Vehicle Passes and Burning Man Traffic Issues

[Simon of the Playa]

if i fly in, do i have to pay the 40$ for my Dirigible if i park it in the air?

just wondering.

[BBadger]

Not all cars with one occupant are non-planners. My little car, with only me in it, also has gear, food and water for three for the week. The other two will be on the Burner Express. (They'll be flying to Reno, and I'll be driving from central AZ.) I keep their big bins in AZ 'til we need them for that one week a year.

You're right, but really I'm thinking more about groups of people here planning and consolidating their rides, rather than the "OMG I just got my ticket 5-hours-before-opening-I'll-hop-in-the-car-and-be-there!" person. You'll be one of the "dude(ttes)-who-brings-in-more-stuff" for the others, and reducing the amount of vehicles by one over the 1:1 ratio. It's still not the 1.9 average, but hey, it's better than nothing.

[Captain Goddammit]

Ok I'm done panicking about spending $800 and then not getting the god damn $40 pass.

Now I'm freaking out about only being able to bring .9 of the First Mate. Either that or we'll only be able to bring 95% of each of us so we total 1.9 in our vehicle. How do we accomplish that? Short haircuts? Take really big dumps before we get there? Ralph our lunches like anorexics?

[Elliot]

.
There's the man who can prove anything with statistics.

[FIGJAM]

Ok I'm done panicking about spending $800 and then not getting the god damn $40 pass.

Now I'm freaking out about only being able to bring .9 of the First Mate. Either that or we'll only be able to bring 95% of each of us so we total 1.9 in our vehicle. How do we accomplish that? Short haircuts? Take really big dumps before we get there? Ralph our lunches like anorexics?

Yes, but you know all the best parts to bring.

[BBadger]

Ok I'm done panicking about spending $800 and then not getting the god damn $40 pass.

Now I'm freaking out about only being able to bring .9 of the First Mate. Either that or we'll only be able to bring 95% of each of us so we total 1.9 in our vehicle. How do we accomplish that? Short haircuts? Take really big dumps before we get there? Ralph our lunches like anorexics?

And what about that "replacement rate" for keeping stable populations! It's like 2.33 children per woman. Two kids and a miscarriage after three months!

[mgb327]

Since I am driving 3000 miles to get there, and will be going alone....do I pick up that dead hippie out on 50 in the desert? The birds had reduced him by 10%. (soft parts first, as the Boids tend to do)

[Captain Goddammit]

Yes but you'll have to gift him a miracle ticket.

[MyDearFriend]

Since I am driving 3000 miles to get there, and will be going alone....do I pick up that dead hippie out on 50 in the desert? The birds had reduced him by 10%. (soft parts first, as the Boids tend to do)

Do you have to go alone? Maybe we could have lunch and talk about this. I am considering making the drive in my Scion XB with 4 passengers.

[TT120]

Found this on the ticket support page:

Last Updated: Jan 10, 2014 12:08AM UTC

Vehicle Passes will be available to purchase during all of our ticket sales. Based on demand, we may also have a separate late-season Vehicle Pass only sale.

If you have been accepted to the Low Income Ticket Program you will be given the option of purchasing a Vehicle Pass when you pay for your ticket.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This will help I think.....

[theCryptofishist]

Woohoo!

[BBadger]

Yes but you'll have to gift him a miracle ticket.

"I'm gifting you half a vehicle pass, allowing you to stink up my car and stain my seats, and now you want a Burning Man ticket too?!!"

[Misti]

I think it would work better to offer a discount for carpooling. Then it would be read as " i can have $40 extra bucks to spend on booze if I carpool" instead of its going to cost me $40 bucks to get there if I'm lucky enough to have a chance to buy a pass.

Everyone loves a good discount.

[theCryptofishist]

As I absolutely cannot carpool, and could possibly kick up a federal level stink about it, they might have been advised against that ploy by the lawyers.

[trilobyte]

If it makes you feel better to think of it as a discount for those who don't need a pass, then think of it as a discount.

