Monkey Hut question

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Drawingablank
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Drawingablank » Fri Jul 19, 2013 11:56 am

Riv wrote:OK, more monkey hut questions!
2) For the ribs, is continuing to use gaffer tape to keep the connectors from slipping? It seems to me that the tension should mostly hold them in place anyway...

The best way is to run a screw into the 2' connectors at the halfway point. No taping needed then because they will not be able to slide past the screw.
Riv wrote:OK, more monkey hut questions!
3) The original MH instructions about the bungee cords seem like they might cause some amount of skew with the flexible inner tube connections. Any suggestions for better ways to hold the spine together? Or will bungee cords still work well in this setup?

The spine bungees are designed to keep the socketed parts in the original design from pulling apart. Since your design uses no sockets they would likely create some issues.
Riv wrote:5) How much guying out/staking down is a good idea and how much will it compromise the whole "flexes instead of breaking" aspect? I'm looking at using either one or two guylines run all the way through the spine and staked at both ends.

I would consider running a rope through your spine and guying down the ends.
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Raoul
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Raoul » Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:58 am

Since this thread has been quiet for a year, I thought I would re-start the fun with a question. :coffee: My apologies if it is answered elsewhere...I really did look before posting.

I want to go with LoveMonkey's design http://www.chromatest.net/Lovemonkey/ but I need slightly more space - ideally shooting for something along the lines of 15 x 15 (with about 7' of height) rather than the 10 x 12 in LM's design. My tent has a 9x14 footprint, and I prefer to put the entire thing inside the MH rather than going the shade flap route.

How much length do I need to add to the ribs to increase the width of the MH to 15'? And, how far apart should the ends be situated to maintain height at about 7 feet?

Any insights would be greatly appreciated.
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby BeeWeeDee » Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:44 am

The MH ribs are typically thought of as a semi-circle. With a diameter of 15' the total rib length from re-bar to rebar would be about 24 feet. This is 4' longer than the ribs for the 10X12 design.
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby oly14 » Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:20 pm

I built a 14' x 24' MH last year using 24' ribs to 'garage' a Ford E250 van. The van is ~7' tall and easily fit inside. Remember, MH ribs don't form a perfect circle, they kind of flatten at the top. You may be able to get away with 24' ribs with the ends 15' apart. I needed an overall height greater than 7' because I had to fit a 'box' inside. Before I bought and cut all the pipes, I built one rib, drove some rebar into my lawn and put it up to see how tall it was. I didn't want to buy all the pipe and build the thing only to find out the van wouldn't fit. :shock: If you want me to try a 15' opening with the parts I have to figure out how tall it is, let me know.

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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Raoul » Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:24 am

oly14 wrote:If you want me to try a 15' opening with the parts I have to figure out how tall it is, let me know.


Thanks a million for the offer, Oly! I found this design http://galaxybeing.com/galaxyhut/ that says it provides 7 feet of clearance and looks like it will do the trick. The ribs are 24' with the ends placed 14' apart. I will probably take your suggestion to build one rib in the back yard to confirm height, but I think my tent my be a little more forgiving than an E250 if I am an inch or so off. :lol:
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Fan C » Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:56 pm

We use a hut based largely on the galaxy hut. 30"x 14" Our guy line ties each section to the next along the spine. This holds the entire thing together and eliminated any spine tubes falling out of place. I plan to do the same along the spine of a carport this year too.

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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby C187 » Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:50 pm

Google is kicking up odd stuff, so I'm just going to ask my question here.

Right now I can only find medium duty tarps in the size I need (I'm building the GalaxyHut version). Would I be fine with a medium duty, or must I find a heavy duty one?

On the shade set-up I've been using I've had smaller tarps of both types as part of the set-up with out issue. But I figured it would be better to ask people who know.
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby oly14 » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:39 pm

A medium duty tarp might be OK until, well, it isn't. I bought a super heavy duty from tarpsupply.com for my monkey hut when I built it last year. I didn't want to take the chance that my tarp would shred in high winds.

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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Fan C » Thu Jul 17, 2014 6:16 pm

Medium duty would probably be okay since once assembled the whole thing rocks as one unit.

