff in addition to starting a car. And yes, you can charge it with a solar panel with an output over 14.2 volts.

The bad news: these batteries are "seconds", ie, they didnt pass muster for OEM use. But they should work fine in the short term for what you are asking!

[theCryptofishist]

IT WILL BLOW UP !!!!!

*runs around in a panic*

[unjonharley]

I run a big ass lead acid battery for BM.. Its in a battery case with jumper cables and out let for small stuff.. I use it around the house/shop for extra lighting or run a drill (110ac inverter).. It rides in the van.. Where the jumper cables are hooked to the van battery.. It is all in a box with all sorts of 12v apps.. Next I'm buying a 12v impact driver.. Might need to change a tire or break free a stuborn bolt/nut.. Also it will work on the scissor jacks..

Two hydraulic jacks died on one trip.. Tried to lift a motor home.. Now I have two scissor house mover jacks.. Think I will remove the handle of the van jack and install a nut instead.. Have two VW van jacks..