[remi]

Well, as I look at different scenarios with the vehicle passes, one scenario I do NOT see is a 2012-style panic scenario.
I do not know if the 35k number for passes is a hard number imposed by BLM and NDOT. Assuming it is NOT contractually imposed, BM could easily say "ooops, we need more passes" and add passes to the individual sale. Maybe limiting their number to one per purchase.
Actually, this scenario would penalize hoarders and scammers (those who plan to take advantage of scarcity) by sticking them with now-almost-worthless vehicle passes.

Another fix would be to make vehicle passes eligible for STEP...

There is a constructive side to vehicle passes. It may force camps and individuals to think about how we move things and people to/from the playa.

^^ +1000
This is what should happen. I'm already laughing at those who are stuck with all these useless extra parking passes. I'll be able to buy mine for below face value!

[remi]

"There will be an initial allotment made for 35,000 Vehicle Passes."

[illy dilly]

Has the BMorg yet stated that 15,000 is maximum number of Vehicle Passes allotted for the Directed Group sale?

They have not stated that there is a maximum number of Vehicle Passes in any sale, just that the initial allotment would be 35,000. Jack Rabbit Speaks says 35,000 full stop, the FAQ does not - I'm assuming that they want people to try to plan to reduce the number of vehicles by having the "full stop" number in the JRS, but being the first year they know it might not go smoothly & have prepared for that. Based on the current people-to-cars ration (1.9) & the amount of tickets for sale this year, 35,000 should be fine.

Cool, thanks Eric!
I think you're right, about the whole "creating more later" idea. I think it would be funny if in August they release another 1,000-ish. Just to really screw anyone that is trying to hoard them tell the last minute. And, to teach a little bit of a "Don't hoard tickets or VPs!" lesson.
I stand by my theory that it will be a shit show tell mid July, then it will sort it self out.

Fishy is correct, Mods are not allowed to poke our eyes out. We are just doomed to endlessly repeat the very first answer in the FAQ on Vehicle Passes while people freak out. Getting upset about the $40, or about having to have a pass, fine. Getting upset about them "running out" when they've phrased it in the FAQ to be pretty clear they're already planning for that scenario... *sigh*

Are there any rules about drinking your self into a stupor?

Now I'm freaking out about only being able to bring .9 of the First Mate. Either that or we'll only be able to bring 95% of each of us so we total 1.9 in our vehicle. How do we accomplish that? Short haircuts? Take really big dumps before we get there? Ralph our lunches like anorexics?

Just don't drink any liquids eat salty foods for the 72 hours before. That way your water weight will be down

[PlayaPatrol]

Are there really that many hippies who just whimsically decide to go to the event, throw a bunch of crap into a Ford Pinto and drive to the playa by themselves?

Yes, and bunch of ravers, artists, engineers and partiers too. A week in advance.

[PlayaPatrol]

This scheme won't increase carpooling. Charging only if cars had less then three people would increase carpooling slightly.
That's what some events do. Burner Express bus type schemes will increase carpooling only if the price is low and there's enough room for peoples stuff.
Most aren't going to spend thousands to rent and fuel a large capacity vehicle so they can ride with a huge group. That's more expensive then driving the small car.
Staggered entry days and exit days would reduce traffic. The event would need to be longer to make that desirable.
This scheme is strictly a fee to charge more money without raising ticket prices. Very little of it will be used for road work.

[Regis Debray]

Perhaps this has been answered elsewhere, but assuming 35,000 vehicle passes @ $40 each, BMORG stands to benefit to the tune of $1,400,000.00. That money is NOT going to be given to the Nevada Dept of Transportation, or to the BLM. The money is going to find its way into someone's pockets. Whose?

[9ah]

I hope they pull my ticket number out of the hat for this lottery.

Perhaps this has been answered elsewhere, but assuming 35,000 vehicle passes @ $40 each, BMORG stands to benefit to the tune of $1,400,000.00. That money is NOT going to be given to the Nevada Dept of Transportation, or to the BLM. The money is going to find its way into someone's pockets. Whose?