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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby conundrum » Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:02 pm

How do you secure your tarp to the playa? I think having some clearance for air flow may be nice. I was thinking of doing a running rig by winding a paracord through the grommets, secured to the front and back rib. Would I stake off between each grommet pair? Or just every once in a while? Should I loop a short bungee or bungee ball through the cord and stake that or just stake the cord itself? Or am I overthinking this and should just stake each grommet directly to the ground?

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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Drawingablank » Fri Aug 01, 2014 7:35 pm

conundrum wrote:How do you secure your tarp to the playa? I think having some clearance for air flow may be nice. I was thinking of doing a running rig by winding a paracord through the grommets, secured to the front and back rib. Would I stake off between each grommet pair? Or just every once in a while? Should I loop a short bungee or bungee ball through the cord and stake that or just stake the cord itself? Or am I overthinking this and should just stake each grommet directly to the ground?


My first time I ran a rope through the side grommets and used a bungee to attach it to a stake at the center of each side.

Since then I no longer attach the tarp to anything but the end poles (with bungee balls). I do use a ratchet strap on each end of the ridge pole to secure the hut to the ground and have not had any problems with securing the tarp only to the end poles.

I use the standard Lovemonkey hut design - if using a different design ymmv.
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Strata » Wed Dec 21, 2016 6:25 pm

Let's see if folks still reply to this thread, it's an oldie but goodie.

I'm planning my first monkey hut for the 2017 burn, and have been reading extensively about them. I've picked up a TON of great info from this thread, but some things are still unclear to me.

1) The bike inner tube wrapping of the spine to the ribs: is this like, X wrapped around the two and then tied off in a square knot, or what? If anybody had a close-up picture, that would be great.

2) Bungees/rib tension: if you are using an arch-and-overlaid-spine style instead of an arch-and-inline-X-T-connector style, is it still necessary to have tension from rib to rib? That would seem to destabilize your wrapped spine-and-rib joint, whereas it would stabilize an X or T connector joint.

3) Tarp going down to the ground or not: how much of an opening can you leave? Does a larger opening mean the hut will act more like a sail than with a smaller opening?

4) The ratchet over the spine and down to the ground: One humungously long ratchet line that goes all the way the length of the hut and down on either side of it? How optional is this?

5) Consensus on tying down the tarp at the edges, especially if you are leaving a foot or two off the ground: Thread rope through and stake in the midpoint of the ribs? Don't stake at all?

6) Rebar length above and below ground: I hear 12 inches, I hear 18 inches. My inclination might be to go with 18 inches if that increases stability. And what about this bit of garden hose on the end? To prevent a sharp piece of rebar from starting a PVC crack? Will definitely include this if folks think it is worthwhile. We have a trashed garden hose just sitting outside waiting for me to disconnect it and throw it out. :-)

7) Shade flap, to tack down / guy out or not to? Seems like leaving it to flap would be noisy and somewhat destructive. Tacking it down prevents airflow through. Somebody said to leave an airflow opening at the top-- other than cutting a hole in the tarp, which seems like a bad idea, how do you do that?

8) Is the monkey hut under wind load basically a monocoque frame / tensegrity structure? Is it worth tossing a length of rope over the top of the tarp along each rib and staking that down to help anchor the roof to the ribs?

I know this is not rocket science, and plan to do a lot of experimenting in my local park, but I am still building the picture in my head of how this all goes together. Thanks for any light you can shed on the above questions!

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Monkey Hut answers

Postby MyDearFriend » Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:06 am

I have had multiple huts out there for 6 years now and this is what has always worked well, starting from the ground up:

Rebar stakes: half inch diameter, 2 feet long. I spray paint half of each stake so I can see when I have 12 inches below ground. If you are staking the standard 5 feet apart, they will hold. Don't need to cap them; the sharp ends might shave a bit off the inside of the PVC (check for curly white MOOP when you break camp!) but the PVC will not crack.

PVC should be Schedule 40, for strength. Length can be whatever you like. Cross pieces between hoops should hold the hoops apart (Ts & Xs or what you will) AND be held in place with bungees or strips of bike tubes. You want the frame to flex, rather than break, and pop apart intact if the worst happens. It is best and easiest to use individual cross pieces (rather than one long spine) and secure them separately. That way, the WORST damage you get from sustained high winds (a popped cross piece) takes 5 seconds to repair.

Shade cloth: the stretchy kind is best, as this allows for better flex. I use 70% aluminet, with a gap of about 12 inches at the bottom on each side. This reduces dust build-up and keeps the heat down. I can sleep until noon in my tent 8) 8) 8) and I need a blanket when I nap in my hammock in the afternoons. No lie. Aluminet is fantastic.

Ropes: I run a slightly stretchy climbing rope along the bottom at the sides, and secure to the end PVC. I bungee the shade to each PVC along the side, at the bottom. Aluminet will puff up with the wind but not sail, as it is open-weave. This is another huge advantage over solid tarps (not to mention the WEIGHT). If Aluminet is too $$$, black shade cloth works too, it's just not as cool in the day time.

I do not use any kind of guy ropes or anchors. I have never needed anything like that. The tension between the bent PVC and the rebar, the stretched cloth and the bungees will hold everything in place. I have watched these huts through some serious storms, and like I said, the worst damage ever took 5 seconds to fix. Good as new. My first hut is 25 feet long and has been a FANTASTIC home through 6 straight arrive-early-stay-late Burns.

The only parts I have replaced are some rebar stakes that bent in sustained high winds. 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Strata » Thu Dec 22, 2016 9:29 am

Thanks for the detailed reply!

I have created a parts list for a 12 x 30 foot monkey hut, and it comes out to (yowza) $725. I'm hoping that if I go to a plumbing supply store or irrigation store I can save some on the PVC, which is the next most expensive part after the shade cloth. I might go with a tarp because it's so much cheaper than 90% shade cloth, but I liked the idea of cool breezes through the walls.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/16fU ... fzA6uG96c/

Am considering scaling back to a 12 x 20, but my tent is 12 feet in diameter, so that doesn't really leave a lot of lounging room at the other end of the hut. At least I can order the pieces in stages, and spread the cost out over the next few months. I want to have the thing assembled and debugged no later than the end of July, so that's 7 months of saving $100/month.... that sounds more manageable somehow. :-)
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Ratty » Thu Dec 22, 2016 5:25 pm

Hi Strata. Great to see detailed planning. I don't have a monkeyhut but I put one up for RobbiDobbs a couple of times. Hers is tarp over the tent and shade cloth for the porch section. That way you're not in a tunnel of isolation. There was just enough shade for her tent and Ice box. She also had a very handy tool. A 6" piece of pipe with a cap screwed on it. Slip this over your rebar to pound it in easily.

Also you can bring a piece of pvc to slip over the rebar and use as a measuring tool. 3 foot rebar. 1 foot pvc. Slip it on and pound till you get to the pvc. Instant 18 inches above and below ground. (If you are using one of those magic pieces of pipe with a cap for the pounding.)
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Strata » Thu Dec 22, 2016 6:18 pm

Thanks much, Ratty!

Sounds like you are of the opinion that 36" rebar is better for this than 24" rebar?
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby BBadger » Sat Dec 24, 2016 2:52 am

Hmm, I never used more than about 18" of rebar with about 6"-8" above the dirt if I recall. The shorter length above the dirt meant that the bend of the PVC wasn't very affected. I did cover them with pieces of hose to give them some grip and not damage the PVC. Note that this was 5/8" rebar, which is a bit thicker than many people used.

This past year I made a clamshell structure using pieces from a 10x27' King Canopy kit, and a single 12x25' heavy silvered tarp. It produced a shade structure about equal size to a standard monkey hut, but could have been a bit longer if I had brought more of the pipes. They worked great, could be set up quickly by one person, and I just secured them to the playa with lag bolts with rope loops around the "legs". It sure beat pounding rebar and I could fit all the pipes and junk in my Subaru Outback.
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Re: Monkey Hut question

Postby Ratty » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:16 am

Me too. This year I'll have a roll up shade for the front made from shade cloth. It was surprisingly effective at keeping the windy dust storm at bay.

On your monkey hut make a end cap to close off the wind when the dust kicks up.

Have you read Zig-Zags post from last year? Her hut was a success.

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