[unjonharley]

Perhaps this has been answered elsewhere, but assuming 35,000 vehicle passes @ $40 each, BMORG stands to benefit to the tune of $1,400,000.00. That money is NOT going to be given to the Nevada Dept of Transportation, or to the BLM. The money is going to find its way into someone's pockets. Whose?

1.4 mill is just a token towards the road upkeep.. This token keep a lot of stiff neck calm..About 200 miles of road

[Sham]

Perhaps this has been answered elsewhere, but assuming 35,000 vehicle passes @ $40 each, BMORG stands to benefit to the tune of $1,400,000.00. That money is NOT going to be given to the Nevada Dept of Transportation, or to the BLM. The money is going to find its way into someone's pockets. Whose?

There was a suggestion that the eplaya moderators use that money for an after burn private party. Still waiting for an answer.

[Regis Debray]

"1.4 mill is just a token towards the road upkeep.. This token keep a lot of stiff neck calm..About 200 miles of road"

Nope. Every weekend more than a million people come into Nevada. Every day, tens of thousands of vehicles cross the state, and the gasoline taxes imposed by the federal government and by Nevada pay for the upkeep on the roads. My point is, unless you are privy to some secret mechanism by which private funds can be added to Nevada Dept of Transportation coffers, the money which is being collected IS NOT BEING TURNED OVER TO THE STATE OF NEVADA. Look in the propaganda about the vehicle fees. No where does it say that the money is being turned over to Nevada or to the BLM for road repairs. It is a scam, and that's what is so insulting. Raise the price for tickets. I don't care, but BMORG is not telling where the funds are going.

[Eric]

Raise the price for tickets. I don't care, but BMORG is not telling where the funds are going.

So don't buy one, or don't go. It's their party, and it's privately owned (until the non-profit takes over) - there is no public mechanism to find out how or why they do anything, or where the money goes, and no matter how much we all have invested in this event they still control every aspect of it.

Personally, over the last few years myself and other long term Burners (including Adrian, the publisher of BRC Weekly, and former publisher of Piss Clear; and Scribe, one of their most vehement thorns-in-the-side) have embraced "fuck-it" (or "fukkit"). They're going to do what they do, it doesn't impact me that much (oh god no - $40 extra dollars spread out amongst the 2 or 3 people in most vehicles!), and if I get all frothy about every time they do something stupid then all I would do is spend all day frothing.

Seriously, if it bugs you, don't pay, and don't get your vehicle in. Otherwise get used to the fact that until the event gets turned over to the non-profit, you are just not going to know for sure where the money goes. It is honestly that simple.

[theCryptofishist]

Wherever the money actually goes, it is their stated intention to use these passes to "to incentivize participants to reduce the number of vehicles entering BRC by increasing the number of participants per vehicle."
A raise in ticket prices would not do this.
It is certainly true that waits to get into and out of the city have become very long indeed, depending on when you arrive/leave.

[Regis Debray]

This isn't about money, and the organization has a board of directors now and is holding itself out as a 501(c)(3) already. The inference that BMORG is making is that the vehicle ticket will ease the traffic. The traffic isn't the problem. The problem is, among other things, the chokepoint at the gate where members of our camp were held for 2 hours and longer for no reason. In other words, the current iteration of traffic control is worse than it ever has been. The solution, with respect, is not "go or don't go." I think the money is being collected by means of misrepresentation of what is going to be done with it. That irks me. Does anyone know how many vehicles were on the Playa in 2012 or 2013?

[unjonharley]

Just take the stick out of your ass, buy a ticket, pay the road tax and go...

Or stay home...........

[Regis Debray]

"Just take the stick out of your ass, buy a ticket, pay the road tax and go...

Or stay home..........."

Are you mentally ill, or something? I voice a concern about the city I call home for more than a week each year, vocalize what I believe to be a serious misrepresentation about this year's festival, and you tell me to "take a stick out of my ass"? If you don't like my comment, either ignore it or move on. Instead, you think that flaming me will make me shut up?